British & Irish Lions Squad 2017

First topic message reminder :

robbo277 wrote:
But as I said, I don't want players to water down their comments. I want to read what the players think, I don't want to read what the press officer tells them to say.

That's fair enough, and I agree with the rest of your comment on this basis. I personally don't particularly care what Mike Brown thinks, especially when it's as obvious as "experienced test player is disappointed to have not been selected for the Lions". I could have told you that without Mike Brown's public statement. The point where it deviated from him merely expressing his disappointment to one where he's put his foot in his mouth is the fact he questioned the coaches' lack of communication to him personally. Even if he's right- and I think he may well be- to publicly bring that into question in the way he has done is antithetical to the whole business of a squad as a unity, a whole above the self.

As for him being a liability, I agree to an extent, but equally he does get in his fair few verbal and physical scraps. He's clearly not a player who's particularly in control of his emotions, a bit like Biggar, in that he wants to plead his case long after it is obvious his efforts are utterly in vain. He's not a catastrophe by any means, but having played with people like him, they can be liabilities. Ticking time bomb may be the incorrect phrase, and overdoing it slightly, but that doesn't negate the point entirely. Either way, it doesn't particularly matter, as I don't think it really affects his performance or mentality, and the players around him, too much: but if it did, it's hard to quantify anyway.

Gatland has been coaching Wales and is now coaching the Lions. It's the same coach.

Plus Howley is the backs coach.

There's no change for the Welsh players. Unfortunately for the other nations they have to work with Howley.

Unfortunately the Lions could pick a great backline would with a poor backs coach......


Sure Nowell is a good option on the wing but if North was picked instead I could understand why.

North looked on fire against Stade I thought.

beshocked wrote:Gatland has been coaching Wales and is now coaching the Lions. It's the same coach.

Plus Howley is the backs coach.

There's no change for the Welsh players. Unfortunately for the other nations they have to work with Howley.

Unfortunately the Lions could pick a great backline would with a poor backs coach......


Sure Nowell is a good option on the wing but if North was picked instead I could understand why.

Nah despite what you've heard BS Steve Borthwick will be running the show. Don't be surprised to see Ashton to get a late call-up. Attack and no defence is the best offence afterall...

It's pretty clear to me that the Welsh players are coming to peak just in time for the tour. The same happened last time, which is very suspicious.

It is obvious that Gatland and Howley have know for some time who would tour and have worked with the Welsh coaches and staff (and perhaps players themselves) to go easy during the 6N and domestic season and peak for the Summer, whilst the other players have been going hard at it all season for club and country.

This will give the impression the Welsh players are physically fitter and also allow more to get the opportunity to play in the test series to further develop themselves for Wales, whilst having the double benefit of damaging the confidence of the other home nation players.

Gats will grind the players in training and throw tired English and Irish players to the wolves in the first test before replacing them with fresh Welsh ones for the final two games in the hope of winning a test.

There needs to be an independent investigation into the whole selection process.

mikey_dragon wrote:

beshocked wrote:...I just wouldn't fill the team with 5 Welsh backs.

I wouldn't either....

Mikey, Beshocked's starting position was arguing against selecting 5 welsh backs in the Lions backline. That's the only point he was making, and you agree with him.

Mikey dragon I don't want Ashton in the Lions. Borthwick running the forwards will help as he's proven to be a good organiser and his work at international level so far has been positive.

Wouldn't want Borthwick in charge of the backs though.

Rugby Fan exactly.

rodders I am worried that there will be a lot of tired and battered bodies after the Lions tour.

Not sure if you're joking or not but Wales certainly put a lot of effort in the 6 nations.

Rugby Fan wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

beshocked wrote:...I just wouldn't fill the team with 5 Welsh backs.

I wouldn't either....

Mikey, Beshocked's starting position was arguing against selecting 5 welsh backs in the Lions backline. That's the only point he was making, and you agree with him.

BS "Wales backs are overhyped gym monkeys that don't score tries." - is what I didn't agree with. Especially as two of them are the top try-scorers in the 6N.

mikey dragon I didn't say Wales don't score tries. I said they don't score enough.

L.Williams needs to score more tries because his try scoring ratio is still too low.

8 tries in 5 games is not good by any stretch of the imagination.

Kind of shows that more Welsh players need to score more tries if you have 2 of the top try scorers but still have a try count much lower than Scotland,England and Ireland.

Having 2 of the top try scorers doesn't paper over the cracks. You came 5th. 2nd lowest points for in the competition.

You didn't score enough points. 0 try bonuses too.

beshocked wrote:8 tries in 5 games is not good by any stretch of the imagination.

High standards.

mikey_dragon wrote:

Rugby Fan wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

beshocked wrote:...I just wouldn't fill the team with 5 Welsh backs.

I wouldn't either....

Mikey, Beshocked's starting position was arguing against selecting 5 welsh backs in the Lions backline. That's the only point he was making, and you agree with him.

BS "Wales backs are overhyped gym monkeys that don't score tries." - is what I didn't agree with. Especially as two of them are the top try-scorers in the 6N.

That statement is fundamentally true. They are overhyped. They are Gym monkeys and scored the least tries in the 6N as opposed to Italy.

They are facts, and not really opinions.

What is also a fact, is that key Welsh players Halfpenny, Williams and Davies have all played better for their clubs in recent weeks than they played for Wales.

North and Williams seem to be the only 2 players who have maintained a consistent excellent form over tests and club games.

Biggar has been consistently awful all season though.

JD2 has looked a different player for the Scarlets. Whatever he is being coached to do at Wales is like night and day by comparison. He has been utterly tremendous over the last few weeks in the matches against the Ospreys, Leinser and Munster. As has Williams. Worryingly the Lions coaches are broadly the same as the Wales coaches, so they are doing something fundamentally wrong.

Scottrf wrote:

beshocked wrote:8 tries in 5 games is not good by any stretch of the imagination.

High standards.

Agreed, as my imagination seems to be stretched

I think most people would take them stats :-)

Is he not saying Wales' 8 tries in 5 games in the 6N is not good enough? I would tend to agree with that!

RDW_Scotland wrote:Is he not saying Wales' 8 tries in 5 games in the 6N is not good enough? I would tend to agree with that!

Oh, then not so good :-)

I think my point was missed and BS seems to have succeeded in getting it off topic and to a Wales-slagging match; that's gone the way of every thread then.

I think there are concerns of the tactics and some of the players who currently play that tactic for their national team.

The other point is - said players have shown they can play a different way and we hope that they are allowed to play that way

Perhaps I am using the term wrong. I certainly don't think 8 tries in 5 games is good. Maybe it's fine if all games are won but if it's 2 wins and 3 losses.... not so impressive.


I would have personally put in Russell or Ford instead of Biggar into the squad.

Mikey Dragon I know you think I hate Wales, I don't. You have some excellent players. I said well played when you beat us in our own RWC. You won fair and square.

I just want the Lions to pick the best backline. If that means no English then fair enough.

I certainly don't think the Lions will be playing like Wales did under Howley this year.... I'm not sure why people think that, especially when Howley is just there to wash kit.

mikey_dragon wrote:I certainly don't think the Lions will be playing like Wales did under Howley this year.... I'm not sure why people think that, especially when Howley is just there to wash kit.

Well as head attack coach you'd think it is quite likely he'll be coming up with the attacking gameplan!

From the training videos they've released he's certainly been heavily involved in sessions.

RDW_Scotland wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:I certainly don't think the Lions will be playing like Wales did under Howley this year.... I'm not sure why people think that, especially when Howley is just there to wash kit.

Well as head attack coach you'd think it is quite likely he'll be coming up with the attacking gameplan!

From the training videos they've released he's certainly been heavily involved in sessions.

I didn't think this was the case on previous tours where Howley has been involved. I think Gatland and Farrell will be running the show.

I may have a pro England jaundiced eye but looking at the Welsh backs we seem to be talking about ( Willaims, North, Davies, 1/2p) the only one I think is consistantly dangerous is Williams.

1/2p works very hard, great kicker and too brave in defense. Used to be a danger with ball in hand but these days it just seems exciting when he does try anything because its a rare event.
North is great with a run up because he's so strong, but still needs space to get up to speed. He's not someone I feel concerned about England facing. He's not as laughably prone to errors as Cuthbert has become but you still feel that if he's caught early enough his strength doesn't count for much. His defense is a bit 'meh', and you don't want to see him get another head injury
JD2 I just don't know. Looked very promising when he first started playing, but just seems a bit direct with not a lot else these days. When he's been on form and playing Scott Williams looked better.
Don't know enough about form. Maybe its as we are being told and they are all hitting form at the right time and that will make a difference, but I don't think muscle alone will make a difference.

mikey_dragon wrote:

BS "Wales backs are overhyped gym monkeys that don't score tries." - is what I didn't agree with. Especially as two of them are the top try-scorers in the 6N.

Depends if you see them as specialist backs or just players that can play in the backs

Taylorman wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:Club rugby whether professional or amateur represents the area where they are based. Halfpenny represents Toulon and gets well paid to do so. To turn his back on his TEAM in their most important game of the year is against the very traditions of the game.
A club final means a lot to those supporters who have followed their team week in week out through thick and thin. The betrayal of his team for thirty pieces of silver is indefensible.

What a load of rubbish. Only reason hes there is because bouj pays more money.

Which part is rubbish? That he is contracted to Toulon or that he doesn't care about his teammates?

Taylorman wrote:Do you really think these guys hearts are in playing with a bunch of money grabbers from all over the world to play in the back blocks of France for a few locals they neither know nor care about?

And you know this how? The majority of imports are from the SH so does this mean SANZAR are producing mercenaries who don't care about their teammates? I think you are doing a disservice to the majority of them and am fairly sure Jonny Wilkinson would disagree with you.

Taylorman wrote:There is honour in playing for a tradtion like the Lions, more so than fir a money grabbing mercenary outfit like Toulon, who offer nothing to the rugby of the areas of the players they steal from.

So stff them. That aint real rugby, its two bit imitation of the baabaas in wolfs clothing.

At least halfpenny knows where his rugby priorities lie.

Where is the honour in leaving your teammates high and dry in the most important game of the season. Where is the honour in taking money from a pointless marketing jamboree and risking your career with club and country. The honourable position would be to favour the club that has favoured you and support the Nation that has developed and supported you. Toulon took years to win anything despite their stellar cast, whereas the Lions have three games to become a team - perhaps the All Blacks should be considering whether there is any honour in perpetuating a 'tradition' that is now so heavily weighted in their favour? ... of course any such consideration would only last a nanosecond before greed overcame it.

The Barbarians are a true tradition of rugby - charitable, playing uncapped players, playing to entertain the crowd, shunning points etc. or in other words about as far away from Toulon as it's possible to get. The Lions on the other hand are drawn from the biggest playing pool in the world, with supposedly the best players competing fiercely amongst themselves for a start in a marketing juggernaut. Fans and players didn't like Alastair Campbell being part of the last tour because it reminded everyone how far the Lions had fallen from their corinthian roots.
The Lions shirt is only a slightly different shade of red to Toulon's, but that doesn't mean that Halfpenny should think it's OK to swap one "money grabbing mercenary outfit like Toulon" for another like the Lions.

So your thoughts on players such as george north ditching their clubs for their country?

Eh?

North had it written into his contract that he could miss northampton games for wales. Presumably you feel he's letting his saints team mates down as wales chase the cash for additional games outside the international window.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Rugby Fan wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

beshocked wrote:...I just wouldn't fill the team with 5 Welsh backs.

I wouldn't either....

Mikey, Beshocked's starting position was arguing against selecting 5 welsh backs in the Lions backline. That's the only point he was making, and you agree with him.

BS "Wales backs are overhyped gym monkeys that don't score tries." - is what I didn't agree with. Especially as two of them are the top try-scorers in the 6N.

That statement is fundamentally true. They are overhyped. They are Gym monkeys and scored the least tries in the 6N as opposed to Italy.

They are facts, and not really opinions..

Radge, I like you as a poster. But when you come up with personal opinions and call them 'facts' you just look like a WUM. "They are gym monkeys"? Come on, you can do better than that. What's your definition of that? For me it's bigger and stronger but with less skill. Too much muscle and weight from gym training making them too slow? So which ones are gym monkeys? Rhys Webb is not a big unit. He's smaller than Conor Murray and about the same as Ben Youngs. Biggar is a stone lighter than Owen Farell, half a stone lighter than Sexton. He's lighter than the god that is/was Dan Carter. Are they all gym monkeys too?! Liam Williams is quite slight in comparison to a lot of wingers these days. He's light a rake, with bandy legs to boot. Tommy Seymour is over a stone heavier. Halfpenny is small. Stuart Hogg is a stone heavier ffs. T'eo is bigger than JD2.

Only North is bigger than a 'normal' winger.  But then he's pretty much the same dap as Julian Savea, give or take a pound or two, and I don't hear anyone complaining about NZ being gym monkeys.

I can only assume you're referring to players like Jamie Roberts who were not picked? Otherwise I'm baffled  

No 7&1/2 wrote:North had it written into his contract that he could miss northampton games for wales. Presumably you feel he's letting his saints team mates down as wales chase the cash for additional games outside the international window.

Plus, let's not forget players who are 'owned' (at least in part) by the union and are limited on the number of games they play each season, which invariably means that their club games are limited to maximise the international games they play. There's been a number of Irish players in this camp over the years, amongst others of course.

The Great Aukster wrote:

Taylorman wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:Club rugby whether professional or amateur represents the area where they are based. Halfpenny represents Toulon and gets well paid to do so. To turn his back on his TEAM in their most important game of the year is against the very traditions of the game.
A club final means a lot to those supporters who have followed their team week in week out through thick and thin. The betrayal of his team for thirty pieces of silver is indefensible.

What a load of rubbish. Only reason hes there is because bouj pays more money.

Which part is rubbish? That he is contracted to Toulon or that he doesn't care about his teammates?

Taylorman wrote:Do you really think these guys hearts are in playing with a bunch of money grabbers from all over the world to play in the back blocks of France for a few locals they neither know nor care about?

And you know this how? The majority of imports are from the SH so does this mean SANZAR are producing mercenaries who don't care about their teammates? I think you are doing a disservice to the majority of them and am fairly sure Jonny Wilkinson would disagree with you.

Taylorman wrote:There is honour in playing for a tradtion like the Lions, more so than fir a money grabbing mercenary outfit like Toulon, who offer nothing to the rugby of the areas of the players they steal from.

So stff them. That aint real rugby, its two bit imitation of the baabaas in wolfs clothing.

At least halfpenny knows where his rugby priorities lie.

Where is the honour in leaving your teammates high and dry in the most important game of the season. Where is the honour in taking money from a pointless marketing jamboree and risking your career with club and country. The honourable position would be to favour the club that has favoured you and support the Nation that has developed and supported you. Toulon took years to win anything despite their stellar cast, whereas the Lions have three games to become a team - perhaps the All Blacks should be considering whether there is any honour in perpetuating a 'tradition' that is now so heavily weighted in their favour? ... of course any such consideration would only last a nanosecond before greed overcame it.

The Barbarians are a true tradition of rugby - charitable, playing uncapped players, playing to entertain the crowd, shunning points etc. or in other words about as far away from Toulon as it's possible to get. The Lions on the other hand are drawn from the biggest playing pool in the world, with supposedly the best players competing fiercely amongst themselves for a start in a marketing juggernaut. Fans and players didn't like Alastair Campbell being part of the last tour because it reminded everyone how far the Lions had fallen from their corinthian roots.
The Lions shirt is only a slightly different shade of red to Toulon's, but that doesn't mean that Halfpenny should think it's OK to swap one "money grabbing mercenary outfit like Toulon" for another like the Lions.

Well I think you're just being a bit of a Lions party pooper. Looking at the fans arriving they look quite clear about what is priority here. No one will be talking about Toulon in a few weeks, where this series will produce yet again some memories and stories that will be relayed long down the years.

Is the first game this Saturday? If so seems a bit crazy to start a few days after landing!

Must be a good thing that Saracens and Leinster didnt make the finals to give them a bit more of a rest, but this tour is going to be ridiculously intense on the players!

The tour begins...

https://www.606v2.com/t65809-lions-2017-the-tour-begins#3573910

Griff wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Rugby Fan wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

beshocked wrote:...I just wouldn't fill the team with 5 Welsh backs.

I wouldn't either....

Mikey, Beshocked's starting position was arguing against selecting 5 welsh backs in the Lions backline. That's the only point he was making, and you agree with him.

BS "Wales backs are overhyped gym monkeys that don't score tries." - is what I didn't agree with. Especially as two of them are the top try-scorers in the 6N.

That statement is fundamentally true. They are overhyped. They are Gym monkeys and scored the least tries in the 6N as opposed to Italy.

They are facts, and not really opinions..

Radge, I like you as a poster. But when you come up with personal opinions and call them 'facts' you just look like a WUM. "They are gym monkeys"? Come on, you can do better than that. What's your definition of that? For me it's bigger and stronger but with less skill. Too much muscle and weight from gym training making them too slow? So which ones are gym monkeys? Rhys Webb is not a big unit. He's smaller than Conor Murray and about the same as Ben Youngs. Biggar is a stone lighter than Owen Farell, half a stone lighter than Sexton. He's lighter than the god that is/was Dan Carter. Are they all gym monkeys too?! Liam Williams is quite slight in comparison to a lot of wingers these days. He's light a rake, with bandy legs to boot. Tommy Seymour is over a stone heavier. Halfpenny is small. Stuart Hogg is a stone heavier ffs. T'eo is bigger than JD2.

Only North is bigger than a 'normal' winger.  But then he's pretty much the same dap as Julian Savea, give or take a pound or two, and I don't hear anyone complaining about NZ being gym monkeys.

I can only assume you're referring to players like Jamie Roberts who were not picked? Otherwise I'm baffled  

Griff doesn't matter whether Welsh players are gym monkeys or not. I didnt say they are.

I am not sure many non Welsh want to see Halfpenny starting ahead of Hogg.

I just don't want to see a Welsh dominated backline, 2 or 3 Welsh players would be fine but not 5+.

Biggar is one of the least creative 10s in NH rugby IMO and I think his selection is a waste.

The Lions could do with a bit of variety by having Russell or Ford who have a bit more of a spark - as another 10 option.

I don't think having a backline including Biggar,Davies and Halfpenny would be able to get the best from the other players.

beshocked wrote:

Griff wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Rugby Fan wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

beshocked wrote:...I just wouldn't fill the team with 5 Welsh backs.

I wouldn't either....

Mikey, Beshocked's starting position was arguing against selecting 5 welsh backs in the Lions backline. That's the only point he was making, and you agree with him.

BS "Wales backs are overhyped gym monkeys that don't score tries." - is what I didn't agree with. Especially as two of them are the top try-scorers in the 6N.

That statement is fundamentally true. They are overhyped. They are Gym monkeys and scored the least tries in the 6N as opposed to Italy.

They are facts, and not really opinions..

Radge, I like you as a poster. But when you come up with personal opinions and call them 'facts' you just look like a WUM. "They are gym monkeys"? Come on, you can do better than that. What's your definition of that? For me it's bigger and stronger but with less skill. Too much muscle and weight from gym training making them too slow? So which ones are gym monkeys? Rhys Webb is not a big unit. He's smaller than Conor Murray and about the same as Ben Youngs. Biggar is a stone lighter than Owen Farell, half a stone lighter than Sexton. He's lighter than the god that is/was Dan Carter. Are they all gym monkeys too?! Liam Williams is quite slight in comparison to a lot of wingers these days. He's light a rake, with bandy legs to boot. Tommy Seymour is over a stone heavier. Halfpenny is small. Stuart Hogg is a stone heavier ffs. T'eo is bigger than JD2.

Only North is bigger than a 'normal' winger.  But then he's pretty much the same dap as Julian Savea, give or take a pound or two, and I don't hear anyone complaining about NZ being gym monkeys.

I can only assume you're referring to players like Jamie Roberts who were not picked? Otherwise I'm baffled  

Griff doesn't matter whether Welsh players are gym monkeys or not. I didnt say they are.

I am not sure many non Welsh want to see Halfpenny starting ahead of Hogg.

I just don't want to see a Welsh dominated backline, 2 or 3 Welsh players would be fine but not 5+.

Biggar is one of the least creative 10s in NH rugby IMO and I think his selection is a waste.

The Lions could do with a bit of variety by having Russell or Ford who have a bit more of a spark - as another 10 option.

I don't think having a backline including Biggar,Davies and Halfpenny would be able to get the best from the other players.

I was speaking to RuggerRadge who said it is a fact that they are gym monkeys. Not you.

I'm not sure many Welsh want to see Halfpenny starting either. Can you tell me who?

The rest of your post - not sure why you're responding to me directly with that as it doesn't seem to relate to my post. Like I said I'm just responding to Radge with some size comparisons. I, personally, do not want to see many Welsh players in the backs. Perhaps just Liam Williams. Maybe George North. Possibly Rhys Webb if Conor Murray is out of form.

Well at least we now know why so many Welshman were on tour.

'The Lions Pride Choir' are available for weddings, funerals and other special occasions.

Andy Farrell tried his best to sing in Welsh but the look on his face just said "I have no idea..."

Griff wrote:

The rest of your post - not sure why you're responding to me directly with that as it doesn't seem to relate to my post.  

He was doing it all afternoon yesterday and then lied about going off topic.

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:

The rest of your post - not sure why you're responding to me directly with that as it doesn't seem to relate to my post.  

He was doing it all afternoon yesterday and then lied about going off topic.

Being worried about 5 Welsh backs being picked isn't off topic, talking about the lack of tries from Welsh backs as a collective (not just 2).



Griff that's fair comment.

My team would be something like:

1.Mako
2.George
3.Furlong
4.Kruis
5.Itoje
6.Stander
7.Warburton
8.Faletau

9.Murray
10.Sexton
11.North
12.Henshaw
13.Joseph
14.Williams
15.Hogg

1 Scot, 5 Irish, 5 English, 4 Welsh

1 Scot, 5 Irish, 5 English, 4 Welsh


I just see 15 Lions.

I just see 5 Saracens players......

He really does have an axe to grind against england player of the year Farrell.

Sgt Pooly

Well I believe in combinations.

I think in the pack you either have to go heavily Irish or heavily English.

Equally you could see a full Irish frontrow but then again the best locks IMO are English.

Could have been a case for a 9-10 English combo if Youngs was still in the squad.


No 7 & 1/2

Why? Because I wouldn't start Farrell? He's a very good player but I think an Irish axis at 9-10-12 is more effective.

Farrell at 12 vs ABs is risky.

If Sexton is crocked then Farrell could slot in at 10. I'd definitely have Farrell in the 23. Just likely on the bench.

Farrell IMO is both 2nd choice 10 and 2nd choice 12.

Just tongue in cheek.

The Lions are there for the taking

Farrell starts for me.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Just tongue in cheek.

I do have an axe to grind but Farrell is still a good rugby player and wouldn't leave him out if I think he's the best option to win the game vs the ABs.

Farrell is one of those players who gets away with a lot though. Being a good rugby player doesn't make you a good person.

beshocked wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Just tongue in cheek.

I do have an axe to grind but Farrell is still a good rugby player and wouldn't leave him out if I think he's the best option to win the game vs the ABs.

Farrell is one of those players who gets away with a lot though. Being a good rugby player doesn't make you a good person.

Do you know the lad personally? If you do not then how can you make this comment?

I know you like to stick to the 'facts' so am interested in your response.

eirebilly wrote:

beshocked wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Just tongue in cheek.

I do have an axe to grind but Farrell is still a good rugby player and wouldn't leave him out if I think he's the best option to win the game vs the ABs.

Farrell is one of those players who gets away with a lot though. Being a good rugby player doesn't make you a good person.

Do you know the lad personally? If you do not then how can you make this comment?

I know you like to stick to the 'facts' so am interested in your response.

Farrell in interviews seems shy but likeable, during games though he's very spikey and I see a lot of similarities between him and Sexton in that regards

Farrell probably refused to sign his Sarries special edition PJ set he got for XMAS.

marty2086 wrote:

eirebilly wrote:

beshocked wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Just tongue in cheek.

I do have an axe to grind but Farrell is still a good rugby player and wouldn't leave him out if I think he's the best option to win the game vs the ABs.

Farrell is one of those players who gets away with a lot though. Being a good rugby player doesn't make you a good person.

Do you know the lad personally? If you do not then how can you make this comment?

I know you like to stick to the 'facts' so am interested in your response.

Farrell in interviews seems shy but likeable, during games though he's very spikey and I see a lot of similarities between him and Sexton in that regards

I agree on that part, both very dedicated and determined players. That does not make them bad people either.

eirebilly wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

eirebilly wrote:

beshocked wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Just tongue in cheek.

I do have an axe to grind but Farrell is still a good rugby player and wouldn't leave him out if I think he's the best option to win the game vs the ABs.

Farrell is one of those players who gets away with a lot though. Being a good rugby player doesn't make you a good person.

Do you know the lad personally? If you do not then how can you make this comment?

I know you like to stick to the 'facts' so am interested in your response.

Farrell in interviews seems shy but likeable, during games though he's very spikey and I see a lot of similarities between him and Sexton in that regards

I agree on that part, both very dedicated and determined players. That does not make them bad people either.

I think people often mistake on field behaviour and demeanour to overall personality, I've done it myself but I think we can all agree Chris Ashton is a d!ck everywhere

eirebilly wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

eirebilly wrote:

beshocked wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Just tongue in cheek.

I do have an axe to grind but Farrell is still a good rugby player and wouldn't leave him out if I think he's the best option to win the game vs the ABs.

Farrell is one of those players who gets away with a lot though. Being a good rugby player doesn't make you a good person.

Do you know the lad personally? If you do not then how can you make this comment?

I know you like to stick to the 'facts' so am interested in your response.

Farrell in interviews seems shy but likeable, during games though he's very spikey and I see a lot of similarities between him and Sexton in that regards

I agree on that part, both very dedicated and determined players. That does not make them bad people either.

eirebilly depends what you mean personally, I've met him on a few occasions over the years at Saracens to make that judgement and from what I know about him - other people's interactions too. I believe he is disdainful of the fans as some of the players like Billy and Ashton are.

Billy's attitude after the Munster game was embarrassing - "everyone hates us and we don't care".  I cringed when Billy said that.

Tighthead funny guy.... I've not asked for many signatures over the years. Something as trivial as not getting a signature wouldn't bother me.