National Anthems. Are they important.

I just heard Jerusalem.

It almost made me Cry. Its beautiful and makes me feel proud.

NZ have two anthems. It gets them geared up for a game.. Sometimes Ireland has 2. Wales and Scotland connect with there's. We can't connect with God save the queen.

Games of Rugby can be lost in the first second of the game. Just like the Wales England game at the weekend. We were never in it.

If we sung Jerusalem with pride- would it have made a difference to how we start

I am not going to suggest this would make a difference in others sports like football or cricket. They are different games and need a different type of focus.

But with Rugby. The passion, the history, the animalistic nature needs patriotism.

We Need Jerusalem

We'll lend you our two! In fact ...keep them and sell them on if you want.

You dont like yours Fly?

Neither of them mystir. Neither of them.... they're not boisterous or aggressive enough in tone. You need something to get your lungs going and the hairs then go up on the back of your neck... not singsongs.

A player who gets fired up during anthems probably gets fired up by any anthem (ie Argentinian Castro when the bum-tiddly-pom Italian anthem plays).

A decent anthem probably fires up the crowd more than the players. As Martin Johnson said to his team just after a hugely passionate rendition of the Welsh anthem (my favourite anthem by a long way) in 2001 "Think how good it will feel when we silence them"

How can we get fired up over GSTQ..

Does it really matter if the corporate rent-a-mob who seem to occupy most seats at Twickenham get fired up? They will go back to sleep again anyway.

Oh and the playing of Jerusalem before England cricket matches always sounds so lame.

LondonTiger wrote:Oh and the playing of Jerusalem before England cricket matches always sounds so lame.

cricket doesnt need anthems. Explained in the op,

How did you manage to win a world cup if your anthem stops you from beating teams? Or, could it be that it doesn't make a difference? Wales v England is roughly equal in terms of games won by each nation over the years, so Wales' anthem has only had an effect 50% of the time.

Hypothesis rejected!

Thats to simple griff

As I said, I think the anthems make no difference whatsoever to the players performance. If it wasn't for the fact that I love hearing "Land of My Fathers" and (Marseillaise" I would say scrap them and just get on with the game.

You dont think it can have a physcoloigcal affect for the start of a game?

mystiroakey wrote:You dont think it can have a physcoloigcal affect for the start of a game?

Maybe, but explain all of England's wins over the years? For England to win then it must also not work some of the time.

Come on guys...anthems play a part - a big emotional part if they're good ones. But then the players have to play for 80 minutes to win a game. And an anthem will only get you so far into a game...maybe five minutes or so.

Stadium noise!!!! Continued stadium noise by the home crowd...passionate supporters...now that's the deal that sometimes gets players through a game. It's energising.

Griff wrote:

mystiroakey wrote:You dont think it can have a physcoloigcal affect for the start of a game?

Maybe, but explain all of England's wins over the years? For England to win then it must also not work some of the time.

Its not the reason for winning a game. Lulz. Its not about which anthem is better. This isnt x factor. Its just one factor of many that can help prepare players for kick off.

Just to clarify NZs situation. We do have 2 anthems. God of Nations and God Save the Queen. We sing God of Nations in English and then in Maori (one of our three official languages). We don't tend to use God Save the Queen much now days.

ngangboy your not clarifying the situation. You are just muddying the waters.

I am talking about the Haka and your anthem.

Its about the fact that you have 2/3 anthems before a game

But at the same time. I am sure there is little point in you having any anthem over or before the haka. The haka is what puts the kiwis in the mental zone pre kick off

It's actually sung in Maori first nganboy and then the same lyrics in English. Hardly two anthems. If you can't be stirred by the haka as well when you face it then you don't get excited easily above a flat line pulse.

If you're looking to the anthems to inspire you like the Welsh crowd did last Saturday then you don't hold out much hope for your players oakey.

By all means get a petition going for changing the anthem to Jerusalem. I like green and pleasant lands myself after the harsh sun baked plains of Spain where the rain does not mainly fall. It rains mostly in the north and a certain place in the province of Cadiz which actually receives the most annual rainfall.

The anthem represents the pride of representing your country and nation. Personally I'd be happy if the players came onto the pitch and the whistle blew shortly afterwards. But it's all part of the pre-match build up and you only have to see the Pumas sing their anthem to know what that means to them.

I like the Italian anthem. It's like a mini-operetta.

I do think Anthems can give you a little lift just before the game...and personally i think our anthem GSTQ is the most dull dire uninspiring Anthem out there.
Irelands Call, The Italian Anthem...La Marsaleille (spelling) etc...great anthems...

Give me Land of Hope and Glory...and ill be happy....

mystiroakey wrote:How can we get fired up over GSTQ..

We'll need to ask Tuilagi how he does it.

I've always been jealous of the Marseillaise, such a stirring tune.
Lyrics a bit bloodthirsty.
FOS is as bad a dirge as GSTQ, and its lyrics just as cheesy.

Now this is an anthem:

Allons enfants de la Patrie,
Children of the Fatherland, let's go,
Le jour de gloire est arrivé!
The day of glory has arrived!
Contre nous de la tyrannie,
Tyranny is against us,
L'étendard sanglant est levé,
The bloody banner is raised,
L'étendard sanglant est levé!
The bloody banner is raised!
Entendez-vous dans les campagnes
In the countryside do you hear
Mugir ces féroces soldats?
The roar of these ferocious soldiers?
Ils viennent jusque dans vos bras
They come into your arms
Égorger vos fils, vos compagnes!
To kill your sons, your companions!
CHORUS
Aux armes, citoyens,
Formez vos bataillons,
Marchons, marchons!
Qu'un sang impur
Abreuve nos sillons !

I think England should have a seperate anthem - QSTQ is the national anthem of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and not just England, so playing QSTQ in Cardiff or Edinburgh is playing the home national anthem twice - the United Kingdon anthem and then the national anthem.
Other issue is of course that QSTQ is an absolute dirge.....

Would much rather have Jerusalem than God Save the Queen in truth.

This is the umpteenth thread about anthems on v2 and its BBC predecessor.

General conclusion from what I can remember from those threads was that anthems fall into a few distinct categories.

The inspiring tub-thumping ones - France, Italy, Argentina, Wales
The thoroughly dreary ones - GSTQ, NZ, Australia
The marginally not-so-dreary ones - Ireland (both of them), Scotland.

Amazed Geordiefalcon that you think Ireland's Call is a great anthem, it divides opinion over here but I've heard very few Irish people say it's a "great" anthem. For me anything penned by Phil Coulter is a heap of sh1te and Ireland's call is just that while the guns and bullets Amhran na bhFiann is awful.

Never knew the Marseillaise was quite so bloodthirsty - but despite that it's a great tune. Love the Italian one - unlike us Irish with our two separate anthems the Italians combine two different tunes into the one anthem, bit like the Argies.

NZ might be the best team in the world, but in terms of having the most dreary dirge of an anthem God of Nations (in Maori and English) is right up there with GSTQ (at least GSTQ is very short though)

Cant scrap the anthems they are extremely important part of international rugby.

I think God Save the Queen is so lame, but have to say how impressed I was at it being sung by the fans and team last Saturday. I don't think I have ever seen GSTQ sung with so much emotion. Well done to all.... Saying that, when Mae hen wlad fy nhadau started it was on another level. I have never heard it sung so well, even in the good old days pre MS at the old Arms Park (or National Stadium to give it its correct title).

Anyone who says the anthems don't play a part has ice water in their veins.

I like the way the Italian bands use this to their advantage. I noticed they played the Irish anthem so slow, it couldn't be sung properly by the crowd. But when they played their anthem the tempo was definitely upped and the crowd responded. First points to Italy. They did the same thing earlier with the Welsh anthem, played it so slow. The Irish bands do the same thing with the Welsh anthem (ie play it too slow to sing properly). When the bands play this trick, it annoys me, but I suppose its all part of the gamesmanship.

if i was the new irish coach the first thing i would do would be can Irelands call. It is dreaful diddly iddldy nonsense and Phil Coulter is insufferable.

If the protestent Ulster lads do not want to sing thats fair enough as long as they continue to give 100% once the game starts

Having 2 national anthems makes us look ridiculous in my opinion.

Some great national anthems in rugby. Ireland Call is not one of them.

Wow ...okay, i stand corrected on Irelands Call.. jeez u guys...

I sang the Italian anthem in a pub in Oxford.

Love em.

GeordieFalcon wrote:Wow ...okay, i stand corrected on Irelands Call.. jeez u guys...

No, no...you didn't go far enough. Now admit that your one is the most beautiful piece of emotive and adrenalin producing music that has ever been played on any rugby field.

Go on!!! Say it!!!!

dublin_dave wrote:if i was the new irish coach the first thing i would do would be can Irelands call. It is dreaful diddly iddldy nonsense and Phil Coulter is insufferable.

If the protestent Ulster lads do not want to sing thats fair enough as long as they continue to give 100% once the game starts

Having 2 national anthems makes us look ridiculous in my opinion.

Some great national anthems in rugby. Ireland Call is not one of them.

100% agree! Complete tosh PC cheese.
Childish Catholic Protestant nonsense has no place in rugby.

England - Smack My Bitch Up - The Prodigy

Scotland - Boom, Blast and Ruin - Biffy Clyro

Ireland - Something by U2(yawn) or Stiff Little Fingers (Ulster lads)

Wales, France and Italy have the best 3 anthems in the world bar none.

dublin_dave wrote:if i was the new irish coach the first thing i would do would be can Irelands call. It is dreaful diddly iddldy nonsense and Phil Coulter is insufferable.

If the protestent Ulster lads do not want to sing thats fair enough as long as they continue to give 100% once the game starts

Having 2 national anthems makes us look ridiculous in my opinion.

Some great national anthems in rugby. Ireland Call is not one of them.

Totally agree.. they should just rename it Northern Ireland's call and skip to the bit about the glens of antrim... I don't feel represented by the other bits anyways.

Norn Ireland, Norn Ireland!
Together standin' on our Own
Shoulder to Shoulder
With anyone north of Tyrone.

Ours is the most beautiful piece of emotive and adrenalin producing music that has ever been played on any rugby field.....

dublin_dave wrote:if i was the new irish coach the first thing i would do would be can Irelands call. It is dreaful diddly iddldy nonsense and Phil Coulter is insufferable.

If the protestent Ulster lads do not want to sing thats fair enough as long as they continue to give 100% once the game starts

Having 2 national anthems makes us look ridiculous in my opinion.

Some great national anthems in rugby. Ireland Call is not one of them.

From an admittedly outside perspective, I think the 2 anthems make Ireland look terrific. To me, it has always shown that one sport, and a special group of athletes, can actually triumph over the terrible stuff of the past. It shows Rugby as a special thing that brings people together rather than further sections and divides people by historical antagonisms.

In the very unique situation which is Ireland, I think it is perfect.

GeordieFalcon wrote:Ours is the most beautiful piece of emotive and adrenalin producing music that has ever been played on any rugby field.....

Which one? Fog on the Tyne?

GeordieFalcon wrote:Ours is the most beautiful piece of emotive and adrenalin producing music that has ever been played on any rugby field.....

Good man We're nice as long as you always agree with us

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:England - Smack My Bitch Up - The Prodigy

Scotland - Boom, Blast and Ruin - Biffy Clyro

Ireland - Something by U2(yawn) or Stiff Little Fingers (Ulster lads)

Wales, France and Italy have the best 3 anthems in the world bar none.

I'd be inclined to utilise Bubbles by Biffy Clyro as your anthem. Upbeat and a great ending. Otherwise Stingin' Belle (as it sounds a little like it has bagpipes at the end).

Though I guess an anthem called Bubbles isn't going to strike fear into the opposition.

Not a fan of Jerusalem myself, would prefer something a little less heavy on the religion as well. I'd go for I Vow To Thee of the more commonly touted.

I dont know why the Irish do not like Irelands call that mutch. I like it my self.

I also like the Welsh, French,SA,NZ.

But even though i am not a big fan of GSTQ. I really cannot see them changing it any time soon. Even if the Queen dies, they will still keep it for the next monarch.

majesticimperialman wrote:

But even though i am not a big fan of GSTQ. I really cannot see them changing it any time soon. Even if the Queen dies, they will still keep it for the next monarch.

Won't that be insulting to the..............em, King?

SecretFly wrote:

majesticimperialman wrote:

But even though i am not a big fan of GSTQ. I really cannot see them changing it any time soon. Even if the Queen dies, they will still keep it for the next monarch.

Won't that be insulting to the..............em, King?

Not really, his wife will be queen. right.

majesticimperialman wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

majesticimperialman wrote:

But even though i am not a big fan of GSTQ. I really cannot see them changing it any time soon. Even if the Queen dies, they will still keep it for the next monarch.

Won't that be insulting to the..............em, King?

Not really, his wife will be queen. right.

...well, you'd hope so, yeah. We've been through the threesomes in another era.

All would be improved if the English simply sang verse 2 instead:

O Lord, our God, arise,
Scatter her enemies,
And make them fall.
Confound their politics,
Frustrate their knavish tricks,
On thee our hopes we fix:
God save the Queen.

There, problem solved - imagine the passion as 75,000 fans belt out "frustrate their knavish tricks"