6N Round 3: Scotland v Italy, 28 February

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SCOTLAND v ITALY
Saturday 28 February 2015
KO 14:30 (GMT)
BT Murrayfield, Edinburgh

Live on BBC1

Referee: George Clancy (IRFU)
AR1: Romain Poite (FFR)
AR2: Leighton Hodges (WRU)
TMO: Graham Hughes (RFU)

A. Teams:

1. SCOTLAND

15 Stuart Hogg
14 Tommy Seymour
13 Mark Bennett
12 Alex Dunbar
11 Sean Lamont
10 Peter Horne
09 Greig Laidlaw (capt)

01 Alasdair Dickinson
02 Ross Ford
03 Euan Murray
04 Tim Swinson
05 Jonny Gray
06 Rob Harley
07 Blair Cowan
08 Johnnie Beattie

16 Fraser Brown
17 Ryan Grant
18 Geoff Cross
19 Ben Toolis
20 Hamish Watson
21 Sam Hidalgo-Clyne
22 Greig Tonks
23 Matt Scott

2. ITALY

15 Luke McLean
14 Michele Visentin
13 Luca Morisi
12 Enrico Bacchin
11 Giovambattista Venditti
10 Kelly Haimona
09 Edoardo Gori

01 Matias Aguero
02 Leonardo Ghiraldini
03 Dario Chistolini
04 George Fabio Biagi
05 Joshua Furno
06 Francesco Minto
07 Simone Favaro
08 Sergio Parisse (capt)

16 Andrea Manici
17 Alberto De Marchi
18 Lorenzo Cittadini
19 Marco Fuser
20 Samuela Vunisa
21 Guglielmo Palazzani
22 Tommaso Allan
23 Giulio Bisegni.

B. Form (last 4 games):

1. SCOTLAND

15/02/15 - Scotland 23 - 26 Wales

07/02/15 - France 15 - 8 Scotland

22/11/14 - Scotland 37 - 12 Tonga

15/11/14 - Scotland 16 - 24 New Zealand

2. ITALY

14/02/15 - England 47 - 17 Italy

07/02/15 - Italy 3 - 26 Ireland

22/11/14 - Italy 6–22 South Africa

14/11/14 - Italy 18–20 Argentina

C. Head to Head:

21 Played 21

14 Wins 7

7 Losses 14

0 Draws 0

40 Tries 28

30 Conversions 23

58 Penalties 50

5 Drop Goals 6

475 Points 365

Majestic83 wrote:Backs look pretty good and could be quite an exciting back division with Horne at 10.
Impact from the bench should be good, only slight surprise is matt scott still sitting on the bench as he looked well down on match fitness and sharpness against wales, thought Visser may have been retained as a sub. Looking forward to seeing what Toolis, Watson, SHC and Tonks bring from the bench as they should offer a lot of mobility and intensity coming on later in the game, same with Fraser Brown who I have been v impressed by.

I think that we have to accept a formal change of his name now to 'Matt Scott - 23'.

I an pretty happy with this team to be honest, it is not far off the best we could have put out given those missing and it will be good to see Watson and Toolis debut from the bench. Hopefully they will get a good 20 mins each and S H-C gets a decent run this time. He probably deserves a start, but Greg was the captain. He needs a good game though, he is under pressure.

You can only assume that neither Denton nor Ashe are fit enough yet. Hopefully both will get a run out with the clubs this weekend and will be in the mix for the last two games.

This selection is going to devastate Glasgow, I think that pretty much just leaves Braid or Lyle for FH against Munster. At the end of the day though, the national team needs to come first. Glasgow just need to go to Ireland with a devil may care attitude and see what they can get from the game. Munster will be short as well I guess.

Was this covered here earlier? Has got to be the story of the 6N so far

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/feb/23/martin-castrogiovanni-scotland-italy-dog-bites-nose-14-stitches

Dog catches Rabies from Mad Castro.

We look like we are all agreed that this is our strongest fit 23 (forgetting squad omissions in the back row) although I agree guys like Toolis, H-C and maybe Tonks should be starting.

I think Denton, Gray Snr, Russell and Maitland would be in the starting line up if available. I'm reasonable happy with this selection and the game plan he looks like he is going for.

I had forgotten what this feels like.

On another note, Glasgow are screwed

on another another note with Clancy in charge Scotland to lose by 17 points.

Hamilton is apparently injured, done his groin.....not sure it can be rugby related as he doesn't do enough surely to damage it on a rugby pitch!

Overall happy with the team. Would have preferred some minor tweaks (Toolis instead of Swinson for example) but can’t complain.

Looking forward to seeing Watson, Toolis and Tonks (if he ever gets on) off the bench.

I can’t say I’m as confident about this result as some folk on here. I think we have enough to win, but Italy have shown they can score, and we have well established issues there. However with Seymour back, hopefully he can help us get over the try line.

Looking forward to the game

Weegie Wizard wrote:We look like we are all agreed that this is our strongest fit 23 (forgetting squad omissions in the back row) although I agree guys like Toolis, H-C and maybe Tonks should be starting.

I think Denton, Gray Snr, Russell and Maitland would be in the starting line up if available. I'm reasonable happy with this selection and the game plan he looks like he is going for.

I had forgotten what this feels like.

I wonder how far off Maitland is? It is perhaps a forlorn hope, but might we see him back for Glasgow to get a run out?

It's a good looking 23. Although some people seem concerned over Furra Linee's goal kicking and tackling. His statistics in both have been very impressive for the Warriors recently. I think, hope, we'll all be pleasantly surprised here. Bear in mind that the Italian Pie Moaner missed most tackles in his side's last outing and the fact that Hornee likes to run at people and I think it could be a positive choice. I also think we should see lots of Schlong (ooh er) coming in at first receiver and smashing into midfield to create space for the outside backs off quick ball. This of course relies on Cowan, Beattie and Frodo doing their jobs. On which subject; can Watson play 8? Who are the jumpers in the line-out? Ickle Jonny, Beattie and Harley at the tail. I think the Italians may see that as one area to attack.
I think the bench looks good as far as covering the front five. If we lose Harley then the back row looks unbalanced. Similarly, if we lose Tennessee Tam we don't have a winger: Hogg to wing and Tonks to FB?
The Azzuri centre pairing looks totally out of their depth so they will probably be planning a set piece oriented game. We should have too much for them in the scrum and if Frodo can get quick ball out to Furra then Saturday could be the day when lightens up all our lives. Interestingly enough I'm really hoping one Glasgow player has a totally ineffectual day at the office.

SHC has and can play on the wing, so he's possibly covering there

jimbopip wrote:It's a good looking 23. Although some people seem concerned over Furra Linee's goal kicking and tackling. His statistics in both have been very impressive for the Warriors recently. I think, hope, we'll all be pleasantly surprised here. Bear in mind that the Italian Pie Moaner missed most tackles in his side's last outing and the fact that Hornee likes to run at people and I think it could be a positive choice. I also think we should see lots of Schlong (ooh er) coming in at first receiver and smashing into midfield to create space for the outside backs off quick ball. This of course relies on Cowan, Beattie and Frodo doing their jobs. On which subject; can Watson play 8? Who are the jumpers in the line-out?  Ickle Jonny, Beattie and Harley at the tail. I think the Italians may see that as one area to attack.
I think the bench looks good as far as covering the front five. If we lose Harley then the back row looks unbalanced. Similarly, if we lose Tennessee Tam we don't have a winger: Hogg to wing and Tonks to FB?
The Azzuri centre pairing looks totally out of their depth so they will probably be planning a set piece oriented game. We should have too much for them in the scrum and if Frodo can get quick ball out to Furra then Saturday could be the day when lightens up all our lives. Interestingly enough I'm really hoping one Glasgow player has a totally ineffectual day at the office.

I imagine Cowan would cover No.8 and Dunbar will cover the wing, both have played there before

EWT Spoons wrote:SHC has and can play on the wing, so he's possibly covering there

Yes that is a decent option as well, he certainly is fast enough. It seems in the backs we have a few options to re-arrange should we need to.

BigGee wrote:

jimbopip wrote:It's a good looking 23. Although some people seem concerned over Furra Linee's goal kicking and tackling. His statistics in both have been very impressive for the Warriors recently. I think, hope, we'll all be pleasantly surprised here. Bear in mind that the Italian Pie Moaner missed most tackles in his side's last outing and the fact that Hornee likes to run at people and I think it could be a positive choice. I also think we should see lots of Schlong (ooh er) coming in at first receiver and smashing into midfield to create space for the outside backs off quick ball. This of course relies on Cowan, Beattie and Frodo doing their jobs. On which subject; can Watson play 8? Who are the jumpers in the line-out?  Ickle Jonny, Beattie and Harley at the tail. I think the Italians may see that as one area to attack.
I think the bench looks good as far as covering the front five. If we lose Harley then the back row looks unbalanced. Similarly, if we lose Tennessee Tam we don't have a winger: Hogg to wing and Tonks to FB?
The Azzuri centre pairing looks totally out of their depth so they will probably be planning a set piece oriented game. We should have too much for them in the scrum and if Frodo can get quick ball out to Furra then Saturday could be the day when lightens up all our lives. Interestingly enough I'm really hoping one Glasgow player has a totally ineffectual day at the office.

I imagine Cowan would cover No.8 and Dunbar will cover the wing, both have played there before

Yeah think Cowan will be the back up No 8 as he has played there a lot before where as Watson is just an out and out 7.
Think wing cover will probably be that if Lamont or Seymour go down injured Scott will come on and Bennett will shift to wing. Bennett played there at u20s a fair bit and out of him and dunbar would probably be the better choice as we'd want dunbar as close to the action as possible for his defence and turnovers. Bennett probably edges him for pace as well.

jimbopip wrote:It's a good looking 23. Although some people seem concerned over Furra Linee's goal kicking and tackling. His statistics in both have been very impressive for the Warriors recently. I think, hope, we'll all be pleasantly surprised here. Bear in mind that the Italian Pie Moaner missed most tackles in his side's last outing and the fact that Hornee likes to run at people and I think it could be a positive choice. I also think we should see lots of Schlong (ooh er) coming in at first receiver and smashing into midfield to create space for the outside backs off quick ball. This of course relies on Cowan, Beattie and Frodo doing their jobs. On which subject; can Watson play 8? Who are the jumpers in the line-out?  Ickle Jonny, Beattie and Harley at the tail. I think the Italians may see that as one area to attack.
I think the bench looks good as far as covering the front five. If we lose Harley then the back row looks unbalanced. Similarly, if we lose Tennessee Tam we don't have a winger: Hogg to wing and Tonks to FB?
The Azzuri centre pairing looks totally out of their depth so they will probably be planning a set piece oriented game. We should have too much for them in the scrum and if Frodo can get quick ball out to Furra then Saturday could be the day when lightens up all our lives. Interestingly enough I'm really hoping one Glasgow player has a totally ineffectual day at the office.

Yeah that Morisi guy was just plain lucky vs England

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:I'm not concerned at all by this. Scotland still have way too much for the Italians and all the forwards need to do is secure quick ball for the backs and it'll be game over by the 60 minute mark.

I'd say that's when the likes of SHC, Tonks, Toolis etc. will start making an appearance.

It's possible we'll see a game like the Argentina one, except the Italians won't get back into it.

sometimes this kind of comment makes me laugh. I hear it year after year and almost every and each single time it turns into a tight, brutal affair often decided by a last gasp drop-kick or by a random single point. Not even wanting to consider the several times Scotland has lost to Italy.
Said that, I admit this time, because of a few injuries, your backline could really shred ours into pieces.
We'll see

lostinwales wrote:

jimbopip wrote:It's a good looking 23. Although some people seem concerned over Furra Linee's goal kicking and tackling. His statistics in both have been very impressive for the Warriors recently. I think, hope, we'll all be pleasantly surprised here. Bear in mind that the Italian Pie Moaner missed most tackles in his side's last outing and the fact that Hornee likes to run at people and I think it could be a positive choice. I also think we should see lots of Schlong (ooh er) coming in at first receiver and smashing into midfield to create space for the outside backs off quick ball. This of course relies on Cowan, Beattie and Frodo doing their jobs. On which subject; can Watson play 8? Who are the jumpers in the line-out?  Ickle Jonny, Beattie and Harley at the tail. I think the Italians may see that as one area to attack.
I think the bench looks good as far as covering the front five. If we lose Harley then the back row looks unbalanced. Similarly, if we lose Tennessee Tam we don't have a winger: Hogg to wing and Tonks to FB?
The Azzuri centre pairing looks totally out of their depth so they will probably be planning a set piece oriented game. We should have too much for them in the scrum and if Frodo can get quick ball out to Furra then Saturday could be the day when lightens up all our lives. Interestingly enough I'm really hoping one Glasgow player has a totally ineffectual day at the office.

Yeah that Morisi guy was just plain lucky vs England

yeah but on Saturday the other centre is a brand new, under-par fella, and never played together with Morisi. from this point of view the commet is sharp enough

aqualung71 wrote:

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:I'm not concerned at all by this. Scotland still have way too much for the Italians and all the forwards need to do is secure quick ball for the backs and it'll be game over by the 60 minute mark.

I'd say that's when the likes of SHC, Tonks, Toolis etc. will start making an appearance.

It's possible we'll see a game like the Argentina one, except the Italians won't get back into it.

sometimes this kind of comment makes me laugh. I hear it year after year and almost every and each single time it turns into a tight, brutal affair often decided by a last gasp drop-kick or by a random single point. Not even wanting to consider the several times Scotland has lost to Italy.
Said that, I admit this time, because of a few injuries, your backline could really shred ours into pieces.
We'll see

apart from the last time we played at Murrayfield?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/21345281

correct.just:last time at Murreyfield we had an horrible display, and was the year we beat France, Ireland and bitchslapped England at Twicks. On paper we were probably favourite that time and you destroyed us. It confirms the Scotland-England clashes are quite unpredictable and irrational

Scotland - Italy sorry

Noone is taking the Itallians lightly, least of all Vern Cotter.

I expect your scrum might struggle without Castro and I expect if we get good ball our backs will be too much for Italy. Certainly if pro 12 form is anything to go by.

aqualung71 wrote:

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:I'm not concerned at all by this. Scotland still have way too much for the Italians and all the forwards need to do is secure quick ball for the backs and it'll be game over by the 60 minute mark.

I'd say that's when the likes of SHC, Tonks, Toolis etc. will start making an appearance.

It's possible we'll see a game like the Argentina one, except the Italians won't get back into it.

sometimes this kind of comment makes me laugh. I hear it year after year and almost every and each single time it turns into a tight, brutal affair often decided by a last gasp drop-kick or by a random single point. Not even wanting to consider the several times Scotland has lost to Italy.
Said that, I admit this time, because of a few injuries, your backline could really shred ours into pieces.
We'll see

As stated by others Aqua, and no offence or disrespect intended, but current form suggests Scotland are vastly improved from last year, whereas Italy haven't...and that's without the new faces starting on Saturday. I just think that we'll have too much for your guys, especially at home in front of over 60k fans.

And I also want us to put a few points over you so that when France beat Wales, we'll be fourth in the table.

I don't think there is a gulf in class at all. Scotland should win but it will be close. Italy will be targeting this game for a win. I'd put it 60/40

I d wait til you beat England before proclaiming a bitchslapping aqua.

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:

As stated by others Aqua, and no offence or disrespect intended, but current form suggests Scotland are vastly improved from last year, whereas Italy haven't.

The issue is 'current form' last year also suggested Scotland were vastly improved over Italy, and we still needed a last gasp drop goal to win. Hope Horne is practising - just in case

Manky-Flanker wrote:

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:

As stated by others Aqua, and no offence or disrespect intended, but current form suggests Scotland are vastly improved from last year, whereas Italy haven't.

The issue is 'current form' last year also suggested Scotland were vastly improved over Italy, and we still needed a last gasp drop goal to win. Hope Horne is practising - just in case

And I would point out our form has not translated into any real wins. Pluckly losers again.

I would argue our form has not moved an inch.....

The difference this year Manky is that Scotland are proving their 'perceived' improved form by actually demonstrating it on the pitch i.e. 3 points difference against Wales rather than 50, running France close and there is no way England will nil us again this 6N.

Riskysports wrote:

Manky-Flanker wrote:

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:

As stated by others Aqua, and no offence or disrespect intended, but current form suggests Scotland are vastly improved from last year, whereas Italy haven't.

The issue is 'current form' last year also suggested Scotland were vastly improved over Italy, and we still needed a last gasp drop goal to win. Hope Horne is practising - just in case

And I would point out our form has not translated into any real wins. Pluckly losers again.

I would argue our form has not moved an inch.....

Risky, I know you're doing your best to win a year's supply of free booze but seriously mate, how can you not say our performances are improved on last year. Yeah we're not winning but there has been some external factors which have heavily influenced the result.

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:

Riskysports wrote:

Manky-Flanker wrote:

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:

As stated by others Aqua, and no offence or disrespect intended, but current form suggests Scotland are vastly improved from last year, whereas Italy haven't.

The issue is 'current form' last year also suggested Scotland were vastly improved over Italy, and we still needed a last gasp drop goal to win. Hope Horne is practising - just in case

And I would point out our form has not translated into any real wins. Pluckly losers again.

I would argue our form has not moved an inch.....

Risky, I know you're doing your best to win a year's supply of free booze but seriously mate, how can you not say our performances are improved on last year. Yeah we're not winning but there has been some external factors which have heavily influenced the result.

I can say that as I, like you, have lived through enough false dawns and close heroic losses.

I have decided that, until we actually start winning, to stop saying we are a better side - as everyone, including me, is bored of that -and we are yet to prove it in results. that is now my ONLY yard stick for improvement of the team

And sadly enough the extra factors, are also something that we have been having for the lasts 10 years

I don't necessarily agree that unless we win our form automatically cannot have improved.

Unfortunately, given where we started from there is an interim stage called 'getting stuffed by fewer points'.

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:The difference this year Manky is that Scotland are proving their 'perceived' improved form by actually demonstrating it on the pitch i.e. 3 points difference against Wales rather than 50, running France close and there is no way England will nil us again this 6N.

Well not to be too cynical ,
1) 3 points against Wales instead of 50 - home advantage and not having our fullback sent off early doors might help explain this.
2) Running France close - we did this last year too, remember a certain mr Huget
3) Nil against England - if we get cards (Dunbar) and Laidlaw leaves his kicking shoes at home as he did last time.......

George Carlin wrote:I don't necessarily agree that unless we win our form automatically cannot have improved.

Unfortunately, given where we started from there is an interim stage called 'getting stuffed by fewer points'.

Yes, but I feel I have used that put stop for years now and there is no gas left in the tank

My personal opinion and I realise that I may be alone in this position

I am with you risky. I argued right from the beginning that 3 wins was the minimum required if we want to be taken seriously and to prove that we are competitive n/ improved. We have lost two games we could and perhaps should have won. Same old same old. Its dispiriting

Judging by Kevin Locke twitter account he's not coming or sru didnt offer him anything. Something to effect bored of rumours ...

Only real concern with this side is Swinson, great club player, but I've said before not big enough for an international lock. I'd rather have seen Toolis on form this season, but appreciate why BVC might think he's too raw to start.

As stated previously this is a must win and with Cotter now fecking-up The Warriors Pro12 efforts, they better do it with some to spare. Pete Horne had a very good game last Saturday and fully deserves the call up in light of the disgraceful decision (s) surrounding Finn Russell. Horne kicked very well on Saturday too and at last has re-discovered his pre-injury form.

Worrying statement from Cotter

“Moving Greig over wasn’t even discussed: we didn’t believe it was a possibility. Greig has been playing well at No 9, and rather than change two playmakers we decided only to change the one.”

Now he obviously isn't going to publicly say that Laidlaw has been slow, laborious and made wrong decisions in previous games, but i hope he has at least had a word in private to get him to speed things up.

As his been said, his track record with inexperienced 10s outside him says otherwise, but we can but hope!

Who let Glasgow boy in here?

Are you talking about kicking form hand or kicking from the tee Mr Schiz? I didn't get to watch the match as, well, there are more important things that watching soap dodgers run about on a bit of grass!

If it's from the tee, who cares, as surely laidlaw will still be taking the shots at goal?

Ah but Tiger, the New Model Gameplan is to run and run so you don't want a kicking 10. If Frodo gets the ball to Furra and if he ships it to Dunbar sharpish, and with great regularity, then we will win. I understand why you feel
"there are more important things that watching soap dodgers run about on a bit of grass!"
All those unmoisturised complexions, all those unconditioned coifs, all those rough cuticles
No amount of free flowing rugby and try bonus points could ever make up for that. You stay with the Luvvies, they're much easier on the eye.
p.s. Sam Warburton says in The Torygraph this morning that last week was the best Scotland side he's played against.

No 7&1/2 wrote:I d wait til you beat England before proclaiming a bitchslapping aqua.

no I don't agree. It's not a question of winning the match or of coming close in the final score. the two years ago match at Twicks turned into the second half in a massive "bitchslapping" of England in their own soil. We outscored them, we scored the only try, we spent 35' into their 22 and only a lethal mix of our usual poor-kicking and ref allowing English players to fly over rucks bailed them out. I know they won the game, but, as always has been said, we're just Italy. We came even closer the year before in Rome, but in a total different way. We were ahead in the scoreboard but they had the control of the game for 40' long minutes. They never did it on 2013. you can re-watch the match on you tube if you like

Valiant losers would be more apt.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Valiant losers would be more apt.

whatever..

jimbopip wrote:Ah but Tiger, the New Model Gameplan is to run and run so you don't want a kicking 10. If Frodo gets the ball to Furra and if he ships it  to Dunbar sharpish, and with great regularity, then we will win. I understand why you feel
"there are more important things that watching soap dodgers run about on a bit of grass!"
All those unmoisturised complexions, all those unconditioned coifs, all those rough cuticles
No amount of free flowing rugby and try bonus points could ever make up for that. You stay with the Luvvies, they're much easier on the eye.
p.s. Sam Warburton says in The Torygraph this morning that last week was the best Scotland side he's played against.

If I was Bender from Futurama, I'd tell Warbs to bite my shiny metal ass!

Is this him trying to mend bridges after his moaning that Russell should have been red carded?

No 7&1/2 wrote:Valiant losers would be more apt.

We wrote the book on that!

RDW_Scotland wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Valiant losers would be more apt.

We wrote the book on that!

we are tired of pats on shoulders to be honest

aqualung71 wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Valiant losers would be more apt.

We wrote the book on that!

we are tired of pats on shoulders to be honest

So are we!

RDW_Scotland wrote:

aqualung71 wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Valiant losers would be more apt.

We wrote the book on that!

we are tired of pats on shoulders to be honest

So are we!

see,in some way you're seen as more serious contenders than us

Because Scotland have at least had recent history of being winners. They're also building a potentially very good team. Perhaps I'm just being funny you chose so a way of describing a good performance that eneded in defeat but I suppose it's not your first language so don't quite get it.

Until Scotland winning we are losers

FACT

Valiant my butttttttt

LOSERS - that is us

And I will stick with that until we win

Then we will be WINNERS

Only LOSERS spent time finding and remembering aspects within a game that was good - WINNERS just have to look at the final score

Hopefully after this week end, we will be WINNERS

RiskySports doing a fine impression of the Reverend IM Jolly as always.

Best opening to a sermon:

"God's creation is a contrast of dark and light, sadness and happiness, and it is the sadness that I wish to dwell on in my sermon today".