England: Autumn Internationals

First topic message reminder :

England squad for autumn Tests:

Forwards: Jamie Blamire (Newcastle), Callum Chick (Newcastle), Jamie George (Saracens), Tom Curry (Sale), Trevor Davison (Newcastle), Nic Dolly (Leicester), Alex Dombrandt (Harlequins), Charlie Ewels (Bath), Ellis Genge (Leicester), Jonny Hill (Exeter), Maro Itoje (Saracens), Courtney Lawes (Northampton), Lewis Ludlam (Northampton), Joe Marler (Harlequins), George Martin (Leicester), Sam Simmonds (Exeter), Kyle Sinckler (Bristol), Will Stuart (Bath), Sam Underhill (Bath)

Backs: Mark Atkinson (Gloucester), Owen Farrell (Saracens), Tommy Freeman (Northampton), George Furbank (Northampton), Max Malins (Saracens), Jonny May (Gloucester), Raffi Quirke (Sale), Adam Radwan (Newcastle), Harry Randall (Bristol), Henry Slade (Exeter), Marcus Smith (Harlequins), Freddie Steward (Leicester), Manu Tuilagi (Sale), Joe Marchant (Quins), Ben Youngs (Leicester)

In Positions:
1.Marler, Genge
2.George, Blamire, Dolly
3.Sinckler, Stuart, Davison
4.Itoje, Hill
5.Lawes, Ewels
6.Curry, Martin
7.Underhill, Ludlam
8.Dombrandt, Simmonds, Chick

9.Youngs, Randall, Quirke
10.Smith

11.May, Radwan
12.Farrell, Atkinson
13.Tuilagi, Slade
14.Freeman, Marchant
15.Steward, Malins, Furbank
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England v Tonga - 6th November
England v Australia - 13th November
England v South Africa - 20th November

Blamire looking absolutely gassed as he fell over the line.

First England forward to score in 4 games in a row though!

No way!!!! He does it again!!!!

Honestly I'm buzzing for Blamire

Bet that line couldn't come fast enough

They really seem to love Blamire!

End of the day , this match more memorable for errors from both sides.

Except for the sight of the hooker "speeding" to the line in the dying seconds

32-15 about right in the end .

And no argument about man of the match

Heaf wrote:

Heaf wrote:Peyper not helped by allowing Oz to constantly give away pens with no YC warning ...

Oh and getting in Youngs way probably preventing a try in the first half ...

And in the second half.

Not perfect but Smith and Steward looked very good in their first games against strong opposition.

Rodd did really well overall.

I thought Sinckler had one of his best games for a fair while.

Dombrandt was bright from the bench.

I liked the Smith and Farrell partnership though I think it needs more running threat around it.

No 7&1/2 wrote:When does everyone say Slade is absolutely average in decision making.

That sentence is too long. He was probably England's worst back. I'm not sure why we persist with him.

Blamire looks like he'll be an ideal successor to George post the next world cup. Third choice until then and then he should be the competition for LCD thereafter.

England pretty much dominant throughout and felt Peyper was keeping Australia in it, a lot of blatant penalties that required TMO intervention.

Well deserved for Steward, he was a rock. Now can we put two wingers beside him please!

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Well deserved for Steward, he was a rock. Now can we put two wingers beside him please!

And drop Farrell

Although Slade needs replaced aswell

Congrats England, not a classic by any means but a good win

GeordieFalcon wrote:

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Well deserved for Steward, he was a rock. Now can we put two wingers beside him please!

And drop Farrell

Preferably drop Slade for me. Back to top quality opponents and he disappeared.

Old Man wrote:Congrats England, not a classic by any means but a good win

Indeed - match of the day was Ireland v NZ by a mile ....

Compared with the Ireland match, England were playing a different game.  They were so conservative - they could have gone for try rather that kicking everything.

Liked Dombrandt's cameo and I think Curry played at O/S.

It was a decent overall performance but Curry and Tuilagi need to shift position, it just doesn't work. Slade should only be playing if Tuilagj is in the centre, with Farrell at 12 he brings no point of difference.

9.Youngs
10.Smith
11.May
12.Farrell
13.Tuilagi
14.Radwan
15.Steward

21.Quirke
22.Slade
23.Malins

If Farrell pulls up OK I'd love to see that against SA.

I hadn't realised that was England's 8th win against Australia in a row!

No 7&1/2 wrote:

GeordieFalcon wrote:

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Well deserved for Steward, he was a rock. Now can we put two wingers beside him please!

And drop Farrell

Preferably drop Slade for me. Back to top quality opponents and he disappeared.

Totally agree...we need to find Slades replacement. He butchered a couple of moves today...

But I was concerned by Farrell also....

king_carlos wrote:9.Youngs
10.Smith
11.May
12.Farrell
13.Tuilagi
14.Radwan
15.Steward

21.Quirke
22.Slade
23.Malins

If Farrell pulls up OK I'd love to see that against SA.

I think we'll see that...but bar the first 20 where Farrell was ok...I just done get his place in the side.

His attempted tackle when chasing back on an Aussie break was not even school boy level...

Youngs never really plays with any tempo.

Easy win taking over any doubts from the ref is great. Just cannot see that team being the one who takes on SA next week.

It was a strangely dissatisfying game. England beat them at a canter, but it could have been an absolute massacre if England have been more accurate.

I think Australia for all their smarts were just not able to manage with the withdrawals and injuries. It was a desperately poor team that they put out against England today.

I love Facebook...criticise Faerrell and your accused of being an uneducated, football fan with no clue...

lostinwales wrote:I think Australia for all their smarts were just not able to manage with the withdrawals and injuries. It was a desperately poor team that they put out against England today.

Yes, missing Tupou, Kerevi, Cooper and Koroibete has taken the sting our of their attack, they also lost physicality and game management because of it, but also consider they have been fortunate to play the majority of their tests (bar a couple in NZ) at home for the past two years.

Winning away from home isn't that easy.

Well England won in the end I did think at one tine Australia in the second half would come back and sneak a win. what with the penalty's going back and forth.

I thought the Blamire try at the end was a great bit of play, he was really blowing when he touched down.

Well played England 8 out of 8 against Australia now.

Finally watching it through.

About 11:16 into the match. Steward is on the ground with the ball just in front of the Oz line. Beale actually kicks him in the arse. I don't think he noticed

king_carlos wrote:I hadn't realised that was England's 8th win against Australia in a row!

Including two Lions victories in 2013, Ben Youngs has now been on the winning side against Australia 13 times, which must be a record for any Northern Hemisphere player. Dan Cole is not far behind.

Just finished watching it properly. Steward deserved MoM. He's very good.

The two tries were good ones, but it was not a great match.

Despite the failure to score more points it was a good day for some of the new guys and the less heralded. Hill was very good. Dombrandt looked the part as did Blamire, couple of dodgy lineouts notwithstanding. Rodd was decent and did everything asked of him and I liked how Sinckler took more of leadership role in the pack.

Australia really got on the bad side of a very pedantic ref, but they were idiots. On the bright side their defense was often good and that monster pack did show its worth in defensive mauls, but in general they were either easily shut down or managed to find new ways to shoot themselves in the foot.

I did see a stat that said that in 80 minutes Australia spent 27s inside the England 22.

lostinwales wrote:Just finished watching it properly. Steward deserved MoM. He's very good.

The two tries were good ones, but it was not a great match.

Despite the failure to score more points it was a good day for some of the new guys and the less heralded. Hill was very good. Dombrandt looked the part as did Blamire, couple of dodgy lineouts notwithstanding. Rodd was decent and did everything asked of him and I liked how Sinckler took more of leadership role in the pack.

Australia really got on the bad side of a very pedantic ref, but they were idiots. On the bright side their defense was often good and that monster pack did show its worth in defensive mauls, but in general they were either easily shut down or managed to find new ways to shoot themselves in the foot.

I did see a stat that said that in 80 minutes Australia spent 27s inside the England 22.

Not a great game. But, for me one of the gratifying aspects was that none of the newer/younger/less experienced players appeared out of their depth. Rodd was fine, Blamire OK (and liked the try), Dombrandt good, and let's not forget this was Smith's first cap against the big boys. And the players with short cameos, each looked comfortable, with the topper being Simmonds pick-up and off load for Blamire's try. Quirke didn't have much opportunity to show what he can do, but made a couple of difficult catches.

Certainly they should have gotten over the line more, but a solid foundation upon which to build.

Early days for Quirke but he looked quite natural at this level. He's really quick around the park and has great service (you could notice the step up in this area from Youngs, who played well tbh). His few box kicks were pretty much on the money too.....I hope he stays around the squad.

Was also impressed by the way Smith got up after being smashed by the Oz centre, who hurt himself in the process. He's going to get a lot of that over the v years but seems to be tougher than he looks. Tackle stats looked good too 8 made 1 missed.

Another thing. Hill's break that lead to him getting held up over the line. Can't help feeling it would have been better for us had he been brought down just before the line than just over it. I know rules change but its one of those things that doesn't quite feel right.

Charlie Morgan in the Telegraph reckons Tuilagi played mostly in his usual centre role, while Slade covered like a full back, and Steward was positionally more of a winger.

Hard to get too excited about that game, as the Wallaby team is not their full strength side. We should get a better idea of life after the South African match. While they are down a few players too, they have still been winning.

Will be interesting to see what we do against SA. Marler gets out of isolation back end of the week and you'd think even with limited training he'll start. Rodd was very good though.

I'm glad Steward is getting the plaudits he deserves, great having a proper full back again.

Suggestion is that Farrell is not badly hurt, but I would not be surprised to see George out. Underhill may be 50/50 which would be a loss, but might mean we start with a more balanced back row.

England looked better with Dombrandt on at 8 - he is in control of the ball at the back of the scrum, which Curry isn't - and he stands where the scrumhalf expects his no 8 to be.  Dombrandt also offers a line out option which takes away the need to have a second row at 6.  Simmonds did more offensively in 7 minutes than Lawes has in 2 games.  A backrow of Curry Dombrandt and Underhill with Simmonds to come on where needed, looks to have a lot better balance.  It also enables Lawes to compete for a second row spot, meaning we don't need the underwhelming Ewels on the bench.

Did Manu do anything playing on the wing that he wouldn't do playing at centre?  England must also have one of the slowest backlines in world rugby.  Steward took his try well, but outright speed isn't one of his strong points.  Please lets have Manu in the centre with either Farrell or Slade, and then Radwan on the wing.  I would imagine Mapimpi must be licking his lips at the prospect of matching up against Manu next week.

Interesting watching the game here in NZ with Oz commentators. They loved the ref! Agreed with all his calls and thought he had a really good game... I think that says enough about his performance though.

Overall a good win for England but when we failed to take a few chances early in the match and when Oz realised how much they could get away with in defence it became very scrappy, England trying a bit too hard at times and Oz able to mess up a lot of their attacks illegally.

Few points:
Manu must go to back to the centre, so much of his talent is wasted on the wing and a better opponent would have caused more damage down his side.
Curry has to move to flanker or bench. Dombrandt showed what you get from an actual 8, his contribution was far more telling.
Steward was great, so good under the highballs and his try was brilliant.
Smith had an up and down game but showed a lot of potential, when he hits a purple patch he changes the whole game as well. He's a match winner.
Hill finally looked like an international lock.

For the next game i'd have:
6. Lawes
7. Underhill
8. Dombrandt
20. Curry

10. Smith
11. May
12. Faz
13. Tuilagi
14. Radwan
15. Steward

No Curry? Second name on the team sheet for me.

Jones' is blatantly targeting this match to put a marker down. He'll still be fuming over how the WC final went; he promised that each match would bring a better performance and we'll need it at least in the scrum this Saturday. This is one of those weeks where he'll earn his wage, need to go into the match in a better frame of mind where there were too many who bottled it. Tactics will be interesting, is he going to be saved the climb down over wing and centre with a Farrell injury and is he going to move Lawes into the second row or will he be trying to negate the SA lineout?

Andrew Brace this weekend for those official spotting.

SA are the best side in the world, it's going to take a monumental effort to turn them over as we don't quite look like ready. Either way, it's a great learning curve for some of the new guys involved.

Not sure I agree with that Sgt, they have just finished 3rd in the RC. Even before that they've been top 5 but not sure I've seen them as the best in the world for a while.

I don't think best side in the world means much at the moment.

SA didn't play last year, they played OZ and NZ in OZ, OZ looked great in the second test vs SA, comfortably beating them. The other three losses the Boks had was within a score and the two vs OZ and NZ was lost by a penalty in the last minute.

Then consider Australia has struggled away from home on this tour.

Home advantage is a real thing.

Plus the Boks don't have Faf, PSDT, Snyman or Kolbe.

Noenaber is likley to play a woeful Jantjies at nine against England, whilst Kwagga has played well he doesn't have the impact of PSDT, Snyman is a big loss, not only for his set piece prowess but he is our most skilled forward and best ball carrier.

Le Roux and Pollard is not in good form.

England should be able to beat this Bok team not only because it is a home, but because our attack is toothless at the moment, we are scoring half the tries we did in 2019 against top teams.

The interesting thing about this match is we really don't have much of a clue what Eddie Jones will do with the line-up. We also don't know everyone who will be free of Covid and any residual impact, if any. Up in the air...

yappysnap wrote:
Curry has to move to flanker or bench.
For the next game i'd have

20. Curry

Bench our best player....? Really?

SA are the best team in the world and extremely difficult to beat. I'd fancy us to turn over the AB's most of the time, especially with the way they're currently looking.

SA are just a different beast for me....we can't physically dominate them like we can other sides, we need to play differently which is on Eddie.

I don't particularly put much on the Rugby Championship in terms of where a side is. Even Aus looked pretty good....they're not.

Underhill is not going as well as we know he can, Curry at 7. Underhill either benched or dropped from the 23 and Simmonds or Ludlam promoted.

Agree, Slade to bench, Manu 12 if Farrell crocked and Marchant at 13 or Manu at 13 if OF fit. Radwan at 14.

Sgt_Pooly wrote:SA are the best team in the world and extremely difficult to beat. I'd fancy us to turn over the AB's most of the time, especially with the way they're currently looking.

SA are just a different beast for me....we can't physically dominate them like we can other sides, we need to play differently which is on Eddie.

I don't particularly put much on the Rugby Championship in terms of where a side is. Even Aus looked pretty good....they're not.

I always fancy us to beat South Africa but regardless of their form it normally takes a special performance to overcome New Zealand.