6N 2016 : Super Saturday Game 2 Ireland vs Scotland Dublin 17h00 KO

by RuggerRadge2611 Mon 14 Mar 2016, 7:59 pm

First topic message reminder :

6N 2016 : Super Saturday Game 2 Ireland vs Scotland Dublin 17h00 KO - Page 2 Irelan10

6N 2016 : Super Saturday Game 2 Ireland vs Scotland Dublin 17h00 KO - Page 2 Scot_f10

IRELAND v SCOTLAND
19 March 2016
KO: 17:00 local
Aviva Stadium, Dublin

Referee: Pascal Gauzere
Assistant Referees: Craig Joubert (South Africa) & Alexandre Ruiz (France)
Television match official: Shaun Veldsman (South Africa)

A. Head to Head

130 Played 130
59 Won 66
5 Drawn 5
66 Lost 59
1,416 Points 1,420

B. Recent Form

21 March 2015
BT Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
10 – 40 to Ireland

2 February 2014
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
28 – 6 to Ireland

24 February 2013
Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
12 – 8 to Scotland

10 March 2012
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
32 – 14 to Ireland

6 August 2011
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
10 – 6 to Scotland

27 February 2011
Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
18 – 21 to Ireland

20 March 2010
Croke Park, Dublin
20 – 23 to Scotland

C. Teams

IRELAND
6N 2016 : Super Saturday Game 2 Ireland vs Scotland Dublin 17h00 KO - Page 2 Laura-lacole-all-people-photo-u2

6N 2016 : Super Saturday Game 2 Ireland vs Scotland Dublin 17h00 KO - Page 2 Laura-lacole-all-people-photo-u2

FB 15 Simon Zebo
RW 14 Andrew Trimble
OC 13 Jared Payne
IC 12 Robbie Henshaw
LW 11 Keith Earls
FH 10 Jonathan Sexton
SH 9 Conor Murray

N8 8 Jamie Heaslip
OF 7 Tommy O'Donnell
BF 6 CJ Stander
RL 5 Devin Toner
LL 4 Donnacha Ryan
TP 3 Mike Ross
HK 2 Rory Best (c)
LP 1 Jack McGrath

Replacements:
HK 16 Richardt Strauss
PR 17 Cian Healy
PR 18 Nathan White
LK 19 Ultan Dillane
FL 20 Rhys Ruddock
SH 21 Eoin Reddan
FH 22 Ian Madigan
WG 23 Fergus McFadden

SCOTLAND
6N 2016 : Super Saturday Game 2 Ireland vs Scotland Dublin 17h00 KO - Page 2 2AowKnX

6N 2016 : Super Saturday Game 2 Ireland vs Scotland Dublin 17h00 KO - Page 2 2AowKnX

FB 15 Stuart Hogg
RW 14 Tommy Seymour
OC 13 Duncan Taylor
IC 12 Alex Dunbar
LW 11 Tim Visser
FH 10 Duncan Weir
SH 9 Greig Laidlaw (c)

N8 8 Ryan Wilson
OF 7 John Hardie
BF 6 John Barclay
RL 5 Tim Swinson
LL 4 Richie Gray
TP 3 WP Nel
HK 2 Ross Ford
LP 1 Alasdair Dickinson

Replacements:
HK 16 Stuart McInally
PR 17 Rory Sutherland
PR 18 Moray Low
FL 19 Rob Harley
FL 20 Josh Strauss
SH 21 Henry Pyrgos
CE 22 Peter Horne
WG 23 Sean Lamont

Could be a cracker guys! guinness

by **RDW** Wed 16 Mar 2016, 9:37 am

BigGee wrote:
EST wrote:
BigGee wrote:We have actually been quite lucky with injuries this tournament, so we can't really complain about losing Jonny G.

I don't think that there is any doubt that Swinson will start, if he was not seen as the next best option, then why would he have been on the bench for the whole tournament. Toolis has 5 mins of international rugby under his belt, hopefully he will get a better run out this time and show that he is up to the task and will get himself into the mix for future engagements. Swinson will give everything and won't let us down. He has played well for Glasgow the last couple of games.

Ryan Wilson as well has played well when he was given his chance, I am happy for him to carry on.

FH is more of a concern, though I have a suspicion that Finn may well be fit. If not then surely Horne will start after his game on Saturday, he may well anyway even if Russell is fit. I would go for Jackson on the bench on the basis of how well he played against Wales. I will also declare an interest as I want Glasgow to have a FH for their game against Leinster on Friday night!

I think we all agree that Swinson will start, my question is why? He is an honest, hard working player who is a very solid performer at Pro12 level. However, he just doesn't make enough impact at international level. BVC is a very good coach, but I do wonder what the continued justification for picking Swinson over Toolis is.

Toolis may well overtake Swinson in the pecking order but at the moment, Swinson is the player with international experience (including a WC) and Toolos has none (bar 5 mins and a yellow card!) So to say that he should be starting ahead of Swinson is a little bit fanciful as we really do not have any sort of idea whehter he will be able to make the international step up. Plenty decent club players don't make the grade as we know.

That is not to say that I don't rate or think Toolis will make it. He is a player with plenty of potential and given the chance may well show us what he can do. To throw him straight in as a starter though is a very big ask. Not many players, particularly forwards just get chucked straight into the white heat of an international test match and thrive.

What this has shown us though is that we have a good starting XV but we do need to develop some depth, particularly in certain key areas such as the second row. We have been lucky wiht injuries so far in this tournament and would not have done as well as we have should we have coped a few more. The summer tour that is comming up and the next set of autumn internationals are surely the opportunity to blood some more of these promising players, like Toolis. Ease them into international rugby a bit. If he gets called up in next years six nations, he may well be ready then.

The current Ireland pack is not England, Wales or France and we will cope against them with Swinson in the boiler room. If Toolis is on the bench, then I hope he does get a decent chunk of the second half to show us what he can bring to the party!

Apart from Itoje! thumbsup

I don't see it as a big risk throwing Toolis straight in there. It's not as if he's a brand new professional who has only just joined up with the Scotland squad. He's played 37 times for Edinburgh, including in a European Cup final, and has been involved with the Scotland squad since last year's 6N, so should be fully up to speed with the gameplan and lineout calls. He's also been training with the squad all 6N.

If Richie Gray calls the lineout (which he has been taking more responsiblity for apparently) then I see no reason why not to give Toolis a start.

by **BigGee** Wed 16 Mar 2016, 9:47 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:

Apart from Itoje!

I don't see it as a big risk throwing Toolis straight in there. It's not as if he's a brand new professional who has only just joined up with the Scotland squad. He's played 37 times for Edinburgh, including in a European Cup final, and has been involved with the Scotland squad since last year's 6N, so should be fully up to speed with the gameplan and lineout calls. He's also been training with the squad all 6N.

Well Itoje was not thrown straight in either and started his first game off the bench as well. He would likely still be on the bench had it not been for injuries but he has taken his chance and now owns the shirt!

To be fair as well, Itoje is that once in a generation player who is simply destined for greatness. I am not sure that even the most one eyed Scottish fan would say the same thing about Toolis, who is still a very good player by the way.

Whatever we think, it is VC opinion that counts and it is very relevant that he did not even give him a game in the WC warmups when he could easily have given him an opportunity. He clearly has doubts that he really is ready or whether he truely has the ability to step up. If he picks Harley in front of him this weekend, which is possible, that would tell us everything we know about how he really rates him.

by **RDW** Wed 16 Mar 2016, 9:50 am

BigGee wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:

Apart from Itoje!

I don't see it as a big risk throwing Toolis straight in there. It's not as if he's a brand new professional who has only just joined up with the Scotland squad. He's played 37 times for Edinburgh, including in a European Cup final, and has been involved with the Scotland squad since last year's 6N, so should be fully up to speed with the gameplan and lineout calls. He's also been training with the squad all 6N.

Well Itoje was not thrown straight in either and started his first game off the bench as well. He would likely still be on the bench had it not been for injuries but he has taken his chance and now owns the shirt!

To be fair as well, Itoje is that once in a generation player who is simply destined for greatness. I am not sure that even the most one eyed Scottish fan would say the same thing about Toolis, who is still a very good player by the way.

Whatever we think, it is VC opinion that counts and it is very relevant that he did not even give him a game in the WC warmups when he could easily have given him an opportunity. He clearly has doubts that he really is ready or whether he truely has the ability to step up. If he picks Harley in front of him this weekend, which is possible, that would tell us everything we know about how he really rates him.

The Itoje comment was meant in jest - I wasn't trying to compare the two - but my point still stands that I see very little risk in playing Toolis over Swinson as he is already an experience pro who has been involved with the Scotland set up regularly over the last year.

Are we more likely to lose if Toolis is picked over Swinson? Unlikely. Is there a greater long term benefit in playing Toolis over Swinson? Absolutely.

As you say though - maybe the big baldy just doesn't rate him. It would be interesting to know why given how good he is for Edinburgh.

by tigertattie Wed 16 Mar 2016, 10:05 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:

If Richie Gray calls the lineout (which he has been taking more responsiblity for apparently) then I see no reason why not to give Toolis a start.

That actually raises a point!

in years gone by, Hamilton was being picked as he was the one that called the lineouts, Jonny Gray then started getting lineout calling lessons from "The great leader" and got a place. Im not entirely sure if Ritchie has been working on the calling or not which may mean that Tiny Tim may get that starting spot as it may be he (as glasgow vice captain) that is the other lineout caller!

by **RDW** Wed 16 Mar 2016, 10:07 am

On the lineout front - apparently of the 8 lineouts we had against France, the following people took the ball:

Barclay - 5
R Gray - 2
Strauss - 1

Jonny didn't have a single lineout called to him! There were a lot of lineouts to the tail.

by Majestic83 Wed 16 Mar 2016, 10:22 am

Yeah I have noticed during this 6 nations that Barclay seems to be the main lineout jumper in most games.
Surprised Jonny didn't take any line out ball in the France game.
There was a shift in trend a couple years back where sides were using their slightly lighter back row players as the main jumpers to be lifted by the locks who with their added height can get them lifted to a greater height.

by TJ Wed 16 Mar 2016, 10:35 am

I would rather Harley than Swinson. Swinson is a liability. He cost both Scotland and Glasgow a game by coming on as a sub and getting a yellow card did he not? for me thats him out. NOr have I ever seen him do any positive play to merit a place.

Toolis or Harley please - send Swinson back to his club to learn some discipline

by funnyExiledScot Wed 16 Mar 2016, 10:59 am

TJ wrote:I would rather Harley than Swinson. Swinson is a liability. He cost both Scotland and Glasgow a game by coming on as a sub and getting a yellow card did he not? for me thats him out. NOr have I ever seen him do any positive play to merit a place.

Toolis or Harley please - send Swinson back to his club to learn some discipline

To be fair Toolis has an international yellow card to his name as well - his ratio to time on the pitch vs time on the naughty step for Scotland is almost Jim Hamilton-esque.

To be fair Swinson is not a bad player. He has a big workrate and throws himself about. When he made his debut I was keen to see how he got on. The downside is that he's small for international rugby and lacks impact. I suppose it's fair to point out that Donnacha Ryan isn't a giant either.

Swinson will be fine, I think think Ben Toolis has a bigger international future and more potential.

by EST Wed 16 Mar 2016, 11:17 am

BigGee wrote:
EST wrote:
BigGee wrote:We have actually been quite lucky with injuries this tournament, so we can't really complain about losing Jonny G.

I don't think that there is any doubt that Swinson will start, if he was not seen as the next best option, then why would he have been on the bench for the whole tournament. Toolis has 5 mins of international rugby under his belt, hopefully he will get a better run out this time and show that he is up to the task and will get himself into the mix for future engagements. Swinson will give everything and won't let us down. He has played well for Glasgow the last couple of games.

Ryan Wilson as well has played well when he was given his chance, I am happy for him to carry on.

FH is more of a concern, though I have a suspicion that Finn may well be fit. If not then surely Horne will start after his game on Saturday, he may well anyway even if Russell is fit. I would go for Jackson on the bench on the basis of how well he played against Wales. I will also declare an interest as I want Glasgow to have a FH for their game against Leinster on Friday night!

I think we all agree that Swinson will start, my question is why? He is an honest, hard working player who is a very solid performer at Pro12 level. However, he just doesn't make enough impact at international level. BVC is a very good coach, but I do wonder what the continued justification for picking Swinson over Toolis is.

Toolis may well overtake Swinson in the pecking order but at the moment, Swinson is the player with international experience (including a WC) and Toolos has none (bar 5 mins and a yellow card!) So to say that he should be starting ahead of Swinson is a little bit fanciful as we really do not have any sort of idea whehter he will be able to make the international step up. Plenty decent club players don't make the grade as we know.

That is not to say that I don't rate or think Toolis will make it. He is a player with plenty of potential and given the chance may well show us what he can do. To throw him straight in as a starter though is a very big ask. Not many players, particularly forwards just get chucked straight into the white heat of an international test match and thrive.

What this has shown us though is that we have a good starting XV but we do need to develop some depth, particularly in certain key areas such as the second row. We have been lucky wiht injuries so far in this tournament and would not have done as well as we have should we have coped a few more. The summer tour that is comming up and the next set of autumn internationals are surely the opportunity to blood some more of these promising players, like Toolis. Ease them into international rugby a bit. If he gets called up in next years six nations, he may well be ready then.

The current Ireland pack is not England, Wales or France and we will cope against them with Swinson in the boiler room. If Toolis is on the bench, then I hope he does get a decent chunk of the second half to show us what he can bring to the party!

I see your point BigGee, and you are right - Swinson will put in a shift and probably won't let us down (his punch earlier this season does seem to have been out of character). However, Toolis should have been given time to accrue international experience prior to this game. After watching both over the past season and a half, his form certainly merits it.

by eirebilly Wed 16 Mar 2016, 2:25 pm

Scotland have been coming along very nicely and as a neutral, its been enjoying to watch. With a full side I suspect that they would have pushed Ireland but I now feel that Ireland will have the edge, especially at home.

still expect an excellent game.

by TJ Wed 16 Mar 2016, 3:44 pm

EST - the punch may have been out of character but he also came on as a sub in another game late on, gave away a couple of stupid pens and cost his side the game. Neither have I ever seen him do anything worthy of a place as an international lock. I bet you this - if he plays he will cost the team big time. Missed tackles and pens. IMO he is a liability. I wouldn't even have him in the team for his club.

by Nematode Wed 16 Mar 2016, 3:49 pm

I know this is a rather moot point, but would anyone have preferred Denton on at second row if fit?

I think given Swinson is on the bench he'll start, although I'd quite like Harley to play as he's a bit more like J gray.

On the topic of Grays, I thought R Gray had his best performance in a Scottish jersey vs France, finally carrying like he should.

by **RDW** Wed 16 Mar 2016, 3:57 pm

Nematode wrote:I know this is a rather moot point, but would anyone have preferred Denton on at second row if fit?

Nope.

Until he's regularly playing there for club he shouldn't be for country. Plus he's really not made for the 2nd row!

by SecretFly Wed 16 Mar 2016, 3:59 pm

So it seems that if Ireland win, they still only manage a draw!

Damn those meddling stats!

(oh sorry - a misread on my part) It's a loss still for Ireland on the overall stats.

by **BigGee** Wed 16 Mar 2016, 4:04 pm

Completely no to Dents in he seond row. He is just not the sort of grafer that you need there. It has taken Ritchie Gray years to work out what he primarily is on the field to do. I am not sure if Dents would ever get it. Plus he clearly does not like playing there.

Harley a maybe, at least he will get on with it. With Denton you would still find him out in the backs far to much!

by funnyExiledScot Wed 16 Mar 2016, 4:36 pm

Agreed - Denton is absolutely not a second row, same with Harley (for different reasons).

I see Denton as a specialist ball carrying number 8. I see Harley as a specialist "tackle everything that moves" blindside. Neither are locks.

by EST Wed 16 Mar 2016, 5:25 pm

I agree on the above, Denton is as much a second row as Nel is a stand-off.

by TJ Wed 16 Mar 2016, 5:34 pm

Nel made a couple of really good passes at first receiver / SH did he not against france ? Wink

by **George Carlin** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 5:28 am

Quality thread, Radge. Please do all of them from now on.

Can I stress again that Karen Gillan is fabulous:

- In terms of injuries, losing the guy who topped the tackle count in the last 6 Nations and the last World Cup is going to hurt anyone and could well be the difference between winning and losing, particularly given how effective the Irish lineout is. How amazingly influential a 22 year old can be. How long before the French clubs move in for Gray the Younger?

- Cotter is going to select Tiny Tim. Accept it, everyone. 'Why' is a very good question - Cotter and Hines must see something in him, however. Hopefully Toolis will bench and when Tim has done his 'bluebottle hitting a windscreen' impression for half an hour, he will be hooked and Toolis will get on to throw his considerable size around. Toolis has to know that he won't get many chances to make an international impact with the Grays, Swinson and Gilchrist on the list, so hopefully he will have the game of his career.

- Radio silence on Russell, so clearly they are hoping that the medics will realise there is little differentiating someone from Ayr with someone with brain damage.

by carpet baboon Thu 17 Mar 2016, 7:51 am

George you can stress all day long about her. No one would blame you

by **RDW** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 8:57 am

Reports in the papers that Tiny Tim will start and Russell isn't going to recover in time.

by **BigGee** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 9:05 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:Reports in the papers that Tiny Tim will start and Russell isn't going to recover in time.

After the game Horne played last week, I am a lot less concerned about Finn not playing than I would have been. It also re-assures me about the adherence they are giving to the concussion protocols, which I am not convinced everybody is following (cough cough London Irish!)

The question will be who then benches, it surely must be one of Weir/Jackson and with a distinctly Glasgow bias and no reflection on Duncan as a player (he has actually been putting in his best run of games in a long time recently) I would rather it was Jacko!

by **RDW** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 9:09 am

BigGee wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:Reports in the papers that Tiny Tim will start and Russell isn't going to recover in time.

After the game Horne played last week, I am a lot less concerned about Finn not playing than I would have been. It also re-assures me about the adherence they are giving to the concussion protocols, which I am not convinced everybody is following (cough cough London Irish!)

The question will be who then benches, it surely must be one of Weir/Jackson and with a distinctly Glasgow bias and no reflection on Duncan as a player (he has actually been putting in his best run of games in a long time recently) I would rather it was Jacko!

Toonie joked on Twitter that earlier in the week he was close to coming out of retirement for the Glasgow game this weekend - suggests maybe Weir has the call for Scotland?

by Majestic83 Thu 17 Mar 2016, 9:55 am

Think it will be Weir on the bench, he was 24th man for the France game and seems to have been involved in the squad quite heavily despite not being in the match day squad.

by **George Carlin** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 10:10 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:
BigGee wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:Reports in the papers that Tiny Tim will start and Russell isn't going to recover in time.

After the game Horne played last week, I am a lot less concerned about Finn not playing than I would have been. It also re-assures me about the adherence they are giving to the concussion protocols, which I am not convinced everybody is following (cough cough London Irish!)

The question will be who then benches, it surely must be one of Weir/Jackson and with a distinctly Glasgow bias and no reflection on Duncan as a player (he has actually been putting in his best run of games in a long time recently) I would rather it was Jacko!

Toonie joked on Twitter that earlier in the week he was close to coming out of retirement for the Glasgow game this weekend - suggests maybe Weir has the call for Scotland?

Either that or he's forced himself to watch the Meatball in training sessions for the first time in 5 years.

by funnyExiledScot Thu 17 Mar 2016, 10:29 am

I'd expect it to be Weir, but Jackson would be a better choice in my opinion. His contribution off the bench against Wales was excellent, plus he offers cover at 15 as well.

Is there still time to loan Jade Te Rure to Glasgow? I'd love that.

by funnyExiledScot Thu 17 Mar 2016, 10:31 am

Karen Gillan was born in Inverness, just like me. Nice conversation starter for our first date.

by Don Alfonso Thu 17 Mar 2016, 11:03 am

funnyExiledScot wrote:Karen Gillan was born in Inverness, just like me. Nice conversation starter for our first

and last

funnyExiledScot wrote:date.

by **BigGee** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 11:44 am

VC really does not get Toolis does he! Harley on the bench alongside Prygos, Strauss and Horne. Weir and Wilson both starting!

I had this feeling he was going to do that in regards to Toolis, he clearly does not feel that he is ready!

Tonnie must be having a lie down in a dark room somewhere!

by funnyExiledScot Thu 17 Mar 2016, 11:46 am

Don Alfonso wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:Karen Gillan was born in Inverness, just like me. Nice conversation starter for our first
and last
funnyExiledScot wrote:date.

You're not seriously suggesting she could do better.....

by funnyExiledScot Thu 17 Mar 2016, 11:47 am

BigGee wrote:VC really does not get Toolis does he! Harley on the bench alongside Prygos, Strauss and Horne. Weir and Wilson both starting!

I had this feeling he was going to do that in regards to Toolis, he clearly does not feel that he is ready!

Tonnie must be having a lie down in a dark room somewhere!

This is Cotter's worst team selection since he took over.

by **RDW** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 11:48 am

by **BigGee** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 11:51 am

funnyExiledScot wrote:
BigGee wrote:VC really does not get Toolis does he! Harley on the bench alongside Prygos, Strauss and Horne. Weir and Wilson both starting!

I had this feeling he was going to do that in regards to Toolis, he clearly does not feel that he is ready!

Tonnie must be having a lie down in a dark room somewhere!

This is Cotter's worst team selection since he took over.

Well bearing in mind that he has us playing our best rugby in a long long time, I guess we need to cut him a little bit of slack and judge on saturday evening.

Maybe, just maybe, as the coach he may have ever such a tiny bit more insight than we all do.

Probably not the team any of us would have picked though!

by alive555 Thu 17 Mar 2016, 11:53 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:

why would you bench strauss for wilson ???? he played great last game . bizarre

by **RDW** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 11:53 am

Looks like Strauss was brought in purely to negate the French physicality and Wilson is preferred with his supposed greater athleticism?

by BamBam Thu 17 Mar 2016, 11:59 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:Looks like Strauss was brought in purely to negate the French physicality and Wilson is preferred with his supposed greater athleticism?

CJ Stander will be pleased!

by funnyExiledScot Thu 17 Mar 2016, 11:59 am

BigGee wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
BigGee wrote:VC really does not get Toolis does he! Harley on the bench alongside Prygos, Strauss and Horne. Weir and Wilson both starting!

I had this feeling he was going to do that in regards to Toolis, he clearly does not feel that he is ready!

Tonnie must be having a lie down in a dark room somewhere!

This is Cotter's worst team selection since he took over.

Well bearing in mind that he has us playing our best rugby in a long long time, I guess we need to cut him a little bit of slack and judge on saturday evening.

Maybe, just maybe, as the coach he may have ever such a tiny bit more insight than we all do.

Probably not the team any of us would have picked though!

I suppose we should just shut down 606v2....

Cotter has done a good job, don't get me wrong, but he has made some bad decisions in my opinion (Strokosch and Wilson in the WC Squad being two particular howlers) and this line-up contains a few more:

- the omission of Toolis for both Harley and Swinson;
- the selection of Wilson ahead of Strauss;
- the selection of Weir to start ahead of Horne and Jackson; and
- the selection of Lamont ahead of Maitland.

Stander and Heaslip will eat Wilson for breakfast, and I think it would take two Tim Swinson's to budge Toner an inch.

Harley isn't a lock, so really only covers Barclay on the bench, and I don't see Barclay coming off.

Weir isn't an international fly half, and despite his good club form I am expecting to see yet another display of aimless kicking and predictable distribution. His style of play is also at odds with the way in which Scotland play. Horne and Jackson are better suited.

Maitland is better at rugby than Lamont.

by TJ Thu 17 Mar 2016, 12:03 pm

I too agree we need to cut Big Vern some slack here. For last weeks win over France he has a lot of positive in the credit bank. Let see how it pans out. I do agree tho some selections are a bit odd. I like the selection of Harley - he can play second row. I'd rather Harley and Toolis tho.

Weir is right in form and to me looks an international FH once more. He has had a great run of games with some top notch performances.

Proof of the pudding is in the eating.

by **BigGee** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 12:04 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:
BigGee wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
BigGee wrote:VC really does not get Toolis does he! Harley on the bench alongside Prygos, Strauss and Horne. Weir and Wilson both starting!

I had this feeling he was going to do that in regards to Toolis, he clearly does not feel that he is ready!

Tonnie must be having a lie down in a dark room somewhere!

This is Cotter's worst team selection since he took over.

Well bearing in mind that he has us playing our best rugby in a long long time, I guess we need to cut him a little bit of slack and judge on saturday evening.

Maybe, just maybe, as the coach he may have ever such a tiny bit more insight than we all do.

Probably not the team any of us would have picked though!

I suppose we should just shut down 606v2....

Cotter has done a good job, don't get me wrong, but he has made some bad decisions in my opinion (Strokosch and Wilson in the WC Squad being two particular howlers) and this line-up contains a few more:

- the omission of Toolis for both Harley and Swinson;
- the selection of Wilson ahead of Strauss;
- the selection of Weir to start ahead of Horne and Jackson; and
- the selection of Lamont ahead of Maitland.

Stander and Heaslip will eat Wilson for breakfast, and I think it would take two Tim Swinson's to budge Toner an inch.

Harley isn't a lock, so really only covers Barclay on the bench, and I don't see Barclay coming off.

Weir isn't an international fly half, and despite his good club form I am expecting to see yet another display of aimless kicking and predictable distribution. His style of play is also at odds with the way in which Scotland play. Horne and Jackson are better suited.

Maitland is better at rugby than Lamont.

So you think we have got a good chance then?

by **NeilyBroon** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 12:05 pm

Well I can safely say we've lost. The most similar team we had to that played South Africa in the world cup and we all remember what happened there.

I'm just hoping that because Weir has a point to prove, especially after Horne's performance last week, he'll need to pull out a stonker. It's been a long time since I've seen him play well, he's been mostly dire in recent seasons. Even with his improvements back at Glasgow he's okay at best. At the moment I'd have Ruaridh any day.

Swinson, well we know his limits. Baffled at the absolute exclusion of Toolis on the bench. I really rate Harley but I think he's suffering Kelly Brown syndrome - no-one wants to pick him in his actual position so he's not really getting a proper look-in, which is a shame as he's a great classic 6 and would be nice to have in that position in the closing stages of matches.

Like others bit surprised we went with Wilson again, although after his Italy performance I am slightly less worried, though he'll have to pull it out again.

Who knows what VC is thinking, he has a better poker face than the easter island statues.

by Hazel Sapling Thu 17 Mar 2016, 12:19 pm

Harley makes sense as a back row sub if you are putting Barclay to 8. Not at 2nd row. Toolis better be f****** annoyed at this. Not only that but it is weakening Glasgow against Leinster on Friday! Edinburgh don't have a game and a better lock option. I do not understand this from any angle. Our 2nd row is going to be seriously underpowered all game and it will exhaust the front row. For the first hour that will be okay due to Ireland having an average front row but the last 20 is going to be brutal. Low will have to play 20 minutes very well. If R Gray goes off....

Wilson ahead of Strauss is silly. Strauss and Barclay vs Heaslip and Stander would be fun to watch as a Scotland fan. Wilson is going to have to have his finest performance.

Weir I have less issue with except again weakening Glasgow. He has played better of late and is full of confidence. Still prefer Jacko.

Lamont won't be able to chase a game but he will not lose it for you. Maitland would be better however he has peed off the SRU thanks to LI. Assume this means Bennett is playing on Friday.

I am in Exeter this weekend watching the Chiefs. I don't think I can put myself through watching this game afterwards with my English friends looking at the line-ups...

by MacKnocked-on Thu 17 Mar 2016, 12:27 pm

Yes a pretty odd selection really, both Strauss and Horne deserved to keep their places after playing so well at the weekend. I don't think Weir has it in him to play the flat distributing game that Horne played on Sunday. Maitland should certainly be back in, the fact he is out of the squad is strange to say the least. Toolis plays well week in week out for Edinburgh and would be a better straight swap for Johnny Gray than Swinson or Harley.

by cakeordeath Thu 17 Mar 2016, 12:31 pm

Don Alfonso wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:Karen Gillan was born in Inverness, just like me. Nice conversation starter for our first
and last
funnyExiledScot wrote:date.

Is sneaking into someones bedroom and sniffing their hair considered a date now?

by SecretFly Thu 17 Mar 2016, 12:34 pm

Well, as Schmidt has said... the thought processes between himself and Vern have gone way beyond mind games, they know each other so well. He said it's gotten to the level where they're both thinking three, four or five times down the "If he thinks I'm going to do that...maybe he knows that I know he thinks I'm going to do that"

So maybe Vern is being very methodical and knows where Schmidt is going to attack the game....or maybe he's mucho overthinking and getting himself all tangled up.

by cakeordeath Thu 17 Mar 2016, 12:39 pm

Perhaps I am being overly optimistic here, but I think we should trust BVC. What we have seen this 6 nations is a Scotland team who tailor their game to the opposition. Not the aimless box kick and no chase of a few years ago. So maybe Vern has a game plan in mind and these players fit the bill.

by **NeilyBroon** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 12:43 pm

cakeordeath wrote:Perhaps I am being overly optimistic here, but I think we should trust BVC. What we have seen this 6 nations is a Scotland team who tailor their game to the opposition. Not the aimless box kick and no chase of a few years ago. So maybe Vern has a game plan in mind and these players fit the bill.

Maybe he's trying to bring that style back, it's the last thing they'd expect!

by SecretFly Thu 17 Mar 2016, 1:20 pm

NeilyBroon wrote:

Maybe he's trying to bring that style back, it's the last thing they'd expect!

We're 'perfectionists' at that game ourselves in recent years Shocked

...so if the Scots came out with it I think our lads would settle in pretty quickly Wink

A nice slow train to bang, bash and bosh for the day.

by **RDW** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 1:32 pm

You Irish are a bunch of miserable feckers - you've won the 6N 2 years in a row and have a grand slam in recent memory, and if it wasn't for so many injuries you'd probably be competing for another title this year.

Compare that with what us Scots have had to put up with - beating Italy is a good result for us!!!!

Rant over.

guinness

by **NeilyBroon** Thu 17 Mar 2016, 1:42 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:You Irish are a bunch of miserable feckers - you've won the 6N 2 years in a row and have a grand slam in recent memory, and if it wasn't for so many injuries you'd probably be competing for another title this year.

Compare that with what us Scots have had to put up with - beating Italy is a good result for us!!!!

Rant over.

In conclusion you should just give us this one on Saturday - the streets of Edinburgh will be filled with tears, laughter and dancing after our moral grandslam victory. Mark Dodson will realise Scotland's true ambition and set Cotter the goal of winning the Grandslam for the next 10 years as well as 2 world cup trophies, with a comprehensive pasting of the All Blacks in both finals - it's no wonder they all want to play for Scotland when the Kiwis just play such sh*te rugby.

Come this time next year, our players will be drinking the orange champagne from the trophy, whilst Frodo hops around shouting "Ah told ye we were gud really!"

On a serious note Ireland 25-10 Scotland this weekend I think.

by carpet baboon Thu 17 Mar 2016, 1:49 pm

I see redan is back on the bench

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