England: 8 Nations

First topic message reminder :

Not sure if theres already a thread kicking about but seeing as the prem is back I thought it may be nice to argue over the numerous players impressing.

As ever it seems to be scrum half, flankers, centre and full back are where there are chances for people to force their way in. Can't say I've ever been able to call what Eddie Jones thinks but Willis and hill must be tempting him to widen the player pool. A number of scrum halfs have started well also but has the time come for Spencer or Robson? Thought Maunder was very good too and Mitchell showed great flashes.

I'm at a bit of a loss for full back based on the games last week. Furbank looked anonymous and let's face it Daly is a Jones favourite.

GeordieFalcon wrote:If we go into lockdown for a month on Wednesday...are all the games cancelled?

Ask Robshaw.

Or maybe don't.

Well hopefully this match is a bit of an anticlimactic, 50 point win kind of a match. Would be nice to just put a bit of pressure on France and Ireland but obviously hoping with that that Rdwards defence is magnificent!

England by 60.

Gotta love Woodward here. Cant have slade at 12 as hes not playing his club position. This from the guy who said he would have played May at 13.

Yeah but that's also from the guy who won a World Cup. I think that's more important than '20,000 posts on 606v2'.

That was very easy for Ben Youngs

Nice start.

1st try. England will score 10 today.

Sympathy for the Youngs Farrel haters

Every time I watch Italy, they just look worse and worse.

Did the ref think England knocked on first there and then realise he was wrong? Otherwise why not play the advantage?

Assumed it was an England knock on given Minozzi threw a ridiculous pass but yes clearly should have been play on.

Hopefully therefore catches on to the cynical blocking on england kicks. Bit blatant!

Great try from Polledri, he is some player

England getting sloppy there

And following it up with sloppy play. Underhill knows his place is under threat though....

Not sure about the pen though - the Italian tackled himself and Underhill was clear before he went for the ball.

Jonny hill in trouble here. High and swinging

Ah nothing too serious.

That will be yellow I think

It's not direct contact to the head though. May have been lost in translation. Launchbury back for the next game.

If England get a lineout in the next 10 minutes it might be interesting...

That's where rugby union is daft. Nothing Hill can do about that, he's committed to a tackle and, after his commitment, the player he's aiming to tackle has shifted down and across suddenly. It's split-second stuff.

Ridiculous decision.

Duty281 wrote:That's where rugby union is daft. Nothing Hill can do about that, he's committed to a tackle and, after his commitment, the player he's aiming to tackle has shifted down and across suddenly. It's split-second stuff.

The point of the law though is to ensure player safety. If you go into the tackle and cant stop you're self its reckless. Is what it is and is deliberate.

It's been poor by england after the first 12 or so mins.

Duty281 wrote:That's where rugby union is daft. Nothing Hill can do about that, he's committed to a tackle and, after his commitment, the player he's aiming to tackle has shifted down and across suddenly. It's split-second stuff.

Well maybe he could have gone lower in the first place!

It's tough, but the only way you will change players habits are to penalise them in that way, if they don't do that, we might be watching touch rugby internationals in 10 years time

Did someone think Italy were bad under the high ball - England seem to be kicking a lot?

Duty281 wrote:That's where rugby union is daft. Nothing Hill can do about that, he's committed to a tackle and, after his commitment, the player he's aiming to tackle has shifted down and across suddenly. It's split-second stuff.

He was always going high. As with tip tackles a few years back the whole point of the laws is to stop people tackling in certain ways and put the onus on them to be safe. What would be daft is a sport thats proven to be fundamentally dangerous because of the number of head collisions doing nothing to reduce them.


We are seeing much dafter things about the game on display here (including the fake crowd noise), its pretty turgid stuff.

Italy look pretty good tbh.

No 7&1/2 wrote:

Duty281 wrote:That's where rugby union is daft. Nothing Hill can do about that, he's committed to a tackle and, after his commitment, the player he's aiming to tackle has shifted down and across suddenly. It's split-second stuff.

The point of the law though is to ensure player safety. If you go into the tackle and cant stop you're self its reckless. Is what it is and is deliberate.

I get that it's to ensure safety, but after a player is committed to a tackle it's impossible for them to pull out. And if the player they're aiming to tackle moves suddenly for whatever reason (slips/contact from another player etc.), as happened here, that alters the original position of the contact. Hill hasn't put in a bad tackle there, but he's been punished for something beyond his control. Rugby League is far more sensible in this regard.

king_carlos wrote:If England get a lineout in the next 10 minutes it might be interesting...

Itoje showing his lineout prowess...time to make amends?

As above duty: could Hill have lower or slower? I think the answers yes.

BigGee wrote:

Duty281 wrote:That's where rugby union is daft. Nothing Hill can do about that, he's committed to a tackle and, after his commitment, the player he's aiming to tackle has shifted down and across suddenly. It's split-second stuff.

Well maybe he could have gone lower in the first place!

It's tough, but the only way you will change players habits are to penalise them in that way, if they don't do that, we might be watching touch rugby internationals in 10 years time

The only way to ensure that would be if players only ever tackled opponents below the waist. It's a physical game, you have to accept that sometimes there will be unintended contact to the head from time to time, through no fault of the tackling player.

No 7&1/2 wrote:As above duty: could Hill have lower or slower? I think the answers yes.

Though the answer to that is 'yes' for every tackle ever made in the history of the game.

Duty281 wrote:That's where rugby union is daft. Nothing Hill can do about that, he's committed to a tackle and, after his commitment, the player he's aiming to tackle has shifted down and across suddenly. It's split-second stuff.

"Eyes on the ball, ref!"

A wobble has now gone to a bad 30 min here. Importance of a warm up being demonstrated but I imagine Jones is about to ring changes.

Duty281 wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:As above duty: could Hill have lower or slower? I think the answers yes.

Though the answer to that is 'yes' for every tackle ever made in the history of the game.

And so I'd invite him to do so for the rest of the game.

Italy deserve the lead here. England have been garbage since the first try.

Duty281 wrote:

BigGee wrote:

Duty281 wrote:That's where rugby union is daft. Nothing Hill can do about that, he's committed to a tackle and, after his commitment, the player he's aiming to tackle has shifted down and across suddenly. It's split-second stuff.

Well maybe he could have gone lower in the first place!

It's tough, but the only way you will change players habits are to penalise them in that way, if they don't do that, we might be watching touch rugby internationals in 10 years time

The only way to ensure that would be if players only ever tackled opponents below the waist. It's a physical game, you have to accept that sometimes there will be unintended contact to the head from time to time, through no fault of the tackling player.

I think everyone is accepting it. The consequence of that happening is to penalise said player.

Too much kicking from Youngs now. He started well fast to ball quick passing and great tap and go. Now just losing possession.

This really is a load of rubbish

No 7&1/2 wrote:A wobble has now gone to a bad 30 min here. Importance of a warm up being demonstrated but I imagine Jones is about to ring changes.

Yep they are definitely rusty

I thought they wanted to raise our morale?

England just need the ball tbh.

Italy look like they've finally found a 10.

Saracens boys also showing they can dish out the obnoxious overcelebrating but can't take it. Embarrassing.

Earl wtf.

Good start followed by absolute pants - can't work out why England keep going to the air and trying cross kicks that aren't working.

Needs Robson and Lawrence on from the start of the second. Should be 100 and the end for Youngs.

Heaf wrote:Good start followed by absolute pants - can't work out why England keep going to the air and trying cross kicks that aren't working.

It worked well for NZ this morning. Stop the opposition getting set in to defensive patterns.