6N 2017: Scotland v Ireland, 4 February

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SCOTLAND v IRELAND 
4 February 2017
KO: 14:25
BT Murrayfield, Edinburgh

Referee: Romain Poite (France)
Touch judges: Jaco Peyper (South Africa) and Nick Briant (New Zealand)
TMO: Glenn Newman (New Zealand

Live on BBC, RTE, DMAX, FR2, ITV (H)

A. Head to Head

132 Played 132
66 Won 61 
5 Drawn 5
61 Lost 66
1,380 Points 1,475

B. Recent Form

19 March 2016
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
35 – 25 to Ireland

15 August 2015
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
28 – 22 to Ireland

21 March 2015
BT Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
10 – 40 to Ireland

2 February 2014
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
28 – 6 to Ireland

24 February 2013
Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
12 – 8 to Scotland

10 March 2012
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
32 – 14 to Ireland

6 August 2011
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
10 – 6 to Scotland

27 February 2011
Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
18 – 21 to Ireland

20 March 2010
Croke Park, Dublin
20 – 23 to Scotland

C. Teams

SCOTLAND 

15-Stuart Hogg; 14-Sean Maitland, 13-Huw Jones, 12-Alex Dunbar, 11-Tommy Seymour; 10-Finn Russell, 9-Greig Laidlaw (capt); 1-Allan Dell, 2-Fraser Brown, 3-Zander Fagerson, 4-Richie Gray, 5-Jonny Gray, 6-Ryan Wilson, 7-Hamish Watson, 8-Josh Strauss

Replacements: 16-Ross Ford, 17-Gordon Reid, 18-Simon Berghan, 19-Tim Swinson, 20-John Barclay, 21-Ali Price, 22-Duncan Weir, 23-Mark Bennett

IRELAND

15-Rob Kearney; 14-Keith Earls, 13-Robbie Henshaw, 12-Garry Ringrose, 11-Simon Zebo; 10-Paddy Jackson, 9-Conor Murray; 1-Jack McGrath, 2-Rory Best (captain), 3-Tadhg Furlong, 4-Iain Henderson, 5-Devin Toner, 6-CJ Stander, 7-Sean O'Brien, 8-Jamie Heaslip

Replacements: 16-Niall Scannell, 17-Cian Healy, 18-John Ryan, 19-Ultan Dillane, 20-Josh van der Flier, 21-Kieran Marmion, 22-Ian Keatley, 23-Tommy Bowe.

eirebilly wrote:

rodders wrote:

Jesus wept, Paddy and Rory will have some job bossing that shower around Murrayfield.

At least Hendo is there to give us a bit of go forward and Tommy Bowe to rescue the day from the bench.

Fair feics to Schmidt for giving the Ulster boys a run out against the weaker sides. Scannell, Keatley and co will be back for the hard matches

Those boys should stick to carrying Tyler's kit bag...

Statistically Ireland had the weakest lineout in the last 6 nations and our stats in November were very weak too.

RDW_Scotland wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:My biggest concern is the lineout. Ireland's lineout has been very bad compared to all other six nations sides since POC retired and yet this is where Ireland scored most of its tries.

I think the Gray brothers will really look to disrupt. With Ryan and POM out of the side I think we will be weaker than normal in the lineout. Could be a concern.

Feck me you have an 8ft second row - your lineout should be easy!

But what if it snows? When it snows Toner opens up for skiing classes.

GunsGermsV2 wrote:My biggest concern is the lineout. Ireland's lineout has been very bad compared to all other six nations sides since POC retired and yet this is where Ireland scored most of its tries.

I think the Gray brothers will really look to disrupt. With Ryan and POM out of the side I think we will be weaker than normal in the lineout. Could be a concern.

That's because Joe insists on picking can't jump at 6 and won't Jump at 8.

It'll be fine we'll just keep the ball in play....

God love the internet rodders, gives you time to come up with clever responses...

I will respond in another 5mins or so

Anyone else worried about jones and the fact he's been on holiday since November?

GunsGermsV2 wrote:Statistically Ireland had the weakest lineout in the last 6 nations and our stats in November were very weak too.

We must have started reusing Eddie's lost calls.

GunsGermsV2 wrote:Statistically Ireland had the weakest lineout in the last 6 nations and our stats in November were very weak too.

That's because nobody but dogs can understand Best when he calls the line out

Doesn't Toner Cartridge just stand on the 5 metre line waving his hands in the air? He'd block anything not shot with a mortar.

tigertattie wrote:A juice else worried about jones and the fact he's been on holiday since November?

Yes - it is a big risk, and one that we didn't have to taken given Matt Scott's form.

Obviously he may have a blinder though!

What does Matt need to do to get back into the match day squad?

tigertattie wrote:What does Matt need to do to get back into the match day squad?

Leave a few trip hazards dotted around Jones, Taylor and Bennett's hotel rooms?

SecretFly wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:Anyone listen to Eddie O'Sullivan's interview on Newstalk on Monday. Basically he spoke about trips to Murrayfield every two years. He was convinced that Scotland had spies that were passing on Ireland's lineout calls every year. In '01 they had to train in a gym cause the pitches in Edinburgh were frozen. Good old Eddie left a folder with all the lineout calls on a bin in the gym when they left so he went back a few hours later to get it. When he got there they gym owner said that he hadnt see anything. Eddie reckoned this was nonsense so they changed all the calls. In the game Scotland couldn't match them at the lineout according to Eddie as he reckons they were working off Ireland's old calls. Tall story?

That was an old pre-game counter strike by Eddie.  He left that folder there on purpose...it was plans for his garden shed and the Scots bought it.

Don't be falling for Eddie-the-Innocent stuff, Guns.  He loves pulling those tricks.

So the SRU bought O'Sullivan a garden shed in return for some out of date lineout calls. I'm not sure Scott Johnson really understands bribery and corruption.

RDW_Scotland wrote:

tigertattie wrote:What does Matt need to do to get back into the match day squad?

Leave a few trip hazards dotted around Jones, Taylor and Bennett's hotel rooms?

You've got to envy Brian Habana and Lee Byrne's team mates - they never actually had to leave the trip hazards there.

eirebilly wrote:God love the internet rodders, gives you time to come up with clever responses...

I will respond in another 5mins or so

I'll be back in an hour ....

IanBru wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:

tigertattie wrote:What does Matt need to do to get back into the match day squad?

Leave a few trip hazards dotted around Jones, Taylor and Bennett's hotel rooms?

You've got to envy Brian Habana and Lee Byrne's team mates - they never actually had to leave the trip hazards there.

GunsGermsV2 wrote:Statistically Ireland had the weakest lineout in the last 6 nations and our stats in November were very weak too.

53/59 for the AIs according to ESPN. I wouldn't consider that weak at all.

Golden wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:Statistically Ireland had the weakest lineout in the last 6 nations and our stats in November were very weak too.

53/59 for the AIs according to ESPN. I wouldn't consider that weak at all.

Not going to speak for guns here but my take on it is that Ireland used to be much better in the line-out and ensuing maul that often led to great platforms being built for attack or resulted in driving over for try's. It's not all about win/loss ratio.

One Scottish player I think who has been barely mentioned by many so far is Richie Gray. Playing away quietly in France whilst his brother Johnny is getting all the attention thanks to Glasgow Warriors success in Europe. I suspect most of the pundits have forgotten Richie is just as impressive, especially in the loose.

jimbopip wrote:

So the SRU bought O'Sullivan a garden shed in return for some out of date lineout calls. I'm not sure Scott Johnson really understands bribery and corruption.

:laughing:ah Scott, ya gotta love him.

eirebilly wrote:

Golden wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:Statistically Ireland had the weakest lineout in the last 6 nations and our stats in November were very weak too.

53/59 for the AIs according to ESPN. I wouldn't consider that weak at all.

Not going to speak for guns here but my take on it is that Ireland used to be much better in the line-out and ensuing maul that often led to great platforms being built for attack or resulted in driving over for try's. It's not all about win/loss ratio.

The stat I saw for the November internationals was Ireland ratio was 79.7% success for November on our own throw. This is below average for a six nations side. Our percentages in the six nations were 84% which was the lowest of all sides. by contrast in 2014 we had a 93.3% success rate.

It is definitely an area we need to improve a lot IMO. I think that having Stander and Henderson in the side will weaken it slightly.

I wonder is our lineout slightly less organised in general since John Plumtree left and Easterby took over.

bsando wrote:One Scottish player I think who has been barely mentioned by many so far is Richie Gray. Playing away quietly in France whilst his brother Johnny is getting all the attention thanks to Glasgow Warriors success in Europe. I suspect most of the pundits have forgotten Richie is just as impressive, especially in the loose.

Richie Gray is a freak in terms of work rate and his stats in a game.  His physicality has also come on significantly, probably helped by his time in France. The problem is Jonny is even more of a freak and is usually just ahead of Ritchie.

Ritchie is no longer the show pony that he (perhaps unfairly) was labelled as being in his early career - he is now an outstanding top class international lock and we're lucky to have him and his brotehr!

Ricthie was my MOTM against Australia in the Autumn - his was ridiculous that game

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

eirebilly wrote:

Golden wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:Statistically Ireland had the weakest lineout in the last 6 nations and our stats in November were very weak too.

53/59 for the AIs according to ESPN. I wouldn't consider that weak at all.

Not going to speak for guns here but my take on it is that Ireland used to be much better in the line-out and ensuing maul that often led to great platforms being built for attack or resulted in driving over for try's. It's not all about win/loss ratio.

The stat I saw for the November internationals was Ireland ratio was 79.7% success for November on our own throw. This is below average for a six nations side. Our percentages in the six nations were 84% which was the lowest of all sides. by contrast in 2014 we had a 93.3% success rate.

It is definitely an area we need to improve a lot IMO.

I think we were the worst in the 6 nations last year but according to ESPN Scrum website (is there a better website for statistics?) the AIs stats weren't that bad. Below is the breakdown. Now possibly they aren't accurate.

Aus- 15/16
NZ II- 18/20
Can- 10/11
NZ- 10/12
Total- 53/59

Thats 89.8% which of course we should be looking to improve on but I wouldn't consider it weak. We are lacking jumpers in the back row with POM and Murphy out and Henderson over Ryan isnt going to help either.

One Freak in a team - possibly advantageous if he's mad enough. Two? Hmmm, time for some serious psychological work on the coach.

Anyone have any idea why Berghan is preferred to Welsh for the bench? seems a strange choice considering his lack of pro12 game time. only 18 apperances off the bench in his 3 year edinburgh career?? is welsh injured and we are literally down to phoning round on friday night for fat lads to play front row?

Prothero wrote:Which irish 13 is best in the air? which is best in a dog fight? which one would you want with you in a trench? Who is the most BOD like of the new BODS?

is Huw Jones the new BOD?

It's been a while but surely he's the new Renwick?

The Great Aukster wrote:

Prothero wrote:Which irish 13 is best in the air? which is best in a dog fight? which one would you want with you in a trench? Who is the most BOD like of the new BODS?

is Huw Jones the new BOD?

It's been a while but surely he's the new Renwick?

He is doing well to be ahead of Bennett, Scott and Taylor so he has something potentially special to bring to this championship.

I think in the Oz game Jonny topped the tackle count with 17 (none missed) and Ritchie was 2nd with 16 and also none missed.

I think only England can claim to have a better pair of locks and even then it's a matter of opinion.

We shall but see.

GunsGermsV2 wrote:My biggest concern is the lineout. Ireland's lineout has been very bad compared to all other six nations sides since POC retired and yet this is where Ireland scored most of its tries.

I think the Gray brothers will really look to disrupt. With Ryan and POM out of the side I think we will be weaker than normal in the lineout. Could be a concern.

Scotlands lineout has been a bit Meh at times as well. I hope scotland will attack Irelands lineout but our record is not great either.

TJ wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:My biggest concern is the lineout. Ireland's lineout has been very bad compared to all other six nations sides since POC retired and yet this is where Ireland scored most of its tries.

I think the Gray brothers will really look to disrupt. With Ryan and POM out of the side I think we will be weaker than normal in the lineout. Could be a concern.

Scotlands lineout has been a bit Meh at times as well.  I hope scotland will attack Irelands lineout but our record is not great either.

The weather is going to be awful on Saturday (wet and windy), so I'd imagine Ireland will be using their maul a lot Ireland has loads of ball carriers.

Was listening to Paul O'Connell on 5 Live - his pick for Lions locks are AW Jones (captain) and Maro Itoe. He rates AWJ very highly - says he is very physical and huge (bulky).

The Scottish locks are great on their own ball, but not mobile enough for defensive work (imo) - a bit like Toner. POM is the master of that as he is light and mobile.

Not mobile enough for defensive work? So why do they consistently top the tackle charts?

in 2 six nations Jonny made 142 tackles and missed one. In 3 autumn internationals he made 43 and missed none

In one recent game the Gray bros made 33 tackles between them and missed none

I agree that jonny is a bit slow to get moving - it takes a while to accelerate that huge weight but this doesn't seem to stop him tackling. Defense is probably the best part of his game.

TJ wrote:Not mobile enough for defensive work?  So why do they consistently top the tackle charts?  

in 2 six nations Jonny made 142 tackles and missed one.   In 3 autumn internationals he made 43 and missed none

In one recent game the Gray bros made 33 tackles between them and missed none

I agree that jonny is a bit slow to get moving - it takes a while to accelerate that huge weight but this doesn't seem to stop him tackling.  Defense is probably the best part of his game.

Lineout defense I'm talking about. They are very good around the pitch. They are too big and heavy to get up in the air quickly. POM & POC (both light) are/were good at stealing lineouts.

Now, this will probably comeback and bite me at the weekend,    but I think that Jonny Gray has a bit to go yet. In recent games against Munster, he really wasn't prominent which is what I would have expected of such a highly rated lock.

edit: no maul defense and don't think the lineout was great for Glasgow either (I know Munster were not great themselves).

Ah - fair enough then. Yes getting 20 stone in the air is not easy hence they often use a back row as a jumper. They do get the odd steal but yes you are right on that.

I often wonder about putting a back into defensive lineouts so they can thow him 20 ft in the air!

Ireland's tactics should be simple enough.

Allow Scotland a penalty in front of the sticks and get the three points.

Restart, Scotland fck it up, Ireland score a try.

Repeat for 80 minutes.

Done.

Sin é wrote:

TJ wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:My biggest concern is the lineout. Ireland's lineout has been very bad compared to all other six nations sides since POC retired and yet this is where Ireland scored most of its tries.

I think the Gray brothers will really look to disrupt. With Ryan and POM out of the side I think we will be weaker than normal in the lineout. Could be a concern.

Scotlands lineout has been a bit Meh at times as well.  I hope scotland will attack Irelands lineout but our record is not great either.

The weather is going to be awful on Saturday (wet and windy), so I'd imagine Ireland will be using their maul a lot  Ireland has loads of ball carriers.

Was listening to Paul O'Connell on 5 Live - his pick for Lions locks are AW Jones (captain) and Maro Itoe. He rates AWJ very highly - says he is very physical and huge (bulky).

The Scottish locks are great on their own ball, but not mobile enough for defensive work (imo) - a bit like Toner. POM is the master of that as he is light and mobile.

AWJ is the best lineout operator in B&I so it makes sense. Wales have the best line out stats in last years 6N too.

I like toner a lot but Jones and Itoje makes a lot of sense to me and is a killer combo.

Toner tends to have one of the highest tackle stats for Ireland Sin.

I often come up with unorthodox tactics!

Id never seen a hooker throw the ball to the front lifter at a lineout before but I did than when I were a wee nipper!

My latest concoction is:

You can't tackle a man in the air
You can't tackle a lifter

Tactic - Throw the ball to a lifted player. Keep the player lifted and carry him to the try line. Opponents can't touch you so march unimpeded to the try line and score

I am very excited to see how the Ringshaw centre pairing goes in the green shirts. It's a partnership that we could be getting very used to for many years to come. Zebo and Earls have been in some form lately, Zebo especially has been outstanding of late. Kearney is always that unknown entity, will he perform or will he simply..........I refuse to even say it, he won't let us down. Our pack speaks for itself, we have a starting 1-8 that could take on any pack in world rugby IMO, Furlong is already a total beast and will get better I reckon.
Scotland have improved from last year in leaps and bounds but Ireland are a totally different animal this season. Farrell has brought a lot to the coaching team and Ireland have been playing the way I've been expecting them to under Joe for what seems an age of waiting.

Ringshaw sounds like something you get after eating a very spicy curry.

tigertattie wrote:I often come up with unorthodox tactics!

Id never seen a hooker throw the ball to the front lifter at a lineout before but I did than when I were a wee nipper!

My latest concoction is:

You can't tackle a man in the air
You can't tackle a lifter

Tactic - Throw the ball to a lifted player. Keep the player lifted and carry him to the try line. Opponents can't touch you so march unimpeded to the try line and score  

Mine is get players to practise diving horizontally 2 feet of the ground for a try from as far out as possible.
Any tackle near the ball will be a high tackle and a red card.

In all seriousness I reckon to be a height tackle it should be over waist height.
Sean Reidy of Ulster got pinged recently for a tackle that was somewhere between 2 and 3 feet of the ground - what are you meant to do ?

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:Ireland's tactics should be simple enough.

Allow Scotland a penalty in front of the sticks and get the three points.

Restart, Scotland fck it up, Ireland score a try.

Repeat for 80 minutes.

Done.

Clearly Scotland have been watching Ulster when it comes to restarts.
We are masters at screwing up restarts both for and against and have been for years - even when we were good a few years back.

Screwing up restarts is a Scottish national trait, and has been for as long as I have been watching rugby!.

The amount of times I scream RESTARTS!!!! when watching Scottish teams play is ridiculous.

Shouldn't it be Henrose?

I'll be cheering on Scotland and France this weekend. I need a shower

munkian wrote:I'll be cheering on Scotland and France this weekend. I need a shower

feeling dirty?

geoff999rugby wrote:
In all seriousness I reckon to be a height tackle it should be over waist height.
Sean Reidy of Ulster got pinged recently for a tackle that was somewhere between 2 and 3 feet of the ground - what are you meant to do ?

I remember watching that on a quiet Friday night a few weeks back, and shouting madly at the TV: "But... how was he.... I mean.... WHAT?!!!"

Honestly, that call was utter, utter b****cks, and highlights the danger of confronting inexperienced refs with fundamental changes to the rules - they don't have the experience or confidence to interpret them in a realistic manner. Owens, Barnes or even Rolland would have looked at that and said: "Nothing more the tackled player could have done, short of reaching over the diving player and suspending him by his underwear. Legal tackle."

To then miss the Ulster player's punch on the ground was equally ludicrous.

Forecast tomorrow looks pretty good - 5 degrees, low chance of a light shower and moderate wind.

RDW_Scotland wrote:Forecast tomorrow looks pretty good - 5 degrees, low chance of a light shower and moderate wind.

Enthralling 3-0 win on the cards then

munkian wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:Forecast tomorrow looks pretty good - 5 degrees, low chance of a light shower and moderate wind.

Enthralling 3-0 win on the cards then

As long as Scotland had the 3 I'd be delighted with that!

RDW_Scotland wrote:Forecast tomorrow looks pretty good - 5 degrees, low chance of a light shower and moderate wind.

Not according to the Norwegian weather forecast.

http://www.yr.no/place/United_Kingdom/Scotland/Edinburgh/