World Tour Finals Thread - Match & Prediction Thread

[Guest]

First topic message reminder :

So the ATPs premier showpiece event hits the O2 on Sunday. The sixth showing at the O2 and yielded only 3 different winners. Very interesting this year. 3 virgin qualifiers in Cillic, Raonic and Nishikori. Can we see a new winner? Can Nishikori and Raonic win the biggest title of their careers to date? Federer will have an eye on the DC like his compatriot Wawrinka, though he is woefully out of form of late. Has Murray much left in the tank to win his first title here at the O2? Can Berdych do a Davydenko and strike out of nowhere? Will it be a routine Djokovic victory?

For me the 2 that qualify from each group will be:

Group A

1) Djokovic
2) Raonic

Group B

1) Murray
2) Federer

Djokovic/Murray final

Winner: Djokovic

[CaledonianCraig]

All I can say is Andy get your arse back to Miami with Mauresmo and work out a plan for 2015.

Also ask Santa for a second serve.

After he won Valencia, and he did play well, I thought he had worked out a plan..why  try to improve on a winning formula. If it aint broke dont fix it. It doesnt seem to take much these days for Andy to lose focus and Im left asking does he really have the hunger to get back into the BIG FOUR. It takes more than desire its the passion that appears to be missing.

I was never carried away with the results in Valencia or elsewhere due to the quality of his opponents. Not the aggressive kind like he was going to face here in London. There was never going to be anything left in the tank for the WTF. Not an ounce. Now he has 2 more matches and then fly to India.

He needs a lot of time with Mauresmo to get a groove going for next season.

I would sort of agree with your first point (maybe not entirely) but disagree with the nothing left in the tank bit. He has had over a week to recharge his batteries and for someone of his fitness and recovery levels that is just fine. Fatigue had nothing to do with today's loss. I'd put it more down to bad gameplan with not enough aggression and too many (far too many) unforced errors by his standards. Coupled, of course, with Kei playing to a very good standard and fully deserving the win.

[Guest]

All I can say is Andy get your arse back to Miami with Mauresmo and work out a plan for 2015.

Also ask Santa for a second serve.

After he won Valencia, and he did play well, I thought he had worked out a plan..why  try to improve on a winning formula. If it aint broke dont fix it. It doesnt seem to take much these days for Andy to lose focus and Im left asking does he really have the hunger to get back into the BIG FOUR. It takes more than desire its the passion that appears to be missing.

I was never carried away with the results in Valencia or elsewhere due to the quality of his opponents. Not the aggressive kind like he was going to face here in London. There was never going to be anything left in the tank for the WTF. Not an ounce. Now he has 2 more matches and then fly to India.

He needs a lot of time with Mauresmo to get a groove going for next season.

Lk I think thats a bit harsh on Robredo.. I thought it was a great final and Robredo played out of his skin:
Ill maintain what ive always believed to be the problem... its not physical, its mental  He never plays two matches the same it depends on what side he gets out of bed.

The Robredo match yes exciting, but not so much quality throughout the match. Were some purple patches, but both men played not to lose.

For Andy it's mental and physical. Hasn't looked fully fit since surgery. Take Nadals comeback. Suffered some defeats, but come IW he was fired up and physically ready for the fight. I have waited for Andy to do similar, but it's been a bit blah. If it's not happening for him physically, mentally it won't either.

I just hope off season he can get stronger for 2015.

[Guest]

All I can say is Andy get your arse back to Miami with Mauresmo and work out a plan for 2015.

Also ask Santa for a second serve.

After he won Valencia, and he did play well, I thought he had worked out a plan..why  try to improve on a winning formula. If it aint broke dont fix it. It doesnt seem to take much these days for Andy to lose focus and Im left asking does he really have the hunger to get back into the BIG FOUR. It takes more than desire its the passion that appears to be missing.

I was never carried away with the results in Valencia or elsewhere due to the quality of his opponents. Not the aggressive kind like he was going to face here in London. There was never going to be anything left in the tank for the WTF. Not an ounce. Now he has 2 more matches and then fly to India.

He needs a lot of time with Mauresmo to get a groove going for next season.

I would sort of agree with your first point (maybe not entirely) but disagree with the nothing left in the tank bit. He has had over a week to recharge his batteries and for someone of his fitness and recovery levels that is just fine. Fatigue had nothing to do with today's loss. I'd put it more down to bad gameplan with not enough aggression and too many (far too many) unforced errors by his standards. Coupled, of course, with Kei playing to a very good standard and fully deserving the win.

I wouldn't say either of them today played what I would call a good standard. Andy for me today looked heavy in the legs. Just nothing clicked.

[Born Slippy]

The Robredo match was high quality. Both players played extremely aggressive tennis, particularly under pressure. Haven't seen the match today but the highlights make it look poor quality. Andy seemed exceptionally passive and Kei obviously destroyed his second serve. Poor result for Andy but great start for Kei.

[Haddie-nuff]

All I can say is Andy get your arse back to Miami with Mauresmo and work out a plan for 2015.

Also ask Santa for a second serve.

After he won Valencia, and he did play well, I thought he had worked out a plan..why  try to improve on a winning formula. If it aint broke dont fix it. It doesnt seem to take much these days for Andy to lose focus and Im left asking does he really have the hunger to get back into the BIG FOUR. It takes more than desire its the passion that appears to be missing.

I was never carried away with the results in Valencia or elsewhere due to the quality of his opponents. Not the aggressive kind like he was going to face here in London. There was never going to be anything left in the tank for the WTF. Not an ounce. Now he has 2 more matches and then fly to India.

He needs a lot of time with Mauresmo to get a groove going for next season.

Lk I think thats a bit harsh on Robredo.. I thought it was a great final and Robredo played out of his skin:
Ill maintain what ive always believed to be the problem... its not physical, its mental  He never plays two matches the same it depends on what side he gets out of bed.

The Robredo match yes exciting, but not so much quality throughout the match. Were some purple patches, but both men played not to lose.

For Andy it's mental and physical. Hasn't looked fully fit since surgery. Take Nadals comeback. Suffered some defeats, but come IW he was fired up and physically ready for the fight. I have waited for Andy to do similar, but it's been a bit blah. If it's not happening for him physically, mentally it won't either.

I just hope off season he can get stronger for 2015.

I think Lk we are of similar opinion Im not totally convinced about the physical bit.. that match in Valencia proved to me that Andy's retrieving skills are second to none.. I dont think he could have got to some of those shots by Robredo had he had any physical handicap. I thought he looked well fired up in that match and believed he was on the way back. He was aggressive and focused... but its gone again. Hey ho whatever the problem Andy you better address it sooner rather than later.

[CaledonianCraig]

Spot on Haddie-Nuff. Those views were part of the reasons for my epitaph thread.

[Calder106]

All I can say is Andy get your arse back to Miami with Mauresmo and work out a plan for 2015.

Also ask Santa for a second serve.

After he won Valencia, and he did play well, I thought he had worked out a plan..why  try to improve on a winning formula. If it aint broke dont fix it. It doesnt seem to take much these days for Andy to lose focus and Im left asking does he really have the hunger to get back into the BIG FOUR. It takes more than desire its the passion that appears to be missing.

I was never carried away with the results in Valencia or elsewhere due to the quality of his opponents. Not the aggressive kind like he was going to face here in London. There was never going to be anything left in the tank for the WTF. Not an ounce. Now he has 2 more matches and then fly to India.

He needs a lot of time with Mauresmo to get a groove going for next season.

I would sort of agree with your first point (maybe not entirely) but disagree with the nothing left in the tank bit. He has had over a week to recharge his batteries and for someone of his fitness and recovery levels that is just fine. Fatigue had nothing to do with today's loss. I'd put it more down to bad gameplan with not enough aggression and too many (far too many) unforced errors by his standards. Coupled, of course, with Kei playing to a very good standard and fully deserving the win.

The trouble was that Kei did not play at a high standard until Murray threw in his poor service game when 3-2 up with a break in set one. That semed to give him the confidence to go for his shots and even though his serving wss still poor he dominated most of the match after that.

[Haddie-nuff]

Yep I agree.. he did. His self belief carried him through. Had Andy come back at him like he did Robredo..it would have been a different match.
Taking nothing away from Kei.. but he really should have been no match for Andy. I was not going to watch it because having seen Andys game in Valencia.. I had him down to win

[Guest]

Can Feds and Milos rescue the day?

Shame Milos qualified as he was good on the commentary last year

[Jahu]

Oi, oi, easy on the shame

While I support the young blood, being a mean person by nature, I want Fed to revenge the loss for Paris.

Sorry Milo

[Guest]

A Raonic victory would certainly add spice to the Federer/Murray clash if they meet on Tuesday

[summerblues]

I sure hope Fed will not have back-to-back loses to Rao after tonight.

[Guest]

That BH slice off a 141mph serve! Backs it up with a fab BH block off a 138mph serve! Amazing!

[Jahu]

Fed breaks.

Milo a little shy, apart from looking like a freshly combed mommies boy and hitting 144mph serves.

[summerblues]

Good start.

[Jahu]

Fed has got lauder this year, with ComeOns.

I guess he feels happy for every point won at this age

[Guest]

Raonic has hit 1094 aces this season. Averaging 16 per match. That is some stat!

[Jahu]

3:0 in 8 min.

No TB on this match

[Jahu]

Goran still far away with 1477 rockets during 1996.

[Guest]

Fed just toying with Raonic. Fast becoming Wimbledon all over again.

Good to see some winners!

[Jahu]

Does anyone have a bio-scientific explanation, as to why Big servers have no FH power?

Milo, Ivo, Roddic, Isner etc etc, crazy serves and then no killer FH shots?

Any of top 4 FH looks much faster then these big servers.

[Guest]

Goran still far away with 1477 rockets during 1996.

Got to love Goran!

However he played 103 matches that year! The average would be 14 per match.

Mightily impressive though.

[Guest]

Does anyone have a bio-scientific explanation, as to why Big servers have no FH power?

Milo, Ivo, Roddic, Isner etc etc, crazy serves and then no killer FH shots?

Any of top 4 FH looks much faster then these big servers.

I would be amazed if a FH looked powerful on this surface

[Jahu]

Ranic as good as a Montenegro wine.

[Jahu]

LK, any surface, these huge servers have no killer FH.

I guess the serving is sucking the energy totally.

[Jahu]

6:1 in 25 min.

Milo better have a stash of Canadian Bacon dipped in Maple Syrup in his bag, as he is going down.

[Guest]

Raonic and Roddick did/do have quite heavy FH's. Saw a few brutal ones at the US Open on the outer courts from them.

However, they were very reluctant to go deep and flat with it.

[summerblues]

Wow, so far this has been easier than I expected.  Rao is not at all tuned in yet.

From what I heard about Montenegro wine, Rao's game so far today may indeed be about as good as that.

[Guest]

We need Forehando to come back!

[temporary21]

Serving is vertical movement, the arm movement is vertical as is overall movement. Theyre also hitting a standing ball from a standing position

[Guest]

Federer returned 100% of serves he got a racquet on?? Insane!

[Jahu]

Yeah, a first for a whole set, or so says the other canadian.

[Guest]

Greg recommending some gamesmanship from Raonic to disrupt the rhythm.

[Jahu]

Hahaha, and we all take Canadians as honest well behaved people

[coolpixel]

Frankly, Federer is the main course at this event. the rest are all fluff, irrespective of who wins finally.

[Silver]

Federer returned 100% of serves he got a racquet on?? Insane!

To be fair, although he gets ragged on for his general return stats, he's probably got the best block/slice return in the game today. One of the reasons he does so well against the big servers, I suppose...I think people should serve to his forehand more, especially in the deuce court. He struggles to get the step out there occasionally.

Pretty amazing stat nevertheless, against a guy serving 140!

[Jahu]

Ok a good FH from Milo finally.

[Guest]

Federer returned 100% of serves he got a racquet on?? Insane!

To be fair, although he gets ragged on for his general return stats, he's probably got the best block/slice return in the game today. One of the reasons he does so well against the big servers, I suppose...I think people should serve to his forehand more, especially in the deuce court. He struggles to get the step out there occasionally.

Pretty amazing stat nevertheless, against a guy serving 140!

It's probably the best I have ever seen. I wouldn't mind Henman's BH slice though

[Silver]

C'mon Tim!

(I wouldn't mind it either )

[summerblues]

All of a sudden Rao looked like he can play tennis. If he can keep it up, he might make a match of this.

[Jahu]

Milo will run out of the steam now.

[summerblues]

Rao much improved; fewer errors, better shot selection, hitting with more authority.

[summerblues]

Maybe it was just his nerves early on - playing at WTF for the first time.

[summerblues]

Fed is starting to get into trouble on his own serve - though arguably he could have won both last games easily.

[Jahu]

Fed confused a little, or he thought he got the win already.

[It Must Be Love]

Fed will strike now imo

[Jahu]

If he does not lose serve and give the set, thats good enough, let alone strike.

He is out of the zone.

[Haddie-nuff]

Hahaha,  and we all take Canadians as honest well behaved people

I can tell you for the most part they are, but just to remind you that Rusedski is half English..
But spare me from a bunch of Canadians when they are talking about Milos.. suddenly they have become
experts, when they are not watching football, icehockey, baseball and soccer that is

[Guest]

I hope Raonic is this charitable against Murray when they face off

[Jahu]

Bagel TB?

Yesssss Fed wins.

[Sponsored content]