EPCR Champions Cup Final

by **LondonTiger** Fri May 10, 2019 12:27 pm

First topic message reminder :

Leinster Rugby v Saracens

Date: Sat 11 May 2019 17:00 (BST)
Venue: St James' Park

Leinster
15. Rob Kearney, 14. Jordan Larmour, 13. Garry Ringrose, 12. Robbie Henshaw, 11. James Lowe, 10. Johnny Sexton (c), 9. Luke McGrath, 1. Cian Healy, 2. Sean Cronin, 3. Tadhg Furlong, 4. Devin Toner, 5. James Ryan, 6. Scott Fardy, 7. Sean O'Brien, 8. Jack Conan.

Replacements: 16. James Tracy, 17. Jack McGrath, 18. Michael Bent, 19. Rhys Ruddock, 20. Max Deegan, 21. Hugh O'Sullivan, 22. Ross Byrne, 23. Rory O'Loughlin,

Saracens

15. Alex Goode, 14. Liam Williams, 13. Alex Lozowski, 12. Brad Barritt (c), 11. Sean Maitland, 10. Owen Farrell, 9. Ben Spencer, 1. Mako Vunipola, 2. Jamie George, 3. Titi Lamositele, 4. Will Skelton, 5. George Kruis, 6. Maro Itoje, 7. Jackson Wray, 8. Billy Vunipola.

Replacements: 16. Joe Gray, 17. Richard Barrington, 18. Vincent Koch, 19. Nick Isiekwe, 20. Schalk Burger, 21. Richard Wigglesworth, 22. Nick Tompkins, 23. David Strettle,

Referee: Jérome Garcès (France)
AR1: Romain Poite (France)
AR2: Pascal Gauzère (France)
TMO: Philippe Bonhoure (France)

Broadcasters: BT Sport 2 / beIN SPORTS / FR2 / Channel 4 / Virgin Media

by Brendan Sat May 11, 2019 7:03 pm

Well done Sarries, have to be considered one of the best teams of the tournament. Take into account the lost finals and semis and they have been at the top for the last 6 years.

Leinster really poor leadership who didn't manage the game at all well. They were poor just trying to get the upper hand physically.

Itoje annoying as always, cheap shots at rucks, pulling shirts off as per most games. Great player but so hard to like

by Lagon Sat May 11, 2019 7:04 pm

Rugby fan. We are all here to appreciate a good game of rugby. Stop Wumming.

by RugbyFan100 Sat May 11, 2019 7:05 pm

Lagon wrote:Rugby fan. We are all here to appreciate a good game of rugby. Stop Wumming.

No wumming from me. Great game. I'm just very, very, very happy.

by Lagon Sat May 11, 2019 7:07 pm

Rugby fan, yes you are wumming. I'm not a Leinster fan by the way. Last I'm saying about this.

by Cumbrian Sat May 11, 2019 7:16 pm

What can you say about a game like that? Saracens were brutal, and I am not a fan by any stretch of the imagination. I was pleased for the England players, many of whom held up really well.

I thought it was harsh on them to go ten nil down, they didn't get the rub of the green, but they dealt with it in a professional manner. I did wonder what would have happened if the Leinster scrum half had got the ball off the park just before half time. Mind you, with the mood they were in, I think they would have found a way to win either way.

To nil a team like Leinster in the second half is impressive.

From an English point of view it is good to see Billy getting back to his best, how many Leinstermen did he drag over the line with him? four? Great to see.

Welsh fans should be excited too, thought that Williams was superb.

by RugbyFan100 Sat May 11, 2019 7:17 pm

Cumbrian wrote:

Welsh fans should be excited too

Stop now

by LeinsterFan4life Sat May 11, 2019 7:18 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:Excellent stuff. Superb for Saracens to play like that against a team with the resources of Leinster.

Great day for rugby.

You really are pathetic. Have fun pretending to be a Scarlets fan on forums.

Calm down please

by **LondonTiger** Sat May 11, 2019 7:21 pm

BigGee wrote:BV interception, he may well be the genuine MoM this time!

He was immense and would have been deserving MotM. Mind you Barrett, Farrell, Kruis and Itoje were all outstanding. Barrington and Koch also deserve the utmost praise.

by Lagon Sat May 11, 2019 7:22 pm

Cumbrian, yes Williams is a class act. Wales have a real gem.

by **BigGee** Sat May 11, 2019 7:22 pm

Well done Sarries, best side won and as a neutral you can't ask for more than that

by LeinsterFan4life Sat May 11, 2019 7:26 pm

BigGee wrote:Well done Sarries, best side won and as a neutral you can't ask for more than that

Test match intensity, you can't beat the European cup. Sarries were phenomenal to be fair.

by RugbyFan100 Sat May 11, 2019 7:26 pm

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:Excellent stuff. Superb for Saracens to play like that against a team with the resources of Leinster.

Great day for rugby.
You really are pathetic. Have fun pretending to be a Scarlets fan on forums.

What will it take for you to stop saying these things.

I got me a signed, framed Hadleigh Parkes Scarlets jersey recently. Looks lovely. I can take a picture of it next to my laptop with this thread open if you want?

Has it really come to that? Laugh

by LeinsterFan4life Sat May 11, 2019 7:30 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:Excellent stuff. Superb for Saracens to play like that against a team with the resources of Leinster.

Great day for rugby.
You really are pathetic. Have fun pretending to be a Scarlets fan on forums.

What will it take for you to stop saying these things.

I got me a signed, framed Hadleigh Parkes Scarlets jersey recently. Looks lovely. I can take a picture of it next to my laptop with this thread open if you want?

Has it really come to that?

Yeah send it on there like a good lad.

by **BigGee** Sat May 11, 2019 7:30 pm

Its been a good thread guys, lets not get silly!

by Cumbrian Sat May 11, 2019 7:32 pm

LondonTiger wrote:
BigGee wrote:BV interception, he may well be the genuine MoM this time!

He was immense and would have been deserving MotM. Mind you Barrett, Farrell, Kruis and Itoje were all outstanding. Barrington and Koch also deserve the utmost praise.

Aye I worried for Saracens when they had to replace their starting props so early. At that point they lost their starting props and Maro was yellow carded, Leinster could be forgiven for thinking it was their day. However, Barrington and Koch beefed their opposite numbers. Barrington is one of those players who will fly under of the radar and perform well at club level, but not quite make it to international honours. It is strange, because there was a time (not THAT long ago) that England would have been crying out for a player like him. Tim Payne springs to mind *shudder*.

by Lagon Sat May 11, 2019 7:34 pm

Best leave him to it, Leinsterfan.
Commiserations by way. Deserved to be there, but back to back is incredibly difficult.

by LeinsterFan4life Sat May 11, 2019 7:42 pm

Lagon wrote:Best leave him to it, Leinsterfan.
Commiserations by way. Deserved to be there, but back to back is incredibly difficult.

To be honest we were lucky to be in the final. Stockdale should have put that ball down!! It's no disaster, we'll be there or there abouts for the next few years due to our academy onwards and upwards.

Again fair play to sarries.

by **BigGee** Sat May 11, 2019 7:44 pm

You have to say that was a great final and a great occasion.

Newcastle is a great place to go for a sporting event, I went to the Scotland v Samoa game there in the WC and it is a fantastic stadium, you really are right on top of the pitch and after the game, right in the centre of the town.

Well done to all four teams and their fans and to 'the toon' it always delivers.

by RugbyFan100 Sat May 11, 2019 7:45 pm

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:Excellent stuff. Superb for Saracens to play like that against a team with the resources of Leinster.

Great day for rugby.
You really are pathetic. Have fun pretending to be a Scarlets fan on forums.

What will it take for you to stop saying these things.

I got me a signed, framed Hadleigh Parkes Scarlets jersey recently. Looks lovely. I can take a picture of it next to my laptop with this thread open if you want?

Has it really come to that?
Yeah send it on there like a good lad.

I'll post this without comment, as the moderator has rightly asked for this thread to not get silly - but I do feel I have a right to reply:

EPCR Champions Cup Final - Page 3 DIn3GtR

EPCR Champions Cup Final - Page 3 DIn3GtR

by Lagon Sat May 11, 2019 7:46 pm

No doubt you will. Gutted about Stockdales error, as an Ulsterman, but Leinster showed their class in closing the game out. Ulster have improved hugely this season, but not Leinster class .... yet

by LeinsterFan4life Sat May 11, 2019 7:56 pm

RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:Excellent stuff. Superb for Saracens to play like that against a team with the resources of Leinster.

Great day for rugby.
You really are pathetic. Have fun pretending to be a Scarlets fan on forums.

What will it take for you to stop saying these things.

I got me a signed, framed Hadleigh Parkes Scarlets jersey recently. Looks lovely. I can take a picture of it next to my laptop with this thread open if you want?

Has it really come to that?
Yeah send it on there like a good lad.

I'll post this without comment, as the moderator has rightly asked for this thread to not get silly - but I do feel I have a right to reply:

fair play but then again this can be from anywhere. You can prove your support by actually talking about the Scarlets on here which youve yet to do strangely enough

by **RDW** Sat May 11, 2019 7:58 pm

LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:
LeinsterFan4life wrote:
RugbyFan100 wrote:Excellent stuff. Superb for Saracens to play like that against a team with the resources of Leinster.

Great day for rugby.
You really are pathetic. Have fun pretending to be a Scarlets fan on forums.

What will it take for you to stop saying these things.

I got me a signed, framed Hadleigh Parkes Scarlets jersey recently. Looks lovely. I can take a picture of it next to my laptop with this thread open if you want?

Has it really come to that?
Yeah send it on there like a good lad.

I'll post this without comment, as the moderator has rightly asked for this thread to not get silly - but I do feel I have a right to reply:

fair play but then again this can be from anywhere. You can prove your support by actually talking about the Scarlets on here which youve yet to do strangely enough

Can you two please give it a break?

by LeinsterFan4life Sat May 11, 2019 7:58 pm

Lagon wrote:No doubt you will. Gutted about Stockdales error, as an Ulsterman, but Leinster showed their class in closing the game out. Ulster have improved hugely this season, but not Leinster class .... yet

it was bizarre and very unlike him given his incredible season ( I've been much more impressed with him this season). Ulster have fantastic support and deserve to have a quality team.

by Lagon Sat May 11, 2019 9:02 pm

I don't think it was bizarre. Just one of those things and he was under pressure from his right. Don't want him to change how he touches down. Ulster rugby fans do deserve better. We have underperformed in some years, but in other years stuffed by a better side ... Leinster.
We need the academy to rival that of Leinster. Some way off that but improving.

by **Rugby Fan** Sat May 11, 2019 11:43 pm

Enjoyed that game. Even when both teams were defending well, you never felt absolutely sure the other side wasn't going to break through.

I'd congatulate Saracens fans but, since beshocked disappeared, I'm not sure we have any actual Saracens fans on the forum...

by yappysnap Sun May 12, 2019 12:02 am

Im sure Beshocked is happy for the win and cursing Farrell at the same time where ever he is.

Well done Sarries, very difficult to like at times but very impressive.

by **George Carlin** Sun May 12, 2019 6:15 am

Couldn't watch the game so I'm hoping that someone posts the whole match online.

Well done Sarries.

by No 7&1/2 Sun May 12, 2019 7:13 am

Good final. Some of the defending was unbelievable from both sides.

by **rodders** Sun May 12, 2019 9:10 am

Hard luck Leinster, Sarries definitely were the better side and proved too powerful in the end.

That said there were a few key moments, in particular McGrath box kicking in field at the end of the 1st half, were the game could have went a different way.

Overall a great final between the two best club sides in Europe but Sarries just seem a cut above the rest again this season, especially with Billy V and Itoje on top form.

For Leinster, maybe Leavy would have made a difference and losing Carbury has weakend them a bit but they have work to do if they want a 5th title.

by yappysnap Sun May 12, 2019 9:12 am

Saw this posted on twitter...

Itoje the Villian

Got to say I found Itoje's antics brilliant and a great remedy to the negative ruck caterpillars cropping up. As someone else pointed out Ryans reaction at the end, his ott rage with his shirt over his head is amazing.

by No 7&1/2 Sun May 12, 2019 9:24 am

Itoje had a great game yesterday though perhaps a little lucky not to see a red. His yellow was harsh but if they'd looked at the moment where he ran into sexton suspect that was a yellow. The fact sexton didn't get a hia at that point is another low point for the medics.

by yappysnap Sun May 12, 2019 9:47 am

Yea I saw quite a few comments on social media that Sexton looked to be carrying an injury but was too important to come off.

by Collapse2005 Sun May 12, 2019 10:02 am

No 7&1/2 wrote:Itoje had a great game yesterday though perhaps a little lucky not to see a red. His yellow was harsh but if they'd looked at the moment where he ran into sexton suspect that was a yellow. The fact sexton didn't get a hia at that point is another low point for the medics.

It looked to me like the elbow KOd Sexton.

by **LondonTiger** Sun May 12, 2019 10:07 am

No 7&1/2 wrote:Itoje had a great game yesterday though perhaps a little lucky not to see a red. His yellow was harsh but if they'd looked at the moment where he ran into sexton suspect that was a yellow. The fact sexton didn't get a hia at that point is another low point for the medics.

I think he would have been fine if it had been removed, as contact seemed to be with Itoje's ball carrying arm which was tight to his body. There have been sanctions in similar circumstances but when the attacker leads with the non carrying arm.

by **LondonTiger** Sun May 12, 2019 10:08 am

Alex Goode won player of the tournament I see. Expect even more press demanding his international selection.

by **rodders** Sun May 12, 2019 10:30 am

Collapse2005 wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:Itoje had a great game yesterday though perhaps a little lucky not to see a red. His yellow was harsh but if they'd looked at the moment where he ran into sexton suspect that was a yellow. The fact sexton didn't get a hia at that point is another low point for the medics.

It looked to me like the elbow KOd Sexton.

Thought the same, it was very blatant and surprised the TMO didn't flag it as was very clear on the replay (which BT hastily stopped showing).

In my opinion it was a red card, certainly a yellow.

I thought quite a few decisions didn't go Leinsters way but that doesn't take away Sarries were the better side.

I was surprised how much Leinster kicked the ball away in the first half, Sarries seemed to have a lot of the possession which is something Leinster usually dominate.

by Northgrill Sun May 12, 2019 10:37 am

He led with the right forearm and held the ball in the left. Didn’t look good on the reverse angle either. I think he was lucky the TMO didn’t pick up on it. Great player but he could end up costing us at some stage with his ‘over exuberance’ in the World Cup.

by **LondonTiger** Sun May 12, 2019 10:48 am

Northgrill wrote:He led with the right forearm and held the ball in the left. Didn’t look good on the reverse angle either. I think he was lucky the TMO didn’t pick up on it. Great player but he could end up costing us at some stage with his ‘over exuberance’ in the World Cup.

I thought the ball was in his right arm, will try and look back.

by Northgrill Sun May 12, 2019 11:04 am

I found a video on twitter showing it.

https://twitter.com/raywilkins90/status/1127268104197873664?s=21

by No 7&1/2 Sun May 12, 2019 11:11 am

Arm to chest so probably ok actually.

by Geordie Sun May 12, 2019 11:31 am

I was at the game obviously...and what an atmosphere. It was electric.

As to the game...the ref gave everything to Leinster. Their first try should not have been be cause they popped up the scrum...etc etc

However...Saracens were brutally efficient in the second half.

In all honesty it should have been a cricket score.

by Collapse2005 Sun May 12, 2019 11:34 am

No 7&1/2 wrote:Arm to chest so probably ok actually.

More like arm to neck/chin then head.

by No 7&1/2 Sun May 12, 2019 11:35 am

Maybe on the fall but initially no.

by lostinwales Sun May 12, 2019 11:44 am

Northgrill wrote:I found a video on twitter showing it.

https://twitter.com/raywilkins90/status/1127268104197873664?s=21

Be very unlucky to get cited for that

by **LondonTiger** Sun May 12, 2019 12:00 pm

Northgrill wrote:I found a video on twitter showing it.

https://twitter.com/raywilkins90/status/1127268104197873664?s=21

Ok so I initially in both but switched to left just before impact. Contact is with Sexton's chest so not cardable but I would award a penalty.

by asoreleftshoulder Sun May 12, 2019 12:21 pm

Great game but Leinster were just a little off our best and got a couple of unlucky breaks.Well done Sarries played some great stuff and were suffocating and aggressive in both attack and defense.

From a Leinster perspective we were close and could have won if we kicked it out for half time and took tje 5 on 2 overlap early in the 2nd half. That's a 14 point swing at a crucial time and kept Saracens in it when we could have killed them off.

We also had a certain 3 points when Wiliams made an illegal turnover in front of the posts, Kearney should never have been pinged for the penalty that led to the first try he was trapped by the Sarries players and Williams made a knock on before the penalty and yellow card to Fardy. Small things and Saracens can probably point to similar decisions that went against them but if one or two of these go our way it would have been a different game.

We were close but needed to be a little better to get it done.

by Collapse2005 Sun May 12, 2019 1:17 pm

LondonTiger wrote:
Northgrill wrote:I found a video on twitter showing it.

https://twitter.com/raywilkins90/status/1127268104197873664?s=21
Ok so I initially in both but switched to left just before impact. Contact is with Sexton's chest so not cardable but I would award a penalty.

Looks like an elbow to the neck to me.

by Collapse2005 Sun May 12, 2019 1:17 pm

asoreleftshoulder wrote:Great game but Leinster were just a little off our best and got a couple of unlucky breaks.Well done Sarries played some great stuff and were suffocating and aggressive in both attack and defense.

From a Leinster perspective we were close and could have won if we kicked it out for half time and took tje 5 on 2 overlap early in the 2nd half. That's a 14 point swing at a crucial time and kept Saracens in it when we could have killed them off.

We also had a certain 3 points when Wiliams made an illegal turnover in front of the posts, Kearney should never have been pinged for the penalty that led to the first try he was trapped by the Sarries players and Williams made a knock on before the penalty and yellow card to Fardy. Small things and Saracens can probably point to similar decisions that went against them but if one or two of these go our way it would have been a different game.

We were close but needed to be a little better to get it done.

Yeah I also thought the penalty on Kearney was very soft

by king_carlos Sun May 12, 2019 1:35 pm

I thought Sarries put in one of the best club performances I've seen yesterday. Losing both props and then dominating the scrum, as well as going in level at half time following Itoje's yellow card just summed up how relentless they are.

They might not be everyone's favourite side given the lingering salary cap accusations but they play some outstanding rugby.

Jackson Wray had a very good game playing out of position at 7. He was everywhere and always plays well in the Sarries defensive system.

The addition of Liam Williams has risen their back three play another notch. Scary to think Daly is going to be added to that back line next season.

by **Rugby Fan** Sun May 12, 2019 1:59 pm

king_carlos wrote:..The addition of Liam Williams has risen their back three play another notch. Scary to think Daly is going to be added to that back line next season.

I was just thinking that Daly doesn't quite fit the Saracens model. He wants to be in the centre but, for all his speed and skill, he isn't known for the kind of dog, and uncompromising tackling which you see from Barritt and Lozowski (or from Williams in the back three, for that matter). Perhaps he will develop that side of his game, or we could see Saracens try to tweak their game plan.

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