Barclays Premier League 13/14 Thread Part 'something'

[Crimey]

A place to discuss things all Premier League.

[Crimey]

Rodgers on Suarez:

‘It was remarkable. I think you have to hold him up as one of the best strikers in the world – and yes, he’s maybe worth £40million and two pounds now!’

[Fernando]

Just a question of how much longer you can keep him without CL Football. I suspect if Madrid come calling the Suarez of the summer may pop up again.

[Crimey]

Just a question of how much longer you can keep him without CL Football. I suspect if Madrid come calling the Suarez of the summer may pop up again.

There's no chance, the only hope of keeping him is if we can get Champions League football this year and perhaps look like we might be able to challenge for the title. My thinking might be that Suarez might prefer to be the centre of a side in the Champions League rather than a smaller name in the pond where he'd be overshadowed by Ronaldo and Bale.

[Guest]

If Suarez is wanting a challenge, how much fun will it be for him to play in league where the only other team with a chance of winning is Barcelona every season?

I'd love to see him stay long enough to get LFC into the CL (What ten years? Hahahahaha) but also have him at LFC whilst they're competing in the competition

[Hulking_up]

I'm sure Saurez will leave in the summer. I have a horrible feeling too that he will go to another prem club.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

I'm still furious. Praying west brom spank us and we can sack Hughton and move on.

[Mat]

Big Vic will tear you apart

[Dolphin Ziggler]

The fight for the sack is on. Can Hughton beat Allardyce? Can AVB do something mental? It's exciting!

Wait, I mean depressing, it's really depressing

[J.Benson II]

I think Suarez will stay if Liverpool get CL qualification. If not, then he is going no doubt. Its a bit like the Bale-Tottenham situation.
Any team in the world will want his talent.

Another poor result for United. Watching Moyes' post match interview, I can't help thinking that he just comes across as being too polite and in awe of his surroundings.
It seems that he respects the players more than they respect him.

Its hard to make an accurate judgement on the whole saga.
On one hand, you see a team pretty identical to the one that coasted to the PL title only a few months back, on the other you see a team thats littered with either mediocrity or ailing former stars.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Big Vic will tear you apart

This might push me to into the oblivion

[Mat]

Kompany couldn't deal with him last night, what hope does Bassong have?

[Guest]

I hear Rooney is suspended this weekend, true?

[Duty281]

I hear Rooney is suspended this weekend, true?

Indeed he is, he got booked again last night.

[Guest]

Good. Still think we will be on the end of some kind of reaction from United though.

Still can't get over United lying in ninth, gets me every time  

[Ent]

If rvp isn't fit you could be in for a good result.

Rooney our only performing player currently.

[westisbest]

Could do with those 2 out on the 15th.

[socal1976]

One thing I will say is that I am happy United is down in the dumps for one reason. How many times I had to hear that there is "no trophy for 4th place" from mainly United fans or "why are you guys celebrating 4th place". If United's struggles continue and right now they are 5 points adrift of 4th place I wonder how happy their fans will be if they eek out a 4th place trophy? Now maybe United Fans will appreciate what a job Arsene did keeping his side at near the top with a non-existant transfer budget for 8 years. In 8 years he spent a net 10 million pounds on transfers never bought a 27 million pound player or had the resources of Moyes and United and he got us there every year and built a stadium out of it that will allow Arsenal to compete long after he is gone.

[socal1976]

Oh PS: RVP freezing his arsse off on thursday nights in Kazakhstan in the winter also has a certain poetic ring to it.

[compelling and rich]

One thing I will say is that I am happy United is down in the dumps for one reason. How many times I had to hear that there is "no trophy for 4th place" from mainly United fans or "why are you guys celebrating 4th place". If United's struggles continue and right now they are 5 points adrift of 4th place I wonder how happy their fans will be if they eek out a 4th place trophy? Now maybe United Fans will appreciate what a job Arsene did keeping his side at near the top with a non-existant transfer budget for 8 years. In 8 years he spent a net 10 million pounds on transfers  never bought a 27 million pound player or had the resources of Moyes and United and he got us there every year and built a stadium out of it that will allow Arsenal to compete long after he is gone.

dont think you'll find any united fan celebrating 4th, but were realistic enough to know that we have lost the greatest manager of all time and are in a transitional period. also fergie was winning titles with a very low net spend, of course this was due to the ronaldo transfer but he also signed him.

[compelling and rich]

i would also like to congratulate arsenal fans on winning the well known pre Christmas trophy. getting incredibly carried away seeing though they haven't won anything yet

[socal1976]

We are not celebrating the Christmas title, just enjoying the fact that we are 12 points clear of United and don't have cleverly and anderson on our team.

[compelling and rich]

we dont have anderson in our team either, he just takes a large part of our bench up

you sound like your righting united off for a top four spot already, the amount of times rival fans have written us off, id be a rich man the amount of times i heard "united are finished now" and we came back. you cant write off a club the size of united with the resources we have got even if fergies not here anymore.

we may be having a bad season so far but still expect top four slot and we'll be challenging again soon enough.

[socal1976]

I don't disagree that you guys should get the top 4 spot and challenge again soon for the title that is why I have to enjoy kicking United while you are down, it probably won't last long. Although I could see Liverpool with the way Suarez is going tick you for it and have you finish 5th. You have to admit quite a few United fans denigrated AW's accomplishments of making 17 straight CLs with a limited budget and scornfully through out 4th place trophy talk, it might make you guys appreciate it more if you had a few trips to Kazakhstan on a snowy Thursday.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

I dont know how you manage to make every discussion about Arsenal, but its impressive. The obvious example of a manager making more from his team than they are worth was the fact Ferguson won the title with that side. And we're talking about United.

[socal1976]

I dont know how you manage to make every discussion about Arsenal, but its impressive. The obvious example of a manager making more from his team than they are worth was the fact Ferguson won the title with that side. And we're talking about United.

What limited resources? maybe compared to the sheik who has 100 billion dollars a couple of hundred slave wives, but not compared to anyone else. Dortmund won the bundesliga with much less financial resources than Bayern. Barca always has less financial resources than Madrid, always. They have enough money to compete for world class players, even now they have those kind of resources. Saying ManU and Fergie had limited financial resources is like saying that John Goodman is skinny. They have more money than Bayern and who has a better team? Who had a better team last year when Fergie was around?

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

I dont know how you manage to make every discussion about Arsenal, but its impressive. The obvious example of a manager making more from his team than they are worth was the fact Ferguson won the title with that side. And we're talking about United.

What limited resources? maybe compared to the sheik who has 100 billion dollars a couple of hundred slave wives, but not compared to anyone else. Dortmund won the bundesliga with much less financial resources than Bayern. Barca always has less financial resources than Madrid, always. They have enough money to compete for world class players, even now they have those kind of resources. Saying ManU and Fergie had limited financial resources is like saying that John Goodman is skinny. They have more money than Bayern and who has a better team? Who had a better team last year when Fergie was around?

Errr in what world do Utd have more money than Bayern...

[socal1976]

I dont know how you manage to make every discussion about Arsenal, but its impressive. The obvious example of a manager making more from his team than they are worth was the fact Ferguson won the title with that side. And we're talking about United.

What limited resources? maybe compared to the sheik who has 100 billion dollars a couple of hundred slave wives, but not compared to anyone else. Dortmund won the bundesliga with much less financial resources than Bayern. Barca always has less financial resources than Madrid, always. They have enough money to compete for world class players, even now they have those kind of resources. Saying ManU and Fergie had limited financial resources is like saying that John Goodman is skinny. They have more money than Bayern and who has a better team? Who had a better team last year when Fergie was around?

Errr in what world do Utd have more money than Bayern...

United are listed as the third richest club in the world in terms of turnover and Bayern are listed as fourth. On the forbes list Man U is listed as third and bayern as sixth. United make more money every year than Bayern Munich and have for a long time.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-21168666

The real world, that is the world we are talking about.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

I dont know how you manage to make every discussion about Arsenal, but its impressive. The obvious example of a manager making more from his team than they are worth was the fact Ferguson won the title with that side. And we're talking about United.

What limited resources? maybe compared to the sheik who has 100 billion dollars a couple of hundred slave wives, but not compared to anyone else. Dortmund won the bundesliga with much less financial resources than Bayern. Barca always has less financial resources than Madrid, always. They have enough money to compete for world class players, even now they have those kind of resources. Saying ManU and Fergie had limited financial resources is like saying that John Goodman is skinny. They have more money than Bayern and who has a better team? Who had a better team last year when Fergie was around?

Errr in what world do Utd have more money than Bayern...

United are listed as the third richest club in the world in terms of turnover and Bayern are listed as fourth. On the forbes list Man U is listed as third and bayern as sixth. United make more money every year than Bayern Munich and have for a long time.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-21168666

The real world, that is the world we are talking about.

And how much on the playing squad....

[socal1976]

You said who had more money money and was richer, Bayern or Manchester; clearly Forbes and Deloitte touche say United. If you are so interested do your own google search, but it is clear that Munich does not have the revenues Manchester has.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Oh, so its revenue and resources used? Well then, United's revenue far outstrips City, they bought the league last year United

[socal1976]

Are you people seriously arguing United have "limited" resources, I guess that is why they are not doing well I suppose. How has Ferguson dealt with limited resources? Limited resources in comparison to what? By the way United spent 6 million per roster spot last year, and munich spent 6.1 million so the argument over salary vis a vis United and Bayern is completely moot. As for the sheikh he can spend whatever he likes he owns a country with 10 trillion in gas under its soil and hardly any population. United 3rd in payroll, 1st in value, 1st in revenue in the EPL; tell me how this reflects doing more with less?

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Well, Arsenal have never been paupers now have they? Fergie actually didnt spend a massive deal per window in his last few years. Not on his roster spots to update the defense and only one signing on the offense.

Its all very relative, but the example really was that Ferguson eeked out Champions from a squad that really isnt incredible.

[Hammersmith harrier]

How about having massive loan repayments?

United do not have the ability of Bayern, Madrid, Monaco, PSG, City, Chelsea, Barca or even Napoli to spend whatever we want. Just like Arsenal we have a very strict business model that factors in more than just turnover.

[socal1976]

Well, Arsenal have never been paupers now have they? Fergie actually didnt spend a massive deal per window in his last few years. Not on his roster spots to update the defense and only one signing on the offense.

Its all very relative, but the example really was that Ferguson eeked out Champions from a squad that really isnt incredible.

Arsenal have been complete paupers for several years and even before when highbury seated 29000 and Trafford seated like 80,000. Now we don't have those issues thankfully and we can spend, if we lose it is not due to lack of resources. Ferguson is a great manager never questioned the man's accomplishents. But the reason his team stinks today lays with him, he brought in all these players and signed them, and he had the resources to get other better players but he chose this bunch. He ran the show for two and half decades, and was never hard pressed for cash in any sense compared to others. In fact the only time his club has not been the richest or at worst one of the two richest clubs in the league in terms of expenditures on players is in the last few years when compared to Chelsea and MC. So it is a great accomplishment he won league with what your are know deeming a limited squad, but who built this limited squad?

[socal1976]

How about having massive loan repayments?

United do not have the ability of Bayern, Madrid, Monaco, PSG, City, Chelsea, Barca or even Napoli to spend whatever we want. Just like Arsenal we have a very strict business model that factors in more than just turnover.

What are you talking about they bought RVP for 30 some odd, Fellaini for 27 some odd, and were in the running for Bale, my understanding is they bid more for Bale but Spurs would not sell to them and Bale wanted to go to madrid.

[Hammersmith harrier]

The same Arsenal who have the 6th largest turnover in world football, that Arsenal are paupers?

[socal1976]

The same Arsenal who have the 6th largest turnover in world football, that Arsenal are paupers?

e
Were paupers, this number is based on a new stadium and new commercials deals that did not exist till the last couple of seasons. And the fact that our debt is being paid off and we have less debt than United is reflected by the fact that in the last 8 years Wenger spent a net 10 million pounds total on transfers. If United has more debt that is because they spent more so, that was their decision and they bought quite a few titles that way. Good on them, but they got to deal with the debt today. Now Arsenal is in a great financial position but the club suffered to get here and it is a more recent development.

[Hammersmith harrier]

How about having massive loan repayments?

United do not have the ability of Bayern, Madrid, Monaco, PSG, City, Chelsea, Barca or even Napoli to spend whatever we want. Just like Arsenal we have a very strict business model that factors in more than just turnover.

What are you talking about they bought RVP for 30 some odd, Fellaini for 27 some odd, and were in the running for Bale, my understanding is they bid more for Bale but Spurs would not sell to them and Bale wanted to go to madrid.

I think that getting Scholes, Kuszscak, Pogba, Owen, De Laet, Berbatov, Park, Morrison, Hargreaves, Obertan, O'shea, Brown and Van Der Sar off the wage bill in the past 2 and a half seasons helped there a bit, also factoring the money we recouped from the sale of some of them.

[socal1976]

Again, Fergie bought and paid for those duds, to say that poor Fergie he won with a limited team ignores the fact that he had plenty of resources and he was the one who assembled said limited team.

The guy was a great manager but according his own fans he left the team with a tight financial position and a limited team, this is what you United Fans are saying by the way.

[Hammersmith harrier]

The same Arsenal who have the 6th largest turnover in world football, that Arsenal are paupers?

e
Were paupers, this number is based on a new stadium and new commercials deals that did not exist till the last couple of seasons. And the fact that our debt is being paid off and we have less debt than United is reflected by the fact that in the last 8 years Wenger spent a net 10 million pounds total on transfers. If United has more debt that is because they spent more so, that was their decision and they bought quite a few titles that way. Good on them, but they got to deal with the debt today. Now Arsenal is in a great financial position but the club suffered to get here and it is a more recent development.

We have more debt because of the owners not because of spurious spending, out of interest what is United net spend over the same period?

You seem very clueless on this whole matter, in 2006 Arsenal were the 5th richest club in the world and have been in the top 8 for the past 12 years, we apparently spent money on players, you spent money of a stadium you couldn't afford, what's the difference?

[Hammersmith harrier]

Again, Fergie bought and paid for those duds, to say that poor Fergie he won with a limited team ignores the fact that he had plenty of resources and he was the one who assembled said limited team.

The guy was a great manager but according his own fans he left the team with a tight financial position and a limited team, this is what you United Fans are saying by the way.

You seem to be stuck in the 90's when we could compete with any team for any player we wanted, jumping back to the present we cannot compete with the likes of City, Chelsea, Barcelona, Madrid, PSG, Monaco or Bayern. Despite what the papers may suggest we cannot go and spend 80mil on one player because if we could do you not think we would?

[socal1976]

The same Arsenal who have the 6th largest turnover in world football, that Arsenal are paupers?

e
Were paupers, this number is based on a new stadium and new commercials deals that did not exist till the last couple of seasons. And the fact that our debt is being paid off and we have less debt than United is reflected by the fact that in the last 8 years Wenger spent a net 10 million pounds total on transfers. If United has more debt that is because they spent more so, that was their decision and they bought quite a few titles that way. Good on them, but they got to deal with the debt today. Now Arsenal is in a great financial position but the club suffered to get here and it is a more recent development.

We have more debt because of the owners not because of spurious spending, out of interest what is United net spend over the same period?

You seem very clueless on this whole matter, in 2006 Arsenal were the 5th richest club in the world and have been in the top 8 for the past 12 years, we apparently spent money on players, you spent money of a stadium you couldn't afford, what's the difference?

We spent money on a building that will generate revenues for years to you got more trophies in the present, we built the foundation to compete in the future. You guys had an Old Trafford we need something larger and similar to it, but are you really going to compare United's transfer expenditures to Arsenal's over the last few years. I mean if you are interested like I said do your own google searches. I guarantee you United spent way more on transfers than Arsenal did the last few seasons, before this last one when we got Ozil. And by the way, the funny thing is that I am not the one complaining about a limited team and limited resources, its you United lot that are complaining and you guys are the Bank freaking England! If Fergie won with a limited team, he was the one who built that team and had the resources to get better players.

[socal1976]

United has massive debt, that is why if they are hamstrung, which I don't buy it; that is why they can't spend. They have massive revenues but have to pay massive amounts of debt. Where did all the debt come from if not from overspending on players? Did the Glazers take it? If they did other shareholders had to get paid as well, you can't just issue a dividend to one shareholder.

[Hammersmith harrier]

Do you understand where our debt came from? It had absolutely nothing to do with spending money on players and we have always spent within our means, you seem to be suggesting we can still compete with the money men in football, we cannot.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

No one said poor United, but I do laugh at poor Arsenal.

[socal1976]

Do you understand where our debt came from? It had absolutely nothing to do with spending money on players and we have always spent within our means, you seem to be suggesting we can still compete with the money men in football, we cannot.

Well personally, I would rather United, Liverpool, or Arsenal win the league than City or Chelsea and the megabillionaire bond villains. I am not convinced that money alone can guarantee success. Yes you need the money to compete but buying players and stockpilling them has not worked that great for City or Chelsea or Real madrid when matched against what Munich, Dortmund, and Barca have accomplished without sugardaddies.

[Hammersmith harrier]

Barcelona and Bayern are absolutely minted, christ Barca just spent 50mil on Neymar. City and Chelsea have both won the league in the past four years with the latter winning the champions league as well.

[socal1976]

Barcelona and Bayern are absolutely minted, christ Barca just spent 50mil on Neymar. City and Chelsea have both won the league in the past four years with the latter winning the champions league as well.

Again Bayern does not spend more on wages than united, oh sorry they spent 1.5 percent more on wages. And on transfers United has spent a lot of money the last few years and quite a few of them have been duds. Lets take the salaries that you guys are paying to Giggs and Scholes the last couple of years and chalk that up to profligate waste right there. By the way Barca also has massive debt on its books it has to service. And you guys won league last and the Champions league what 3 years ago. All this with budgetary constraints you are talking about, but still you guys are buying players and paying top wages.

[Hammersmith harrier]

You seem to be completely clueless so i'll leave you to talk nonsense to someone else.

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