6N 2017: Scotland v Ireland, 4 February

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SCOTLAND v IRELAND 
4 February 2017
KO: 14:25
BT Murrayfield, Edinburgh

Referee: Romain Poite (France)
Touch judges: Jaco Peyper (South Africa) and Nick Briant (New Zealand)
TMO: Glenn Newman (New Zealand

Live on BBC, RTE, DMAX, FR2, ITV (H)

A. Head to Head

132 Played 132
66 Won 61 
5 Drawn 5
61 Lost 66
1,380 Points 1,475

B. Recent Form

19 March 2016
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
35 – 25 to Ireland

15 August 2015
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
28 – 22 to Ireland

21 March 2015
BT Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
10 – 40 to Ireland

2 February 2014
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
28 – 6 to Ireland

24 February 2013
Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
12 – 8 to Scotland

10 March 2012
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
32 – 14 to Ireland

6 August 2011
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
10 – 6 to Scotland

27 February 2011
Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
18 – 21 to Ireland

20 March 2010
Croke Park, Dublin
20 – 23 to Scotland

C. Teams

SCOTLAND 

15-Stuart Hogg; 14-Sean Maitland, 13-Huw Jones, 12-Alex Dunbar, 11-Tommy Seymour; 10-Finn Russell, 9-Greig Laidlaw (capt); 1-Allan Dell, 2-Fraser Brown, 3-Zander Fagerson, 4-Richie Gray, 5-Jonny Gray, 6-Ryan Wilson, 7-Hamish Watson, 8-Josh Strauss

Replacements: 16-Ross Ford, 17-Gordon Reid, 18-Simon Berghan, 19-Tim Swinson, 20-John Barclay, 21-Ali Price, 22-Duncan Weir, 23-Mark Bennett

IRELAND

15-Rob Kearney; 14-Keith Earls, 13-Robbie Henshaw, 12-Garry Ringrose, 11-Simon Zebo; 10-Paddy Jackson, 9-Conor Murray; 1-Jack McGrath, 2-Rory Best (captain), 3-Tadhg Furlong, 4-Iain Henderson, 5-Devin Toner, 6-CJ Stander, 7-Sean O'Brien, 8-Jamie Heaslip

Replacements: 16-Niall Scannell, 17-Cian Healy, 18-John Ryan, 19-Ultan Dillane, 20-Josh van der Flier, 21-Kieran Marmion, 22-Ian Keatley, 23-Tommy Bowe.

marty2086 wrote:

EST wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

George Carlin wrote:
Fair enough Guns, but I have been watching rugby for 30 years and I have never heard a player speak to the press about how he was worried he would be hurt in a tackle.

Everyone can draw their own conclusions about that. I have.

You are absolutely right that Ireland has real quality at the breakdown. I would go with 6. Stander 7. Vd Flier and 8. Heaslip. Nice balance to that.

In the 2005 Lions tour O'Driscoll spoke a lot to the press about how his collar bone was broken in a tip tackle. In the game the referee didn't penalise the dump tackle nor did the citing comissioner retrospectively. The tackle was deemed ok by the officials. As a result of this incident indirectly or otherwise however, the rules around tackles were changed.

I have no issue with Murray raising his concern over tackling a kickers standing leg. Id much rather the concern was raised before someone gets injured and out of the game than after. Each to their own though.

 

I think it was the manner that it was raised, Guns - through the media and with a strong implication that it was premeditated, all based on very dubious evidence.  If an Irish team were accused of deliberately injuring another team, via the press, I can't imagine that would go down too well.  Anyway, its been done to death.

I'm looking forward to what should be a cracking game of rugby.  

It was raised with the officials during the game and they saw nothing wrong but how else would you prefer them to address it?

Glasgow admitted they targeted Murray, they denied they set out to injure him

Watching the game live there were a number of 'tackles' that were bordering on late and all aimed and hips and knees. There was nothing overtly illegal in what was done but it was clear they were trying to hurt or antagonise Murray

Its this that I have a problem with. When you say something like that, you are fundamentally questioning the integrity of the Glasgow players. There is absolutely no proof for the assertion that Glasgow were trying to hurt Murray.

Pete330v2 wrote:FES is the Scottish front row that bad???

Fagerson is promising but very young. Dell is technically ok but very underpowered. Brown is useful in the loose but lacks power in the tight. All in all, Ireland are streets ahead.

Arrogance doesn't suit us as a people (though we have many arrogant basterdes - not looking at you Peter Pomp Sutherland)... but when you think about it, why is Eddie Jones allowed to be arrogant? Why was Martin Johnson allowed to swagger in his heyday? Maybe the attitude doesn't come with the territory (winning) but actually helps creates the habit?

So.................... to keep the winning ways going.................. Jesus, this game - no offence to the pluckyScots - but it's going to be a walkover. Sure aren't we now the All Blacks of the North?

funnyExiledScot wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:FES is the Scottish front row that bad???

Fagerson is promising but very young. Dell is technically ok but very underpowered. Brown is useful in the loose but lacks power in the tight. All in all, Ireland are streets ahead.

Cheers FES

I think Fagerson is good and he has a fairly epic name.

Ireland team out, and I know by the time I've learned how to upload the IRU's annoying wee GIF to 606, someone will have just typed up the names on here...

15 R Kearney
14. Earls
13. Ringrose
12. Henshaw
11. Zebo
10. Jackson
9 Murray
1. McGrath
2. Best (c)
3. Furlong
4. Henderson
5. Toner
6. Stander
7. O'Brien
8. Heaslip

Replacements:
Healy, N Scannell, Ryan, Dillane, van der Flier, Marmion, Keatley, Bowe,

IanBru wrote:Ireland team out, and I know by the time I've learned how to upload the IRU's annoying wee GIF to 606, someone will have just typed up the names on here...

Yep

OK, fine.

15. Kearney
14. Earls
13. Ringrose
12. Henshaw
11. Zebo
10. Jackson
9. The kid who dropped his icecream.

8. Heaslip
7. O'Brien
6. Stander
5. Toner
4. Henderson
3. Furlong
2. Best
1. McGrath

16. Scannell
17. Healy
18. Ryan
19. Dilane
20. Van der Flier
21. Marmion
22. Keatley
23. Bowe

FFS.

I'm actually really looking forward to it now. I hope Ireland are still in touch with 20 to go, so it can be your mental, nippy* wee scrum-half against ours!

*(and not in the way John Beattie said it when commentating the summer test against Japan)

1st impressions. Loving the pack and forward replacements, I think we will be stronger there for the full 80.

Backs are ok, should hopefully be able to match the Scottish guys but Hogg is defo better than his opposite number. The bench seems very light, all 3 are big step downs if they need to come on. Injury only I think.

The forwards will have a lot to do again (as usual) but I hope the backs start to break out and take more of the strain of finding some scores. Kearney needs to have one of his good games. And Earls and Zebo have to be sharp minded with anything that comes their way.

Those three players need to click. No excuses for shabbiness or over-running promising moves.

Very good Ireland squad - and one I predict will have too much power for us to contend with in the backrow, and off the bench in Dilane and VDF.

IanBru wrote:OK, fine.

15. Kearney
14. Earls
13. Ringrose
12. Henshaw
11. Zebo
10. Jackson
9. The kid who dropped his icecream.

8. Heaslip
7. O'Brien
6. Stander
5. Toner
4. Henderson
3. Furlong
2. Best
1. McGrath

16. Scannell
17. Healy
18. Ryan
19. Dilane
20. Van der Flier
21. Marmion
22. Keatley
23. Bowe

Oh smeg. I forgot about Sean O'Brien.

SecretFly wrote:The forwards will have a lot to do again (as usual) but I hope the backs start to break out and take more of the strain of finding some scores.  Kearney needs to have one of his good games.  And Earls and Zebo have to be sharp minded with anything that comes their way.

Those three players need to click.  No excuses for shabbiness or over-running promising moves.

Zebo & Earls will be fine (and have been fine in wins v Glasgow recently). The only one I'd worry about is No. 15.

Ireland's 1-8 is very worrying.

9-14 is worrying

15 a bit meh

Subs - a bit meh in the backs, forward replacements are pretty good

Pete330v2 wrote:

funnyExiledScot wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:FES is the Scottish front row that bad???

Fagerson is promising but very young. Dell is technically ok but very underpowered. Brown is useful in the loose but lacks power in the tight. All in all, Ireland are streets ahead.

Cheers FES

Or to put it in context, Pete:

- Brown is better than Ford in every respect apart form bulk and experience. He is more dynamic, a better carrier, more explosive, has better arrows under pressure and scores tries. He is also used to playing alongside Fagerson.
- Fagerson has proven to be astonishing for a 20 year old and has put in some mega performances against the likes of the Springboks, the French and the South Sea Islanders. But he's still a 20 year old and we're comparing him to Williem Nel, who a huge number of pundits have down as one of the best 5 NH tightheads.
- Dell is to Alasdair Dickinson what my racist and mildly senile Uncle Dougie is to Donald Trump. Along the same lines, but much much less of everything.

Sin é wrote:

SecretFly wrote:The forwards will have a lot to do again (as usual) but I hope the backs start to break out and take more of the strain of finding some scores.  Kearney needs to have one of his good games.  And Earls and Zebo have to be sharp minded with anything that comes their way.

Those three players need to click.  No excuses for shabbiness or over-running promising moves.

Zebo & Earls will be fine (and have been fine in wins v Glasgow recently). The only one I'd worry about is No. 15.

I would worry about 13 v 13 too.

Sin é wrote:

SecretFly wrote:The forwards will have a lot to do again (as usual) but I hope the backs start to break out and take more of the strain of finding some scores.  Kearney needs to have one of his good games.  And Earls and Zebo have to be sharp minded with anything that comes their way.

Those three players need to click.  No excuses for shabbiness or over-running promising moves.

Zebo & Earls will be fine (and have been fine in wins v Glasgow recently). The only one I'd worry about is No. 15.

People really do seem to dismiss (or not see) the form Earls and Zebo are in constantly. They, along with CJ have been standout performers for Munster and have great international experience.

Kearney at 15, seems to be having an Indian summer as well and will not let Ireland down. No worries from me regarding the back 3.

George Carlin wrote:
I would worry about 13 v 13 too.

Ringrose is a quality player and very good defensively, not worried about him at all.

eirebilly wrote:

George Carlin wrote:
I would worry about 13 v 13 too.

Ringrose is a quality player and very good defensively, not worried about him at all.

Yeah I reckon Ringrose will have a decent campaign. Looking forward to seeing how he does. Kearney's defense can be a bit sh1te when he starts believing his own hype so hopefully he continues his form from November.

I am a fan of Earls but he is liable to the odd brain fart in attack and defense. Serious attacking potential though. Not sure why Henderson was selected. Surely we need a better lineout jumper against the Gray giants.

Sin é wrote:

SecretFly wrote:The forwards will have a lot to do again (as usual) but I hope the backs start to break out and take more of the strain of finding some scores.  Kearney needs to have one of his good games.  And Earls and Zebo have to be sharp minded with anything that comes their way.

Those three players need to click.  No excuses for shabbiness or over-running promising moves.

Zebo & Earls will be fine (and have been fine in wins v Glasgow recently). The only one I'd worry about is No. 15.

I'll keep you to that, Sin. I expect them boys to move on now.... especially with Earls. Show the promise - don't over-reach.

GunsGermsV2 wrote:I am a fan of Earls but he is liable to the odd brain fart in attack and defense. Serious attacking potential though. Not sure why Henderson was selected. Surely we need a better lineout jumper against the Gray giants.

I like that! Just one step short of the 'White Walkers' (though just as scary).

SecretFly wrote:

I'll keep you to that, Sin.     I expect them boys to move on now.... especially with Earls.  Show the promise - don't over-reach.

What do you have against Earls and what else does he have to prove to you?

I think we should start a debate about the Ireland 13 shirt.

That hasn't been done before on here has it?

I think Ireland should play Earls at 13. He's the natural heir to BOD.

IanBru wrote:I think Ireland should play Earls at 13. He's the natural heir to BOD.

Thought Luke Fitzgerld was?

eirebilly wrote:

George Carlin wrote:
I would worry about 13 v 13 too.

Ringrose is a quality player and very good defensively, not worried about him at all.

I see Ringrose is the next in line to be the next BOD.

No-one ever seems to talk about the next Kevin Maggs.....

Ringrose is better than Huw Jones. aaaand go.

Which irish 13 is best in the air? which is best in a dog fight? which one would you want with you in a trench? Who is the most BOD like of the new BODS?

is Huw Jones the new BOD?

eirebilly wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

I'll keep you to that, Sin.     I expect them boys to move on now.... especially with Earls.  Show the promise - don't over-reach.

What do you have against Earls and what else does he have to prove to you?

I have nothing against him.  I love him.  Why always so sensitive at the assumed.... well I won't even mention the assumed because I don't give a schidt about that.  You're old enough to have grown out of that sparky sensitivity billy.  It's tiresome.

I look at the team and I say to myself (as I'm always more concerned with the backs - just my preference as other guys concentrate on forwards) - I say to myself "what do I see?" - and what I see is three guys that if they get their act together big time could really take loads of pressure off our always over-worked forwards. Could add buckets to Ireland's cause.

Those three guys happen to be Kearney, Earls and Zebo.  I couldn't give a schidt what colour their club shirt is.  I see three players that I'm concentrating on.  I see much over-eagerness from Earls in an Ireland shirt.  If he settles down, he becomes a lethal tool in our overall plans.  But he needs to rein in that often over-zealous bubbliness.  I say it as I see it.

RDW_Scotland wrote:

Jones will reform the midfield partnership he forged in those two tests with Alex Dunbar in between returning half backs Greig Laidlaw and Finn Russell, and the back-three trio of Stuart Hogg, Sean Maitland and Tommy Seymour, who contributed half of Scotland’s 10-try tally in the autumn.

Think you've just inadvertently given away Scotland's new "fasle 10" position.

Playing the centres between the half backs. Could be genius. Russel to play 3rd 5/8th.

SecretFly wrote:16 Carrots
17 Corn Flakes
18 Milk

....oops, sorry, that was just my shopping list.

16 Carrots and 17 Corn Flakes sounds like a depressing meal.

No idea how much an 18 of Milk is...

Think ye may be getting a little tetchy there now secretfly, I simply asked a question in response to your statement... Certainly did not mention anything about the colour of club shirt, that's all ye...

miaow wrote:

SecretFly wrote:16 Carrots
17 Corn Flakes
18 Milk

....oops, sorry, that was just my shopping list.

16 Carrots and 17 Corn Flakes sounds like a depressing meal.

No idea how much an 18 of Milk is...

He's part rabbit

IanBru wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:I am a fan of Earls but he is liable to the odd brain fart in attack and defense. Serious attacking potential though. Not sure why Henderson was selected. Surely we need a better lineout jumper against the Gray giants.

I like that! Just one step short of the 'White Walkers' (though just as scary).

Thats more or less what I was thinking alright.

GunsGermsV2 wrote:Eddie tends to be fairly balanced. I think it is fair enough to think we will win as we have a good record against Scotland even if they are getting better.

Yeah the balance was there overall, but if Ireland were to lose on Saturday I would probably hazard a guess that he would feel Ireland played poorly rather than they got beaten by a better team so to speak. I liked the show though, i'll definitely watch the next one for the post match analysis.

marty2086 wrote:

miaow wrote:

SecretFly wrote:16 Carrots
17 Corn Flakes
18 Milk

....oops, sorry, that was just my shopping list.

16 Carrots and 17 Corn Flakes sounds like a depressing meal.

No idea how much an 18 of Milk is...

He's part rabbit

Carrots brings much better vision to the team but I'd be disappointed if Milk were to feature, his attitude on the field can be a bit sour..

eirebilly wrote:Think ye may be getting a little tetchy there now secretfly, I simply asked a question in response to your statement... Certainly did not mention anything about the colour of club shirt, that's all ye...

Nah, I kinda figured you'd eventually make a comment along the lines you made a comment, billy.  That's the disappointing thing.

What have I got against Heaslip?  In the old days I was furious at him for his on-field narkiness (he went through a phase of scowl and backtalk), I felt it was not helping the team and said so many times.  Now he's back to where I want him to be and gets the praise.
What have I against Bowe?  I'm always at Bowe about those over-reaching attempts to catch a ball that then dances on his fingers but falls away from him, and I was annoyed at a phase of back taps he was giving in areas of the field where it would have been better for him to take on the ball himself and run.  But do I have anything against him?  No.  I want him to be the best that he can be

.... and I concentrate most of my comments on backs. You gotta bring up their names if you're talking about them

IanBru wrote:I think Ireland should play Earls at 13. He's the natural heir to BOD.

Sure we cant all be blessed to have the Messiah ( ) on the bench.

eirebilly wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

I'll keep you to that, Sin.     I expect them boys to move on now.... especially with Earls.  Show the promise - don't over-reach.

What do you have against Earls and what else does he have to prove to you?

Most Scotland fans have quite strong views about young Keith, which I can surmise pictorially as follows:

bsando wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

miaow wrote:

SecretFly wrote:16 Carrots
17 Corn Flakes
18 Milk

....oops, sorry, that was just my shopping list.

16 Carrots and 17 Corn Flakes sounds like a depressing meal.

No idea how much an 18 of Milk is...

He's part rabbit

Carrots brings much better vision to the team but I'd be disappointed if Milk were to feature, his attitude on the field can be a bit sour..

He keeps spilling the ball, too.

George Carlin wrote:

eirebilly wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

I'll keep you to that, Sin.     I expect them boys to move on now.... especially with Earls.  Show the promise - don't over-reach.

What do you have against Earls and what else does he have to prove to you?

Most Scotland fans have quite strong views about young Keith, which I can surmise pictorially as follows:

That's because he called out their Ronaldo impersonations

Golden wrote:

IanBru wrote:I think Ireland should play Earls at 13. He's the natural heir to BOD.

Sure we cant all be blessed to have the Messiah ( ) on the bench.

If he's on the bench, then he isn't the Messiah, he's a very naughty boy

the-goon wrote:15 R Kearney
14. Earls
13. Ringrose
12. Henshaw
11. Zebo
10. Jackson
9 Murray
1. McGrath
2. Best (c)
3. Furlong
4. Henderson
5. Toner
6. Stander
7. O'Brien
8. Heaslip

Replacements:
Healy, N Scannell, Ryan, Dillane, van der Flier, Marmion, Keatley, Bowe,

Jesus wept, Paddy and Rory will have some job bossing that shower around Murrayfield.

At least Hendo is there to give us a bit of go forward and Tommy Bowe to rescue the day from the bench.

rodders wrote:

Jesus wept, Paddy and Rory will have some job bossing that shower around Murrayfield.

At least Hendo is there to give us a bit of go forward and Tommy Bowe to rescue the day from the bench.

Fair feics to Schmidt for giving the Ulster boys a run out against the weaker sides. Scannell, Keatley and co will be back for the hard matches

My biggest concern is the lineout. Ireland's lineout has been very bad compared to all other six nations sides since POC retired and yet this is where Ireland scored most of its tries.

I think the Gray brothers will really look to disrupt. With Ryan and POM out of the side I think we will be weaker than normal in the lineout. Could be a concern.

GunsGermsV2 wrote:My biggest concern is the lineout. Ireland's lineout has been very bad compared to all other six nations sides since POC retired and yet this is where Ireland scored most of its tries.

I think the Gray brothers will really look to disrupt. With Ryan and POM out of the side I think we will be weaker than normal in the lineout. Could be a concern.

Feck me you have an 8ft second row - your lineout should be easy!

Its a major concern guns, really not the strongest part of the game it once was. Can seriously see Scotland making ground there.