Ongoing NFL Discussion Thread V

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Sun 08 Jan 2017, 8:50 pm

First topic message reminder :

Pr4wn wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
Pr4wn wrote:Love this Texans D. They're amazing without Watt. Scary.

Amazing is a bit far - they're pretty good, nothing special.

Number one D in the NFL without their best player.

They're one of about 8 teams to hold that tag - and lets face it it's measured in yards...in points the #1 D was the Pats.

No great defences out there this year, just a lot of pretty good ones. If they had Watt, maybe they'd be great...but they don't

by **Pr4wn** Mon 29 Jan 2018, 2:17 pm

Yet another year where I'm wishing for a way for both teams in the Superbowl to lose.

I'm so over the Patriots, though. Unbelievably dull.

by GSC Mon 29 Jan 2018, 2:44 pm

Kinda wish the Jags made the SB so I could go full heel

by **Pr4wn** Mon 29 Jan 2018, 3:30 pm

I'd have loved it if the Jags made it. The officiating in that game was nothing short of shambolic. Jags deserved the win.

by GSC Mon 29 Jan 2018, 5:17 pm

Jags have no one to blame but themselves. Stopped playing to win at the end of the first half.

Eagles got the ball with about half the time left the Jags had with no timeouts and got a FG running 2 screens and a wide open Ertz

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Mon 29 Jan 2018, 5:52 pm

If you look at their 4th quarter play calling on both sides of the ball they stopped doing what was working - for some bizarre reason they stopped playing man on defence and went zone (thus Amendola was open literally the whole time), and on offence their play calls for four drives in a row was run up the middle, deep shot, pass short of the sticks on 3rd down.

It was Atlanta esque stupidness

by GSC Wed 31 Jan 2018, 3:48 am

DAN
SNYDER

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Wed 31 Jan 2018, 6:53 am

The most redskins move ever

by Lowlandbrit Wed 31 Jan 2018, 7:14 am

A 3rd round pick, Kendall Fuller and $70 million guaranteed for Alex Smith just to avoid giving Cousins a new contract. There's been a lot of debate about what the Redskins should do, but surely we can all agree it wasn't this?

by GSC Wed 31 Jan 2018, 9:05 am

They've spent 3 years avoiding ponying QB money for a guy they publicly griped wasn't good enough to carry a team to a ring.

They then trade a 3rd rounder, their best corner last year and give 70m guaranteed to a QB 2 QB gurus have decided isn't good enough to win a ring.

by skins4ever Wed 31 Jan 2018, 6:20 pm

I'm probably in the minority in saying that I expected this and don't have a big problem with the deal. I'm a little put off by the contract and letting Fuller go, but there are a few reasons I actually think it suits us right now.

1) Cousins didn't seem interested in signing a long term (sort of) cap friendly deal, and ultimately I agree that good as he is, he can't carry a team on his back.
2) Had we resigned him, it would likely be an albatross contract and hamstring our ability to bring in SB quality talent in the next year or 2 to bolster the D and keep the O in good shape.
3) It saves us having to draft a win now QB in the draft, and maybe not even draft one at all. Most mocks have predicted the Skins having to go QB and early because they all expected Cousins to walk. We can probably focus away from QB now for 2-3 years drafts, and we haven't taken the big cap hit expected so we have room to sign an FA or 2 that could make the difference. We could, for example go after someone Jarvis Landry if they don't resign Pryor, or they let Fuller go because they are looking to target Johnson or Butler? The cap space opens up possibilities in the coming years.
4) The lack of need to concentrate on QB should mean we draft real needs at other positions (like S, DL and OL) or even trade down to maximise picks. And the same could apply next year. We can draft a QB in 2 years and he will still have 1-2 seasons on the bench instead of a repeat of the Griffin situation.

My worries are:

1) We don't have a medium to long term answer at TE, unless Reed can suddenly find a way to stay healthy. Sprinkle might be a find, but if Davis is still playing at a starter level, can he develop behind Davis and Reed? I can't see anyone in FA to enable a change, and it would be plain dumb to draft another TE this year. If anything, I'd have been looking for a trade deal on Reed to get value while they still can?
2) With Fuller and Breeland gone or going, we're paper thin at CB. As said, I suspect they may make a play for one of the top FA's, but they are still going to have to expend at least one pick on a CB to ensure some kind of depth.
3) Smith probably isn't going to get a ring on his own, so are they expecting to build a team that can do it with his limitations? So is it a build to win in 2-3 years scenario, or are they going dumb again and throwing money at guys in the hope of winning now? I really hope it's not the latter!

I like the way Smith approaches everything, he's a bit like John McClane! Smile

I just hope he doesn't have to die hard in DC.

by Number-25 Wed 31 Jan 2018, 11:00 pm

Predictable hysteria on here about the Redskins trade for Smith.... am particularly enjoying the hyperbole around Kendall Fuller.... he’s a freakin slot corner!! And an OK one at that... nothing more, nothing less. Holsey or Moreau will likely replace him just fine.

As for the rest of the trade who the feck cares? We sucked before and we’ll still suck after it... but we’ve sucked for the last 25 years and will still suck in another 25 years time so honestly, who the feck cares? At least Smith will be a cheaper option than the stat stuffer Cousins and we have the added bonus of people talking about this rather than the Eagles Superbowl appearance.

by skins4ever Wed 31 Jan 2018, 11:33 pm

Number-25 wrote:and we have the added bonus of people talking about this rather than the Eagles Superbowl appearance.

by Number-25 Thu 01 Feb 2018, 12:52 am

That’s my favourite bit Skins... we’ve not had much to smile about the last quarter of a century so watching the Eagles HC have to answer a question about the Redskins at a Superbowl presser... I’ll take that.

As for the trade.... Smith=Cousins but cheaper. The stat stuffer signs elsewhere in FA we get a 3rd round compensatory pick in 2019 to square off the 3rd round pick we give up this year. I’m completely ambivalent towards this trade.

by GSC Thu 01 Feb 2018, 7:28 am

I'd take a blind stab that he was asked because he was the Chiefs OC 2 years ago but hey, take your victories where you can

by Number-25 Thu 01 Feb 2018, 9:40 am

I'd say your wild stab is spot on GSC... but I'm still taking it Laugh

I'm so conflicted on this trade... I hate it on one hand but can see the sense and thinking behind it on the other.

by GSC Thu 01 Feb 2018, 9:49 am

From the position they were in it was a solid move.

Getting themselves in that position however took some of the poorest management this side of Cleveland. You can't spend years sniping at Cousins for not being good enough to carry a team then pay a premium for a older, worse QB who 2 very competent QB gurus decided wasn't good enough to carry a team.

The reality in the NFL is there aren't 32 good QBs and the ones that are, get paid. For trying to deny this, the Skins ended paying a third rounder, their best corner from a year ago and 70m to get older and worse at QB.

(And the 3rd round comp pick requires Snyder and co to sit out FA)

by Number-25 Thu 01 Feb 2018, 8:32 pm

Agree that all the Redskins have done is try fix a bad situation of their own making.

Disagree that Smith is worse than Cousins..... Smith = Cousins.... just cheaper.

by GSC Thu 01 Feb 2018, 8:57 pm

Cousins is definitely better than Smith. Not sure it's that close either, the Chiefs basically had to run a gimmick offense to account for his limitations.

What Cousins did last year with a beat up OL and productive receivers replaced by turds was much more impressive than anything Smith has done.

by Number-25 Thu 01 Feb 2018, 9:25 pm

What you saw from Cousins last season was more of the same... a QB that comes up small in big moments, who can't get the job done in the redzone or 3rd down and who doesn't play well in pressure situations. His stats may look good but scratch the surface and it's ugly. Situational football is his downfall and is exactly why any team with Cousins at the helm, unless everything else is perfect or close to it will be doomed to a life of 8-8 +/- 2 games depending on how the breaks go. I could have lived with it for sensible money but for circa 27mil per year frankly I'd had enough of him.

Smith will be no better... but he'll be no worse. Here's to another 6-10 to 8-8 season again next year.

Anyway... enough about my manky mob... what's gonna happen on Sunday? Eagles going to win?? The closer it gets the more I'm finding myself wanting the Eagles to do it!

by GSC Thu 01 Feb 2018, 9:56 pm

My expectations for this season died with Wentz's knee. that said if Sam Bradford and Chip Kelly can beat the Pats in Foxborough, and the Jags can almost do it pretending the passing game doesn't exist, they have a shot by dominating both lines. Not that likely though.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Fri 02 Feb 2018, 8:23 am

GSC wrote:Cousins is definitely better than Smith. Not sure it's that close either, the Chiefs basically had to run a gimmick offense to account for his limitations.

What Cousins did last year with a beat up OL and productive receivers replaced by turds was much more impressive than anything Smith has done.

I agree with this - two of the best offensive minds of recent times have decided Alex Smith (in his prime years) was not good enough to get them over the hump, let alone a 34 year old one who showed since about week 6 this past season he was very below average. It's not the worst situation Washington could've found themselves in of course, but you're just tying yourselves to mediocrity for longer. Go take a punt on a QB in the draft, try to find a real difference maker!

As for the Super Bowl - as GSC says, Eagles need to dominate both lines, and Foles to play like he did in the NFC title game (not in games previous), then they have a real shot. if you get the Foles that played against the Raiders/Cowboys, Philly has issues. I do think the Pats will be able to move the ball against the Eagles D fairly easily, not sure Philly has anyone who can begin to cover Gronk or the RBs like Jacksonville did (and that's really why they were in that game)

by Number-25 Fri 02 Feb 2018, 10:52 am

Agree with drafting a QB... that's the way I'd have gone this offseason... it's not like we're close to evem winning the division at the moment so nothing to lose by taking a swing in the draft and hoping we strike gold and get a guy to build around.

Also don't get me wrong re Smith... I'm not saying he's great or anything like that... he's fine... nothing more and nothing less. Just like Cousins is fine. Neither will get you over the hump though. They're the same QB. I'm not worried about Smith's age too much... he looks after himself and is a good pro so he could easily go on another 4 years or so.... the worrying bit is whether the Redskins brain trust is smart enough to start planning for Smith's departure right now and history doesn't give many reasons for optimism in that regard.

I'd have taken a swing in the draft this year though.

by GSC Fri 02 Feb 2018, 11:11 am

Number-25 wrote:the worrying bit is whether the Redskins brain trust is smart enough to start planning for Smith's departure right now .

Spoiler:

by Number-25 Fri 02 Feb 2018, 6:39 pm

by skins4ever Sat 03 Feb 2018, 4:29 pm

OK, who's getting MVP this year? I'd like to see anyone else but Brady get it, but seeing how their D was al but useless early on and he kept them in the hunt until the D caught up, I can't see anyone else getting it. Gurley is a worthy winner, but he couldn't carry the team like Brady has.

by GSC Sun 04 Feb 2018, 8:39 am

Even accounting for that I thought Urlacher was kinda overrated, that's a stacked HoF class.

Next year will be equally stacked

by Number-25 Sun 04 Feb 2018, 10:35 am

TO.... why??

He’s got stats but won nothing and is a douchebag.

That he got into the HoF and Joe Jacoby didn’t is an actual crime.

by GSC Sun 04 Feb 2018, 10:57 am

4/5 members of the class don't have rings. It's an individual accolade not a team one. T.O is a top 5 receiver all time

by GSC Sun 04 Feb 2018, 11:00 am

Last year was the year to complain about snubs when a kicker went in.

Wouldn't hold out hope for next year either, Tony Gonzalez, Ed Reed, Champ Bailey and Brian waters are all up

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Sun 04 Feb 2018, 1:40 pm

TO is literally the 3rd/4th best WR of all time, it’d be a crime if he hadn’t got in

by Number-25 Sun 04 Feb 2018, 9:47 pm

You’ve taken that too far

by Guest Sun 04 Feb 2018, 10:02 pm

Where are we putting our dosh tonight, Olly?

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Sun 04 Feb 2018, 11:02 pm

Solid - I’ve got some good ones like first kickoff no touchback at 11/8, first Pats TD scorer James White at 8/1 and first eagles TD scorer Corey clement at 14/1

Also placed money on Philly to win cos the odds they’re offering were crazy for what’s a 50/50 game

by Guest Sun 04 Feb 2018, 11:06 pm

They were an even bigger price 2 weeks ago. On it.

by Guest Sun 04 Feb 2018, 11:07 pm

That is one beautiful arena.

by Duty281 Sun 04 Feb 2018, 11:22 pm

New England going to cruise this.

by Guest Sun 04 Feb 2018, 11:24 pm

Cos they got England in their name, Duty? Laugh

by Duty281 Sun 04 Feb 2018, 11:30 pm

Haha. Precisely!

by Guest Sun 04 Feb 2018, 11:32 pm

Top man, LOL.

by Breadvan Sun 04 Feb 2018, 11:44 pm

Decent opening drive by Phily.

by Guest Mon 05 Feb 2018, 12:29 am

I'm getting high off Josh Norman's enthusiasm. The GOAT guest.

by Guest Mon 05 Feb 2018, 12:32 am

It's last year all over again....

by Duty281 Mon 05 Feb 2018, 12:33 am

Time to bet the house on New England...

Philadelphia may very well regret not getting extra points on either of their touchdowns.

by No name Bertie Mon 05 Feb 2018, 12:38 am

The Patriots have developed a fearsome reputation of being able to clawback any deficit in the fourth. I wonder what the menu is going to be for today.

They are the two best teams in the Leagues with virtually identical main season records:
New England Patriots: win 13 loss 3 points for 458 points against 296
Philadelphia Eagles...: win 13 loss 3 points for 457 points against 295

Of course the Eagles lost their brilliant quarterback late in the season but their replacement seems to have been equally as good.

by No name Bertie Mon 05 Feb 2018, 12:57 am

Three touchdowns so far and no conversions. Must be swirling winds or something? Actually the kicking distance for the extra point is so short, winds shouldn't play much of a role.

by Guest Mon 05 Feb 2018, 1:04 am

Ballsy! Great stuff.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Mon 05 Feb 2018, 1:22 am

Pats defence literally could not be playing worse if they tried - and the coaching is embarrassing. Why is Jordan Richards playing over Butler. Why is Rowe on Jeffrey to start the game? Why is McDaniels calling the worst third down calls he has all season?

Getting out coached and manned by Philly so far

by Guest Mon 05 Feb 2018, 2:04 am

Massive controversy, there.

by Duty281 Mon 05 Feb 2018, 2:06 am

Slightly stunned that was given!

by Duty281 Mon 05 Feb 2018, 2:12 am

Excellent response, that.

by Sponsored content