Mike Brown a serious doubt.

Article on BBC Sport now rates Brown very doubtful for the game on Sunday, what do 606v2 reckon then... Goode to Full back in a straight swap or Nowell to right wing and Watson to full back?

Just read the article about him. I do hope he will be all right. I would rather see him on the side line and recovering, than seeing him on the field and not being 100% fully fit, and get injured again.

I didn't think England missed much when he went off. On form brown is class, but he's been out of sorts lately. Poor defensive reads and not offering much on attack.

Watson has been electric, leave him where he is would be my advice.

This is good and bad.
Good that the concussion eval, treatment, and recovery are being taken dead on seriously. I am really not surprised for a number of reasons, practical and otherwise. But gratified to see Brown is being treated as a handle-with-care case. As he should.
Bad, because no one wants to see any Rugby player have a severe head trauma at any time. Clearly, this was very serious.

He didn't look flash at the time. Best to lay up and get yourself sorted, agree. Glad this is getting addressed now.

I actually wonder how long this upright choke tackle will be tolerated from the likes of Ireland. Just asking for concussion when the smaller lads get hit head on by a couple of back rowers/props.

Shame about Brown but he needs to be right before returning and it's true that he hasn't quite hit top form yet - that said I think we'll miss him if he doesn't play. I thought England looked good with Watson at full back against Italy but Ireland will be a much sterner test. Probably best to stick Goode at the back and hope that as Beshocked says he plays like a man with lots to prove and that he grasps the opportunity.

England's problem is nigh on unmanageable depth. Too many players of similar calibre and no way to test the best line up.

stub wrote:Shame about Brown but he needs to be right before returning and it's true that he hasn't quite hit top form yet - that said I think we'll miss him if he doesn't play. I thought England looked good with Watson at full back against Italy but Ireland will be a much sterner test. Probably best to stick Goode at the back and hope that as Beshocked says he plays like a man with lots to prove and that he grasps the opportunity.

Agree completely.  Put Goode back there.  Shame Foden isn't healthy, but that is a long way off.  

By the way, does anyone have a good video of the choke tackle?  I want to share it with some coaches later this week to get opinions.  I am uncomfortable with it at youth age groups.

TheRugbyMaster wrote:England's problem is nigh on unmanageable depth. Too many players of similar calibre and no way to test the best line up.

It sounds like England's problem is having no one who stands out from the rest.

[quote="doctor_grey"]

stub wrote:
By the way, does anyone have a good video of the choke tackle?  I want to share it with some coaches later this week to get opinions.  I am uncomfortable with it at youth age groups.

PM sent with two video links. Hope they got through

This World Cup could be the first decided by TKO if it continues.

LondonTiger wrote:

doctor_grey wrote:By the way, does anyone have a good video of the choke tackle?  I want to share it with some coaches later this week to get opinions.  I am uncomfortable with it at youth age groups.

PM sent with two video links. Hope they got through

yes, they did get through - thanks! This was perfect. Especially the counterpoint between how to do it and then what can happen if it goes wrong. You read my mind.
I want to make sure at age groups we are not teaching kids to go in high on defense. My worry is exactly what you showed in the second video - the risk of another injury.

Goode isn't everyone's cup of tea but, if Nowell also came into the starting side, the back three would all have full back experience which might be useful if Ireland kick and chase a lot.

Can't wait to watch the "catch, run 5m, jink absolutely no one then get smashed" x 15 on Sunday

Trying to be positive. Trying trying not to think 'jink jink smash'. Or of the deceptive speed.

On the plus side Goode is smart, an excellent kicker and good under the high ball. He might be just the right player for a bad weather game, as he was a couple of years ago.

As others have alluded to , Goode has both useful attributes and some weaknesses. If he plays, we have a natural 2nd playmaker option so cover for the relative weakness of Burrell and Joseph as a pair in this regard (didn't matter v Wales, and 12trees played most of the game v Italy anyway). He's also pretty solid under the high ball and has a very good boot.

He's not the greatest tackler to ever play 15 (then again I don't think Brown is either), and he lacks a bit of pace to be a great international back 3 player. It's the quote about deceptive pace apparently first used to describe former Liverpool football player and manager Roy Evans: He has deceptive pace, he's slower than he looks.

Overall though for a game in Dublin, while I would prefer Brown to be fit, I prefer the idea of Goode being the starting fullback than for Watson to play there as opposed to the wing.

I wonder if Goode's inclusion will make Nowell's more likely as well.  Our current backline isn't the most physical and Brown made up a fair bit of that.  The breakdown battle will be really tough at the weekend and I think we've struggled to get there quick enough or in good numbers thus far this 6N, so I'm expecting a lot of slow ball and congested play on Sunday.  With Lancaster stating that Nowell is in strong contention it might be his more nuggety running abilities in the backline that swing it his way.

Brown is a class act. England will be worse without him. Nowell on the wing in place of May and Goode to fullback if the great Mike is not available.

TheRugbyMaster wrote:I didn't think England missed much when he went off. On form brown is class, but he's been out of sorts lately. Poor defensive reads and not offering much on attack.

Watson has been electric, leave him where he is would be my advice.

He made one poor read, confused by Watson's inexplicable decision to dummy tackle, and had a good game vs Wales. He will be hugely hugely missed, and offered a lot in attack vs Wales, his form was down in the autumn but has been fine since.


Big big loss especially given conditions in Ireland this weekend. Think you are a tad mad to think he's genuinely out of sorts in 2015

TheRugbyMaster wrote:England's problem is nigh on unmanageable depth. Too many players of similar calibre and no way to test the best line up.

This is false too for most positions. The person holding the shirt in a gelled team is de facto better than an equal player on equal form, and id say we have very clear first choices in the entire pack, 15 and options who can show up equal well everywhere else bar the centres which are an issue. That's not a weakness, it's a strength

Also I have to say the tone of your comments seems familiar, have we met elsewhere?

The Great Aukster wrote:

TheRugbyMaster wrote:England's problem is nigh on unmanageable depth. Too many players of similar calibre and no way to test the best line up.

It sounds like England's problem is having no one who stands out from the rest.

Reckon we'll be fine, thank you