Wales recent record

First topic message reminder :

So as usual poor old Wales have been the victim of misused quantitative data, quite often actually. I'm not really sure why or how our third team winning one and then losing one (as expected) against Japan has any bearing on the team that won back-to-back 6 Nations championships. If you consider that then our recent record contains a 30-3 win and a 40-6 win over highly ranked teams, and we also went through winning 4 games on the bounce without conceding a single try. We were expected to lose SA, they have an exceptional team right now and are well ahead of Wales and everyone else bar just the one team in black. It's not such a bad recent record as made out by everyone if you ask me.

  

quinsforever wrote:

RDSguru wrote:IMO, I am just pointing out, that I don't take the world rankings at face value.

Feel free to have your own opinions though

they should put that stirrer emticon up for us to use LOL

No way, between you, tj and saint all the pots would be hiding all the kettles!

How you can say a team that has not beaten NZ, SA or Aus for years, is 7th in the rankings is a better than than the one third in the rankings who have beaten the aforesaid teams is quite quite ridiculous.

We have not discussed the rankings - you have ignored them because they show the truth. Wales are not the best team in the 6N.

Its not antiwelsh to proclaim the truth. Its unutterably stupid to claim black is white and anyone who disgrees with you is a bigot. You really do look ridiculous you know.

TJ wrote:So you don't care about your dismal record against the SH teams?  When did you last beat one of the big three?  Lowly scotland have beaten both SA and Aus recently.  I wouldn't attempt to claim it made them a better side than their ranking

You act like the biggest and most pathetic spoilt child on here and I don't know why the mods don't take action against it. I've told you time and time again you stick the boot into Wales and here is another example! I've also pointed out that it's ironic to criticise seeing as your team has such a dismal record against all teams and in particular, the one you really have it in for. Stop acting like a spoilt child when someone disagrees with you and stop living in denial. Pathetic, childish behaviour.

 

quinsforever wrote:on a small side note, wales should be thankful that england are ahead of them in the IRB rankings, otherwise wales would be a lot lower than 6th. Victories against teams higher up in the rankings count much more favourably points wise i am told than victories against lower ranked teams.

you're welcome.  

Whats really annoying is that when Eng, Scot and Ire get a win over the big 3, they come down to Wales seriously wanting to put the record straight carrying less ranking points for us to hope to take off them!

In other words we lose to them when they're ranked lower!

It's really tough being a Welsh fan...

Please point out where I stick the boot into wales? I do love your calling of WUM and your insults.

The Saint wrote:

TJ wrote:So you don't care about your dismal record against the SH teams?  When did you last beat one of the big three?  Lowly scotland have beaten both SA and Aus recently.  I wouldn't attempt to claim it made them a better side than their ranking

You act like the biggest and most pathetic spoilt child on here and I don't know why the mods don't take action against it. I've told you time and time again you stick the boot into Wales and here is another example! I've also pointed out that it's ironic to criticise seeing as your team has such a dismal record against all teams and in particular, the one you really have it in for. Stop acting like a spoilt child when someone disagrees with you and stop living in denial. Pathetic, childish behaviour.

 

To be fair you;ve spent the last 48 hours insulting people and generally belittling other peoples posts.

FGS bullsbok can't you read. I don't appreciate posts that deny something happened. We had a lot of constructive debate going on and TJ ruined it again. Funny how he has the audacity to complain about Welsh posters doing that and run crying to the mods like a baby when somebody tells him the truth. No idea why he's allowed to get away with his childish behaviour.

TJ wrote:How you can say a team that has not beaten NZ, SA or Aus for years, is 1.  7th  in  the rankings is a better than than the one third in the rankings who have beaten the aforesaid teams is quite quite ridiculous.

We have not discussed the rankings - 2.  you have ignored them because they show the truth.   3.  Wales are not the best team in the 6N.  

Its not antiwelsh to proclaim the truth.  Its unutterably stupid to claim black is white and anyone who disgrees with you is a bigot.  4.  You really do look ridiculous you know.

1 Again?

2 I spent 3 mins and 42 seconds gathering data

3 Reigning 6ns champions

4 IMO your comments (in the quotes) look ridiculous

The truth is Wales are deservedly 6th in the rankings and England 3rd. England are the better side as their record and the rankings shows. Your inability to understand and accept differing opinions and your continual baseless assertions of anti welsh posting look ridiculous. Your personal insults are tiresome. Not even very inventive or funny.

The Saint wrote:FGS bullsbok can't you read. I don't appreciate posts that deny something happened. We had a lot of constructive debate going on and TJ ruined it again. Funny how he has the audacity to complain about Welsh posters doing that and run crying to the mods like a baby when somebody tells him the truth. No idea why he's allowed to get away with his childish behaviour.

Stop getting so worked up , yes we're all passionate rugby fans but this is just a forum . Everyone is entitled to their own opinion even wums . So if everyone can just stick to the rugby and not make assumptions about people they dont even know , the quality of discussions on 606 will improve

RDSguru wrote:

quinsforever wrote:on a small side note, wales should be thankful that england are ahead of them in the IRB rankings, otherwise wales would be a lot lower than 6th. Victories against teams higher up in the rankings count much more favourably points wise i am told than victories against lower ranked teams.

you're welcome.  

Whats really annoying is that when Eng, Scot and Ire get a win over the big 3, they come down to Wales seriously wanting to put the record straight carrying less ranking points for us to hope to take off them!

In other words we lose to them when they're ranked lower!

It's really tough being a Welsh fan...

i feel for you, i do. emotional rollercoaster. we english fans have a more even ride from a consisteny perspective but we always seem to get beaten by someone in the 6N who then beats us around the head with it for a while

and every once in a while we pull a whopper result out of the bag, NZ last yr, RWC 2007 after 1st game vs SA.

not as bad for either of us as being any kind of a football fan though. that must be horrible.

RDSguru wrote:

TJ wrote:How you can say a team that has not beaten NZ, SA or Aus for years, is 1.  7th  in  the rankings is a better than than the one third in the rankings who have beaten the aforesaid teams is quite quite ridiculous.

We have not discussed the rankings - 2.  you have ignored them because they show the truth.   3.  Wales are not the best team in the 6N.  

Its not antiwelsh to proclaim the truth.  Its unutterably stupid to claim black is white and anyone who disgrees with you is a bigot.  4.  You really do look ridiculous you know.

1 Again?

2 I spent 3 mins and 42 seconds gathering data

3 Reigning 6ns champions

4 IMO your comments (in the quotes) look ridiculous

O FFS -    

quinsforever wrote:

not as bad for either of us as being any kind of a football fan though. that must be horrible.

I'd rather be english than a football fan!

I feel dirty.....

TJ wrote:

RDSguru wrote:

TJ wrote:How you can say a team that has not beaten NZ, SA or Aus for years, is 1.  7th  in  the rankings is a better than than the one third in the rankings who have beaten the aforesaid teams is quite quite ridiculous.

We have not discussed the rankings - 2.  you have ignored them because they show the truth.   3.  Wales are not the best team in the 6N.  

Its not antiwelsh to proclaim the truth.  Its unutterably stupid to claim black is white and anyone who disgrees with you is a bigot.  4.  You really do look ridiculous you know.

1 Again?

2 I spent 3 mins and 42 seconds gathering data

3 Reigning 6ns champions

4 IMO your comments (in the quotes) look ridiculous

O FFS -    

Chill TJ, Chill...

Bullsbok wrote:

The Saint wrote:FGS bullsbok can't you read. I don't appreciate posts that deny something happened. We had a lot of constructive debate going on and TJ ruined it again. Funny how he has the audacity to complain about Welsh posters doing that and run crying to the mods like a baby when somebody tells him the truth. No idea why he's allowed to get away with his childish behaviour.

Stop getting so worked up , yes we're all passionate rugby fans  but this is just a forum . Everyone is entitled to their own opinion even wums . So if everyone can just stick to the rugby and not make assumptions about people they dont even know , the quality of  discussions on 606 will improve

TBH while I think you do post sensible comments, mostly, you did enter into the discussion yesterday with regurgitated comments based on assumptions of Wales fans and their team because of what a couple WUM posters said, or what the media said. I don't see why you would just have a go at Wales when it happens among every nation. All I did was point this out. As I had previously pointed out the truth in my OP, I don't see why the said posters should come in and have the audacity to deny their behaviour after engaging in it for so long. As you can see the behaviour has only got worse and a lot more childish as I've continued to raise the awareness. It's all really repetitve and boring. I do appareciate that this evening's comments from you were posted with what seemed like good intentions though.

Just seen the time..

Night folks

RDSguru wrote:

TJ wrote:

RDSguru wrote:

TJ wrote:How you can say a team that has not beaten NZ, SA or Aus for years, is 1.  7th  in  the rankings is a better than than the one third in the rankings who have beaten the aforesaid teams is quite quite ridiculous.

We have not discussed the rankings - 2.  you have ignored them because they show the truth.   3.  Wales are not the best team in the 6N.  

Its not antiwelsh to proclaim the truth.  Its unutterably stupid to claim black is white and anyone who disgrees with you is a bigot.  4.  You really do look ridiculous you know.

1 Again?

2 I spent 3 mins and 42 seconds gathering data

3 Reigning 6ns champions

4 IMO your comments (in the quotes) look ridiculous

O FFS -    

Chill TJ, Chill...

Ta I need refreshing  

me too. offski. been fun, mostly

Wales going into the most recent 6N tournament already holding the title, then winning it again would obviously make them the best team in the 6N. IMO their record as of late isn't too bad if we consider all of the evidence provided, so I'm not sure why it's made out to be god awful, like the most awful record of all time?

Cue childish posters bringing up results against Fiji from 2 years ago and repeating themself over and over, after already saying it 100 times.........

The Saint wrote:

Bullsbok wrote:

The Saint wrote:FGS bullsbok can't you read. I don't appreciate posts that deny something happened. We had a lot of constructive debate going on and TJ ruined it again. Funny how he has the audacity to complain about Welsh posters doing that and run crying to the mods like a baby when somebody tells him the truth. No idea why he's allowed to get away with his childish behaviour.

Stop getting so worked up , yes we're all passionate rugby fans  but this is just a forum . Everyone is entitled to their own opinion even wums . So if everyone can just stick to the rugby and not make assumptions about people they dont even know , the quality of  discussions on 606 will improve

TBH while I think you do post sensible comments, mostly, you did enter into the discussion yesterday with regurgitated comments based on assumptions of Wales fans and their team because of what a couple WUM posters said, or what the media said. I don't see why you would just have a go at Wales when it happens among every nation. All I did was point this out. As I had previously pointed out the truth in my OP, I don't see why the said posters should come in and have the audacity to deny their behaviour after engaging in it for so long. As you can see the behaviour has only got worse and a lot more childish as I've continued to raise the awareness. It's all really repetitve and boring. I do appareciate that this evening's comments from you were posted with what seemed like good intentions though.

I know this is aimed at me. My only possible answer is to tell you again. I am not anti welsh. I have never posed an anti welsh comment and you cannot show a single antiwelsh comment from me. I challenge you to show anything anti welsh from me ever.

All the comments you post bringing up a record against SA/Aus with the sole intentions if upsetting Wales posters, sticking the boot into their team, out of your genunine and unneccessary distaste for everything Welsh rugby. And then denying all of it. And then childishly repeating yourself over and over if you dislike somebody's retort. And shouting down other people's opinion while showing great disrespect for those posters. Your postings have been full of this long since before the Lions tour, while they were slightly more constructive back then they certainly are not now. I won't be repeating this, I know you'll ask again so I'll just refer you to previous postings.

Nothing is done with intent to upset.  I love Wales and welsh rugby.  I cheer them on at every opportunity.  I have never stuck the boot into them.  I

Now please quote a single post that contains this anti welsh sentiment.   Its the only way you can show you are actually right.  A simple quote or copy and paste will do. the fact you are unable to do so shows the truth of the situation. I have nver made an anti welsh post.

Read previous posts. I told you this would happen because you struggle with comprehension. Please don't ask me again, if you do then you'll just get the same answer and I feel this behaviour is a waste of everyone's time.

You know what -
I thoroughly enjoyed Wales beating of England last year.  

What I want to see from Wales is them kicking on and getting up there in the rankings and matching the best.  I want to see 1/2 penny counter-attacking and causing havoc.  I want to see your great wings getting decent ball and attacking ball in hand.  I want to see you being the great team could be if not held back by what to many of us are poor tactics.

wales right now remind me of the lumbering England of the past.  Playing  negative game relying on opponents to make mistakes and playing for penalties.  Doing his will and has won you 6n but it is not enough against the best.  Wales could be so much better than they are.  they have the players.

The Saint wrote:Read previous posts. I told you this would happen because you struggle with comprehension. Please don't ask me again, if you do then you'll just get the same answer and I feel this behaviour is a waste of everyone's time.

so you are unable to show a single anti welsh post from me. figures 'cos there are none.

I think tj is offering an olive branch there. Could be a good way to end the argument? Maybe even get some reasoned discussion. Maybe everyone agree to differ sometimes and not take everything so personally?? Maybe??

I think the moments been lost now. ...

Sidestep - all I am doing is showing my true thoughts.  this is what got me labelled anti welsh - criticising the tactics employed by Gatland and criticising Phillips.  

the saint has continually made accusations agaisnt me with no foundation and is unable to back them up. Its somewhat irritating. Its also completely untrue.

Sidestep this is just a warmup. Imagine the fun I am going to have after England win by 15 in a few months at HQ...

I can't imagine England winning by 15 quins so I can't imagine the following fun either. Ha. Tj. I did notice saint saying you were personally attacking Wales by saying their results against the big sh 3 were abysmal. Which in fairness is a fact. They are. They don't win. Not for ages anyway.

How does one personally attack Wales? Cross the Severn bridge with a big stick?

Indeed sidestep - I actually said dismal IIRC. However that is taken by The Saint as anti welsh posting designed to wind up welsh fans - when actually it was clearly making a point about Wales and Englands comparative recent success and why england are the better and higher ranked team.

quinsforever wrote:How does one personally attack Wales? Cross the Severn bridge with a big stick?

Criticise Gatland or Phillips apparently if you are me.

I am saying that stating results as abysmal against sh 3 is factual And NOT a personal attack on Wales. Clearly when you don't agree that Wales are indeed supreme European overlords of rugby this is an insult. And big sticks to. That's assault.

...as it happens I think the next 6N game between the two is going to be an absolute cracker, with Wales very slight favourites perhaps cancelled by home advantage this year. And at present I can't decide who will win. Wales have been very good but seem to me to have stalled a bit, whereas England to me seem to be getting better, but haven't got their back line sorted. Too many imponderables at present even to have a gut feeling. At least beyond feeling pretty good about the way England are going which is no use for prediction!

I still believe Wales would win 3 times out 5 against England. Buts that's my opinion. If the argument became about rankings. And England were above. I would simply go back to it being my opinion. The rankings are a number. 3 is closer to 1 than 6 is.

Criticise Phillips??? Phillips is a saint.... Hmmmm. We could be on to something??? Lots of posting recently. Phillips out of A job?? Smells fishy to me !!

I've pointed this out. Facts are facts. It's how they're continually used and repeated by a poster over and over again for the sole purpose of upsetting Wales posters out of genunine dislike for Welsh rugby. Whilst there is a great deal of posters who can discuss this now and again in a constructive manner, there are a number of posters using it to stick the boot in (TJ) and the misuse of statistical data just to stick the boot in. All of this has been pointed out so I don't see why I have to tell people again.

TJ wrote:You know what -
I thoroughly enjoyed Wales beating of England last year.  

What I want to see from Wales is them kicking on and getting up there in the rankings and matching the best.  I want to see 1/2 penny counter-attacking and causing havoc.  I want to see your great wings getting decent ball and attacking ball in hand.  I want to see you being the great team could be if not held back by what to many of us are poor tactics.

wales right now remind me of the lumbering England of the past.  Playing  negative game relying on opponents to make mistakes and playing for penalties.  Doing his will and has won you 6n but it is not enough against the best.  Wales could be so much better than they are.  they have the players.

Now here's a good answer. I can't see why you didn't post this instead of saying "Wales are rubbish and have a dismal record against SH" a 100 times. The debate would have been very good otherwise.

Better is a canard. There are only results against each other, and results against others. Wales tick the first box and England the second. And if England win in 6N does that mean they are better? Just means they won a rugby match. The "better" debate exists to sell newspapers and keep forums going, in all sports.

Quins!! That's far to reasoned a comment for this thread ...

The Saint wrote:I've pointed this out. Facts are facts. It's how they're continually used and repeated by a poster over and over again for the sole purpose of upsetting Wales posters out of genunine dislike for Welsh rugby. Whilst there is a great deal of posters who can discuss this now and again in a constructive manner, there are a number of posters using it to stick the boot in (TJ) and the misuse of statistical data just to stick the boot in. All of this has been pointed out so I don't see why I have to tell people again.

TJ wrote:You know what -
I thoroughly enjoyed Wales beating of England last year.  

What I want to see from Wales is them kicking on and getting up there in the rankings and matching the best.  I want to see 1/2 penny counter-attacking and causing havoc.  I want to see your great wings getting decent ball and attacking ball in hand.  I want to see you being the great team could be if not held back by what to many of us are poor tactics.

wales right now remind me of the lumbering England of the past.  Playing  negative game relying on opponents to make mistakes and playing for penalties.  Doing his will and has won you 6n but it is not enough against the best.  Wales could be so much better than they are.  they have the players.

Now here's a good answer. I can't see why you didn't post this instead of saying "Wales are rubbish and have a dismal record against SH" a 100 times. The debate would have been very good otherwise.

I have never said Wales are rubbish find one post where I have. stop making false accusations

Oh, I am sure someone will find something there to have a pop at. I am a welsh hater after all...

Ummm. Ok. Which box is better to tick?? First or second?? Hey hey hey??? Ok. I couldn't find anything.

Sidestep you obviously didn't see saint in action on the Phillips drinking incident thread. Was the first time TJ and I had agreed on anything! While sainty was irrationally defending Phillips, and we did wonder if he did PR for him, as more info came out and Phillips got fired, the thread died out naturally. Like Phillips club rugby career...

quinsforever wrote:Better is a canard. There are only results against each other, and results against others. Wales tick the first box and England the second. And if England win in 6N does that mean they are better? Just means they won a rugby match. The "better" debate exists to sell newspapers and keep forums going, in all sports.

Depends how you use the word. I say that England are playing a more effectively style than they were and we saw an improvement in execution over these AIs (and perhaps the last 2 years though I'm not going to argue that too hard). I summed it up as playing better. Also, records against individual nations or as a whole only tell you what happened in the past and unless said records are abysmal or fantastic to the nth degree, they mean very little when the players walk out to 80 mins of destiny in the future...

True cowshot. Better can be forward looking.

Yeah well. Phillips is a bit of an idiot. Famous for his arrogance.. I'm
Welsh and we here plenty of stuff about Ashton's swan diving and cipriani being an arrogant type. So we should be able to accept it and share the banter when people criticise Phillips who has done a lot worth criticising. He gets paid enough to be a role model and sportsman. And then he acts a fool and deserves the criticism. I think if I wasn't welsh he would be one of those players I have an irrational dislike for.
Played well against Argentina though.
Good good mike It' all adds to the cv. .

And Welsh results against the sh 3 are abysmal. They've been a good side for a few years now and never win. The performances might be bad, good, brilliant. But not winning for years should be seen as a bad return. Hopefully the oz game might see a change of fortunes. That extra 1% I've heard about

Look, its simples:

Wales massively raise their game when they play England.
England (the last twice anyway) massively raise their game when playing NZ.

Wales and England are actually very evenly matched currently, and the upcoming 6N game should show this. England will come away with a narrow victory due to home advantage.

Like I said, simples

Surely it's Scotland and Italy we raise our game for? Best record against them in the 6 Nations. We've had the beating of England in recent seasons, who were not the team to beat at one point due to not being the cup holders. Alternatively, you could just accept reality and admit the Wales were better than all 3 teams, hence the results!

IF Wales beat Tonga and then Australia, I fancy us to beat all and sundry in the next 6 Nations, again . Though fail and I don't give us a hope in hell of qualifying from the group of death in 2015.