French clubs increase salary cap

Once again the French are strengthening their grip on European rugby.

The Ligue Nationale de Rugby in France have extended the salary cap in the Top 14 up to 10million euros for next season.

According to Midi Olympique, the change sees the salary cap increase from 9.5million euros.

The cap will now be frozen for the next two seasons, avoiding a further increase.

One notable change to the cap is that youth players will no longer be included in the salary cap, unless their salaries are greater than 50,000 euros a year.

Thats bad news for everybody else including the French national team.

Everyone hold onto your hats, there may have just been an extra million euros added to each french club...

The real question is whether they can actually afford it, on a sustainable basis. If they can, fair play.

I certainly don't feel like the French are "strengthening their grip on European rugby" though. Their international team is a mess, and their club sides in Europe aren't particularly devastating either. I think the record of the English and Irish clubs/regions certainly stacks up against them. They've frankly wasted a lot of money in some cases.

fES - have you watched Clermont Auvergne this season - look pretty awesome to me !

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:fES - have you watched Clermont Auvergne this season - look pretty awesome to me !

That'll be the Scottish, Canadian and Welsh quality seeping through.

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:fES - have you watched Clermont Auvergne this season - look pretty awesome to me !

Yes they can look awesome.

However based purely on matches against us, Toulouse and toulon are someway below them.

French sides have so often "looked awesome" - but I'm pointing purely to success in terms of winning.

I'm fairly sure a French side will always win their domestic league, so the question is how does all this money translate into European success?

Not so much so far. Maybe we're about to see a long period of French domination of the European competitions backed by all this cash, but I don't think so.

I suppose what it means is that they can all sign another top player in the Sexton, Roberts, Lydiate category.

funnyExiledScot wrote:The real question is whether they can actually afford it, on a sustainable basis. If they can, fair play.

I certainly don't feel like the French are "strengthening their grip on European rugby" though. Their international team is a mess, and their club sides in Europe aren't particularly devastating either. I think the record of the English and Irish clubs/regions certainly stacks up against them. They've frankly wasted a lot of money in some cases.

Unfortunate use of words exiled, in that I know what you mean of course but 'fair' is the last thing that comes to mind when French club rugby meets the rest of us.

Yep, I do get your point about them wasting loads of it but how much easier then might it be for English, Irish teams...okay, Welsh, Scottish and Italian ones too.. to progress in Europe if the French were limited to a similar spend per side as us? I mean Clermont is an International All Sorts and Toulon is and will be even moreso next season.

If this continuing push by French sides is followed by English sides, and if European rugby is redrawn under that funding free-for-all design that won't be kept at bay by wish-washy rules...then we'll have our great opening up of European rugby as a small group of sides push to the top and stay there using financial muscle.

Oh great more money for them to steal our players.
I bet all antions have had enough, the only one they hav really untouched is New Zealand, got a feeling that will change next season.
it's beond a joke, how can any other nation compete with a 10m sallery cap.
Thats even doubling the English salasry cap of 4.25 m
Bluddy ridiculous
I hope the National french team carry on to struggle and make the FRU see what they are doing to the state of their international game. Phillipe Saint Andre isn't going to be very happy.

There is not one club in France that can sustain these wages on their own, there are about half a dozen who have very rich owners who plunge money into their clubs. I hope that the IRB bring in what FIFA are bringing into football and that is a fair play rule where you can only spend what you the club can generate. OK this will still give the French an advantage over most but at least it will be easier for us to keep our players.

If the clubs can't sustain performance with these highly paid groups of players it will eventually blow up in their faces.

In the meantime, the SH
Layers will just keep milking it for all their worth.

Nice retirement packages to be had.

Wasn't there a thing about Toulouse not making a profit last year for the first time in ages? That suggests they CAN afford it.

HammerofThunor wrote:Wasn't there a thing about Toulouse not making a profit last year for the first time in ages? That suggests they CAN afford it.

Note, NOT making a profit, so if they are not making a profit now, how are they going to make a profit with more wages to pay. A lot of the finances around French clubs are all fudged by the rich owners putting money in anyway.

Well if Toulouse don't keep winning the title they will soon have to recruit like the likes of Racing and Toulon, and last year they spent more than usual didn't they to keep up/ahead???

The problem is not just the French spending big and making losses, it's pressuring the rest of europe to pay players more to stop them from going to France, and also the wage demands of lesser players have risen with the crazy French signings, for example players like Lewis Evans, Daf Hewitt, and Madigan must be looking at the 100's of thousands earnt by their former team mates and think, hang on, I'm around all season, I play more, and contribute more than they did, are they really worth 3 times what I am??? This could be very dangerous for brit and Irish rugby, having to pay our own players inflated wages to keep hold, when SH lesser players and retirees will do the same job for less.

I can see this ending in tears French ones

thebluesmancometh wrote:Well if Toulouse don't keep winning the title they will soon have to recruit like the likes of Racing and Toulon, and last year they spent more than usual didn't they to keep up/ahead???

The problem is not just the French spending big and making losses, it's pressuring the rest of europe to pay players more to stop them from going to France, and also the wage demands of lesser players have risen with the crazy French signings, for example players like Lewis Evans, Daf Hewitt, and Madigan must be looking at the 100's of thousands earnt by their former team mates and think, hang on, I'm around all season, I play more, and contribute more than they did, are they really worth 3 times what I am??? This could be very dangerous for brit and Irish rugby, having to pay our own players inflated wages to keep hold, when SH lesser players and retirees will do the same job for less.

That's exactly it. In order to survive you have to try to do two things to sustain competitiveness with French sides -
1. try to head forward with wage increases yourself to try to keep your own central players at home or at your club;
2. buy in even more outside players to try to compete on the playing field as the French sides increasingly become International standard units.

So with unlimited money in one League, other leagues are forced to try and follow and that's begins to impact on teams that can't sustain the madness plus it also means National sides begin to see the issues the French National side allegedly already experiences - fewer players being central figures in their own League.

Ok so the French clubs have an extra half a million big ones to spend on wages, this could be a busy summer, and a worrying one for the British and Irish fans. Who is going to be prime beef for the French clubs ?

Perhaps the Aussie backs will be looked at, Beale, Cooper, Barnes, Iaone, all could be tempted. South African forwards perhaps the Beast, or the likes of couple of the All Blacks could be tempted. From a Welsh point of view, I would worry about any of the Welsh international players being targeted, who else is worried that they could lose out this summer ?

I don't worry so much about player drain yet..Wales have been hit quite badly by it so I understand their concerns.

For me the first worry is that the extra funds makes the French that much stronger again.... able to compete in Top14 easily and finding it easy too to get to the final stages of any European competition that might emerge. I worry that if they hit the top this time, they'll be extremely difficult to dislodge...and if they have much bigger budgets than ours well that just isn't a fairly run contest...it's a sham.

But when that happens it's then that I would begin to worry about player drain becoming a flood as players not only chase money, they chase glory and cup wins. So it's another incentive to leave certainly for Irish players who remained in Ireland not just because of tax breaks but because they were part of winning sides.

SecretFly wrote:I don't worry so much about player drain yet..Wales have been hit quite badly by it so I understand their concerns.

For me the first worry is that the extra funds makes the French that much stronger again.... able to compete in Top14 easily and finding it easy too to get to the final stages of any European competition that might emerge. I worry that if they hit the top this time, they'll be extremely difficult to dislodge...and if they have much bigger budgets than ours well that just isn't a fairly run contest...it's a sham.

But when that happens it's then that I would begin to worry about player drain becoming a flood as players not only chase money, they chase glory and cup wins. So it's another incentive to leave certainly for Irish players who remained in Ireland not just because of tax breaks but because they were part of winning sides.

You may not worry yet, but as the money like the Sexton deal becomes more the norm I can't see how Irish players can resist.

Do you Think the Sexton deal is a one off bumper thing, or could it be the beginning?

Also, what is a worry as well, contracts seem to be two bits of nothing these days, as seen when Northampton seemed to come up with 250 big ones to but out George North's contract. So do not think, that just because the player has signed a contract that he will still not leave.

The final of the HC every year will soon be an all French affair. Apart from odd occasion where a brilliant young home grown team emerges from another country. But soon after they emerge, they too will be stripped of their assets, which will be used to further strengthen Toulon etc.

thebluesmancometh wrote:

SecretFly wrote:I don't worry so much about player drain yet..Wales have been hit quite badly by it so I understand their concerns.

For me the first worry is that the extra funds makes the French that much stronger again.... able to compete in Top14 easily and finding it easy too to get to the final stages of any European competition that might emerge. I worry that if they hit the top this time, they'll be extremely difficult to dislodge...and if they have much bigger budgets than ours well that just isn't a fairly run contest...it's a sham.

But when that happens it's then that I would begin to worry about player drain becoming a flood as players not only chase money, they chase glory and cup wins. So it's another incentive to leave certainly for Irish players who remained in Ireland not just because of tax breaks but because they were part of winning sides.

You may not worry yet, but as the money like the Sexton deal becomes more the norm I can't see how Irish players can resist.

Do you Think the Sexton deal is a one off bumper thing, or could it be the beginning?

I'm admitting that bluesman... it's all in there I'm just saying my first worry is French sides becoming excessively dominant and then Irish players flowing off to where the action is.

Salary cap does not always mean extra funds... In fact I am puzzled by this decision given the lack of growth in french rugby (as a product) which is line with the rest of the economy. This will just increase the gap between Toulon / Racing and the small teams.

Looking at the Clermont team they have nearly the depth for a French XV and a Foreign XV. Both arent' bad.

French XV:

01 Thomas Domingo
02 Benjamen Kayser
03 Vincent Debaty
04 Loic Jacquet
05 Julien Pierre
06 Alexandre Lapandry
07 Julien Bonnaire
08 Elvis Vermuelen
09 Morgan Parra
10 David Skrela
11 Julien Malzieu
12 Wesley Fofana
13 Aurelien Rougerie
14 Anthony Floch
15 Jean Marcellin Buttin

That team has 14 French international on it.

However you could just as easily go with a Foreign XV:

01 Davit Zirakashvili (Georgia)
02 Ti’i Paulo (Samoa)
03 Daniel Kotze (South Africa)
04 Nathan Hines (Scotland)
05 Jamie Cudmore (Canada)
06 Julien Bardy (Portugal)
07 Gerhard Vosloo (South Africa)
08 Vito Kolelishvili (Georgia)
09 Kevin Senio (New Zealand)
10 Brock James (Australia)
11 Napoleon Nalaga (Fiji)
12 Benson Stanley (New Zealand)
13 Regan King (New Zealand)
14 Sitiveni Sivivatu (New Zealand)
15 Lee Byrne (Wales)

OK so apart from taking liberties in the backrow thats an amazing Foreign XV considering the French one has 14 capped players.

That is incredible. There are 31 players in the Clermont squad to have played international rugby.

Toulon have signed drew Mitchell haven't they?

mikey_philVIII wrote:Toulon have signed drew Mitchell haven't they?

Yes and Brian Habana. Adds great options to the back three.

I don't care how much the French spend; that's their business.

I've seen enough this season (and in recent seasons) to suggest that clubs/provinces/regions can beat them.

There's much more than money that goes into making a good team.

It all reminds me of those nasty RL clubs stealing our stars and paying players to play. Including one of the great mercenaries of all time Jiffy Davies.

Guys its a pro sport and money talks.

If the French English Irish etc etc can afford the wages good luck to them.

Ominously the espn report http://www.espnscrum.com/france-top-14-2012-13/rugby/story/180729.html states

The new figure is a €500,000 increase on the present limit but crucially
youth players will no longer be included in the salary cap unless they
earn in excess of €50,000 (£43,000) a year in a move designed to
encourage the development of fresh talent.

Now this may be window dressing for domestic consumption.

But there seems to be degree of of an investment bubble mentality developing in certain parts of the rugby world.

Japan, France and (dare I say?) Saracens.

After the dotcom boom and bust and the bleedin' obvious banking crisis, I wonder where this is all going to end when so many clubs are chasing so few prizes and overextending themselves in the process.
Surely the IRB, if there was a critical mass of brain cells, would realise that expenditure should be related to income.

In England Gloucester's sugar daddy Tom Walkinshaw passed away and fortunately his estate has provided a degree of continuity. At Wasps, there's been a much more pinball approach but at least with the latest owner they've won a replay.

I fear an increase of instability in the professional game.

Remember. If a major club/franchise collapses, then there will be a sudden influx of top players instantly placed on the market and the financial ripples will go further than the epicentre.

Similar to the collapse of Woolies.

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:I can see this ending in tears French ones

Absolutely agree. They are learning nothing from the lessons of football. Whilst football is now desperately trying to claw back towards fair play rules, French rugby is going in completely the opposite direction.

Rich owners are all good an well, but we know what happens when they leave, or when their wealth diminishes.

I don't think this circus is going to last very long, and we must not respond by trying to match the silly money. It'll ruin us.

funnyExiledScot wrote:

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:I can see this ending in tears French ones

Absolutely agree. They are learning nothing from the lessons of football. Whilst football is now desperately trying to claw back towards fair play rules, French rugby is going in completely the opposite direction.

Rich owners are all good an well, but we know what happens when they leave, or when their wealth diminishes.

I don't think this circus is going to last very long, and we must not respond by trying to match the silly money. It'll ruin us.

In Football these new Financial "Fair Play" laws are being brought into protect the status quo of big clubs, rather than to try and even the playing field!

No, they are trying to prevent clubs loading themselves with unsustainable debt, and spending money on players which they don't have.

Of course it benefits "big clubs". By definition those are the clubs with the most fans commanding the most revenue. They will have more money to spend. That's exactly how it should be.

There shouldn't be an "even playing field". That should not be the aim. You want clubs to strive to increase revenue, by attracting new local fans through the gates, and increasing supporter interaction. You also want therefore to reward those clubs who are able to pull in new fans and increase revenue.

The issue of rich owners is that they aren't gifting this money to the clubs, they are loaning it (albeit with little or no interest). When these guys leave or go bust, they can recall these loans. It put clubs in the peril of administration, and risks the whole game. The reason? Clubs agree to salaries they can never sustain without these debts, and they end up with liabilities they can never hope to repay through genuine profit. When clubs get desperate for money, ticket prices inevitably go through the roof.

That's what we need to stop, before player salaries get so far out of hand that the whole system faces ruin.

Let clubs spend what they earn, but don't let them spend a penny more.

FES - it's just occurred to me that your real name might be Gordon Brown, your day job being the hangdog honourable member for Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath...

funnyExiledScot we've heard for years that French rugby will go bust same as people always saying for English football's prem League, I don't think they will.

Dorothy_Mantooth agree that it will help the big clubs, I think they didn't like Chelsea then Man City getting rich backers and outbidding them.

The fair play rules means the rich clubs can spend more but poor clubs can't get a rich backer to compete, and many journalists, fans and people working in football are concerned that UEFA's Financial Fair Play rules will reduce the excitement of the Premier League and that the larger clubs will dominate the domestic competitions.

However it may be better to look at the Bundesliga
The Bundesliga already operates in a Financial Fair Play environment. The majority of German clubs break-even and there is political pressure used by the Bundesliga to discourage overspending. Other than Wolfsburg and Levekeusen the clubs operate on a model whereby the fans own 51% of each Bundeliga club. Consequently, there is no scope for wealthy owners to inject huge funds into buy success - the wealthy benefactor model doesn't operate in Germany

funnyExiledScot wrote:No, they are trying to prevent clubs loading themselves with unsustainable debt, and spending money on players which they don't have.

Of course it benefits "big clubs". By definition those are the clubs with the most fans commanding the most revenue. They will have more money to spend. That's exactly how it should be.

There shouldn't be an "even playing field". That should not be the aim. You want clubs to strive to increase revenue, by attracting new local fans through the gates, and increasing supporter interaction. You also want therefore to reward those clubs who are able to pull in new fans and increase revenue.

The issue of rich owners is that they aren't gifting this money to the clubs, they are loaning it (albeit with little or no interest). When these guys leave or go bust, they can recall these loans. It put clubs in the peril of administration, and risks the whole game. The reason? Clubs agree to salaries they can never sustain without these debts, and they end up with liabilities they can never hope to repay through genuine profit. When clubs get desperate for money, ticket prices inevitably go through the roof.

That's what we need to stop, before player salaries get so far out of hand that the whole system faces ruin.

Let clubs spend what they earn, but don't let them spend a penny more.

Trouble is FeS, That books are not open, regulation is announced but not auditable and accountants/lawyers exist.

T'was always inevitable since rugby placed its destiny in the professional game.

Look at the EU. When was the last time the accounts were approved by an auditor? Dark forces apply just as in the Universe, 94% of its mass/matter is totally unexplained by dark matter.

True Tiger. Unseen forces are the only possible thing that have kept Rob Andrew's grandly upholstered backside in his current office for this long.

The larger clubs will always dominate, always will always have. That is only distorted when some rich bloke just piles in unlimited wads of cash in a short terms experiment that usually ends in tears, whilst at the same time inflating wages for everyone else and damaging the game.

I don't know why we're so scared of French rugby. Given the money they've ploughed in, their teams are specatularly unsuccessful in Europe (and their international side isn't coming close to realising its potential). Racing Metro have spent a stinking fortune over the last few seasons, and yet Edinburgh debagged them twice last year in the HC.

The key is not to follow these guys. The salary cap in England was an excellent response to rising wages, and in my view it's done a great job of simply letting the French cut their own throats. We should continue to let that happen. Let them continue spending money they don't have and don't earn. If the rich owners are happy to pick up the slack then fine. I say this as a Scots fan, and clearly there is and will be a trend for Scots players to move towards the money. I have no issue with that. I'm much happier to see that happen than to see the SRU kill itself trying to hang onto internations by paying them salaries we can't afford.

Interestingly I was talking to a Toulon fan not long ago and he was saying that they are trying to promote themselves as the South East Region in France.

They have a lot of fans not just in Toulon but also in Marseilles and Nice which have massive populations.

They are also appealing to the wealthy areas in Monaco and Cannes and there is speculation they want to start playing more Top 14 games in Marseilles and Monte Carlo.

Well they're going to need to, to sustain the vast fortune they will be paying in salaries next season!

I agree Greytiger, for fair play to work accounts need to be open and audited properly. Frankly that ought to be a given.

Hound of Harrow wrote:I don't care how much the French spend; that's their business.

I've seen enough this season (and in recent seasons) to suggest that clubs/provinces/regions can beat them.

There's much more than money that goes into making a good team.

This, Ulster last year were a bad ref away from turning Clermont at home over, Tigers away to Toulon is also a prime exemple.
I would quite fancy Munster against Clermont in wet conditions unfortunately high temperatures in the south of france suggests it will be a high expensive running game which doesn't suit Munster at all.

We've done it once before VinceWLB

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZjMCkiA_iM

Probably the best rugby we have ever played.

I think that a backline of Murray, Keatley, Zebo, Laulala, Earls, Howlett, Jones - can compete.

It's up to Top14 to run Top14 as it sees fit and if that means injecting big money in there to attract big name stars...so be it. They have autonomy over their own league....nobody should dictate terms to them.

The problem arises when the big buck teams of Top14 go to battle with the other sides in Europe - then the disparity in resources is often not just apparent in the players playing but the very competitions themselves are downright weighed heavily in favour of Top14 sides even before a skilled ball is kicked or a blade of grass is spoiled by fancy side stepping feet.

The pan Europe competition, and all pan European competition actually, should have specific European ground rules (don't we hear a lot about that particular subject in recent months!). And I believe one of them should be a reasonably common ground budget for players entered into European competition.

That would not stop or interfere with French teams going where they want to go in terms of domestic competition but it would force them to decide on European squads that would fall within a certain budget constraint.

In short, rules that would force them to decide which highly paid players to keep in and which to leave out. A fairer actual contest on the field would be a positive development for European rugby rather than many of the current proposals which only talk about where the power should lie in relation to all the lovely money from the TV deals.

In National rugby you accept the constraints of size and eligibility as all Nations have to subscribe to the same conditions. That's why it's National/International rugby. But in club rugby, when some clubs have unlimited funds to buy in from anywhere in the world, there must be some jointly agreed limits to sustain inter-European competitiveness. If it's not a contest then it isn't a competition.

red_stag wrote:We've done it once before VinceWLB

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZjMCkiA_iM

Probably the best rugby we have ever played.

I think that a backline of Murray, Keatley, Zebo, Laulala, Earls, Howlett, Jones - can compete.

No Downey? thought he was immense against Quins.
They can indeed but they will need to be at the very top of their game, fitness may be crucial under those conditions.

SecretFly wrote:It's up to Top14 to run Top14 as it sees fit and if that means injecting big money in there to attract big name stars...so be it. They have autonomy over their own league....nobody should dictate terms to them.

The problem arises when the big buck teams of Top14 go to battle with the other sides in Europe - then the disparity in resources is often not just apparent in the players playing but the very competitions themselves are downright weighed heavily in favour of Top14 sides even before a skilled ball is kicked or a blade of grass is spoiled by fancy side stepping feet.

The pan Europe competition, and all pan European competition actually, should have specific European ground rules (don't we hear a lot about that particular subject in recent months!). And I believe one of them should be a reasonably common ground budget for players entered into European competition.

That would not stop or interfere with French teams going where they want to go in terms of domestic competition but it would force them to decide on European squads that would fall within a certain budget constraint.

In short, rules that would force them to decide which highly paid players to keep in and which to leave out. A fairer actual contest on the field would be a positive development for European rugby rather than many of the current proposals which only talk about where the power should lie in relation to all the lovely money from the TV deals.

In National rugby you accept the constraints of size and eligibility as all Nations have to subscribe to the same conditions. That's why it's National/International rugby. But in club rugby, when some clubs have unlimited funds to buy in from anywhere in the world, there must be some jointly agreed limits to sustain inter-European competitiveness. If it's not a contest then it isn't a competition.

That's a nice idea. How would you handle the central contracts issue with the Provinces (and potentially the Regions)? Do they count as 'free' because the provinces don't pay them (at all or is their pay just supplimented by the IRFU?) Or do you count the IRFU pay which inlcudes international pay (not included by anyone else)? Is there some breakdown of how much their pay is for provincial games and how much is for international games?

All this assumes that the French are actually dominating European competitions!! They aren't. Look at the history of winners and runners up in the HC, it's hardly confirmation that we need to take severe measures to stop the French from dominating! In fact, they've been so unsuccessful that they're trying to change the rules in their favour!!

I watched Leicester vs Toulon, and I really didn't think Toulon were getting value for money compared to Leicester, did you? It was a close game.

They are wasting fortunes over there. Let them get on with it.

VinceWLB wrote:

red_stag wrote:We've done it once before VinceWLB

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZjMCkiA_iM

Probably the best rugby we have ever played.

I think that a backline of Murray, Keatley, Zebo, Laulala, Earls, Howlett, Jones - can compete.

No Downey? thought he was immense against Quins.
They can indeed but they will need to be at the very top of their game, fitness may be crucial under those conditions.

Actually yes for some reason I forgot about him. I actually like the idea of Earls, Zebo and Howlett as the back three.

funnyExiledScot wrote:All this assumes that the French are actually dominating European competitions!! They aren't. Look at the history of winners and runners up in the HC, it's hardly confirmation that we need to take severe measures to stop the French from dominating! In fact, they've been so unsuccessful that they're trying to change the rules in their favour!!

I watched Leicester vs Toulon, and I really didn't think Toulon were getting value for money compared to Leicester, did you? It was a close game.

They are wasting fortunes over there. Let them get on with it.

It doesn't assume a word of that Exiled. It doesn't assume that at all. It states a fact that French Top14 sides are heavily equipped with highly paid pay-for-bucks players and that is a heavy advantage over sides that aren't close to them on that level. That's a real advantage before a ball is kicked to decide where the real talent lies.

So nope, up until now French rugby has not been dominating but how much easier would the journey through Europe for non-French sides have been had they (the French) been functioning without the advantage? They might be embarrassed by that history of 'ifs'

HammerofThunor wrote:

That's a nice idea. How would you handle the central contracts issue with the Provinces (and potentially the Regions)? Do they count as 'free' because the provinces don't pay them (at all or is their pay just supplimented by the IRFU?) Or do you count the IRFU pay which inlcudes international pay (not included by anyone else)? Is there some breakdown of how much their pay is for provincial games and how much is for international games?

It would mean what it means...when entering European competition... each wage packet of each player (regardless of source) would add to a total for each squad that would fall within a certain agreed limit. It doesn't matter who the paymaster is, it matters that each side entering a European competition knows that the squads of each other competitior is in the same reasonable region price range.
A player gets paid, he has an income at the end of the year. Whether a big French millionaire, and English millionaire or the IRFU pays the wages is irrelevant...it's an amount that is on paper somewhere that can be entered into the overall squad limit.

Firstly, the French would never accept it. Why should they? If the owners are going to gamble the house on black, they at least deserve to cast the dice, and spend the reward (should it materialise).

Secondly, I personally love the Heineken Cup, in it's current form, and I cannot for the life of me understand why so many want to seemingly rip it apart and change the rules.

This whole notion of trying to legislate for "fairness" is pointing in the wrong direction. I'm not suggesting clubs only spend what they earn (in the UK and Ireland, I don't care about France) in order to make things "fair", I'm suggesting it so that our clubs and regions don't perish in some silly attempt to combat the stupidity currently manifesting itself in France.

Were the French sides to completely dominate all European competitions for the next three years, I may think differently. But currently, overall, it's just a hugely expensive failure, and they wouldn't be so frantically trying to reorder the European structures if everything was going well.

They are also destroying their national team, and we should certainly encourage that!