Leicester Tigers 2016/17 thread.

[Welly]

First topic message reminder :

2016/17:
Director of Rugby: Richard Cockerill
Head Coach: Aaron Mauger
Assistant Backs Coach: Geordan Murphy
Assistant Forward Coach: Richard Blaze
Defence and Scrum Half Coach: Scott Hansen
Head of Rugby Operations: Ged Glynn
Team manager: Matt Cornwall

2016/17 Senior Squad: (Confirmed So Far) (Blue = EQP)
Hookers: Bateman, McGuigan, Thacker, Youngs
Props: Ayerza, Balmain, Brugnara Cilliers, Cole, Genge, Mulipola, Rizzo
Locks: Barrow, Fitzgerald, Kitchener, Slater
Back Row: Croft, Fonua, Hamilton McCaffrey, O'Connor, Williams
Scrum Half: Harrison, Kitto, Youngs
Fly Half: Burns, Williams
Centre: Catchpole, Roberts, Smith, Toomua, Tuilagi
Back 3: Betham, Brady, Pieterson, Tait, Thompstone, Veainu
Squad number: 37, EQP: 24, Academy products: 8

Transfers
IN: (7)
McGuigan (Newcastle Falcons), Cilliers (Montpelier), Genge (Bristol), Hamilton (Agen), Toomua (ACT Brumbies). JP Pieterson (Sharks), Brady (Sale)

OUT: (12)
Ghiraldini (Toulouse), Pasquali (Treviso), De Chaves (London Irish), Crane (Bristol), Pearce (Sale), Bell (London Irish), Baikeinuku (retirement), De Villiers (Retirement), Benjamin (retirement), Morris (N/A), Camacho (N/A), Goneva (Newcastle Falcons)

Not Sure: (No official confirmation of leaving or Staying) 3
Aguero, Sio Loamanu,

Rumours:
Harry Wells (Bedford) Lock/6

2016/17 Development Squad: (15)
Bryant, Evans, Hills, Lewis, Mahoney, Maksymiw, J.Olowofela, R. Olowofela, Owen, Simmons, Thacker, Tuilagi, White, Worth, Yawayawa

Transfer
IN: (7)
Lewis, Mahoney, J.Olowofela, R. Olowofela, Simmons, White, Yawayawa

OUT: 11
Odogwu (sale), Beckett (Glous), Povoas (Coventry), Tresidder (Rotherham Titans), Douglas, Farnworth, Galletly, Hogan, Murrin, Nairn, Priestley-Nangle.


Academy
Academy Head Coach/forwards Coach: Brett Deacon
Academy Backs Coach: Anthony Allen

[rosbif]

I read above a tiger supporter moaning about their academy not producing quality players . Last night from the Exeter squad there were 7 players from the academy and that excludes Nowell ( with England ) and Ewers ( injured ), so its a very relevant point.

[Welly]

I read above a tiger supporter moaning about their academy not producing quality players . Last night from the Exeter squad there were  7 players from the academy and that excludes Nowell ( with England ) and Ewers ( injured ), so its a very relevant point.

Not sure how relevant it is? (Also if Ewers was playing Simmonds wouldn't be on the bench).

[formerly known as Sam]

Honestly wish we didn't renew O'Connor and Fitzgerald contracts both fine players but both are more hard ground running forwards.

To win this league and Europe you need dog (like Sarries and Burger) and that is something we are lacking in the back 5 forwards wise outside of Barrow and Mike Williams.

Fitzgerald hurt his shoulder mid way through the first half and drifted out of the game a little after that. He didn't connect at all well with Youngs at the lineout and his lineout calling was suspect. Croft was probably our best forward in defence and was under used at the lineout, I'd have kept him in and pushed Williams into the second row. We lack experienced horrible forwards as you say.

Rosbif the difference wasn't necessarily the academy it was the brilliance of the Chiefs coaching staff. They came with a game plan that was pretty much all they worked on in the warm up and it was perfect for the conditions and the opposition. Baxter needs to be signed up as the man to succeed Jones in a few years time.

[rosbif]

Baxter might be an excellent coach but he has to have a supply of players who have potential to improve and play at a high level

[Welly]

Mauger starting XV was odd Harrison, Genge, Williams all where excellent v Quins IMO, with the weather as predicted I would of liked to see a Pack of Williams and Croft at the flanks with Hamilton @8.

I honestly put this loss on Mauger and his selections, too much rotation.

[formerly known as Sam]

Baxter might be an excellent coach but he has to have a supply of players who have potential to improve and play at a high level

If you look over the whole 23 man squads Tigers have more caps there are plenty of players on the Tigers side who have played at the highest level, there were two Tigers academy products who had represented the Lions in the starting line up.

 Exeter have done well to develop players though, having started in the Championship it is bread and butter there to be as self sufficient as possible (because it's cheaper) and add to the squad with hardworking experience. They've continued in that vein and done it well.

Welly I think selection played a part but I liked how quickly Mauger reacted in subbing players to maximise impact. Genge and Williams had been with England most the week. There's no excuse from our crap defensive line and lack of line speed, Tigers were stopped before the gain line on 22 occasions, Chiefs twice. We went in ones and they went in with at least one person to drive them through the tackle every time.

The little things annoyed me as well. Why stand directly behind the ruck to kick clear. You make yourself a target for the charge down and it you are under pressure there's no option and no where to go. Stand in the line but deeper and you can always pass the ball down the line or kick at an angle to touch as a way out. Why Kitto didn't take control and kick to touch I don't know. That gifted the back into the game. Why did we let them have the front of the lineout in our 22? Gifting them driving maul opportunities every time when they have one of the best in the league. Croft should have gone up at the front everytime with our big boys arranged behind him to defend. Maximum pessure. Fitzgerald is a poor lineout general. Kitto and the inaccurate pop passes,  he's a   scrum half pop passing into the breadbasket of an onrushing forward should be his bread and butter but no he bloomed them time after time easing momentum and forcing players to reach for the ball.

[Welly]

I do think we might had a chance if Harrison had stayed fit he is a big loss of his injury is serious.

[formerly known as Sam]

Definitely. The tempo he injected and the accuracy of his passing was perfect. Really feel for him, Harrison is one of those like Smith and Croft who will always put their bodies on the line for the team. We need more of them.

[LondonTiger]

Team for Allianz tomorrow evening:

Worth, Brady, Tait(c), Roberts, JPP, Burns, Kitto, Lockie, Thacker, Hamilton, Kitch, Wells, Balmain, McGuigan, Genge.

Reps: Croft, Rizzo, Bateman, Maksymiw, Owen, White, Williams, Thacker Jr

[LondonTiger]

Sarries:

Gallagher, Ellery, Streather(c), tompkins, Earle, Whitely, Taylor, Vunisa, Conlon, Brown, Flanagan, Lemalu, Koch, Saunders, Barrington

Reps: Linsay, Stringer, Lamositele, Isiekwe, Burger, de Kock, Lozowski, Perkins

[formerly known as Sam]

Fairly even sides. Good chance for a few of ours to put a marker down. Can't see past home advantage sadly.

[king_carlos]

I'm pleased with that side. I think it's a good balance.

Does that scrum battle look tasty to anyone else? If Genge can get a nudge on Koch...

[formerly known as Sam]

Genge will be desperate to show up well against a mobile and powerful prop like Koch. Will help press his England claims with Eddie.

Good to see Kitch approaching full fitness. We could do with him back to help the lineout.

[nathan]

Well that turned out to be a great day of rugby

[formerly known as Sam]

Most definitely Nathan.

A first win at Allianz Park at the 7th attempt. Hopefully that jinx is now well and truly broken.

[LondonTiger]

What a day.

Sat in the clubhouse bar at Allianz with some old friends, watching England rip Scotland new ****home, followed by that performance from Tigers. Physical, confrontational, spiky and large precise. Plus first time in inumerable visits to Barnet and Watford that I have seen us win.

[formerly known as Sam]

Really positive improvement from the forwards. Backrow looked excellent and I thought Wells was everywhere. I'd like to see the majority of that team start in the final. Maybe offer us a little more power in the centres to give Burns a little more option.

Great ruck defence, very abrasive.

[formerly known as Sam]

Ibanez leaving Bordeaux in the summer. He's turned them into a formidable outfit over the last five years. One for us to target?

[king_carlos]

I'd say he's turned them into a solid outfit rather than a formidable one.

He's also another that falls into the head coach role rather than DOR. Would it once again be a case of two head coaches rather than a DOR and head coach?

It would feel very odd to see Ibanez in a Tigers tracksuit after him being at the forefront of Wasps for a few huge battles!

[formerly known as Sam]

That's true. I doubt he'd move away from his media commitments either.

The DOR search has gone very quiet. I can't see Mauger getting the job though depending on who gets the DOR job he might remain as head coach. Then again his wife was making it known in Kibworth pre Christmas that they were heading back to NZ. Obviously a lot has changed since then.

No big names have thrown their hats into the ring. We'll no one other than Mauger has thrown the hat into the ring.

[George Carlin]

What a day.

Physical, confrontational,  spiky and large precise.

I've heard that's exactly the sort of 'real' woman one finds in Leicester.

[king_carlos]

Quote from Geordie on BBC Leicester Sort twitter:

"I hope Harry Thacker will be at the club next season. Leicester means a lot to him. I know he wants to be here and I know we want him."

Hopefully he's right and there's an official announcement soon!

[formerly known as Sam]

What a day.

Physical, confrontational,  spiky and large precise.

I've heard that's exactly the sort of 'real' woman one finds in Leicester.

Yep and it's a whole load of fun.

Carlos, I hope that deal is done soon. We don't have many forwards that can pull something from nothing and Thacker is a unique talent. Hopefully we'll have a DOR soon that will give him a set position to work towards.

[formerly known as Sam]

Leicester Tigers (v Exeter Chiefs, The Twickenham Stoop, Sunday 3.00pm)
15 George Worth
14 Peter Betham
13 Mathew Tait (c)
12 Jack Roberts
11 Tom Brady
10 Freddie Burns
9 Jono Kitto
1 Ellis Genge
2 George McGuigan
3 Fraser Balmain
4 Harry Wells
5 Graham Kitchener
6 Mike Williams
7 Harry Thacker
8 Lachlan McCaffrey

Replacements
16 Tom Youngs
17 Michele Rizzo
18 Greg Bateman
19 Dom Barrow
20 Luke Hamilton
21 Ben White
22 Owen Williams
23 Matt Smith

[formerly known as Sam]

CHIEFS SIDE TO FACE LEICESTER TIGERS

15 Lachie Turner
14 Matt Jess
13 Max Bodilly
12 Sam Hill
11 James Short
10 Joe Simmonds
9 Jack Maunder
1 Moray Low
2 Shaun Malton
3 Greg Holmes
4 Ollie Atkins
5 Damian Welch
6 Dave Ewers
7 Julian Salvi (capt)
8 Sam Simmonds

16 Elvis Taione
17 Billy Keast
18 Jack Owlett
19 Sam Skinner
20 Tom Johnson
21 Haydn Thomas
22 Will Hooley
23 Tom Hendrickson

[formerly known as Sam]

33 tackles from Thacker  .

[nathan]

Then the next down was a 26 tackles

[LondonTiger]

Incredible defence by us. Took 40 passes for Chiefs to score their try at the end, while there were a few 20+ please attack that yielded no score.

[formerly known as Sam]

The Tigers backrow made more tackles than the Exeter team. The improvement in the defence was very satisfying though there were a couple of needless penalties, noticeably from Williams, that we just need to tighten up on.

Our attack still needs some work as our only try was an interception. I do wonder how many of the guys that put their bodies on the line today will get a game against Saints, probably not as many as there should.

[king_carlos]

The energy that Thacker adds in defence is fantastic. The same with Will Evans as well. O'Connor is very good at leading the defence rush around the fringes but he rarely makes the sort of aggressive hits that Thacker or Evans do which belie their relative stature.

I really hope that Harry stays and rotates at 7 with Evans next year. I rate O'Connor and think he does a lot of good work, he's a good option to have in the squad. If we are going to rebuild a pack with some more bite then those two home grown talents at 7 would be a fantastic place to build it around IMO.

I really hope a long term Genge contract and Wee 'arry re-signing are the highlights of a magic Monday some time soon...

Harry Wells has done everything he could with his opportunities to earn an extension as well.

[formerly known as Sam]

Agreed Carlos. What I particularly likes about Thacker's performance yesterday was his ability to step in to 9 when Kitto wasn't at the breakdown and Thacker's ability to act as an additional midfield playmaker. Great skill level.

[king_carlos]

I hope that Marcos lifting the trophy with Matt Smith was just a case of two club legends being rewarded for their efforts. Smith's 200th first team appearance, raising the trophy with the squads other 200 cap stalwart.

The pessimistic side of me can't help but wonder if we've seen Marcos on the pitch for the final time. A serious back injury at 34 years old for a guy with his miles on the clock is always going to be hard to come back from.

I just hope he makes it back raring to go for next season. He's not a man who will want to bow out early or on anyone else's terms!

[formerly known as Sam]

Well we've taken a huge backwards step by appointing MOC as head coach from early April. Mauger to leave after the game this weekend.

As the news article specifically states the role is head coach then I wonder if they'll announce a DOR to work above him soon. I'm praying for someone forward thinking who'll develop players.

[HongKongCherry]

For your sake, I hope it's not Mike Ford!

[formerly known as Sam]

Doubt it HKC. Rumours are we aren't getting a DOR coming in but Ged Glynn the head scout and now erm I can't remember what is current job title is but he deals with all the scouting and academy is due a promotion.

[king_carlos]

Judging by the response from Veainu on twitter it seems the players haven't been in the loop here. The guy sounds understandably put out and others will be too.

Cockers goes after the coaches agree that the tactical disagreements between RC and AM can't be solved. Now Mauger has gone too...

It's feeling like a thoroughly uninspiring series of events.

[formerly known as Sam]

Very uninspiring. 

What has gone on behind the scenes we may never know but no comment from Mauger who is leaving early having been appointed until the end of the season is odd. Was he told that he wasn't going to be employed next season and told the board to do one or have the board decided to fire a popular coach who was slowly turning performances around?

Rumours around December time had Mauger's wife saying they were heading back to NZ in the summer...

[Big]

Very uninspiring. 

What has gone on behind the scenes we may never know but no comment from Mauger who is leaving early having been appointed until the end of the season is odd. Was he told that he wasn't going to be employed next season and told the board to do one or have the board decided to fire a popular coach who was slowly turning performances around?

Rumours around December time had Mauger's wife saying they were heading back to NZ in the summer...

If he had decided to leave regardless, I don't think the club can be blamed for making changes as soon as possible - better to just get the change done and (hopefully) be a bit more settled next year. But if this is performance related it seems odd, especially coming just after the first silverware in however many years.

Provided he has learnt from the Burgess fiasco, we could do worse than Mike Ford.

[formerly known as Sam]

We just don't know Big that's the thing. What does seem generally certain though is that Simon Cohen is less and less popular with the fans these days and appointing MOC isn't helping that. 

Not interested in Mike Ford. We need a forwards coach with some experience and the ability to develop young players.

[king_carlos]

Peter Tom and Cohen are both taking some heat at the moment. Back when Cockers went many fans (a few here as well) voiced feelings that a shake up was need from the top down rather than a slice through the middle. Whether Cockers going was correct in that shake up only time will tell, but changes were need at the head of the BoD as well coaching staff.

O'Connor did at least have a good record here as a backs coach. Admittedly it could be argued that forward dominance and some back line star dust (Alesana in his prime...) made that easier but he did still get the side scoring tries.

Alienating fans and young players is not something any club needs, it especially isn't something Welford Road or Oval Park need at the current moment in time. They are both themes which follow MOC wherever he goes.

It's irrelevant now but I find myself wishing more and more that Tigers had snaffled Wig when he left the England set-up. A decent salary and opportunity to progress at his club would have been a strong offer at the time. A forwards coach position below Mauger as head coach and Cockers as DoR would have taken some pressure off his shoulders following the RWC debacle but also allowed him to keep working with a good pack and a team that demands success. It would also have allowed Cockers to move off the training paddock a bit.

The above could also have been true with another forwards coach coming in to take some hands on coaching pressure off Cockers. Being forwards coach and latterly defence coach too he couldn't get away from that side of things when he and Mauger disagreed on how the side should play.

All coaching structures reach an expiration date but the NZ set-up under Hansen has shown how throwing it out to refresh things isn't always needed. The ABs rejigged their coaches roles (Wayne Smith from attack to defence coach for instance) and it freshened their approach without overhauling the set-up. I wish that Tigers had looked to that possibility rather than throwing the baby out with the bath water. Had Cockers wanted to get back on the paddock in a year or two then another re-jig could have been possible with Wig and Mauger both guys who might have been interested in a DoR job with a bit more experience.

[nathan]

Very uninspiring. 

What has gone on behind the scenes we may never know but no comment from Mauger who is leaving early having been appointed until the end of the season is odd. Was he told that he wasn't going to be employed next season and told the board to do one or have the board decided to fire a popular coach who was slowly turning performances around?

Rumours around December time had Mauger's wife saying they were heading back to NZ in the summer...

I heard the same thing RE: Maugers wife a while back in the village I work in. Makes me think this has been coming for a while.

[formerly known as Sam]

He's come out and said he's devastated so maybe plans were changing once Cockers had gone.

[Ozzy3213]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/39342300

As fkaS has said, looks as if Mauger wanted to stay. Seems a peculiar decision from th Tigers board.

[formerly known as Sam]

Leicester Tigers (v Northampton Saints, away, Saturday 3.00pm)
15 Telusa Veainu
14 Adam Thompstone
13 Mathew Tait
12 Maxime Mermoz
11 J P Pietersen
10 Freddie Burns
9 Ben Youngs
1 Ellis Genge
2 Tom Youngs (c)
3 Dan Cole
4 Dom Barrow
5 Graham Kitchener
6 Mike Fitzgerald
7 Brendon O'Connor
8 Luke Hamilton

Replacements
16 George McGuigan
17 Michele Rizzo
18 Pat Cilliers
19 Mike Williams
20 Lachlan McCaffrey
21 Ben White
22 Owen Williams
23 Jack Roberts


Jebus wept. Fitzgerald at 6 and BOC at 7 doesn't do anything to fill me with confidence. Our backrow was awesome last weekend and two thirds are on the bench and Thacker with his 33 tackles and multiple turnovers is nowhere to be seen. Tait couldn't tackle last weekend but gets another go despite Smith and Roberts being fit and available.


If Myler brings his kicking boots I forsee us giving him plenty of practice. Only positive is that Kitch will lead the lineout instead of the Fitz so we might have a passable lineout defence for a change.

[formerly known as Sam]

15 Ahsee Tuala
14 Ben Foden
13 Nafi Tuitavake
12 Harry Mallinder
11 George North
10 Stephen Myler
9 Nic Groom
1 Alex Waller
2 Dylan Hartley
3 Kieran Brookes
4 Courtney Lawes
5 Christian Day
6 Tom Wood (capt)
7 Calum Clark
8 Louis Picamoles

16 Mikey Haywood
17 Ethan Waller
18 Paul Hill
19 Jamie Gibson
20 Teimana Harrison
21 Lee Dickson
22 Luther Burrell
23 Ken Pisi


We're so going to get done over at the breakdown. 

[Welly]

our backrow was awesome BUT they did put in a huge 80 min shift as said Thacker made 33 tackles and Williams 20 tackles and that can take a lot out of a player to ask them to follow that up again might not have been good for the fatigue POV. Thacker esp to follow that game up with a game against a huge saints pack might not be great. players are not machines.

Also interesting stat BOC has the most turnovers in the prem, (that surprised me a fair bit.

[formerly known as Sam]

Got to say I'm stunned by that stat Welly. Good on him though I can rarely remember him getting involved enough at the breakdown, he obviously targets them well.

True some of the lads might be bit bruised from last weekend but they'll be on a high and should have had a light preperation week to be ready. I fear there's too much impact on the bench that should be starting when it comes to the backrow.

[Welly]

Got to say I'm stunned by that stat Welly. Good on him though I can rarely remember him getting involved enough at the breakdown, he obviously targets them well.

True some of the lads might be bit bruised from last weekend but they'll be on a high and should have had a light preperation week to be ready. I fear there's too much impact on the bench that should be starting when it comes to the backrow.

It is a worry he got it wrong v Exeter IMO aswell and it was another nail in the coffin for him being in charge of Tigers full term. Loading N the bench is great if you can keep within a scoring distance from the opp.

[formerly known as Sam]

Just about worked today. I really hope ditch the three lock policy, it almost cost us today as Fitzgerald was a non-entity at the breakdown.

[formerly known as Sam]

Harry Thacker signs a new contract 

Mat Tait signs a new contract as well.

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