The v2 Forum
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

+73
Margin_Walker
Presuming Ed
Cowshot
dummy_half
stub
emontagu
DirtyRucker7
Hoonercat
nlpnlp
maestegmafia
king_carlos
B91212
Cyril
mikey_dragon
Duty281
Scottrf
TJ
Exiledinborders
GLove39
LordDowlais
Notch
Sgt_Pooly
doctor_grey
nathan
Bathman_in_London
BamBam
No 7&1/2
beshocked
jamesandimac
ClivesWoodWould
Mad for Chelsea
LondonTiger
WELL-PAST-IT
cb
kingelderfield
aucklandlaurie
majesticimperialman
Knowsit17
DaveM
Rory_Gallagher
Taylorman
thomh
emack2
Gwlad
hugehandoff
bedfordwelsh
rodders
SecretFly
Poorfour
Rugby Fan
protea438
TightHEAD
Welly
fa0019
Dubbelyew L Overate
lostinwales
RubyGuby
RuggerRadge2611
Sin é
Pal Joey
Barney McGrew did it
sad_gimp
munkian
George Carlin
chewed_mintie
funnyExiledScot
offload
Student-A1
englandglory4ever
Geordie
gregortree
eirebilly
yappysnap
77 posters

Page 11 of 20 Previous  1 ... 7 ... 10, 11, 12 ... 15 ... 20  Next

Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by yappysnap Fri 20 Nov 2015, 7:24 am

First topic message reminder :

So the worst kept secret is out...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/england/12005671/Eddie-Jones-to-be-confirmed-as-England-head-coach-in-next-24-hours.html

Jury's out on this one, will have to see how the 6Ns goes then ponder his selection.

yappysnap

Posts : 11993
Join date : 2011-06-01
Age : 36
Location : Christchurch, NZ

Back to top Go down


Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by Scottrf Fri 18 Dec 2015, 12:22 pm

I'm sure they know it, putting it to practice is different. The backs haven't been flowing for about 12 months now. But that's not so relevant when you're talking about the scrummaging ability of Mako/other front rows.

Scottrf

Posts : 14359
Join date : 2011-01-26

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 18 Dec 2015, 12:34 pm

I'd just like the best exponents of the scrum and lineout on the pitch at the start. Vunipola has a lot to offer but I don't think he's as strong as a few looseheads but offers a great deal coming off the bench. I'm not sure we can count on Borthwick hitting the ground running and improve both scrum and lineout, more liekly a longer term thing. It will reveal a lot who he picks but I'm hoping he looks at perceived mistakes of having a pack too focused on open play.

No 7&1/2

Posts : 31374
Join date : 2012-10-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by beshocked Fri 18 Dec 2015, 12:35 pm

scottrf it's not just about the backs... A team is about the backs and the forwards.

A frontrow these days needs to be able to do more than just scrummage. Needs to be able to be a strong carrier, tackle well, help at the breakdown, help in the rolling mauls.

The scrummage battle was almost a irrelevance in the Racing Metro vs Saints game. Racing Metro forwards overpowered their Saints counterparts.

Vunipola might not be as technically gifted at scrum time as some of his fellow frontrowers but he's shown his value time and again in other ways.

Oh and reffing decisions can sometimes be random anyway.

beshocked

Posts : 14849
Join date : 2011-03-08

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by Student-A1 Fri 18 Dec 2015, 12:37 pm

Seems that we are getting back to being strong in areas we have traditionally been good in. My pick at TH is Brookes as has been the best prop in the league this year. But having him and Cole pushing for that spot, not a bad problem to have.
Hartley for me plays if fit, some distance between him and anyone else. Really not that sold on George, may be proved wrong.
LH is interesting, I would imagine that Marler will start which is understandable. But the replacement is interesting, I beleive that the most talented prop coming through is Auterac but would probably benefit from full season of first 15 at club. Vunipola to be on bench.
Locks I would love to see Launchbury and Itoje, both just ooze class and even if Itoje is still raw his talent is worth the risk. Kruis a very capable backup.
Backrow is Vunipola certainly then questions. Would love for it to be Fraser but just always worry for him injury wise, so Kvesic to be given a run. Not sure about 6, not sold on Robshaw as think he is a work horse but we need something more.

Backs highlight the same weaknesses as always, still no outstanding 9, Youngs form is better and most people would say Simpson is the stadnout SH this year. Hopefully one will emerge and be consistent.
FH, think Ford is suffering from having two SHs at club who are woeful distributers so would still like him starting. 12 is another issue, for all the talk of Burgess keeping out Burrell, nothing this year has made me think England missed out at all. Devastating that Slade was injured as is a star in the making but highlights are huge weak area. Need some youth to hopefully come through and hope Slade returns soonish.

One controversial thing I would like to see this year is Watson being played at fullback, I want to make clear that Brown has done zero wrong but firstly Watson is a fullback really not a winger and one who can go the length on the counter, but secondly it also allows us to see other wingers. Yardes' form has returned and Rokoduguni is still beating men for fun. I believe the back 3 will be the same as at world cup but would like some experimentation too.

Student-A1

Posts : 142
Join date : 2013-03-19

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by LondonTiger Fri 18 Dec 2015, 12:44 pm

Until Mako can bring his loose play form from Sarries to England I will always be doubtful of his value to the team.

LondonTiger
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 23485
Join date : 2011-02-10

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 18 Dec 2015, 12:51 pm

It's still Itoje as a starter I scratch my head at. Maybe at a push at 6 but even then some quality players around there. Not good enough at the lineout to sit next to Launchbury and not big enough to sit next to a Parling. No real need to rush him in the short term.

No 7&1/2

Posts : 31374
Join date : 2012-10-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by beshocked Fri 18 Dec 2015, 12:53 pm

Student A-1 I think you make a lot of very good points. Don't agree with all of it but does show how complicated it is and how people can have such opposing opinions.

Londontiger I thought he showed that in the game vs Fiji prominently, him and his brother working effectively in tandem.

We haven't seen that combo from England from the start have we? I am not saying it would work but it's certainly an option. England certainly have to look to get over the gain line and that means taking the work load off the no 8.

beshocked

Posts : 14849
Join date : 2011-03-08

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by LondonTiger Fri 18 Dec 2015, 12:56 pm

Last time you pushed Mako, I dug up his caree stats tackling and carrying and compared vs Marler. Marler was superior in terms of tackles and yards per minute. You completely disregarded/ignored that so not doing it again. Just saying though that for me Mako has, like many players, looked far more effective for club than country.

LondonTiger
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 23485
Join date : 2011-02-10

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by Scottrf Fri 18 Dec 2015, 12:57 pm

beshocked wrote:scottrf it's not just about the backs... A team is about the backs and the forwards.

A frontrow these days needs to be able to do more than just scrummage. Needs to be able to be a strong carrier, tackle well, help at the breakdown, help in the rolling mauls.

The scrummage battle was almost a irrelevance in the Racing Metro vs Saints game. Racing Metro forwards overpowered their Saints counterparts.

Vunipola might not be as technically gifted at scrum time as some of his fellow frontrowers but he's shown his value time and again in other ways.

Oh and reffing decisions can sometimes be random anyway.
Well we have the longest distance made by mauls in the Champions Cup this year so it's not all they do.

Agree with most of Student's last post.

Scottrf

Posts : 14359
Join date : 2011-01-26

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by Student-A1 Fri 18 Dec 2015, 1:05 pm

I think Itoje is ready and at 6'5'' and 18st5lb wouldn't say he lacks size. I very much doubt that Parling will be in the squad. If dependable lineout is what is gone for then I would imagine it will be Kruis. I think the fact Itoje is starting and performing against teams like Ulster and Toulose is a good indication he is ready. However I would be happy with Kruis, I struggle to see beyond these two being the partner for Launchbury who is surely a banker.

Student-A1

Posts : 142
Join date : 2013-03-19

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 18 Dec 2015, 1:09 pm

He looks like a similar stature to Lawes without being as good in the lineout. I'd rather have Slater, Kitchener guys coming to their peak and have been around a while.

No 7&1/2

Posts : 31374
Join date : 2012-10-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 18 Dec 2015, 1:17 pm

I am nit picking, we're got some great players and not much between them, just feel that fraser or Kvesic needs to come in, Robshaw is a helluva player so losing Wood I'd want a really strong 2nd row. Kitchener is the guy who adds ballast for me along with a really great lineout presence. Launchbury is just undroppable for me.

No 7&1/2

Posts : 31374
Join date : 2012-10-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by lostinwales Fri 18 Dec 2015, 1:19 pm

Find it hard to look past Kitchener. Very good line out operator. Big guy who works hard whats not to like?

lostinwales
lostinwales
lostinwales

Posts : 13355
Join date : 2011-06-09
Location : Out of Wales :)

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by sad_gimp Fri 18 Dec 2015, 1:32 pm

Tbh we aren't short of quality locks, Launchbury, Kruis, Kitchener, Lawes. Itoje I'd introduce with some bench appearances or the Italy game this 6n, no rush.

Dave Ward starting at 7 again for quins again tomorrow...he's as good a breakdown technician as any English player.

sad_gimp

Posts : 518
Join date : 2011-05-20
Location : Germany

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 18 Dec 2015, 1:47 pm

Kind of a shame they ever moved him from 7 given how good he is.

No 7&1/2

Posts : 31374
Join date : 2012-10-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by Sgt_Pooly Fri 18 Dec 2015, 2:06 pm

If Launchbury starts, Itoje will not. Neither are strong in the line out or at re-starts.

I read an article yesterday suggesting Launchbury wasn't as much as a banker as most people seem to think he his. It cited his "core lock work" as not being particularly strong and he was more about loose work. I'm pretty sure the article suggested Attwood & Kruis as the best options.

Find it hard to look past Kitchener. Very good line out operator. Big guy who works hard whats not to like?

I think he can be a little lazy at times. I'm not completley sold although he's certainly improved in this area.


Sgt_Pooly

Posts : 36294
Join date : 2011-04-27

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 18 Dec 2015, 2:22 pm

Who was saying that sgt?

No 7&1/2

Posts : 31374
Join date : 2012-10-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by LondonTiger Fri 18 Dec 2015, 2:23 pm

How much has Attwood played this season?

I certainly cannot remember seeing him doing well - but may be because he has not been playing.


As to hooker, if Hartley can escape the concussion symptoms and play anything like he was at the start of the season he will be selected I feel. If however he is not back playing in the next two weeks things open up. This 6Ns may be too early but Tommy Taylor as about the only AP hooker who strikes for the ball regularly may well interest Jones and Borthwick.

LondonTiger
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 23485
Join date : 2011-02-10

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by Sgt_Pooly Fri 18 Dec 2015, 2:44 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:Who was saying that sgt?

http://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/features/columnists/nick-cain/24710/nick-cain-suggests-new-england-coach-eddie-jones-should-seize-his-chance-to-revamp-the-scrum/

They seem to ask more questions than try and give answers but there's some valid points.

"The idea that Joe Launchbury is suddenly the panacea to all England’s front five and captaincy ills is also flush with wishful thinking. Launchbury remains a promising lock who should be in the mix, but he is no towering presence as a lineout or re-start operator, and until those areas are as impressive as his work in the loose sometimes is, he is not assured of a place."

Sgt_Pooly

Posts : 36294
Join date : 2011-04-27

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by Student-A1 Fri 18 Dec 2015, 2:47 pm

LondonTiger wrote:How much has Attwood played this season?

I certainly cannot remember seeing him doing well - but may be because he has not been playing.


As to hooker, if Hartley can escape the concussion symptoms and play anything like he was at the start of the season he will be selected I feel. If however he is not back playing in the next two weeks things open up. This 6Ns may be too early but Tommy Taylor as about the only AP hooker who strikes for the ball regularly may well interest Jones and Borthwick.

Came back last week and was excellent for Bath who had been playing with no senior second rows previous. Prior to the injury he was also very good albeit in a somewhat unbalanced second row with Dominic Day being injured. The fact that there is so much debate over the best selection shows how this should become an area of strength.

Why we can't do the same in the 12 position ever is pretty gutting.

Student-A1

Posts : 142
Join date : 2013-03-19

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 18 Dec 2015, 2:51 pm

I agree he's not brilliant in the lineout just good and no one for England seems assured on restarts bar maybe Parling. Absolute nailed on starter for me though. One of the best locks in the world. The author is just doing what we've all been doing, naming anyone remotely in the running. I'd be amazed if Launchbury is fit and doesn't start every game.

No 7&1/2

Posts : 31374
Join date : 2012-10-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by Student-A1 Fri 18 Dec 2015, 2:53 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:I agree he's not brilliant in the lineout just good and no one for England seems assured on restarts bar maybe Parling. Absolute nailed on starter for me though. One of the best locks in the world. The author is just doing what we've all been doing, naming anyone remotely in the running. I'd be amazed if Launchbury is fit and doesn't start every game.

100% agree with this comment.

Student-A1

Posts : 142
Join date : 2013-03-19

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by LondonTiger Fri 18 Dec 2015, 2:54 pm

Sgt_Pooly wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:Who was saying that sgt?

http://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/features/columnists/nick-cain/24710/nick-cain-suggests-new-england-coach-eddie-jones-should-seize-his-chance-to-revamp-the-scrum/

They seem to ask more questions than try and give answers but there's some valid points.

"The idea that Joe Launchbury is suddenly the panacea to all England’s front five and captaincy ills is also flush with wishful thinking. Launchbury remains a promising lock who should be in the mix, but he is no towering presence as a lineout or re-start operator, and until those areas are as impressive as his work in the loose sometimes is, he is not assured of a place."

Ah well. Nick Cain is a complete and utter dicktard, usually with no idea of what the selectors are planning

LondonTiger
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 23485
Join date : 2011-02-10

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 18 Dec 2015, 2:56 pm

Brilliant use of an insult I've never heard before LT!

No 7&1/2

Posts : 31374
Join date : 2012-10-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by Sgt_Pooly Fri 18 Dec 2015, 3:53 pm

I agree it's a little bit of a sweeping article but he has a point on some things. The speed of our flankers and lack of breakdown the obvious ones.

Sgt_Pooly

Posts : 36294
Join date : 2011-04-27

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by gregortree Fri 18 Dec 2015, 9:03 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:Brilliant use of an insult I've never heard before LT!

Lol laughing Also known technically as a flaccid erection.

gregortree

Posts : 3676
Join date : 2011-11-23
Location : Gloucestershire (was from London)

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by yappysnap Tue 29 Dec 2015, 5:14 pm

Ian Peel leaves England U20 role to take part-time role as England's scrum coach and also joins Saracens.

yappysnap

Posts : 11993
Join date : 2011-06-01
Age : 36
Location : Christchurch, NZ

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by yappysnap Tue 29 Dec 2015, 5:21 pm

I know absolutely nothing about him, and the U20's are difficult to compare against full internationals.

I assume Eddie or his advisers see something impressive in him though.

And he'll know a heck of a lot about a lot of youngsters that Jones may want to select.

So that's

Head Coach/Manager/Attack Coach/Backs Coach - Eddie Jones
Forwards Coach - Steve Borthwick
Defense Coach - Paul Gustard
Scrum Coach - Ian Peel

4 coaches, 2 ex Saracens coaches, 1 ex Saracens captain and 1 soon to be Saracens coach.


What a time to be alive.

yappysnap

Posts : 11993
Join date : 2011-06-01
Age : 36
Location : Christchurch, NZ

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by nathan Tue 29 Dec 2015, 5:40 pm

does that mean a sarries game plan?

nathan

Posts : 11033
Join date : 2011-06-14
Location : Leicestershire

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by yappysnap Tue 29 Dec 2015, 6:16 pm

Who knows, although we can assume it may be similar

yappysnap

Posts : 11993
Join date : 2011-06-01
Age : 36
Location : Christchurch, NZ

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by nathan Tue 29 Dec 2015, 6:21 pm

Joy. The media and fans will be doing a full circle then.

-Moan about England's lack of ambition under Lancaster
-Moan about not winning and so we should go back to what we are good at (forward based game)
-Eddie comes in and plays a forwards based game, fans moan about the style and want an exciting brand of rugby...

It goes on

nathan

Posts : 11033
Join date : 2011-06-14
Location : Leicestershire

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by Gwlad Tue 29 Dec 2015, 6:29 pm

There will only be moaning about style when England start winning stuff. Thats a good thing, but i predict a long way off.

Jones challenge will be consistency in the face of so many options and finding a 10-12 axis he can stick with

Gwlad

Posts : 4224
Join date : 2014-12-04

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by yappysnap Tue 29 Dec 2015, 6:30 pm

Part of the joys of being an England fan Nathan, best get on board now while you can. OK

yappysnap

Posts : 11993
Join date : 2011-06-01
Age : 36
Location : Christchurch, NZ

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by DaveM Tue 29 Dec 2015, 7:23 pm

I'm pretty sure Brad Barritt is going to be the IC in the 6 Nations......

DaveM

Posts : 1912
Join date : 2011-06-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by gregortree Tue 29 Dec 2015, 7:31 pm

DaveM wrote:I'm pretty sure Brad Barritt is going to be the IC in the 6 Nations......
Noooooo ! picard

gregortree

Posts : 3676
Join date : 2011-11-23
Location : Gloucestershire (was from London)

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by No 7&1/2 Tue 29 Dec 2015, 8:15 pm

I'm starting to feel we're going to be the Saracens of International teams, or Ireland for short.

No 7&1/2

Posts : 31374
Join date : 2012-10-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by yappysnap Tue 29 Dec 2015, 8:22 pm

Where's Beshockeds post naming an all EQ Sarries team? Who'd have thought that was actually a premonition... Perhaps he's Ian Peel?

yappysnap

Posts : 11993
Join date : 2011-06-01
Age : 36
Location : Christchurch, NZ

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by LondonTiger Tue 29 Dec 2015, 8:39 pm

DaveM wrote:I'm pretty sure Brad Barritt is going to be the IC in the 6 Nations......

Is that in doubt?

LondonTiger
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 23485
Join date : 2011-02-10

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by king_carlos Tue 29 Dec 2015, 8:52 pm

I'd be happy with us using Sarries defensive system. Let our quick wingers rush up rapidly and lead the defence, alongside Joseph/Daly at 13 it's system that our fast outside backs could utilise well.

Brown would also be excellent at working as the 'last man' in defence covering outside the winger when they rush up. He is great at covering probing kicks and fearless in the tackle so would carry out that role excellently.

I hope we look to move the ball wider, faster than Sarries do though. Given our attacking prospects are built around quick 13s and wingers who are strong on the outside break it would be foolish to move to a route 1 game plan.

king_carlos

Posts : 12741
Join date : 2011-05-31
Location : Ankh-Morpork

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by DaveM Tue 29 Dec 2015, 9:47 pm

LondonTiger wrote:
DaveM wrote:I'm pretty sure Brad Barritt is going to be the IC in the 6 Nations......

Is that in doubt?

In my opinion not since Gustard was named defence coach, no.

DaveM

Posts : 1912
Join date : 2011-06-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by DaveM Tue 29 Dec 2015, 9:51 pm

king_carlos wrote:I'd be happy with us using Sarries defensive system. Let our quick wingers rush up rapidly and lead the defence, alongside Joseph/Daly at 13 it's system that our fast outside backs could utilise well.

Brown would also be excellent at working as the 'last man' in defence covering outside the winger when they rush up. He is great at covering probing kicks and fearless in the tackle so would carry out that role excellently.

I hope we look to move the ball wider, faster than Sarries do though. Given our attacking prospects are built around quick 13s and wingers who are strong on the outside break it would be foolish to move to a route 1 game plan.

In that case you need players who can move it wide fast. Barritt can't do that, and so the only actual creativity in the back line will come from Farrell and, possibly, from whoever is playing 13 (assuming they get to see the ball). We can't have our cake and eat it here - if we get a lot of the Saracens defence we'll also get quite a lot of the Saracens attack (which is incisive, but probably not as ambitious as we'd like to see from England).

DaveM

Posts : 1912
Join date : 2011-06-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by No 7&1/2 Tue 29 Dec 2015, 9:56 pm

Jones has placed himself in charge of attack pretty much which is the thing I'm clinging to. He'll surely want some attacking emphasis from midfield which i'm more and more convinced Barritt hinders rather than offering balance for others to attack.

No 7&1/2

Posts : 31374
Join date : 2012-10-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by DaveM Tue 29 Dec 2015, 10:18 pm

Yes, Barritt clearly hinders our attack. However, Jones has hired a defence coach who places a great deal of faith in him, and there actually aren't many other options:

- Hill: Not starting every game for Exeter, and probably about a year short of being ready for international rugby
- Burrell: Out of form.
- Eastmond: Playing in a backline which is struggling and has clear weaknesses as well as strengths.
- Slade: Injured
- Tuilagi: Injured
- Devoto: Not playing regularly enough.
- Stephenson: Not playing regularly enough and too inexperienced to be seriously considered at present.
- Farrell: By far the best FH in the country at the moment and so unlikely to be moved to 12.
- Williams: At least a year from being a serious contender as needs to gain experience.
- Mills: Has the skill-set and starts every game, but difficult to get selected whilst playing for Worcester at the moment and I have no idea how well he's actually playing.

I still think IC will be fine in a couple of years', as Slade, Hill, Devoto, Williams and Stephenson (and even Tuilagi and Sloan) all have considerable strengths and if they all stay fit and gain experience then it should become a very competitive position. Right now though I can't see past Barritt.

DaveM

Posts : 1912
Join date : 2011-06-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by king_carlos Tue 29 Dec 2015, 10:21 pm

DaveM wrote:
king_carlos wrote:I'd be happy with us using Sarries defensive system. Let our quick wingers rush up rapidly and lead the defence, alongside Joseph/Daly at 13 it's system that our fast outside backs could utilise well.

Brown would also be excellent at working as the 'last man' in defence covering outside the winger when they rush up. He is great at covering probing kicks and fearless in the tackle so would carry out that role excellently.

I hope we look to move the ball wider, faster than Sarries do though. Given our attacking prospects are built around quick 13s and wingers who are strong on the outside break it would be foolish to move to a route 1 game plan.

In that case you need players who can move it wide fast. Barritt can't do that, and so the only actual creativity in the back line will come from Farrell and, possibly, from whoever is playing 13 (assuming they get to see the ball). We can't have our cake and eat it here - if we get a lot of the Saracens defence we'll also get quite a lot of the Saracens attack (which is incisive, but probably not as ambitious as we'd like to see from England).

Hill has the hands to give and take a pass when under pressure from a tackler but still has the carrying to fix defenders.

In form, which he seems to be working back towards, Barritt has some basic distributions skills as well. Many players have been saved from criticism for their RWC performances due to being out of form, not fully fit and playing under a terrible game plan. I think it's fair enough to give Barritt the same scope.

My main fear with a Farrell and Barritt 10-12 is having to watch our attack function a fraction as well attacking left to right as it will right to left...

king_carlos

Posts : 12741
Join date : 2011-05-31
Location : Ankh-Morpork

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by yappysnap Tue 29 Dec 2015, 11:37 pm

On form alone Ashton is likely to be the right wing, or Nowell. Both are very good st coming in looking for the ball and not hanging out waiting for a pass.

That might save us a bit.

yappysnap

Posts : 11993
Join date : 2011-06-01
Age : 36
Location : Christchurch, NZ

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by king_carlos Tue 29 Dec 2015, 11:45 pm

Nowell will be on the left with Watson on the right I reckon Yappy.

Nowell is in even better form than Ashton and has been around the squad more recently. Watson hasn't impressed the same as Ashton or Nowell this season but has showed up well in internationals thus far and I just can't see Jones dropping a guy that talented unless he performs poorly enough to demand it.

king_carlos

Posts : 12741
Join date : 2011-05-31
Location : Ankh-Morpork

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by Mad for Chelsea Tue 29 Dec 2015, 11:51 pm

poor Jones Sad hasn't even picked his EPS yet, let alone his team, and already being criticised for playing a negative brand of rugby, and seeking to copy a template which is so dreadful it's seen a team not yet lose a match this season. Wink

Mad for Chelsea

Posts : 12103
Join date : 2011-02-11
Age : 36

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by DaveM Wed 30 Dec 2015, 12:42 am

king_carlos wrote:Nowell will be on the left with Watson on the right I reckon Yappy.

Nowell is in even better form than Ashton and has been around the squad more recently. Watson hasn't impressed the same as Ashton or Nowell this season but has showed up well in internationals thus far and I just can't see Jones dropping a guy that talented unless he performs poorly enough to demand it.

So:

11. Nowell
14. Ashton/Rokoduguni
15. Watson


DaveM

Posts : 1912
Join date : 2011-06-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by DaveM Wed 30 Dec 2015, 12:45 am

Mad for Chelsea wrote:poor Jones Sad hasn't even picked his EPS yet, let alone his team, and already being criticised for playing a negative brand of rugby, and seeking to copy a template which is so dreadful it's seen a team not yet lose a match this season. Wink

Isn't that how forum's work? Of course we could suspend discussion here until Jones names his matchday 23 for Scotland.........

DaveM

Posts : 1912
Join date : 2011-06-20

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by king_carlos Wed 30 Dec 2015, 1:08 am

DaveM wrote:
king_carlos wrote:Nowell will be on the left with Watson on the right I reckon Yappy.

Nowell is in even better form than Ashton and has been around the squad more recently. Watson hasn't impressed the same as Ashton or Nowell this season but has showed up well in internationals thus far and I just can't see Jones dropping a guy that talented unless he performs poorly enough to demand it.

So:

11. Nowell
14. Ashton/Rokoduguni
15. Watson

Brown is a much better FB than Watson currently. We add much more to the side with him at 15 and Watson on the wing that we do by moving Watson to 15. It will likely be Watson's best position long term, in fact I think he could be a star there with a bit more room to run. At current Brown is our best 15, I hope Jones tries to give Watson game time there towards the end of games if he gets the chance though.

For the sake of argument, if we want to replace Brown for the 6 Nations (I can't see why personally) then Pennell is our next best FB anyway IMO.

king_carlos

Posts : 12741
Join date : 2011-05-31
Location : Ankh-Morpork

Back to top Go down

Eddie Jones - England's New Coach - Page 11 Empty Re: Eddie Jones - England's New Coach

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 11 of 20 Previous  1 ... 7 ... 10, 11, 12 ... 15 ... 20  Next

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum