Pacquiao Retains P4P#1 Status: Do you agree with The Ring's points?

First topic message reminder :

THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT THEY CONSIDERED FOR RETAINING PACQUIAO'S STATUS AS THE POUND FOR POUND KING.

Pacquiao wasn’t fighting a chump. Marquez is the No. 5 fighter in the world pound for pound. And Pacquiao beat him, at least officially.

A great fighter shouldn’t necessarily be demoted because another great fighter has his number. We didn’t think less of Muhammad Ali because he had trouble with Ken Norton three times. The same with Willie Pep and Sandy Saddler in their series.

A fighter shouldn’t necessarily be demoted because he has an off night, if that’s what it was on Saturday. Sergio Martinez didn’t look great against Darren Barker but no one clamored for him to be demoted.

Pacquiao has accomplished more than Mayweather in recent years. The Filipino is 9-0 against big-name opponents since the beginning of 2008; Mayweather is 3-0 in that time.

Mayweather isn’t exactly coming off a sterling performance. He looked good against Victor Ortiz for three-plus rounds but scored a knockout when Ortiz wasn’t looking.

And you can’t say that Mayweather should supplant Pacquiao because he defeated Marquez more easily. That doesn’t take into account styles and strengths. Plus, Pacquiao beat Ricky Hatton and Oscar De La Hoya more easily than Mayweather did.

rowley wrote:

ShahenshahG wrote:

rowley wrote:

oxring wrote:

rowley wrote:Bible of Boxing, dear god has there ever been a more puke inducing self important tagline for a magazine. The Ring is third in a three horse race when it comes to boxing magazines.

Which 2 above it? Boxing monthly and boxing news I assume?

Absolutely, both are a country mile in front of the ring, Boxing News by as wide a gap as you could ever hope to see. To be honest would be almost tempted to put Frank Warren's column in the Sun above the Ring.

Surely you mean below the ring - or are you usually upside down when you wipe your behind?

I like to experiment with different methods.

Did you buy the sun or did you just navigate to it online and wipe it with your laptop screen

Fists of Fury wrote:

oxring wrote:

88Chris05 wrote:

OasisBFC wrote:of course manny should remain top.
it's POUND FOR POUND.

manny has gone from light welter to light middle in a short time (yes...catchweight, i know).

and according to the score cards manny beat marquez who is a VERY good opponent. far better than ortiz or mosley.

Jumping weight divisions doesn't automatically consitute being the 'pound for pound' champion. Far from it, in fact; give me Carlos Monzon's career over Oscar De la Hoya's any day of the week.

Pacquiao scraped past Marquez with a huge slice of luck - Mayweather absolutely dominated him from start to finish. As I said, I wouldn't argue too much for or against either man, but Pacquiao doesn't necessarily have an edge just because he's moved through divisions.

And technically - the original p4p man, for whom the title was invented - was awarded it in large part, due to his stylistic magnificence at 1/2 weights.

The title was not accorded/invented for Hammering Hank.

Who's this Hammering Hank you speak of?

Lol. There's no colour footage of him, so he probably didn't exist to be honest. I wouldn't worry about him fists.

Henry Armstrong.

88Chris05 wrote:

OasisBFC wrote:of course manny should remain top.
it's POUND FOR POUND.

manny has gone from light welter to light middle in a short time (yes...catchweight, i know).

and according to the score cards manny beat marquez who is a VERY good opponent. far better than ortiz or mosley.

Jumping weight divisions doesn't automatically consitute being the 'pound for pound' champion. Far from it, in fact; give me Carlos Monzon's career over Oscar De la Hoya's any day of the week.

Pacquiao scraped past Marquez with a huge slice of luck - Mayweather absolutely dominated him from start to finish. As I said, I wouldn't argue too much for or against either man, but Pacquiao doesn't necessarily have an edge just because he's moved through divisions.

while i see your point, i dont agree.
comparing mayweather's win to manny's isn't relevant. its about the styles. marquez wasn't conditioned anywhere near as well as he was for saturdays fight. he was slow and out of shape. he put the weight on beautifully for this fight.

manny destroyed hatton in less than 6 minutes. putting him down 3 times. its irrelevant. he put mosley on his backside and scared the crap out of him meaning he covered up for the rest of the fight.

just because manny made a human punch bag out of marg, and mayweather then fights marg and it's not as one sided doesn't mean mayweather is worse than manny.

the 2 fighters have completely different styles and can't be judges on their shared opponents. they have to be judges on their victories, and while manny has been more active, destroying everyone with ease apart from marquez, mayweather has been in and out of the ring for too long between fights.

if floyd was more active he'd be number one in a heartbeat for me.

Scottrf wrote:Henry Armstrong.

Was my sarcasm lost on you, scotty?

Guilty, wasn't following every post.

Fists of Fury wrote:

Scottrf wrote:Henry Armstrong.

Was my sarcasm lost on you, scotty?

The Galveston Giant wrote:Can i ask why Hatton was shot against Pacquiao but not against Mayweather.

Hatton was coming off the back oh is best career wins, was a 2 weight wordl champion and still undefeated and generally beleived he was invincible.

FLoyd utterly dominated him, and he was never the same afterwards. His homecoming agains the special Juan and a laboured victory over feather fisted malignaggi showed this.


I think shot against manny is going to far. Lets not forget at the start of the second he did have some joy with manny, before that left hand from hell. He just went about the fight all wrong in hindsight. Though at the time everyone still believed Manny to be a smaller man and his true welterwieght power wasnt widely acknowledged.

Hatton was not the same fighter, and we could speculate his out of ring "habits" may go back to this time, but equally he fought the wrong tactics against and caught manny at the wrong time, Roach and Arum knew that hatton was tailor made to make him look good, but perhaps even they didnt think hatton would be so bad defensively.

Hatton, as with Cotto, came across Manny at the very wrong time, when he truly was at the peak of his powers in my view.

He had some serious energy back then and was an absolute buzzsaw throwing outrageous amounts from outrageous angles (something which the apparent slight decline in his legs is preventing him from doing quite so much now).

That is why any FMJ fight should have happened after Cotto, to give us a real idea of their standing and not one that may be masked slightly by a decline in one or both of the fighters.

Always had Mayweather no 1......and he still is.....

The ring aren't doing anything controversial and I can't blame them..but as Oscar tweeted that he basically thought the decision was scandalous...I think we know how they actually feel..

I suppose you have to base it off the official result. Even had Marquez been given the decision he deserved I would probably have put him 3rd and Pacquiao second. In the true meaning of pound for pound Pacquiao has acheived more and I still believe hes a better fighter than Marquez. Marquez has the individual style to beat Pacquiao but if you put the up against the same opponents over the same timeframe I think Pacquiao comes out ahead, especially considering the weights he has fought at.

i think it's not so bad keeping pacquiao at number 1 pound for pound but mayweather should be elevated to number 1 in the welterweight rankings

i dont think mayweather deserves #1 even if manny did get a gift vs marquez. mayweather didnt exactly beat ortiz convincingly - it was a farcical ending to a fight where even if mayweather was picking ortiz off, ortiz was bullying floyd at times.
mayweather gets #1 back if/when he beats manny or cleanly beats a couple of top guys at 147 or 154 IMHO