Irish provinces NEWS and GOSSIP thread part 2

[profitius]

First topic message reminder :

Continued from this one. https://www.606v2.com/t63658-irish-provinces-news-gossip-thread-2016-17
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[LeinsterFan4life]

Agree. I also feel that CJ Stander has a fight on his hands for the number 8 jersey for Ireland right now as well. Just as I thought he would usurp Heaslip for Ireland, he is now under some pressure.

Is Jack Conan not his biggest worry? The guy has been incredible for the last 18 months at least.

He is exactly who I am referring to. I feel he has usurped Heaslip at Leinster and, if form dictates selection, should be Irelands number 8 ahead of CJ Stander right now.

I can see Cullen going back to Heaslip at 8 and putting Conan at 6. Good to have this depth in the backrow

[eirebilly]

Agree. I also feel that CJ Stander has a fight on his hands for the number 8 jersey for Ireland right now as well. Just as I thought he would usurp Heaslip for Ireland, he is now under some pressure.

Is Jack Conan not his biggest worry? The guy has been incredible for the last 18 months at least.

He is exactly who I am referring to. I feel he has usurped Heaslip at Leinster and, if form dictates selection, should be Irelands number 8 ahead of CJ Stander right now.

I can see Cullen going back to Heaslip at 8 and putting Conan at 6. Good to have this depth in the backrow

That would be a mistake in my opinion, I think that he is a far better 8 than 6. Heaslip is not the youngest anymore and not really the future so I would prefer to see Conan stay at 8.

Agree its great to have such depth in the back row, happy days ahead

[LeinsterFan4life]

Agree. I also feel that CJ Stander has a fight on his hands for the number 8 jersey for Ireland right now as well. Just as I thought he would usurp Heaslip for Ireland, he is now under some pressure.

Is Jack Conan not his biggest worry? The guy has been incredible for the last 18 months at least.

He is exactly who I am referring to. I feel he has usurped Heaslip at Leinster and, if form dictates selection, should be Irelands number 8 ahead of CJ Stander right now.

I can see Cullen going back to Heaslip at 8 and putting Conan at 6. Good to have this depth in the backrow

That would be a mistake in my opinion, I think that he is a far better 8 than 6. Heaslip is not the youngest anymore and not really the future so I would prefer to see Conan stay at 8.

Agree its great to have such depth in the back row, happy days ahead

I would agree but this Leinster team is quite youthful at this moment in time and I guess he'll feel he will need the experience out there.

[Marshes]

I think Heaslip will have competition from Max Deegan as well

[Marshes]

Also this Henshaw recovery was fantastic: https://streamable.com/olqfz

[asoreleftshoulder]

Yeah that was something else,just pure dogged determination,you have to respect anyone who works that hard.

[eirebilly]

Henshaw was superb yesterday. Also after listening to him during the game against Munster last week, I feel Ireland could do a hell of a lot worse than make him Captain if Best or Sexton are not playing. Natural leader.

Cant help than dream of Scannell at 12 and Henshaw at 13 for Ireland though, has the feeling of a great balance in attack and defence.

[rapidsnowman]

And Adam Bryne will be having nightmares of Nadolo!

I have only watched the first half, but Byrne made a lot more ground past Nadolo than vice versa.

I think Byrne got bumped on his butt every time he went for the tackle, but in fairness he was technique was spot on. He at least slowed Nadolo for the cover to arrive.

On a separate note: Devin Toner is a great servant to Irish rugby, but every time I see him I think 'Hush Puppy shoe salesman!'
He looks so mild.

[the-goon]

Nadolo is a freak, not really fair to judge against him. But he does have defensive weaknesses. Going forward he is such a threat, but Cullen is keeping faith with him. With more experience he will learn. It tends to be the way with all young wingers, as it is such a hard position to defend. You have the most space to mark, and you are often left 1 v 1 against normally the oppositions best strike runner.

[Marshes]

Ah yeah I wouldn't be judging him too harshly, just more than being barreled through six or seven times probably isn't the nicest thing in the world! Hopefully he can improve the defensive side because he is very dangerous in attack

[rapidsnowman]

In a straight on tackle Nadolo would bump most people and at least Byrne didn't stand and try to hug him.

From the side he can be felled like in your link above of Henshaw.

[Pete330v2]

Connacht sign centre Pitu Akhi.

That won't be confusing at all for Jim Neilly.

[marty2086]

Connacht sign centre Pitu Akhi.

That won't be confusing at all for Jim Neilly.

Imagine what it'll be like for Stuart Barnes, he struggles not to mix up those on the field with people who aren't

[Sin é]

Zebo is leaving Munster. Don't know where he is going, probably either Racing or Pau.

https://munsterrugby.ie/2017/10/23/zebo-leave-munster/

[rodders]

Man knows a sinking ship when he sees one.

[Sin é]

Man knows a sinking ship when he sees one.

He is only 27. Playing wise, Munster is probably fine but from a marketing point of view, he will be a huge loss. The kids in particular love him.

[marty2086]

Zebo is leaving Munster. Don't know where he is going, probably either Racing or Pau.

https://munsterrugby.ie/2017/10/23/zebo-leave-munster/

Surely no coincidence it comes after playing Racing?

[LordDowlais]

Zebo is leaving Munster. Don't know where he is going, probably either Racing or Pau.

https://munsterrugby.ie/2017/10/23/zebo-leave-munster/

Hasn't he been offered a central contract by the IRFU ?

That's now him, Rhys Webb and Dan Biggar leaving the Pro14.

We need to be keeping hold of our star players for the sake of the league.

[Sin é]

Zebo is leaving Munster. Don't know where he is going, probably either Racing or Pau.

https://munsterrugby.ie/2017/10/23/zebo-leave-munster/

Surely no coincidence it comes after playing Racing?

He posted a photo of himself with some ex-Munster players in Racing at the end of the summer, so I suspect it might be there. His partner is a Spanish model so she might get more work in Paris than Pau or Cork!

[marty2086]

The fashion industry in Cork is thriving I'm sure

I do seem to remember a picture with Lualua I think at some point.

I mention the Racing game because it would have been a good opportunity for all parties to be in one place and sign or negotiate something.

I know Ulster used the Clermont game last season to bring Jono Gibbes in.

The question becomes will Joe still pick him?

With Trimble, Bowe, Kearney and Payne on the way out is he a player that Ireland can do without going in a RWC?

[Sin é]

I wouldn't be surprised if he was back in 2 years time (and he will only be 29, 30 then). ROG wrote in his column 2 weeks ago that Zebo would be a popular acquisition in France.

What would really worry me now is Conor Murray whose contract is also up. I'd imagine Schmidt would make an exception for him if he was to move to France, but it would be awful for Munster. I hope the IRFU get the cheque book out.

Conway is playing great stuff at the moment, so along with Tiernan O'H, Zebo shouldn't be missed too much and don't forget Rob is back fit again.

[whocares]

Zebo is leaving Munster. Don't know where he is going, probably either Racing or Pau.

https://munsterrugby.ie/2017/10/23/zebo-leave-munster/

Someone on twitter was mentionning that he was retiring but if he joins racing it is about the same.
Good luck to him.

[Pot Hale]

Zebo is leaving Munster. Don't know where he is going, probably either Racing or Pau.

https://munsterrugby.ie/2017/10/23/zebo-leave-munster/

Hasn't he been offered a central contract by the IRFU ?

.

In the link that you read:

“The 27-year-old winger and fullback has attracted the interest of several European clubs who have offered terms that Munster and the IRFU are unable to match despite both the province and the Union making every effort to retain the player with substantial improvements made to his existing deal.”

He’s not a Category A contract player. Munster pay his salary from club budget. I would reckon he’s been offered €500k plus.

[Sin é]

According to Gerry Thornley in Irish Times:

It is understood that the substantially increased offer from Munster was in the region of €350,000 and along with match fees and bonuses with Ireland, this could have risen to about €400,000.

The Irish Times has learned that the offer from Racing is in the region of €650,000 to €700,000, and quite probably with accommodation and a car.

PS - what the heck is a Category A contract player? Would Jamie Heaslip be one?

[marty2086]

Im guessing they are the foundation of the team, Best, Murray and Sexton along with maybe Heaslip

[BigGee]

Munster not even in the ball park.

It is a bit of a worry for all the Pro 14 clubs. There are players around who would presumably be worth even more than that. It is the kind of money that it is very hard to turn down.

[Sin é]

Im guessing they are the foundation of the team, Best, Murray and Sexton along with maybe Heaslip

There is no logic to the central contracts. For instance, Heaslip was earning more than Paul O'Connell.

According to Donal Lenihan, Zebo was offered a central contract.

[marty2086]

Im guessing they are the foundation of the team, Best, Murray and Sexton along with maybe Heaslip

There is no logic to the central contracts. For instance, Heaslip was earning more than Paul O'Connell.

According to Donal Lenihan, Zebo was offered a central contract.

Don't think the values mean much in the grand scheme, that's for the individuals and their own idea of their own value

If POC was happy with what he was getting then is there really an issue?

Its more the arbitrary nature of how they are handed out, in hindsight is not giving Madigan one going to bite us in the a$$ especially given that the only 10 at the time was and is prone to being banged up a bit?

[Geen sport voor watjes]

Im guessing they are the foundation of the team, Best, Murray and Sexton along with maybe Heaslip

There is no logic to the central contracts. For instance, Heaslip was earning more than Paul O'Connell.

According to Donal Lenihan, Zebo was offered a central contract.

Not a central contract. Munster one with some extras if/when he played for Ireland. Considering we have Tommy I am Crocked Bowe, Rob I can catch anything but do f all else Kearney and Jared fush and chups i’m from wanganui Payne on central contracts says it all really.

[Sin é]

Im guessing they are the foundation of the team, Best, Murray and Sexton along with maybe Heaslip

There is no logic to the central contracts. For instance, Heaslip was earning more than Paul O'Connell.

According to Donal Lenihan, Zebo was offered a central contract.

Don't think the values mean much in the grand scheme, that's for the individuals and their own idea of their own value

If POC was happy with what he was getting then is there really an issue?

Its more the arbitrary nature of how they are handed out, in hindsight is not giving Madigan one going to bite us in the a$$ especially given that the only 10 at the time was and is prone to being banged up a bit?

So, there is no such thing as 'A' Central Contracts - just CC's given to people who had screw as much as possible out of the IRFU. You seriously think POC was happy earning less than Heaslip?

[Sin é]

Im guessing they are the foundation of the team, Best, Murray and Sexton along with maybe Heaslip

There is no logic to the central contracts. For instance, Heaslip was earning more than Paul O'Connell.

According to Donal Lenihan, Zebo was offered a central contract.

Not a central contract. Munster one with some extras if/when he played for Ireland. Considering we have Tommy I am Crocked Bowe, Rob I can catch anything but do f all else Kearney and Jared fush and chups i’m from wanganui Payne on central contracts says it all really.

Yea, I saw there on Munsterfans that he was offered a Munster contract which would be topped up if he got to play for Ireland (either by not being picked or injured).

[Pot Hale]

A Category A contract is what we call a central contract.  (Categories run from A to F I think). Since all players are ultimately contracted to IRFU, they fall into different categories.   Category A refer to those deemed by IRFU to be first team picks and want to manage their playing time and meet other associated protocols.  The IRFU pays the salary directly and it does not come from the province’s playing budget.

Currently, there are 15 of them. Offered to players who would be deemed to be in first team selection on a regular basis.   Kearney, Bowe, Best and Payne are all due to finish in June 2018.  Everyone else is post RWC 2019, bar Toner who is specified as June 2020.  

There is no way that IRFU would seek to pay directly above €500k for a player under the current regime/policy.   Provinces now have the option of topping up the player’s salary if they can budget for it.

[toml]

I was listening to the rugby pod last week and they were saying Zebo's pace was poor for a winger "Zero wheels Zebo"
I have noticed sometimes he doesn't back himself from 30m plus. Maybe didn't think he was going to keep his Ireland place further down the line so better to grab the big dollars.

[marty2086]

Im guessing they are the foundation of the team, Best, Murray and Sexton along with maybe Heaslip

There is no logic to the central contracts. For instance, Heaslip was earning more than Paul O'Connell.

According to Donal Lenihan, Zebo was offered a central contract.

Don't think the values mean much in the grand scheme, that's for the individuals and their own idea of their own value

If POC was happy with what he was getting then is there really an issue?

Its more the arbitrary nature of how they are handed out, in hindsight is not giving Madigan one going to bite us in the a$$ especially given that the only 10 at the time was and is prone to being banged up a bit?

So, there is no such thing as 'A' Central Contracts - just CC's given to people who had screw as much as possible out of the IRFU. You seriously think POC was happy earning less than Heaslip?

Well POC signed the contract so unless he did it at gunpoint Im pretty sure at one point he was happy with the value

Maybe his ego didn't work that way and he was happy to see guys doing well and was happy to pull on the green shirt, only the man himself knows

Obviously he saw an opportunity to earn more post RWC 2015 but I doubt jealousy played a part in that

[rodders]

I was listening to the rugby pod last week and they were saying Zebo's pace was poor for a winger "Zero wheels Zebo"
I have noticed sometimes he doesn't back himself from 30m plus. Maybe didn't think he was going to keep his Ireland place further down the line so better to grab the big dollars.

His pace is poor, he's bloody useless. If he was from Ulster he'd be playing for Edinburgh reserves, so he's lucky his old mucker ROG has got him a spot on the Racing gravy train.

[Sin é]

I was listening to the rugby pod last week and they were saying Zebo's pace was poor for a winger "Zero wheels Zebo"
I have noticed sometimes he doesn't back himself from 30m plus. Maybe didn't think he was going to keep his Ireland place further down the line so better to grab the big dollars.

Em, not sure about Zebo having poor pace - think he was something like 100 metres in 11 seconds. I don't ever recall seeing him caught for pace. Schmidt's philosophy changed Zebo as a player - safety first - don't take chances. I wouldn't be surprised if that is one of the reasons why Zebo is leaving Ireland actually. He isn't a Schmidt type of player although he made himself one. Zebo is given a much freer roll in Munster and he scores a lot more tries. He is Munster's all time top try scorer at 27 which isn't bad when Munster have had the likes of Doug Howlett and Christian Cullen among their ranks. I think he will be missed big time in camp Ireland both on and off the field - off the field because of his fun, relaxed personality and on the field for his confidence and his left boot.

He could be back in 2/3 years time when Schmidt leaves. He will still be only 29/30.

[Sin é]

Im guessing they are the foundation of the team, Best, Murray and Sexton along with maybe Heaslip

There is no logic to the central contracts. For instance, Heaslip was earning more than Paul O'Connell.

According to Donal Lenihan, Zebo was offered a central contract.

Don't think the values mean much in the grand scheme, that's for the individuals and their own idea of their own value

If POC was happy with what he was getting then is there really an issue?

Its more the arbitrary nature of how they are handed out, in hindsight is not giving Madigan one going to bite us in the a$$ especially given that the only 10 at the time was and is prone to being banged up a bit?

So, there is no such thing as 'A' Central Contracts - just CC's given to people who had screw as much as possible out of the IRFU. You seriously think POC was happy earning less than Heaslip?

Well POC signed the contract so unless he did it at gunpoint Im pretty sure at one point he was happy with the value

Maybe his ego didn't work that way and he was happy to see guys doing well and was happy to pull on the green shirt, only the man himself knows

Obviously he saw an opportunity to earn more post RWC 2015 but I doubt jealousy played a part in that

No, it says that Jamie Heaslip was more highly rated than Paul O'Connell by the IRFU. Cian Healy is on a central contract and he isn't even first choice at Leinster.

[marty2086]

Im guessing they are the foundation of the team, Best, Murray and Sexton along with maybe Heaslip

There is no logic to the central contracts. For instance, Heaslip was earning more than Paul O'Connell.

According to Donal Lenihan, Zebo was offered a central contract.

Don't think the values mean much in the grand scheme, that's for the individuals and their own idea of their own value

If POC was happy with what he was getting then is there really an issue?

Its more the arbitrary nature of how they are handed out, in hindsight is not giving Madigan one going to bite us in the a$$ especially given that the only 10 at the time was and is prone to being banged up a bit?

So, there is no such thing as 'A' Central Contracts - just CC's given to people who had screw as much as possible out of the IRFU. You seriously think POC was happy earning less than Heaslip?

Well POC signed the contract so unless he did it at gunpoint Im pretty sure at one point he was happy with the value

Maybe his ego didn't work that way and he was happy to see guys doing well and was happy to pull on the green shirt, only the man himself knows

Obviously he saw an opportunity to earn more post RWC 2015 but I doubt jealousy played a part in that

No, it says that Jamie Heaslip was more highly rated than Paul O'Connell by the IRFU. Cian Healy is on a central contract and he isn't even first choice at Leinster.

Or does it say they needed to pay more to retain him?

Maybe POC didn't see the money as important as Heaslip did who along with SOB are always off to France before the IRFU pony up

Giving a 3 year contract to a 33 year old 2 years out from the RWC is the strange one to me

[the-goon]

Zebo struggles to perform at internaltional level >> Joe Schmidt's fault....

[Sin é]

Zebo struggles to perform at internaltional level >> Joe Schmidt's fault....

Yea, this is Zebo struggling against the All Blacks.

https://www.sportsjoe.ie/rugby/this-almost-unbelievable-simon-zebo-take-sums-up-irelands-heroism-against-new-zealand-101839

He can do Joe's kick and chase thing perfectly.

[the-goon]

I'm paraphrasing you.

Schmidt's philosophy changed Zebo as a player - safety first - don't take chances. I wouldn't be surprised if that is one of the reasons why Zebo is leaving Ireland actually. He isn't a Schmidt type of player although he made himself one. Zebo is given a much freer roll in Munster and he scores a lot more tries.

The clear implication that Schmidt has "made" Zebo a more limited player, and would actually be a better player if someone else were Ireland coach.

Zebo alongside the entire 23 were imense that day, and those are the standards Zebo is capable of. It is clear that your position is Zebo plays well > great player playing well. Zebo plays poorly > Schmidt's stifling demands, not Zebo's fault.

Change the record please, we get it you don't like anyting Leinster.

[Sin é]

I'm paraphrasing you.

Schmidt's philosophy changed Zebo as a player - safety first - don't take chances. I wouldn't be surprised if that is one of the reasons why Zebo is leaving Ireland actually. He isn't a Schmidt type of player although he made himself one. Zebo is given a much freer roll in Munster and he scores a lot more tries.

The clear implication that Schmidt has "made" Zebo a more limited player, and would actually be a better player if someone else were Ireland coach.

Zebo alongside the entire 23 were imense that day, and those are the standards Zebo is capable of. It is clear that your position is Zebo plays well > great player playing well. Zebo plays poorly > Schmidt's stifling demands, not Zebo's fault.

Change the record please, we get it you don't like anyting Leinster.

You need to read my post again. And how in the name of god did you come to the conclusion from what I posted that 'I don't like anything Leinster?' Are you saying that Schmidt is something to do with Leinster now?

I think you need to look into the mirror - you come out with this cowpat: 'Zebo struggles to perform at international level and its Joe Schmidt's fault'.

[rodders]

I think you need to look into the mirror - you come out with this cowpat: 'Zebo struggles to perform at international level and its Joe Schmidt's fault'.

Well I agree it is Joe's fault for bowing to pressure from the Munster mafia to pick Zeebs instead of Dave Kearney.

At least Ireland camp will be a tall poppy free zone now he's gone to Racing.

[geoff999rugby]

Anyone who picks Dave Kearney instead of Zebo should be shot

[Pot Hale]

Kearney Zebo Earls are all sooo yesterday. Stockdale, Nyrne and Daly for me please. Oh and Sweetnam and O’Loughlin and Healy too.

Hopefully James Lowe whenever he eventually gets here after playing in the never ending mitre Cup gets a scorching case of the sarcoptic mangemites and has to leave the country followed by Aki, Aki eile, and Blahendal.

[eirebilly]

Pot, have you seen Earls in the last few matches he has played since his return from injury? His speed is back, his defence solid, counter rucking impressive and his finishing is back to its best.

Not yesterdays man at all, still the best winger in Ireland.

[geoff999rugby]

If the wingers are not Earls and Stockdale then form is obviously irrelevant
They have been the best two and by some distance

Who is 15 though - relying a hell of a lot on Rob Kearney being fit
If Zebo not considered and Payne will not be back - we are one injury from a problem
Carbery by default I assume

[rodders]

Kearney Zebo Earls are all sooo yesterday.  Stockdale, Nyrne and Daly for me please.  Oh and Sweetnam and O’Loughlin and Healy too.    

Go easy, yer man Sweetnam is lucky to be anything other than a semi pro.

Stockdale and Keith "cry baby" Earls are the form wingers, with Conway and Bowe not far behind.

Fergus McFadden had a good game recently so expect him to start against the Boks though.

[geoff999rugby]

If McFadden start Schmidt can stick his selection where the sun doesn't shine !!

[rodders]

If McFadden start Schmidt can stick his selection where the sun doesn't shine !!

Limerick?

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