The French Open 2020

First topic message reminder :

With the draw about to be made for RG, I thought I would get this topic going.

For me - and I say this every year - Rafa is clear favourite, although the strange nature of all sport this Covid-19 year might mean someone else (Thiem? Djoko?) might have a chance.

Halep stands out as the women's favourite, particularly as some of the top women are not appearing. More on this after the draw.

Be back later hopefully Djokovic makes this interesting.

Djoko at least making a fight of it, despite persevering with the (losing) drop shot.

Nadal holds 5-5

Nadal breaks 6-5

Disappointing service game hands Rafa the chance to serve for the title.

Remarkable Rafa 13th French Open - won’t see domination like this for many lifetimes.
4th time without dropping a set
Djokovic’s heaviest defeat in major finals

Well done, Rafa. Total annihilation and dominance.

Biggest anti climax ever. Awful final

No set drop guyssss...again

Well done Nadal, played brilliant but that’s about the worst I have ever seen from Djokovic. Unforced error after unforced error just handing points away.

Well done to Rafa Nadal on winning his 13th  French Open title. It takes him joint top of the tree with Roger Federer for most slam titles on 20.

I don't think Rafa had to be at his best to win today as Novak Djokovic was bizarrely flat and seemingly out of nick. He was blown away in the first two sets and at least made a fight of it in the third set but he just did not look like he had it in him physically or mentally to turn the match around.

Rafa remains untouchable on clay - the greatest of all-time on the red stuff.

A too-good-to-be-lucky 13th for Rafa at RG. Hint of a comeback by Djoko in that third set but it was not to be.

The UE count says it all. Just 14 from Rafa but 52 from Djoko.

The serving stats are significant, too. Novak only won 50% of the points when he got his first serve which is nowhere near good enough.

Playing against Rafa on clay, it might look like the opponent's making huge UEs but I think there were actually forced errors..the way the balls that keep coming back, u started to try to hit the line and overcooked the shots.

It’s ridiculous to think Sampras won 14 career majors but Nadal is now pretty much odds on win 14 French Opens

I was out and actually missed the first 2 and half sets, though judging from comments on here don't think I missed much.

Congratulations to Nadal though - astonishing achievement, both in terms of matching Federer's 20 slam haul and an unbelievable 13 French Open titles. We take it for granted with how good Nadal is but French Open is a tough slam to win, physically and mentally, and to win this 13 times is an amazing achievement, still going strong at age of 34. This time also without dropping a set.

On the match, whilst there were some enjoyable moments from when I saw it in closing stages, really does sound a damp squib with shocking number of unforced errors from Djokovic (52 in 3 sets is abysmal). In hindsight now I think it's a shame Tsitsipas didn't get through to final. It would have been the same outcome but there would have been more fight and spirit shown and a more competitive spectacle.

Will miss the tennis - been a real treat to see the coverage this year - has certainly livened up these days and made working from home that bit less of a chore!

Nadal then was pushed more by Sinner and Schwartzman than anyone else this year.

Congratulations to Rafael Nadal.  

It's very rare that I want him to win a match, but today I did.

No doubt there will be more GOAT debates now Rafa has caught Rog at the top of the GS leaderboard.

I certainly think Rafa and Novak are capable of further Slam wins. So the most-GS-title mark will go even higher.

And to think we once thought Roy Emerson's total of 12 was going to be difficult to beat.

52 unforced errors from Novak, that is scarcely believable from a word number one with 17 slams. Can’t get my head around that 52 number, really abysmal.

Hopefully he can bounce back and he has had an amazing year

Like Rafa Im still here,, thats my boy he WILL BE THE GOAT !!!! Gotcha Novak !!

Haddie-nuff wrote:Like Rafa Im still here,, thats my boy he WILL BE THE GOAT !!!! Gotcha Novak !!

On clay no doubt but overall a fair way behind Federer for me, his 8 Wimbledon titles are more significant than 13 at the French.

In YOUR opinion... He has 5 yrs on Federer .. dream on !!!

Haddie-nuff wrote: In YOUR opinion...  He has 5 yrs on Federer .. dream on !!!

Dream on? So you're a child then.

Work it out !!! I was on this forum when you had nappy rash

Huge congrats to Nadal on yet another FO. He is a pleasure to watch on Chatrier, it's just special for a lack of a better word. Novak was uncharacteristically poor and I do wonder if there was something bothering him. Maybe it was the weight of history trying to win the double career grand slam. I just get the impression that in recent Djoko's main motivation for playing has been to break as many records as he can and that this might have an adverse effect on him as he gets closer to these achievements. I don't so much get that vibe from Fed and Nadal who I think genuinely just love to play (and win) with the history books being secondary.

8 Wimbledon’s more significant than Rafas 13 French. That is the funniest thing I have read in a while. Sure Nadal beat Federer in Wimbledon final and Djokovic beat Federer in all 3 finals they met.

Nadal 13 finals 13 wins, even Novak with 8 finals and 8 wins in oz beats Federers Wimbledon record

quote="Soul Requiem"]

Haddie-nuff wrote:Like Rafa Im still here,, thats my boy he WILL BE THE GOAT !!!! Gotcha Novak !!

On clay no doubt but overall a fair way behind Federer for me, his 8 Wimbledon titles are more significant than 13 at the French.[/quote]

Pleased to see you Haddie-nuff. Laverfan posts very occasionally nowadays not sure how long the others have been around. I sort of joined towards the end of 606, then my tennis lounge and here. I remember Doug but he went silent some time ago. There was a group that supported Nadal and they left early on in the life of 606v2. Then there were the murraymoaners and they left later.

slashermcguirk wrote:
8 Wimbledon’s more significant than Rafas 13 French. That is the funniest thing I have read in a while. Sure Nadal beat Federer in Wimbledon final and Djokovic beat Federer in all 3 finals they met.

Nadal 13 finals 13 wins, even Novak with 8 finals and 8 wins in oz beats Federers Wimbledon record

quote="Soul Requiem"]

Haddie-nuff wrote:Like Rafa Im still here,, thats my boy he WILL BE THE GOAT !!!! Gotcha Novak !!

On clay no doubt but overall a fair way behind Federer for me, his 8 Wimbledon titles are more significant than 13 at the French.

[/quote]

Oh look the Djokovic fans are in full blown comedy mode.

Ah, I see the GOAT debate is already in full swing!

Comparing the value of each slam is a difficult thing. Rafa has, clearly, been unbelievable on clay at RG.

Fed has won three of the Slams at least five times. Djoko has eight Melbournes and five Wimbledons. They're all great figures.

We are really lucky that these guys are still around, still winning and sparking off the arguments.

You keep telling yourself that slashermouth... I think you will find the tennis history books will tell you differently.
It takes something special, no matter what the surface. to win the same tournament 13 times.
AND HE AINT FINISHED YET !!!!

Truth hurts.....grand slam head to head Djokovic 11 Federer 6. Grand slam finals Djokovic 4 Federer 1

quote="Soul Requiem"]

slashermcguirk wrote:
8 Wimbledon’s more significant than Rafas 13 French. That is the funniest thing I have read in a while. Sure Nadal beat Federer in Wimbledon final and Djokovic beat Federer in all 3 finals they met.

Nadal 13 finals 13 wins, even Novak with 8 finals and 8 wins in oz beats Federers Wimbledon record

quote="Soul Requiem"]

Haddie-nuff wrote:Like Rafa Im still here,, thats my boy he WILL BE THE GOAT !!!! Gotcha Novak !!

On clay no doubt but overall a fair way behind Federer for me, his 8 Wimbledon titles are more significant than 13 at the French.

[/quote]

Oh look the Djokovic fans are in full blown comedy mode. [/quote]

8 Wimbledon’s is all good and well until you also say Federer has lost 4 finals at Wimbledon.

Nadal hasn’t ever been close to losing a French Open final

13-0 > 8-4

Different players different talents all remarkable. I sort of thought Nadal would just keep on going when the Nadal naysayers said he wouldn't last and would grind his body into the dust.

You do realise I said Nadal winning 13 French opens is incredible and way ahead of Federer winning 8 Wimbledon’s. I think you were mixing me up with someone else

quote="Haddie-nuff"]You keep telling yourself that slashermouth... I think you will find the tennis history books will tell you differently.
It takes something special, no matter what the surface. to win the same tournament 13 times.
AND HE AINT FINISHED YET !!!![/quote]

Oioi wrote:Huge congrats to Nadal on yet another FO. He is a pleasure to watch on Chatrier, it's just special for a lack of a better word. Novak was uncharacteristically poor and I do wonder if there was something bothering him. Maybe it was the weight of history trying to win the double career grand slam. I just get the impression that in recent Djoko's main motivation for playing has been to break as many records as he can and that this might have an adverse effect on him as he gets closer to these achievements. I don't so much get that vibe from Fed and Nadal who I think genuinely just love to play (and win) with the history books being secondary.

Could be onto something there. Novak does have a different approach to it than the other two, which may sometimes work against him.
Although I think in general, the greats want to go one better than their predecessor. Sampras was motivated by Borg/Emerson, Federer was motivated by Sampras, Rafa was motivated by Federer and Novak is motivated by both Rafa/Fed. I think it's easier to keep motivated when you're chasing the bar and more difficult too keep motivated to keep raising the bar, once you've beaten it. Sampras, for example, quit after winning the USO, when he probably would have had a good chance at Wimbledon for 2 or 3 more years - but he felt he'd done what he had to do.

Please sort out those quotes - some comments are getting confusing.

Now Ive rattled s few cages Ill retire JM for that Im sure you will be relieved... happy times eh ?? VAMOS RAFA

No name Bertie wrote:Please sort out those quotes - some comments are getting confusing.

It takes great mental strength to control the quote function in the midst of a fierce online battle!

Haddie-nuff wrote:Now Ive rattled s few cages Ill retire JM for that Im sure you will be relieved... happy times eh ??  VAMOS RAFA

An interesting approach to life Haddie

Also keep an eye on those weeks at world number one stats, tick tock

slashermcguirk wrote:Truth hurts.....grand slam head to head Djokovic 11 Federer 6. Grand slam finals Djokovic 4 Federer 1

quote="Soul Requiem"]

slashermcguirk wrote:
8 Wimbledon’s more significant than Rafas 13 French. That is the funniest thing I have read in a while. Sure Nadal beat Federer in Wimbledon final and Djokovic beat Federer in all 3 finals they met.

Nadal 13 finals 13 wins, even Novak with 8 finals and 8 wins in oz beats Federers Wimbledon record

quote="Soul Requiem"]

Haddie-nuff wrote:Like Rafa Im still here,, thats my boy he WILL BE THE GOAT !!!! Gotcha Novak !!

On clay no doubt but overall a fair way behind Federer for me, his 8 Wimbledon titles are more significant than 13 at the French.

Oh look the Djokovic fans are in full blown comedy mode. [/quote][/quote]

JuliusHMarx wrote:

Haddie-nuff wrote:Now Ive rattled s few cages Ill retire JM for that Im sure you will be relieved... happy times eh ??  VAMOS RAFA

An interesting approach to life Haddie

Well when you have been in lockdown as long as me Julius we have to get our laughs some how.. Im sure you remember the good old times with bogbrush and tenez Henman Bill and the like... those were the days when we kept you on your toes... but .. I wont trouble you again.. :-) stay safe

It's getting heated in here! For the goat race I think there's definitely an advantage to having a bar to chase. Federer probably thought he was home and dry at some point and was hard for him to keep the foot on the gas when you don't have anything to chase. The others possibly also drew inspiration from seeing it's possible to win in your mid to late 30s. Standing on the shoulders of giants comes to mind, I'm sure someone will come along and break the grand slam record set by the big 3 as again they'll have a target to reach.

Oioi wrote:It's getting heated in here! For the goat race I think there's definitely an advantage to having a bar to chase. Federer probably thought he was home and dry at some point and was hard for him to keep the foot on the gas when you don't have anything to chase. The others possibly also drew inspiration from seeing it's possible to win in your mid to late 30s. Standing on the shoulders of giants comes to mind, I'm sure someone will come along and break the grand slam record set by the big 3 as again they'll have a target to reach.

Mention of possible Slam record breaking reminds me of the fact - and forgive me for mentioning this again - that Sampras set the high-water mark of 14 GS in 2002.

Within SEVEN YEARS, a guy who had not won a single Slam by 2002 had overtaken the Sampras mark. What odds would you have got on that?

Obviously now, the mark is higher but you never know what's around the corner. Thiem was pretty knackered at RG this week but it's possible he could go on a great spree of GS winning - not only adding to his total but stopping the Big Two adding to THEIR totals.

Oioi wrote:It's getting heated in here! For the goat race I think there's definitely an advantage to having a bar to chase. Federer probably thought he was home and dry at some point and was hard for him to keep the foot on the gas when you don't have anything to chase. The others possibly also drew inspiration from seeing it's possible to win in your mid to late 30s. Standing on the shoulders of giants comes to mind, I'm sure someone will come along and break the grand slam record set by the big 3 as again they'll have a target to reach.

Doubtless one day.... but how long have you got .. ?? It speaks volumes when you think of Federer approaching 40 yrs old Novak and Rafa in mid 30's and nothing on the horizon comes close .. wake me up when it happens !!!

Records being broken are an inevitable part of sport, though I can't see Rafa's RG records ever being beaten tbh. For overall GS record is not such an impossible target imo, could take 30 or 40 years but someone will break it. Just imagine an era with a big 3 level player without a big 3 type rival, they could win over 30 slams as long as they had a target to motivate them.

My view, for what it is worth, is it will be many years before players like the top three we have now will emergel. They are an act that will be difficult to follow.. Glad I was around to see it

The breakdown on Nadal’s 100 wins at Roland Garros:
straight sets: 79
4 sets: 17
5 sets: 2
Opponent retires: 2

Just get a set is an achievement

Jeff Navarro wrote:The breakdown on Nadal’s 100 wins at Roland Garros:
straight sets: 79
4 sets: 17
5 sets: 2
Opponent retires: 2

Just get a set is an achievement

Quite remarkable stats. And here today, 15 years on from his first triumph at RG and at 34 years of age, I doubt he's played much better.

Who's the greatest?

Unless one of them has a clear lead over the others, then it's still up for debate. For me, winning one or two more majors than the other just gives you bragging rights nothing more. Just like Serena Williams, she has one more major than Steffi Graf, but I still rate Graf as the greater player and if someone rates Martina Navratilova as greater than either Graf or Williams, that's fine with me too. There's a whole career and other tournament wins to also consider.

As with beauty... its all in the eye of the beholder :-)

I think that is the best I can ever remember seeing Nadal play, particularly the first two sets. While looking back Djokovic played poor, Nadal took so much time away from him and he was just relentless making next to no mistakes.

It reminded me a bit of what Djokovic did to him in the final of the Australian Open in 2019 (6-3 6-2 6-3). In that match Nadal looked suffocated and had no answers.

Today Djokovic I think went for too much too soon in the rallies and he got desperate and hence the ridiculous number of unforced errors. Nadal missed nothing and that must be so hard to play against.

I think Djokovic had a real chance in that 3rd set, he should never have been broken at 5-5 and earlier in the set he had worked his way into a couple of Nadal service games only to hit unforced errors just when he could have planted a seed of doubt.

I think what disappointed me most about Novak was he was far too impatient, why not go into some long rallies? He is the one player that has been able to do that over the years but he pulled the trigger too quick time and again. I think maybe he was just shell shocked after the first couple of sets. In the first game in the match he was 40-15 up and was in other service games and inexplicably lost them. You just can’t give Nadal a lead like that on clay.

Overall Nadal was phenomenal and thoroughly deserved his win. I think the manner of this loss will hurt Novak but time and again the top 3 bounce back and I still think if they meet in Oz, Djokovic will fancy his chances.

Well done Rafa, 13 French opens is quite frankly ridiculous. Will never see the likes of that dominance again