Ulster Rugby 2017-2018 Part 2

First topic message reminder :

Carberry is 22, McPhillips is 21. Is this talk about sticking with McPhillips and hoping he turns out to be a gem maybe a tad naive? Carberry at a year older is being talked about as though he was the second coming and all this despite Sexton and Byrne and a whole backline of stellar players potentially blocking him. By contrast, it's almost as if we only know the name of McPhillips because we had no choice. A year ago the thinking was Jackson and Nelson. We then were saying Cooney can play 10 a bit. Then we signed Lealifano. Surely if McPhillips was the hot prospect, the coaches would have featured him more before Lealifano left.
In fact during Leanlifano's time here wasn't Nelson the preferred bench 10, and indeed started 3 games at 10 before Christmas, but then got injured?

Not meaning to be super negative, I hope I'm wrong. Cooney is a perfect example of a player suddenly shining from nowhere. I guess Ulster coaches know better than me if he's a real prospect worth thrusting into the limelight or not.

toml wrote:

rodders wrote:Just heard the IRFU are allowing an NIE fly-half.

Who is left to sign though?

Francois Steyn??

I can't say I have watched Jantjies to judge him, but I don't think we should sign him.

The 10 spot is the most important and I want a player there we are all amazed at. Jantjies isn't that player, we do have a great chance to pick one up post WC.
Why use a 3 year contract on a player we are not over the moon about, and next year looking at other teams signing great 10's and us looking at what we should have had, if we waited.

I say wait, bring back Nail O'Connor for a year if needed (yes he isn't good but he will cover for a year). This year is all about building for next year, and the target is secure HCup rugby. McPhillips and NOC should be ok to do that.

In the meantime since we are needing a NIQ back we should be looking at players like Connacht have got (Reece, Godwin, Horwitz) who all cover centre and OH, really we need a FB thats covers OH and 12. A player like that would ease the burden at OH until next year when we get a top class NIQ OH. Francois Steyn fits that bill perfectly.

Also since we are short at FB I used to like D'Arcy, any chance of him returning, just on a one year deal?

toml wrote:

Redman wrote:I'm going controversial here and saying it's probably somewhere inbetween.  

I'm glad he's not coming, but in his defence from that 1 game that everyone watched the Scrumhalf's delivery to him was woeful.  One of the worst performances you're going to see.  Especially in the first half.  

He is very talented but flaky. Best on a hard track playing running rugby, not at Ravers mid January though.

I see the Paddy Jackson stories to Perpignan are kicking off in the papers now, sounds like a done deal. Not a bad spot to earn your crust

I thought Jackson to Perpignan was less likely as Jantjies was now there number one target.

Would the reignition of these rumours now suggest Jantjies has signed with another club... such as Ulster??

I hope Jacko does finally get signed, if it's Perpignan then all the better.

clivemcl wrote:

toml wrote:

Redman wrote:I'm going controversial here and saying it's probably somewhere inbetween.  

I'm glad he's not coming, but in his defence from that 1 game that everyone watched the Scrumhalf's delivery to him was woeful.  One of the worst performances you're going to see.  Especially in the first half.  

He is very talented but flaky. Best on a hard track playing running rugby, not at Ravers mid January though.

I see the Paddy Jackson stories to Perpignan are kicking off in the papers now, sounds like a done deal. Not a bad spot to earn your crust

I thought Jackson to Perpignan was less likely as Jantjies was now there number one target.

Would the reignition of these rumours now suggest Jantjies has signed with another club... such as Ulster??

Perpignan are short at 10 and with the cash injection from promotion it could be they are wanting to sign both, with Jantjies being away with SA and Jackson being a cut price deal it wouldn't be the worst idea

rodders wrote:Just heard the IRFU are allowing an NIE fly-half.

Only a few weeks too late when everyone decent has already signed elsewhere. Oh how they spoil us.

Pete330v2 wrote:

toml wrote:

rodders wrote:Just heard the IRFU are allowing an NIE fly-half.

Who is left to sign though?

Francois Steyn??

I heard an Ozzie.....

JmD wrote:

rodders wrote:Just heard the IRFU are allowing an NIE fly-half.

Only a few weeks too late when everyone decent has already signed elsewhere. Oh how they spoil us.

Everyone decent had already signed, that was why we were talking to Janties....

rodders wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:

toml wrote:

rodders wrote:Just heard the IRFU are allowing an NIE fly-half.

Who is left to sign though?

Francois Steyn??

I heard an Ozzie.....

Bryce Hegarty ?

If someones speculating Foley I doubt he'd come before November given he'd be 2 caps short of the 60 the selection policy requires for the Wallabies and they'll throw buckets of cash at him to stay going into the RWC

Not sure of the score but Planet Rugby are losing their sh*t on the U20 game.  Safe to say they're not impressed with our performance.

Redman wrote:Not sure of the score but Planet Rugby are losing their sh*t on the U20 game.  Safe to say they're not impressed with our performance.

Ireland lost 24-20 earlier to Georgia. 3 losses out of 3 in the group for Ireland. Disappointing campaign although they did have France and South Africa in their group and were at times promising

Just watched first 20mins. Ireland making tonnes of errors, but credit to them, Georgia have been really quite good!

To the point that the comment boards are talking about Georgia replacing Italy in the 6 nations in future.

clivemcl wrote:Just watched first 20mins. Ireland making tonnes of errors, but credit to them, Georgia have been really quite good!

To the point that the comment boards are talking about Georgia replacing Italy in the 6 nations in future.

Well they are idiots, Georgia won one game, the same as Italy last year, who did Italy beat last year?....Ireland

Italy this year beat Scotland and Argentina but Georgia did this year what Italy did last year so obviously Italy should be replaced

Italy should be removed from the 6 Nations as soon as possible, but not replaced. We need to move back to 5 Nations.

Jackson confirmed on a two year deal to Perpignan

Hoping that means Jantjies to Ulster just to prove some people wrong

marty2086 wrote:Jackson confirmed on a two year deal to Perpignan

Hoping that means Jantjies to Ulster just to prove some people wrong

Unless of course USAP has signed them both

Pete330v2 wrote:

marty2086 wrote:Jackson confirmed on a two year deal to Perpignan

Hoping that means Jantjies to Ulster just to prove some people wrong

Unless of course USAP has signed them both

They are waiting on the IRFU financing it to screw Ulster over

I never thought the day would come when I was overjoyed at Paddy Jackson being signed to another club but I really am. The man the social media tried to destroy will be living and playing in the beautiful south of France. Shove that in your pipe Mark Zuckerberg

Logans confirmed he's leaving in August

June the 8th would have suited better.

Well is there much he can screw up in the next two months?

In fairness though we are in a better place than when he came in, there is a better infrastructure there and finances but things could have been so much more

marty2086 wrote:Well is there much he can screw up in the next two months?

In fairness though we are in a better place than when he came in, there is a better infrastructure there and finances but things could have been so much more

Agreed, but we're in a worse place than we were 2-3 years ago. Which means he's taken us backward since then.

I posted a long reply on him ages ago but in summary, he's a man who after initial success didn't work on his flaws. Didn't learn the game, didn't try and improve himself. As a result when we were short on the rugby front after Humphreys left, he floundered and Ulster haven't recovered from that yet.

Logan was never going to "learn the game" - that wasn't his remit. Ulster's demise over the last 2-3 years comes directly from the IRFU, who have instigated and overseen a series of dubious appointments untouched by Ulster hand.

The reason Logan had to go was solely down to this season and his cowardice in the face of the trial - not the Jackson Olding one specifically but the trial of Ulster by media. He sent everyone bar the tea lady to face the criticism while he cowered in the shadows. As 'captain' it was definitely his remit to steer the ship through the storm, rather than hide below decks. His lack of backbone to stand up for the ulstermen was then reinforced by his willingness to lay down for the sponsors, and have the temerity to claim the moral highground.

So......Any rumours????
I'm bored and there isn't a whiff of a rumour from here or t'other place and it's this time of year that I usually thrive on speculation.

Logan rumoured to be loading his guns with Nucifora the target, once the new man is appointed.

Pete330v2 wrote:So......Any rumours????
I'm bored and there isn't a whiff of a rumour from here or t'other place and it's this time of year that I usually thrive on speculation.

We can make some stuff up Pete if you'd like, could be fun to see if anything makes it onto some of the interweb sites

The Great Aukster wrote:Logan rumoured to be loading his guns with Nucifora the target, once the new man is appointed.

Going to tell the world he was locked in Nuciforas basement for months and couldn't give interviews while it hit the fan?

"We can make some stuff up Pete if you'd like, could be fun to see if anything makes it onto some of the interweb sites Whistle "

It wouldn't be the first time Marty. I have a secret identity on t'other forum and I did just that 2 years ago. It worked a little too well and found it's way here as well. I felt bad when that happened and never did it again

There's a rumor that Iain Henderson has been testing to see Bernard Foley and Israel Folou will both squeeze into his hand luggage bag.

rodders wrote:There's a rumor that Iain Henderson has been testing to see Bernard Foley and Israel Folou will both squeeze into his hand luggage bag.

The DUP have even offered Folau the chance to become their next leader if he comes to Ulster

marty2086 wrote:

rodders wrote:There's a rumor that Iain Henderson has been testing to see Bernard Foley and Israel Folou will both squeeze into his hand luggage bag.

The DUP have even offered Folau the chance to become their next leader if he comes to Ulster

Aw man he would love it over here

Heard a rumor that Ulster were going to offer me big money to come out of retirement. But I will as a little tipsy and may have misunderstood

We're re-signing Mark McCrea

I see Paddy Ryan is out of contract at Waratahs. Which side of the front row is he? He has Irish roots too (but is an NIQ due to 3 Ozzie caps)

clivemcl wrote:I see Paddy Ryan is out of contract at Waratahs. Which side of the front row is he? He has Irish roots too (but is an NIQ due to 3 Ozzie caps)

NIQ?? Who do you think we are Clive, Leinster?

I see it's looking like Danny Wilson will be going to Scotland rather than Wasps, so we should have McFarland once the June tests are over. Good news on that then

So we were excited we had the most players in an under 20 squad in a long time, but it appears to be one of the worst under 20s teams in a long time. Should we still be excited?

Are the Ulster players good but the other in the team are less than average? Is the whole team on a par with other under 20s and there has been poor coaching management.

Should be be as excited about or acamady prospects as we were or have we over estimated them?

Bit of both Kingshu. I haven't seen a single match this summer but the feedback from the U20 6 Nations and hearing from various other people is that :

- The backline is awful. I can attest to that from what I saw at the turn of the year. The 9/10 don't work at all. That cripples the rest of the line, but there's no particular standouts there other than possibly the Leinster 15.
- Of the pack O'Toole was a standout and is injured.
- Doris is another stand out for Leinster.
- Ulster representation did fine, didn't disgrace themselves but didn't amaze either.

Oh and Dalton is an athlete and they use him as such. Hands are fairly awful though.

Leinster have signed Joe Tomane in the wing/centre.

In regards to the U-20's I watched all the matches except the Scotland match, generally speaking Ireland made a lot of individual errors that cost them, the most concerning part for me was the handling was awful, it was knock on after knock on
In terms of Ulster representation, Dalton looked athletic and powerful but suffered from bad hands. Stewart was decent but made a few mistakes, Curtis and O'Toole didn't play as they were injured but appear to be 2 of the better players from what I saw at the U-20 6 nations. Our back rowers seem gritty and tackle well which is positive, back line was generally not great but had their moments, Hume was pretty rubbish in my opinion and didn't look like he is anywhere near ready to step up, which is worrying considering how thin we are in the backs next year.
All in all I'd say there is a fair bit of potential in those guys and with good coaching and gametime then we will see more than a few of them make it to Ulster regulars over the next few years.

It's worth saying when I'm talking about the backline, I'm talking about it now rather than the 6 Nations. Curtis, as you will have seen in his cameos, is one to be hopeful of. He's injured currently though.

Hume took a lot of abuse for the performance mid-week. Having not seen the game I can't comment on that but it can't have helped with Byrne at 10.

Hume has yet to impress, playing with either Byrne or Dean at 10, in either the centre or the wing and in either the 6N or the JWC. Didn't think he was anything special in the 2017 Schools Cup final, and nowhere near the performance that Matthew Reaney put in this year.

Still he has had some glowing reports for both Banbridge and the A side, and crucially is a Soper favourite so has every opportunity.

No Ulster or Connacht in Irelands staring 15.

While there is rotation what player do we have that look to be internationals in the future?

Gibbes off to La Rochelle after all:
https://twitter.com/Murray_Kinsella/status/1007125382120669184?s=19

Lying naughty naughty boy.

JmD wrote:Gibbes off to La Rochelle after all:
https://twitter.com/Murray_Kinsella/status/1007125382120669184?s=19

Lying naughty naughty boy.

Think it's harsh to call him a liar

I don't know what his family problems are/were but it was being said earlier this week that he was dealing with them prior to the move to France

marty2086 wrote:

JmD wrote:Gibbes off to La Rochelle after all:
https://twitter.com/Murray_Kinsella/status/1007125382120669184?s=19

Lying naughty naughty boy.

Think it's harsh to call him a liar

I don't know what his family problems are/were but it was being said earlier this week that he was dealing with them prior to the move to France

The family problems may have been Afoa Syndrome. That rare condition that inexplicably gives you an aversion to living in Belfast.

Are we surprised though, in hindsight he ran out on his Clermont contract using a new title that he had no wish to fulfil. You reap what you sow, doubt he'll stay in France for too long and La Rochelle will be shafted like we were

Not great behavior from Gibbs at all and has gone down in my estimation.

In saying that Ulster have been pretty poor in how they've dealt with coaches themselves in recent times, having sacked McLaughlin, Anscombe, Kiss, Doak and Clarke to name a few, so they can't really complain at someone not showing loyalty to their word.

Doak and Clarke weren't really sacked though were they? Their contracts were up and weren't given new ones and to be fair, given they are meant to have fought during training then they were lucky they were allowed to see out their contracts