More unpopular boxing opinions from v2

First topic message reminder :

Afternoon fellas, hope that you guys are finding this first day back at work after the Easter weekend a little easier going than I am.

If you can forgive me for a blatant rip off, I'd like to resurrect a great idea of Adam's from all the way back in 2011 where we all voice our unpopular boxing opinions. This can be anything within reason; a fighter (either currently active or from back in the day) who you rate a lot lower than just about everyone else, a fighter who you rate higher than just about everyone else, your take on a certain fight or decision from any era, a minority view on how a hypothetical match up would go, etc. You get the picture.

This took off really well last time and, given it's been a slow day so far, hopefully this could give us all something to at least get our teeth in to.

I'll get the ball rolling with a few unpopular boxing opinions of my own, which tend to go against general consensus and ruffle a few feathers.....

* The Manny Pacquiao, Tim Bradley fight from last summer just wasn't anything like the highway robbery that just about everyone else reported it as.

* Roy Jones Jr starts as favourite against just about any other Light-Heavyweight who ever drew breath, with the exception of Bob Foster (Bob being the narrow-ish favourite, for me) and, perhaps, Ezzard Charles who I'd put at 50:50.

* James J Corbett is, perhaps, the most overrated fighter in history.

* Mike Tyson at his best would beat both Lennox Lewis and Larry Holmes in their pomp.

* Tommy Ryan is the most underrated all-time great of them all - even more underrated (in relative terms, remember) than Mr Burley and Mr Langford.

Any more for any more, then? If you've got an unpopular boxing opinion that you feel sure plenty of people will disagree with, the floor is yours and hopefully it'll get the debate flying again.

Cheers, everyone.

Great thread... and that's not my first point.

Lewis is an ATG top 5 heavy

Pacquiao is a p4p ATG

Leonard beats Floyd

1-0 against, Cuevas, Shields, Duran, Hill, Benitez, Andries with some of them in great style and others when far past his best against younger, bigger men.
1-1 with Leonard. Id back to beat anyone at 154, although that is conjecture. Champion from welter to light heavy in a supreme era.

Hearns is closer to underrated than over in my opinion.



I think all heavyweights get more attention than their talent justifies.

1. Hearns is underrated...On Boxing skill alone he's better than any welter-middle in history.....

2. Duran is woefully overrated....Lost to every elusive operator he ever faced...who boxed him!!

3. Curry looked like a Schindler's list extra against Honey and lost...Can Starling and Breland both be wrong when they said Honey was average.......

They did prove the case!!...............

4. Anybody who has never been World champion needs to be marked down by history...Because like winning a major in Golf it is the ultimate..........Sorry Langford and Burley..

Monty better than Harrington for sure...but should he be higher........

No sirreeee...........................

Ricky Hatton cried like a woman when he got beat by Schenshenko. Was embarrassing. Worse than Gazza.

No excuse, if you get beat, you get beat, all part of the trade, but there was snots etc running down his face.

People felt sorry for him, my opinion is he was like a woman

Number four is a load of rubbish Truss when you are afforded the opportunity to win one.

Monty had the chance to win multiple majors so that analogy falls on it's arse.

My opinion is my opinion..............How do you know they don't freeze at the ultimate level..?????????

When it's all on the line people freeze..look at Monty........great at winning like Phil when it's not important..

Reborn-DeeMcK-Reborn wrote:Ricky Hatton cried like a woman when he got beat by Schenshenko. Was embarrassing. Worse than Gazza.

No excuse, if you get beat, you get beat, all part of the trade, but there was snots etc running down his face.

People felt sorry for him, my opinion is he was like a woman

I'm not what you'd call a man in touch with his feminine side, but I honestly see nothing shameful about crying after a defeat. Respect fighters for getting in their and doing it.

Is that how women usually react when you hit them with a nasty left to the short rib?

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:My opinion is my opinion..............How do you know they don't freeze at the ultimate level..?????????

When it's all on the line people freeze..look at Monty........great at winning like Phil when it's not important..

Uh, well Burley wiped the floor with a guy often ranked 2nd greatest light heavy ever. Got outmuscled by the greatest light heavy ever, but by all accounts didn't freeze.

The highest level in Burleys day wasn't really the world title, all the best fighters were in the black murderers row.

Lots of World champions lost in non title contests..............

How many golfers have beaten Woods in meaningless tournaments..

Good grief

Lets compare racial prejudice Truss with Colin Montgomery not being able to win a major, outdone even yourself this time.

JBW, I agree there's nothing wrong with shedding a tear or 2. Like Barker against Martinez. He was upset, fair enough.

But Hatton could barely string a sentence together, could hardly breathe he was blubbering that much. Took the peepee.

Just thought it was awful, watching the guy doing the post fight interview turn into a shrink.

Dear oh dear...

I'll ignore the idiot...........

Ghosty what I'm saying is they may have been the greatest thing since slice bread...But when it really matters is when you see the real person!!!

Not their fault but we never saw them in the ultimate fight..

A world title back then was the ultimate........Nervous energy and all that..

Not all the titles were the ultimate Truss because simply you had boxers who simply weren't good enough holding them. Maxim, Mills, Lesnevich, LaMotta, Cerdan etc. were all very good but they weren't the best by any means.

Pacquaio would have knocked Mayweather out if they'd fought in 09'.
Alexander will stop Brook on the middle rounds.
Foreman knocks out Ali if the fight is in America.

The first one in retrospect would never have happened.

Stay with me Ghosty............

How many people can beat Phil Taylor in non TV events and Woods in smaller competitions when the pressure is off...............Quite a few....

When it really matters how many beat them??...............Not many because it's life changing winning a TV major or golfing major and people freeze...

Now at the highest level with one ultimate life changing crown at stake these guys were never tested...

For me that means they get marked down.......not their fault but life aint fair..

I didn't think so at the time, only since the Mosley fight where Floyd was caught and hurt. I just see Pacquaio landing big at various times throughout and feel that it may have been to much for Floyd.
Defensively brilliant but the amount of shots from angles that Pacquaio was throwing, some would have got through big.

Dear oh dear...................

Ricky Hatton isn't really a man of the people. He is incredibly wealthy who played his part very well.

You can't really mark them down for something they were never given the chance to prove.

The ultimate prize for Marshall, Bivins, Burley, Chase, Cocoa Kid, Williams, Burley, Booker, Charles and Moore was bragging rights over the rest of them. Each and every one of them could have got a title shot if they played the game (Charles and Moore much sooner) but their integrity meant that for Burley giving Moore a real beating meant more than selling out to win a world title. You can use that argument against your Grahams, Eastmans and the like who had the ability to be very very good boxers but couldn't apply it when it meant most to them.

I would even say Wills and Langford were different to the BMR in that respect because of the time and effort they put into chasing Demspey and Johnson but in itself by virtue of being black they couldn't afford to have an off night like their white counterparts.

Yes you can.................How many grand prix drivers were better than Senna???

But never got the chance to prove it.....................

RanjitPatel wrote:I didn't think so at the time, only since the Mosley fight where Floyd was caught and hurt. I just see Pacquaio landing big at various times throughout and feel that it may have been to much for Floyd.
Defensively brilliant but the amount of shots from angles that Pacquaio was throwing, some would have got through big.

Mosley has and always will be a bigger puncher than Pacquiao.

They said a similar thing when Chavez faced Whitaker, ultimately Pacmans only hope would have been a lapse in concentration from Mayweather which are so few and far between that you can count them on half a hand.

If you are wealthy you can't be a man of the people.............

Bull..........

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:
3. Curry looked like a Schindler's list extra against Honey and lost...Can Starling and Breland both be wrong when they said Honey was average.......

curry spoke very highly of honeyghan... When he'd finished making his excuses. Of course starling lost to 3 guys honeyghan beat and breland just the one... so maybe they werent all that themselves and just got him at the right time when his legendary partying caught up with him

Starling lost about the same amount of times as Honey tapped him on the shoulder during the fight..

To thank him...

Breland lost to Vaca as well Milky who Honey dominated.

End of the day Curry, Breland, Starling and Honeyghan were much of a muchness.

P4P number 1...much of a muchness..........

Dear oh dear....

Has there ever been a Brit number 1 pound for pound???

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Has there ever been a Brit number 1 pound for pound???

Jimmy Wilde

Wow..........so there has been one??

Are you sure.....I mean p4ps are much of a muchness back home!!

End of the day Honey beat Curry, Vaca, Bumphus and Blocker
Breland and Starling beat Honey
Vaca beat Breland
Blocker, Bumphus and Curry beat Starling


He could have been proclaimed as the messiah for all I care Truss, that era of Welterweights is epitomized by the 'win some, lose some' maxim.

One more time...........................Breland and Starling both said Honey was an ordinary fighter that got lucky..............

Starling-Honey - 89-82
Breland - 20-15

Before the finish...............................................

end of.............

I think the Olympian and the Simon Brown-basher both know what they are talking about...

.. Honey lost his at the end if his reign, though so you could argue in their primes, he tops the list ghosty

Starling beats Brown, Honey and Breland..............and is in the same league as Honey????

Curry beats Starling twice, Mccrory and wins a wbc jr midd title and is too......

Brown beat Blocker who lost to starling..................Brown is higher than Honey.. Sonny!!!

You Sir are a joke..

Brown...Breland...........Honey...............= Starling

Give me three Honey victories that compare..............

Apart from a half dead Curry...............

"Told you he beat a burnt out Curry" - Who said that??

Why don't we go and ask Jorge Vaca his opinion on it?
What about Bumphus or Blocker?

I don't really care what any American boxer says to be honest Truss.

Jorge Vaca??

If I were you I'd forget he existed...

"I hate Starling.....I'm gonna ram my fist down his throat"........

Are the Olympian and Simon brown basher ordinary too then truss... Or do only their wins count, not their losses to... 1,2,3,4 honey victims between them?

You sir are a highly selective wummy beefster

Simon Brown.......Mark Breland...........Lloyd Honeyghan.............- Marlon Starling!!

Three wins please?????????????????????

I love that pumpkin defence...........You know the one.............

Where the thug from the club throws punches and you counter all night.......

Like taking candy from a baby...............

"Told you he had a bit of a punch and nothing else.....Beat a burnt out Curry" "Anybody could have beaten Curry that night"

Youtube watch the post fight interview............

.He just didn't respect Honeyghan before or after.........and he was right not to...

I'm always left wondering who the hell is Rene Jacquot?

three wins............

Lets give you 3 wins, curry, blocker, bumphus... All too good for starling when he fought them.

The honey that fought curry was a different fighter to the headhunting big time Charlie he became.

Poor old don. Terrible thing weight draining. One day, you ko mcrory, in your finest hour, and just 9 months later, you're apparently too dead at the weight to lift a glove.

Curry got battered by the better man on the day. No arguments. The raggamuffin tore him a new one. Honey had his number and would have beaten any version of Curry.Easy win for Honey.

I'm being nice to you asking for three Starling beat number 1 contender Tommy Ayers and Lupe Aquino too...

Johnny Bumphus and Maurice Blocker...

I have no love for any of the mid 80's lot Truss for the simply reason they were all damn lucky that the main men had all moved up, lets say Leonard, Hearns or Benitez hangs around for just one more year, we don't even have this discussion. Beneficiaries of circumstance and that includes Honeyghan who wasn't that great himself.