Pro14: Edinburgh Rugby vs Dragons Fri 8/09

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Last time out:
Edinburgh 24 - 20 Dragons

Head to Head
Dragons -  Edinburgh
31 Played 31
15 Wins 15
15 Losses 15
1 Draws 1
62 Tries 67


This Season
Edinburgh - Dragons
Who knows, certainly not the Pro14 Website apparently.

Teams
Edinburgh
15. Blair Kinghorn (43)



14. Damien Hoyland (48)

13. Chris Dean (43)

12. Robbie Fruean *

11. Jason Harries (1)



10. Duncan Weir (21)

9. Sam Hidalgo-Clyne (83)



1. Michele Rizzo (1)

2. Stuart McInally (101)

3. WP Nel (104)

4. Ben Toolis (70)

5. Grant Gilchrist (99)

6. Jamie Ritchie (31)

7. Hamish Watson (72)

8. Magnus Bradbury CAPTAIN (31)


Replacements

16. Ross Ford (176)

17. Darryl Marfo (1)

18. Simon Berghan (32)

19. Fraser McKenzie (80)

20. Cornell du Preez (80)

21. Nathan Fowles (34)

22. Jason Tovey (24)

23. Junior Rasolea (14)

Can see Edinburgh getting a yellow soon too

BigGee wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:Now the Edinburgh of old would end up losing 21-20 from here - have we turned a corner?

You really do like to tempt fate don't you!

Looking pretty accurate!

Next Edinburgh penalty, someone is going to walk

RDW_Scotland wrote:

BigGee wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:Now the Edinburgh of old would end up losing 21-20 from here - have we turned a corner?

You really do like to tempt fate don't you!

Looking pretty accurate!

I would learn to contain your optimism!

That's a lot better. Brilliant take by Hoyland

We want 4!

(Winning the game would be good enough just now!)

https://twitter.com/dragonsoffic_sc/status/906246319219625984

Leaves a very bad taste that.

If that's out, the touchjudge should get sacked as he didn't call it.

RiscaGame wrote:https://twitter.com/dragonsoffic_sc/status/906246319219625984

Leaves a very bad taste that.

If that's out, the touchjudge should get sacked as he didn't call it.

If it happened to a Scottish team they'd be moaning for weeks. I agree that TMO should be sacked though.

Fruean out on his feet - bring Tovey on!

Good try by Fruean.

I make that 4000 turnovers conceded tonight. Fook sake. Desperately need to work on that area. Amongst others.

I can see the flood gates opening now. 40 points?

RDW_Scotland wrote:Fruean out on his feet - bring Tovey on!

I stand corrected!

We have a BP!!

Griff wrote:I make that 4000 turnovers conceded tonight. Fook sake. Desperately need to work on that area. Amongst others.

I can see the flood gates opening now. 40 points?

Hmm, who's at 7 again? Can't say I've seen him much.

What a maul and what a line.

mikey_dragon wrote:

RiscaGame wrote:https://twitter.com/dragonsoffic_sc/status/906246319219625984

Leaves a very bad taste that.

If that's out, the touchjudge should get sacked as he didn't call it.

If it happened to a Scottish team they'd be moaning for weeks. I agree that TMO should be sacked though.

Sorry that photo tells you nothing, you would need the rugby equivalent of Hawkeye to give the real verdict. The laws state, if in doubt, no try.

As I said before, it was unlucky though, deserved a try.

Fortunately Edinburgh not leaving it in doubt now

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:I make that 4000 turnovers conceded tonight. Fook sake. Desperately need to work on that area. Amongst others.

I can see the flood gates opening now. 40 points?

Hmm, who's at 7 again? Can't say I've seen him much.

2003 called, they want their openside flanker job description back.

Fantastic to get a BP win but a hell of a lot to work on - we started poorly and the first 25 minutes in the second half were really poor.

If we can get Fruean fully fit he'll be some player for us!

BigGee wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

RiscaGame wrote:https://twitter.com/dragonsoffic_sc/status/906246319219625984

Leaves a very bad taste that.

If that's out, the touchjudge should get sacked as he didn't call it.

If it happened to a Scottish team they'd be moaning for weeks. I agree that TMO should be sacked though.

Sorry that photo tells you nothing, you would need the rugby equivalent of Hawkeye to give the real verdict. The laws state, if in doubt, no try.

As I said before, it was unlucky though, deserved a try.

Fortunately Edinburgh not leaving it in doubt now

You can even see it's a try. It came at a crucial moment as we had all the momentum at that point. Momentum killed by someone who can only be described as a cheat.

Law needs changed. Unless you can see the foot in touch then the try should stand.

Stone Motif wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:I make that 4000 turnovers conceded tonight. Fook sake. Desperately need to work on that area. Amongst others.

I can see the flood gates opening now. 40 points?

Hmm, who's at 7 again? Can't say I've seen him much.

2003 called, they want their openside flanker job description back.

Not very witty. Not sure what your definition of an open-side flanker is either but Benjamin was anonymous. Is that your definition, being anonymous?

Well Edinburgh get the bonus point win. Not sure they entirely deserved it but the result stands and the points are in the bank.

Compared to recent years, the performance is light years ahead though, even if the confidence is still a little bit flaky. Hopefully that will come as they get more used to winning games.

Dragons certainly will be disappointed. A bit of a curates egg from them, some really good stuff but they gave away the ball very cheaply sometimes. Again, so much comes down to confidence, but you would hope that there would be something there to build on.

Ritchie played well, but Kinghorn MoM for me.

mikey_dragon wrote:

Stone Motif wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:I make that 4000 turnovers conceded tonight. Fook sake. Desperately need to work on that area. Amongst others.

I can see the flood gates opening now. 40 points?

Hmm, who's at 7 again? Can't say I've seen him much.

2003 called, they want their openside flanker job description back.

Not very witty. Not sure what your definition of an open-side flanker is either but Benjamin was anonymous. Is that your definition, being anonymous?

The whole team were bummed because they're not very good. You thought Steve Jones was anonymous.

Once again very honest interview from Cockers - wasn't happy despite a BP win!

Cockers pretty scathing. He's used the word disappointed about 6 times.

tigertattie wrote:Law needs changed. Unless you can see the foot in touch then the try should stand.

Then all marginal calls have to go that way. Every time the ball crosses the line it has to be a try.

It is the downside of TMO, sometimes it goes against you when you can't be absolutely sure about a call. On balance though, it is a better system than that which proceeded it.

BigGee wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

RiscaGame wrote:https://twitter.com/dragonsoffic_sc/status/906246319219625984

Leaves a very bad taste that.

If that's out, the touchjudge should get sacked as he didn't call it.

If it happened to a Scottish team they'd be moaning for weeks. I agree that TMO should be sacked though.

Sorry that photo tells you nothing, you would need the rugby equivalent of Hawkeye to give the real verdict. The laws state, if in doubt, no try.

As I said before, it was unlucky though, deserved a try.

Fortunately Edinburgh not leaving it in doubt now

There should be no doubt though.

That said, it's a poor law of if in doubt no try. I preferred it when there'd be a try for benefit of the doubt. Thought the game was being geared more towards rewarding attacking play.

There is no way a Scottish TMO would have doubt if that was an Edinburgh winger's boot.

Stone Motif wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Stone Motif wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:I make that 4000 turnovers conceded tonight. Fook sake. Desperately need to work on that area. Amongst others.

I can see the flood gates opening now. 40 points?

Hmm, who's at 7 again? Can't say I've seen him much.

2003 called, they want their openside flanker job description back.

Not very witty. Not sure what your definition of an open-side flanker is either but Benjamin was anonymous. Is that your definition, being anonymous?

The whole team were bummed because they're not very good. You thought Steve Jones was anonymous.

Yeah we weren't good enough, but Benjamin was anonymous and part of the reason we got a tuning at the breakdown. We need signings badly (as do Cardiff) otherwise this won't change.

RDW_Scotland wrote:Once again very honest interview from Cockers - wasn't happy despite a BP win!

Probably fair enough. We all had our hearts in our mouths. Edinburgh clearly are improving, but they are not there yet!

mikey_dragon wrote:

Stone Motif wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Stone Motif wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Griff wrote:I make that 4000 turnovers conceded tonight. Fook sake. Desperately need to work on that area. Amongst others.

I can see the flood gates opening now. 40 points?

Hmm, who's at 7 again? Can't say I've seen him much.

2003 called, they want their openside flanker job description back.

Not very witty. Not sure what your definition of an open-side flanker is either but Benjamin was anonymous. Is that your definition, being anonymous?

The whole team were bummed because they're not very good. You thought Steve Jones was anonymous.

Yeah we weren't good enough, but Benjamin was anonymous and part of the reason we got a tuning at the breakdown. We need signings badly (as do Cardiff) otherwise this won't change.

Hence my comment - the idea that the breakdown relies on a jackaling seven to win the contest is about as out dated as cotton traders collared shirts. The tight five need an overhaul that isn't coming anytime soon, and n is the real reason the breakdown was lost. There is no power or aggression there.

RiscaGame wrote:

BigGee wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

RiscaGame wrote:https://twitter.com/dragonsoffic_sc/status/906246319219625984

Leaves a very bad taste that.

If that's out, the touchjudge should get sacked as he didn't call it.

If it happened to a Scottish team they'd be moaning for weeks. I agree that TMO should be sacked though.

Sorry that photo tells you nothing, you would need the rugby equivalent of Hawkeye to give the real verdict. The laws state, if in doubt, no try.

As I said before, it was unlucky though, deserved a try.

Fortunately Edinburgh not leaving it in doubt now

There should be no doubt though.

That said, it's a poor law of if in doubt no try. I preferred it when there'd be a try for benefit of the doubt. Thought the game was being geared more towards rewarding attacking play.

There is no way a Scottish TMO would have doubt if that was an Edinburgh winger's boot.

I really don't see how anyone could have made that call, so I think we should leave nationality out of it. There are calls in rugby, usually involving the touchline, where it is not possible with the technology available to make a truly objective call. They are not frequent enough to make it worthwhile in investing in the appropriate kit to be 100% sure, so they are something we just have to live with. Every team thinks they come away with bad calls sometimes, over a season they tend to even themselves out.

tigertattie wrote:Law needs changed. Unless you can see the foot in touch then the try should stand.

I agree - the attacking team should have the benefit of the doubt.

BigGee wrote:

RiscaGame wrote:

BigGee wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

RiscaGame wrote:https://twitter.com/dragonsoffic_sc/status/906246319219625984

Leaves a very bad taste that.

If that's out, the touchjudge should get sacked as he didn't call it.

If it happened to a Scottish team they'd be moaning for weeks. I agree that TMO should be sacked though.

Sorry that photo tells you nothing, you would need the rugby equivalent of Hawkeye to give the real verdict. The laws state, if in doubt, no try.

As I said before, it was unlucky though, deserved a try.

Fortunately Edinburgh not leaving it in doubt now

There should be no doubt though.

That said, it's a poor law of if in doubt no try. I preferred it when there'd be a try for benefit of the doubt. Thought the game was being geared more towards rewarding attacking play.

There is no way a Scottish TMO would have doubt if that was an Edinburgh winger's boot.

I really don't see how anyone could have made that call, so I think we should leave nationality out of it. There are calls in rugby, usually involving the touchline, where it is not possible with the technology available to make a truly objective call. They are not frequent enough to make it worthwhile in investing in the appropriate kit to be 100% sure, so they are something we just have to live with. Every team thinks they come away with bad calls sometimes, over a season they tend to even themselves out.

It's just in this league, the mush making the call is often directly employed by body that stands to benefit from the success of one of he teams on the pitch but not the other.

BigGee wrote:

RiscaGame wrote:

BigGee wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

RiscaGame wrote:https://twitter.com/dragonsoffic_sc/status/906246319219625984

Leaves a very bad taste that.

If that's out, the touchjudge should get sacked as he didn't call it.

If it happened to a Scottish team they'd be moaning for weeks. I agree that TMO should be sacked though.

Sorry that photo tells you nothing, you would need the rugby equivalent of Hawkeye to give the real verdict. The laws state, if in doubt, no try.

As I said before, it was unlucky though, deserved a try.

Fortunately Edinburgh not leaving it in doubt now

There should be no doubt though.

That said, it's a poor law of if in doubt no try. I preferred it when there'd be a try for benefit of the doubt. Thought the game was being geared more towards rewarding attacking play.

There is no way a Scottish TMO would have doubt if that was an Edinburgh winger's boot.

I really don't see how anyone could have made that call, so I think we should leave nationality out of it. There are calls in rugby, usually involving the touchline, where it is not possible with the technology available to make a truly objective call. They are not frequent enough to make it worthwhile in investing in the appropriate kit to be 100% sure, so they are something we just have to live with. Every team thinks they come away with bad calls sometimes, over a season they tend to even themselves out.

I fail to see how that can balance itself out, but willing to be proven wrong.

Sadly, until we have full neutrality, I can't see how a person's nationality isn't relevant.

What happened to the good old days of white markings on the boot, or stud/blade marks on the touch line? I suspect neither was present.

Very pleased to hear Cockers pick up on some pretty sloppy play throughout the game. Playing well in fits and starts (very well in places) won't be enough to beat Scarlets, Leinster, Ulster and Munster away from home, which is where we need to be. He is saying all the right things (unlike Dell in commentary...).

I thought MOTM was a close call today. Kinghorn did some particularly eye catching things but for me it was a close call between Ritchie and Toolis, with an honourable mention to Nel. Toolis was the only Edinburgh player to really come out of the traps, and made some tremendous tackles in the first 30 minutes.

I thought Watson was a little quiet today. On the showing of the first two games I'd say Hardie has the edge. Ritchie is shaping up to be a fine player, and possibly a long term option to replace John Barclay at 6 for Scotland.

All in all we've started well this season. I'd better not jinx the team by turning up to a game!

I should also add that there's plenty of promise in the Rasolea/Freaun partnership.

I'm still on BBC Alba. Some cracking fiddle playing on Horo Gheallaidh!

Griff wrote:I'm still on BBC Alba. Some cracking fiddle playing on Horo Gheallaidh!

Topless?

My Edinburgh ratings:

Rizzo - 6

Signed as short term injury cover and that's what we got! Solid and unspectacular.

McInally - 5

A big step down from last week - line-out was s shambles which didn't help our poor start. Needs to lose his place if Cockers is serious about setting standards.

Nel - 7

Again started to get the better of his opposite man and plenty work in the loose.

Toolis - 8

Another all action display and one of the few who performed across the full 80.

Gilchrist - 7

It's not fashionable to say he played well but I thought he had another solid game. Grew less effective as the game went on and rightly subbed.

Ritchie - 8

Edinburgh's answer to Rob Harley with another tireless display. Starting to make the 6 shirt his own.


Watson - 6

A quiet outing perhaps to be expected for his first game of the season.

Bradbury - 6

Again didn't impose himself in the game - he needs to up his game as we know he can offer a lot more.

SHC - 7

Passing a little wayward at time but another assured performance - his box kicks are superb.

Weir - 4

Not a good shift. A needless (if soft) yellow, kick out on the full, panicked grubber kick etc. His defence was good though - that's been the best aspect of his game!

Harries - 7

A willing carrier and showed good strength - must wonder what he has to do to get a try just now!

Fruean - 6

Didn't look fully fit and probably wasn't meant to play 80. His try showed exactly what he can do though which we'll hopefully see a lot more of!

Dean - 7

A strong display sadly cut short by injury - let's hope it's not serious. More fantastic running lines with another Kinghorn assist. Yet again solid in defence.

Hoyland - 6

Didn't see much ball but a few key interventions that helped turn the game.

Kinghorn - 9

Another outstanding attacking display and solid defence - my MOTM. Let's hope he keeps it up!

Guess Cockers doesn't rate Tovey mind, if Weir can play like that and last 70.

Have to say for Dragons, Jackman needs to look at his bench and have 12 cover on it, as I think we need Super Gav at ten judging by tonight and last week. He clearly doesn't think much of Adam Warren or even Carl Meyer.

"Great result, great five points but disappointed with how we played.

"We played poorly at times but did enough to win the game. Credit to the players on that but we are a better side than the way we played tonight and I'm disappointed.

"We had opportunities but our lineout was a bit scrappy, we dropped the ball and we were inaccurate. So disappointed, but delighted with the way the boys got themselves back into the lead."

Cockers says it as it is!

Radge - interested to hear what you thought about your first myreside experience?

I was speaking to a couple of players after the game. Apparently Cockerill tore into into them after the match. He was not happy with their performance.

What did you make of Myreside spoons?

It's pretty good. The improvements have made a difference. It's not a massive change to be fair, but having toilets with lights for example is a huge improvement. The Huxley tent/supporters bar is fine, even if it does look like a combination of a wedding reception & a garden party.

The changes are pretty minor really, but it's all positive.

RDW_Scotland wrote:"Great result, great five points but disappointed with how we played.

"We played poorly at times but did enough to win the game. Credit to the players on that but we are a better side than the way we played tonight and I'm disappointed.

"We had opportunities but our lineout was a bit scrappy, we dropped the ball and we were inaccurate. So disappointed, but delighted with the way the boys got themselves back into the lead."

Cockers says it as it is!

Radge - interested to hear what you thought about your first myreside experience?

Really enjoyed Myreside. It was a half hour walk from haymarket, and we had pretty and post match pints in Morningside. I felt like a proper high roller! It was quite an unsettled atmosphere in the first half, but the crowd were right behind Edinburgh and it helped them in the 2nd half.

I thought that despite the win Edinburgh's overall performance was a bit unconvincing. It was refreshing to hear Cockers criticise the performance. As FES pointed out, we can't be so inconsistent if we really want to challenge for silverware.

The dragons attempted try also happened right in front of me, and the dragons players heal had white wash on it. He was definitely out of play.

Jamie Ritchie had a tremendous game, as did Watson, they both got through a huge amount of work. Bradbury also impressed me, he covered a lot of ground whilst Weir was on the naught step.

Kinghorn has been a revelation this season though. He looked dangerous whenever he got the ball.

EWT Spoons wrote:It's pretty good. The improvements have made a difference. It's not a massive change to be fair, but having toilets with lights for example is a huge improvement. The Huxley tent/supporters bar is fine, even if it does look like a combination of a wedding reception & a garden party.

The changes are pretty minor really, but it's all positive.

Yeah I did think that from the pictures! Did many people actually use the bar?

RiscaGame wrote:Guess Cockers doesn't rate Tovey mind, if Weir can play like that and last 70.

Have to say for Dragons, Jackman needs to look at his bench and have 12 cover on it, as I think we need Super Gav at ten judging by tonight and last week. He clearly doesn't think much of Adam Warren or even Carl Meyer.

Gameplan again though innit, if we're going for run it around with the gayest of abandon as Plan A, you need footballers at 10 and 12, and particularly if your pack is in for a pasting every single match.

RiscaGame wrote:Guess Cockers doesn't rate Tovey mind, if Weir can play like that and last 70.

Have to say for Dragons, Jackman needs to look at his bench and have 12 cover on it, as I think we need Super Gav at ten judging by tonight and last week. He clearly doesn't think much of Adam Warren or even Carl Meyer.

Strange as on recent form Beard and Warren is our best midfield. Morgan isn't cutting it. AOB... I think I say enough on him but he proved me correct again. I also thought Owain Leonard's passing was a lot better than Charlie Davies'.

Good win Embra, TMO decision aside but thats still an ongoing league issue.

I must say though BBC Alba is most biased commentary on the planet ! They don't even pretend to be neutral, every thing was 'we' must do this and 'we can still win'. Very poor from a tax payers funded channel.

RDW_Scotland wrote:

EWT Spoons wrote:It's pretty good. The improvements have made a difference. It's not a massive change to be fair, but having toilets with lights for example is a huge improvement. The Huxley tent/supporters bar is fine, even if it does look like a combination of a wedding reception & a garden party.

The changes are pretty minor really, but it's all positive.

Yeah I did think that from the pictures! Did many people actually use the bar?

Yeah it was quite busy pre & post match. I mean it's a fairly small size so there might not have been that many, but certainly seemed to be near full.

munkian wrote:Good win Embra, TMO decision aside but thats still an ongoing league issue.

I must say though BBC Alba is most biased commentary on the planet ! They don't even pretend to be neutral, every thing was 'we' must do this and 'we can still win'. Very poor from a tax payers funded channel.

Can you really claim that BBC Wales and BBC Northern Ireland are any different?

Or Jiffy's commentary whenever he's covering a Wales game??