England training squad this week

First topic message reminder :

Brothers Vunipola missing, as is Joe Launchbury. Mike Williams back in with yet another chance to break his arm. Various other players who missed the AI also back. Beeb picks up on Nathan Catt's inclusion also

Tuilagi back in. Given his current physical state I am just hoping that its not kill or cure, or that Jones doesn't give up on him given he's probably not fully fit yet. Usual 2 scrum halves, Alex Lozowski also in for more experience.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/38477218

Forwards: Josh Beaumont (Sale Sharks), Nathan Catt (Bath Rugby), Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers), Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby), Jamie George (Saracens), Teimana Harrison (Northampton Saints), Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints), James Haskell (Wasps), Nathan Hughes (Wasps), Maro Itoje (Saracens), George Kruis (Saracens), Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints), Joe Marler (Harlequins), Matt Mullan (Wasps), Chris Robshaw (Harlequins), Kyle Sinckler (Harlequins), Tommy Taylor (Wasps), Mike Williams (Leicester Tigers), Tom Wood (Northampton Saints).

Backs: Mike Brown (Harlequins), Danny Care (Harlequins), Elliot Daly (Wasps), Owen Farrell (Saracens), George Ford (Bath Rugby), Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby), Alex Lozowski (Saracens), Jonny May (Gloucester Rugby), Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs), Ben Te'o (Worcester Warriors), Manu Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers), Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby), Marland Yarde (Harlequins), Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers).

Towards the end of the 6N I think.

Being reported that Robshaw is set to miss the 6N's with a shoulder injury. Bugger

yappysnap wrote:Being reported that Robshaw is set to miss the 6N's with a shoulder injury. Bugger

He's been a big part of holding things together, clearing trouble up, when the opposition has been squeezing hard. Whether you see him as a six or seven, our back row mix will need someone with good game appreciation to cover what he brings. Actually, Itoje has those skills, so it might be an idea to start him there.

I suppose this is the problem with being so consistent and injury free for so long! When was the last time England played a major game without him? He seems to have been ever present for the last three or so years. Who do we put out against France?


04. Itoje
05. Launchbury/ Lawes
06. Haskell
07. Wood
08. Hughes

Not sure who would call the lineouts and it is crying out for a burglar at 7. There is more than enough pace, power, athleticism and carrying to make up for a smaller 'groundhog' type player. How many back-rowers constitutes an 'injury crisis' and allows us to pick Sam Underhill?

Robshaw has said he'll know the full extent of the shoulder injury on Monday so fingers crossed!!

I think Kruis will be back in time for 6Ns - on Rugby Club he reckons another 2 weeks.
So potentially Launch & Kruis locks Itoje dropping back as flanker with Hask & Nath at 8.

BigTrevsbigmac wrote:I think Kruis will be back in time for 6Ns - on Rugby Club he reckons another 2 weeks.
So potentially Launch & Kruis locks Itoje dropping back as flanker with Hask & Nath at 8.

i'd be happy with that. Power, pace and good line-out options.

It's terrible news for Robshaw and Quins, but I guess Eddie will find out if Itoje can cut it at 6.

And Stuart Barnes will be all skippy with joy, and Gatland won't need to find a better excuse.

6.Itoje
7.Haskell
8.Hughes

With whatever combination of Kruis/Launchbury/Lawes are fit to fill the boiler room.

Clifford being fit gives options and a good bench option too.

Ok I made reference before...but once again after his immense performance last night....how is Mark Wilson not anywhere near the England setup....especially with so many injuries!!!!

It really defies belief.

If he played for Wasps or Saracens or Bath he would be in there!

I think jones will have been on contact with him. As with an earlier comment though it'd be easier looking at him with fewer injuries. Jones won't want too many new players given all the new combos.

GeordieFalcon wrote:Ok I made reference before...but once again after his immense performance last night....how is Mark Wilson not anywhere near the England setup....especially with so many injuries!!!!

It really defies belief.

If he played for Wasps or Saracens or Bath he would be in there!

If Robshaw is out, he might get a call up!


As an aside, I can't help feel that it's unfair to have Wasps on that list- they are underrepresented in England if anything!

Have to say that from the reports I have read you would expect to see May and Nowell line up on the wings

With the way injuries are going, I don't think there is any point picking a team right now. Players seem to be dropping like flies. Lets get to February and see who is still standing.

It is hard for players in teams constantly at the bottom of the table fighting relegation to be considered top players. Pennell at Worcester suffered that fate and lost any chance he had by staying with them. Others like Wilson and Dowson had to leave Newcastle to get recognition. As a Sale fan it is the same - our best players seem to move off to Bath/Wasps/etc. Until a team is pushing for honours, top players will always move to 'top' clubs. More money, more fans, more chance of winning something and more chance of international recognition.

After the start Solomona has made wondering if Jones is a little tempted to give him a call? Rough maths says he would qualify this month for England.

No 7&1/2 wrote:After the start Solomona has made wondering if Jones is a little tempted to give him a call? Rough maths says he would qualify this month for England.

I would not have thought so to be honest. He should have at least 1 year 18 months in union. before being considerd.

majesticimperialman wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:After the start Solomona has made wondering if Jones is a little tempted to give him a call? Rough maths says he would qualify this month for England.

I would not have thought so to be honest. He should have at least 1 year 18 months in union. before being considerd.

 He played Rugby Union at school as a teenager, but with a surname like Solomona he was always going to go to League.

BigTrevsbigmac wrote:I think Kruis will be back in time for 6Ns - on Rugby Club he reckons another 2 weeks.
So potentially Launch & Kruis locks Itoje dropping back as flanker with Hask & Nath at 8.

I suspect it would be Kruis and Lawes rather than Launchbury, neither Kruis or Launchbury have the pace to get across and cover like Lawes or Itoje. Both make a lot of tackles and work extremely hard, but you need at least one "more athletic" type in their, especially if Itoje is moved to the back row.

I would love to know just how fast Lawes is, I have seen him run down fast centres for Saints, takes a bit of time to get going, but once he is moving that stride just eats up the ground. Reminds me of a certain Usain Bolt, built the same way as well.

Short-lived return for Haskell. He lined up a tackle wrongly and knocked himself out.

It looked really nasty on first viewing and he was definitely out cold.

Good to see him already back on his feet and looking steady on them though.

With 4 weeks to go until the France game he might just make it back in time.

It will depend completely on how quickly all symptoms of concussion disappear as usual.

A shame for Haskell as that hit on Burns (head position aside) was brutal.

king_carlos wrote:It looked really nasty on first viewing and he was definitely out cold.

Good to see him already back on his feet and looking steady on them though.

With 4 weeks to go until the France game he might just make it back in time.

It will depend completely on how quickly all symptoms of concussion disappear as usual.

A shame for Haskell as that hit on Burns (head position aside) was brutal.

I'm not sure I'd want a player who is a key tackling asset going into a major game without much experience of how referees are policing this new tackling directive. It's one thing to train for it, but another to put it into action under pressure.

Rugby Fan wrote:

king_carlos wrote:It looked really nasty on first viewing and he was definitely out cold.

Good to see him already back on his feet and looking steady on them though.

With 4 weeks to go until the France game he might just make it back in time.

It will depend completely on how quickly all symptoms of concussion disappear as usual.

A shame for Haskell as that hit on Burns (head position aside) was brutal.

I'm not sure I'd want a player who is a key tackling asset going into a major game without much experience of how referees are policing this new tackling directive. It's one thing to train for it, but another to put it into action under pressure.

Fair. If both Hask and Robs out, go with backrow of Itoje, Wood (for experience), Hughes, I reckon. Clifford on bench if fit, if not then M Williams. Or both! As Itoje can cover lock and Williams at a stretch.

No 7&1/2 wrote:After the start Solomona has made wondering if Jones is a little tempted to give him a call? Rough maths says he would qualify this month for England.

You see this is another case where cross code should not mean a change in availability.

He has played League for Samoa...so that should mean he has to represent Samoa in Union. I genuinely hope he doesn't represent England. It will be a bit of a joke to be honest. Just like Henry Paul and Vainikolo etc.

ChequeredJersey wrote:

Rugby Fan wrote:

king_carlos wrote:It looked really nasty on first viewing and he was definitely out cold.

Good to see him already back on his feet and looking steady on them though.

With 4 weeks to go until the France game he might just make it back in time.

It will depend completely on how quickly all symptoms of concussion disappear as usual.

A shame for Haskell as that hit on Burns (head position aside) was brutal.

I'm not sure I'd want a player who is a key tackling asset going into a major game without much experience of how referees are policing this new tackling directive. It's one thing to train for it, but another to put it into action under pressure.

Fair. If both Hask and Robs out, go with backrow of Itoje, Wood (for experience), Hughes, I reckon. Clifford on bench if fit, if not then M Williams. Or both! As Itoje can cover lock and Williams at a stretch.

Genuinely want to know what he has done better than Mark Wilson?

I agree he shouldn't be eligible but I think he is by the end of the month. Extremely early but he looks very very good as does his mate on the other Sale wing.

No 7&1/2 wrote:I agree he shouldn't be eligible but I think he is by the end of the month. Extremely early but he looks very very good as does his mate on the other Sale wing.

Is that Charnley?

Another huge performance from Ellis Genge in front of Eddie Jones. The young lad seems to have reacted well to being dropped from teh squad.

Yup Charnley. Some really good options pushing even if you don't agree with eligibility. And I am just throwing it out there not seen it mentioned or considered yet but if Solomona in particular carries in in this form. ..

Genge looked class and with Marler carrying a knock must be in the squad.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Yup Charnley. Some really good options pushing even if you don't agree with eligibility. And I am just throwing it out there not seen it mentioned or considered yet but if Solomona in particular carries in in this form. ..

Well lets just hope that Nowells form, May and Watson (and ironically Roko) we don't need to look to yet another foreigner fast tracked in....makes a mockery of England to be fair.

Going to be hard to ignore him.

No its not....

Ignore whom?

Solomona

GeordieFalcon wrote:Solomona

Who?

king_carlos wrote:A shame for Haskell as that hit on Burns (head position aside) was brutal.

Lucky he wasn't red carded for accidental head contact

Are England fans confident of back to back six nations wins this year?

I would say England are favourites, cant see the injuries making that much a difference.

LondonTiger wrote:

GeordieFalcon wrote:Solomona

Who?  

Exactly!

Harder set of fixtures Guns. Going away to Wales and Ireland could easily see defeats in both fixtures and France 1st up with a disrupted side. I'm edging towards yes we'll win it again but not as confident as last year.

Wade was at his best against Tigers on the weekend...

GunsGermsV2 wrote:Are England fans confident of back to back six nations wins this year?

I would say England are favourites, cant see the injuries making that much a difference.

I would say Ireland are favourites as they have the home fixture against England.

Should be a good competition either way, I just hope it isn't decided by the new tackle laws.

I would be confident Ireland will do well because we tend to be quite disciplined however, we do sometimes have to defend a lot and that's not good news with the new rules.

England are for sure favourites though. No one has defeated them in a while but I think they will lose at least one fixture this year with the championship decided on points and Wales, Ireland and France all in the mix.

Would be a downer for jones to lose more than 1 even with the injuries.

The toughest game is obviously Ireland away. It's going to be a real test of the squad depth to turn them over.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Would be a downer for jones to lose more than 1 even with the injuries.

The opening test v France could be banana skin this year. They looked much better against NZ in Nov.

GeordieFalcon wrote:Ok I made reference before...but once again after his immense performance last night....how is Mark Wilson not anywhere near the England setup....especially with so many injuries!!!!

It really defies belief.

If he played for Wasps or Saracens or Bath he would be in there!

Would he stand out as much if he played for those 3?

cascough wrote:

GeordieFalcon wrote:Ok I made reference before...but once again after his immense performance last night....how is Mark Wilson not anywhere near the England setup....especially with so many injuries!!!!

It really defies belief.

If he played for Wasps or Saracens or Bath he would be in there!

Would he stand out as much if he played for those 3?

I actually think he would, he is not a stand out flashy player like Armitage, he does things simply and effectively and gets through a mountain of work. I am a bit surprised that one of the bigger clubs haven't tried to tempt him away, especially as he seems to have done something to offend every England coach we have had recently as he cannot get near the squad. A quality player to have around in international breaks

I'm not convinced by Wilson. His work rate is outstanding, but I'm not convinced he has the skillset to operate at international level. In many ways I see him like Ed Slater, a great club player.

HongKongCherry wrote:I'm not convinced by Wilson. His work rate is outstanding, but I'm not convinced he has the skillset to operate at international level.  In many ways I see him like Ed Slater, a great club player.

I can see your point and I'm kind of in agreement, even as a Falcons fan. What I'd like to see though is how he'd get on with other quality players around him. He has the physical attributes and the workrate to be a Robshaw type player, but can he step it up?

On a similar note, if Robshaw was a Falcons player, I doubt he'd of got into the England set-up.

Robshaw confirmed out of the 6N. Launchbury out of the France game with a calf injury. Kruis still recovering from the cheekbone fracture.

Guess Itoje will be playing in 3 positions at the same time.