Super XV Week 5 Preview and Live Match Thread

[Pete C (Kiwireddevil)]

First topic message reminder :

After the opening four weeks of the 2012 Super XV 70% of matches have seen a team win by 7 points or less. Only the Highlanders and the Stormers remain unbeaten, and only the Rebels are yet to win a match.

Points table after round 4
Australian Conference

Position	Team	Played	Wins	Losses	Draws	Byes	Points For	Points Against	Points Difference	Bonus Points	Total
1	Reds	4	3	1	0	0	93	74	19	1	13
2	Brumbies	3	2	1	0	1	65	69	4	1	13
3	Waratahs	4	1	3	0	0	93	83	10	4	8
4	Rebels	3	0	3	0	1	51	79	-28	2	6
5	Western Force	4	1	3	0	0	77	120	-43	1	5

New Zealand Conference

Position	Team	Played	Wins	Losses	Draws	Byes	Points For	Points Against	Points Difference	Bonus Points	Total
1	Highlanders	4	4	0	0	0	87	77	10	0	16
2	Chiefs	4	3	1	0	0	101	78	23	2	14
3	Hurricanes	4	2	2	0	0	119	105	14	2	10
4	Crusaders	3	1	2	0	1	62	69	-7	2	10
5	Blues	4	1	3	0	0	78	98	-20	1	5

South African Conference

Position	Team	Played	Wins	Losses	Draws	Byes	Points For	Points Against	Points Difference	Bonus Points	Total
1	Stoprmers	3	3	0	0	1	81	55	26	0	16
2	Bulls	3	2	1	0	1	92	61	31	2	14
3	Sharks	4	2	2	0	0	84	75	9	3	11
4	Lions	3	1	2	0	1	75	87	-12	1	9
5	Cheetahs	4	1	3	0	0	100	128	-28	2	6

Matches
Blues vs Hurricanes
The injury and suspension-hit Blues are currently sitting bottom of the New Zealand conference after a disappointing start to the 2012 season. The Hurricanes have performed better than expected so far; though they will be disappointed to have lost at home to the high-flying Highlanders last week.

For the Blues Isaia Toeava has been diagnosed with a stress fracture in his hip that looks like ending his season. Keven Mealamu (calf-strain), Luke Braid (suspension) and Rene Ranger (suspension) are all out, while Gareth Anscombe (nose fracture) drops to the bench meaning ex-Hurricane Piri Weepu starts at 10 inside Ma’a Nonu. Tony Woodcock is available for the first time this season and wingers David Raikuna and Rudi Wolf return from injury, but the Blues still have 3 Wider Training Group players on their bench.

By contrast the Hurricanes are virtually unchanged from last week, the only change could come at loosehead where Ben May is bracketed with Michael Bent,

Most of the UK bookmakers have the Blues as strong favourites, but personally I would tip the ‘Canes. Though over recent years both teams have been experts of doing the exact opposite of what’s expected of them. Hurricanes by 7.


Rebels vs Western Force
Melbourne sees a battle of the cellar-dwellers this week, the winless 13th placed Rebels host the last placed Force. The Rebels have a very classy backline, but their pack has been found wanting at times this season. A home loss to South African strugglers the Cheetahs last week will have wounded their pride. The Force upset the Waratahs in Sydney at the weekend and they will be keen to notch up another crucial away win in Melbourne.

Kurtley Beale is expected to miss another match for the Rebels with his calf strain, as is Stirling Mortlock, but Sale-bound Danny Cipriani is recovered from the flu and may well start after coming off the bench well at the weekend.

The Force have made two changes to the starting fifteen who beat the Waratahs with winger Nick Cummins returning and prop Pek Cowan rotating to the bench. Skipper David Pocock will be a key for the Force as they seek to starve the Rebels of possession.

Expect this to be a close one. Rebels by 2.


Waratahs vs Sharks
After a slightly disappointing start to the season the highly fancied Sharks find themselves in third in the South African conference as they start their four match Australasian tour in Sydney. The Waratahs will be smarting after their loss at home to the Force last week that leaves them third in the Australian conference, one spot behind the Sharks overall. The Sharks have not won in Sydney since 2000.

The Waratahs have delayed naming their starting side due to a number of injury concerns, but will welcome Wycliff Palu back to the side, and will be captained by prop Benn Robinson as Berrick Barnes is to move into fly half, displacing captain Daniel Halangahu. Brendan McKibbin starts at scrum half ahead of the impressive Sarel Pretorius.

The Sharks have injury concerns in their front row with both their tightheads, Jannie du Plessis and Wiehahn Herbst doubtful forcing them to fly in emergency cover, but du Plessis is named to start. Jandre Marais is rewarded with a start at lock after scoring in last week's win over the Reds. Freddie Michalak stays on the bench, while JP Pietersen is not quite fit enough to return to the playing 22.

On the “if in doubt pick the home team” rule, Waratahs by 5.


Crusaders vs Cheetahs
The Crusaders play their first match at Rugby League Park this weekend, their first match in Christchurch since 2010. After a couple of narrow losses before their bye last week, they need some home points at the expense of the Cheetahs. The Cheetahs managed to pick up their first win of the season in Sydney last week, but have never won a Super Rugby match in New Zealand and lie 2nd-to-last in the competition.

Daniel Carter is back in red and black for the first time this season and will come off the bench, while Israel Dagg moves to fullback after three matches on the wing with Sean Maitland and Zac Guildford on the wings. Tom Taylor moves in to first five eighth in place of the dropped Tyler Blayendaal while Ryan Crotty returns from injury at second five eighth. In the forwards Sam Whitelock returns at lock while his younger brother Sam takes older brother George’s number 6 jersey.

Naka Drotske has tinkered slightly with the side that beat the Waratahs, dropping WP Nel and Davon Raubanheimer. Heinrich Brussow will be a key man for Cheetahs up against Matt Todd.

As long as the Crusaders can overcome the emotions on their return to Christchurch they should win comfortably. Crusaders by 12.


Brumbies vs Highlanders
The unbeaten Highlanders fly to Canberra to take on the Brumbies this week, seeking to stay at the top of the table. The ACT side have picked up a pair of narrow wins at home in the early weeks, but lost to an injury time try in Hamilton last week. Jake White will be happy at sitting second in the Australian conference, given the team’s lack of star names.

The Brumbies have made minor changes to the side that lost to the Chiefs with Sam Carter returning at lock, pushing Peter Kimlin to the blindside flank.

Jimmy Cowan makes his first start of the season for the Highlanders pushing young star Aaron Smith to the bench. Ben Smith returns from injury at fullback, allowing Colin Slade to move up to first five eighth in place of Lima Sopoaga who injured his shoulder last week. James Haskell remains on the bench.

The Brumbies are always tough to beat at home, but this Highlanders team has the talent to do it. Highlanders by 7.


Bulls vs Reds
The injury-plagued Reds travel to Pretoria this week for a match that could be a real clash of styles. The Queenslanders sit at the top of the Australian conference though they have less competition points than the Bulls who are currently the second-placed South African side.

The Bulls welcome Francois Hougaard and Johan Saadie back from suspension and injury respectively in the only changes to the starting fifteen who beat the Blues.

The Reds on the other hand currently have three injured fly-halves in Quade Cooper, Mike Harris and Ben Lucas so they have been forced to call up rookie Dallan Murphy, regarded as a strong ball-runner. Luke Morahan replaces the suspended Digby Ioane in a massively re-jigged backline. The news is better in the forwards where Wallabies Saia Faingaa and Ben Daley return to the front row, and Rob Simmons is back at lock. Radike Samo drops to the bench as he will be covering both the back row and the outside backs on what Ewan McKenzie called a “four and a half-two and a half bench.”

Sadly the Reds’ injuries rather diminish what could have been a cracker of a match. Bulls by 10.


Lions vs Stormers
The Stormers are currently trailing the Highlanders on tries scored in the overall competition table, and they will be looking to keep the pressure on the southerners when they visit the injury-plagued Lions at Ellis Park. Promising New Zealand referee and former Chiefs’ first five eighth Glen Jackson will referee his second Super match after impressing in the Stormers vs Blues match last week.

John Mitchell has re-shuffled his backline this week, and has added scrum-half to his long list of positions plagued by injury. Butch James starts again at 10 with Elton Jantjes still injured, Tian Meyer replaces Michael Bondesio at 9 while Doppies la Grange moves in one to 12 and Jaco Taute shifts from 15 to 13.

The Stormers by contrast are unchanged, Allister Coetzee opting to retain the side that accounted for the Blues last week.

The Lions’ injury list suggests they will have a tough time this week, even though they are at home. Stormers by 7.


Bye
Chiefs

[Biltong]

Problem though Taylorman, the confidence in the Brunbies are building, the highlanders need to break it.

[Full Credit]

Wouldn't I love it if that screaming woman in the crowd would put a sock in it.

[aucklandlaurie]

These Highlander forwards are going to have to work a lot harder with no Adam Thompson about.

[Taylorman]

Yes the coach influence is apparent with several teams this year. For us the Canes are a completely different module under Hammett. Much more structure and composure than the star days of the last few seasons.

The Chiefs have gone up a notch under Smith and Rennie. The Highlanders are getting stronger under Joseph. The Saders need more time to be the same as usual and the Blues under Lam have got considerably worse.

7 in it now...

[Biltong]

That injury to slade looks bad.

It looked like his ankle is broken in the tackle by McCabe.

Luckily Pat Mcabe immediately called for the referee to stop play before the players hit the ruck en masse.

Smart play there by McCabe.

[Full Credit]

Yes, a pretty innocuous tackle but sometimes legs just get caught in the wrong position. I'm still getting over an injury in the NRL last night where the bone was clearly sticking out.

[Biltong]

My sportsguru predictions are going from bad to worse.

[Taylorman]

Yeah me too. Its been a weird competition so far...

[Biltong]

Well the Bulls are surprisingly running the ball. Little kicking but too many errors.

Bulls already penalised twice at the scrum.

[Biltong]

The Bulls indisculine is costing them scoring opportunities. If they aren't making handling mistakes they go in from the side at the attacking rucks or off their feet.

Against the Reds it is dangerous.

score 3-3 and the Bulls have been making all the play.

[GunsGerms]

any links for bulls reds?

[Biltong]

Rdes very unlucky there. Ndungane dives short of the line, stretches out, still short then in a second movement rolls the ball back.

TMO is asked wether it is a try in the first instance and he answers.

"The ball was short, BUT the ball was not knocked on."

Firstly it isn't in his power to say that, and apart from that if he wanted to say anything he should have said 2nd movement and should have been a penalty to the Reds.

Bulls get a scrum and scores a try.

Bulls lead 16-3

[Biltong]

Sorry leinster, the link I have won't work unless you have a DSTV subscription.

[GunsGerms]

no worries cant find one anywhere.

[Full Credit]

check your pm leinster

[Biltong]

good try by the Bulls, Steyn is actually impressing me for the first time in a long time

[Full Credit]

I missed the first half Bil but that try looked all too easy.

[Biltong]

The first half was much of the same as the second half so far, only the bulls should have scroed at least 2 more tries.

They controlled possession and territory completely, but made many mistakes.

[Biltong]

Pierre Spies is having a good game as well.

Long time since he made meters in contact

[Biltong]

The Bulls are now just monstering the Reds.

[Full Credit]

I think Ewen McKenzie's going to be walking around Brisbane asking people off the street if they want a starting spot such is the injury list. The reds just look a combination of inept and disinterested so far this season.

[Biltong]

Yeah, the injuries has not been kind to them, brilliant try by the Bulls.

[Full Credit]

Rod Davies at fullback, sheesh, that bloke couldn't stop a runny nose.

[Biltong]

Try for the Reds. Geez they needed that just to get some respectability in the score.

[Biltong]

Another try for the Bulls 44-8

[Pete C (Kiwireddevil)]

Ouch.

[Biltong]

yeah, now 61-8

[Taylorman]

Missed this one Biltong. I know Reds had a couple of injury issues but this years comp seems to have no rhyme nor reason to it.

You mentioned Steyn. I was quite impressed with him in an earlier match in that he seems to thrive on go forward ball with some good link work in keeping the ball flowing- something I hadnt seen much of against us.

Overall two good weekends in a row for SA sides. NZ and Oz left scratching their heads again.

For the Blues Lam really is a lamb and for that outfit far more discipline is required in terms of structure and until then their year will be about 'having a go' whenever and wherever.

Strange year we are in for alright...

[Biltong]

I was actually impressed with a couple of old stalwarts.

Hougaard did not have his best game, his passing was often very inaccurate and if it wasn't for the good hands of the bulls they could have dropped a lot of balls.

Steyn lloked very good, ran into space a few times and one of his quick offloads created a beautiful try, he wasn't standing so deep and kicked little compared to usual.

SPies was very physical and gained ground every time he touched the ball.

The Reds did well in the first half compared to the second, but then perhaps you could blame it on the Bulls making plenty mistakes.

[Biltong]

Players who are hitting form on the SA side.

Dean Greyling, Kitshoff, Bismarck, Jannie de Plessis, Eben Etsebeth, Andries Bekker, Juandre Kruger, Heinrich Brussow, Pierre Spies, Dewald Duvenhage, Hougaard, Morne Steyn, Patrick Lambie, Bryan Habana, Bjorn Basson.

[B91212]

Wow , didn't see the Bulls Reds result coming. That's the best I've ever seen Steyn play with ball in hand and even Spies made a telling impact. That looked like a conscious decision to play a more expansive game from the Bulls as opposed to just running the ball once they realised the Reds hadn't turned up. The Reds were awful mind, I know injuries have hammered them but they looked totally un-interested. Really looking forward to the Stormers Bulls game next week now.

[Biltong]

The fact is Meyer on basis of that performance will look at Morne Steyn as his flyhalf without a doubt.

I just hope he can play that way for the Springboks.

[B91212]

Players who are hitting form on the SA side.

Dean Greyling, Kitshoff, Bismarck, Jannie de Plessis, Eben Etsebeth, Andries Bekker, Juandre Kruger, Heinrich Brussow, Pierre Spies, Dewald Duvenhage, Hougaard, Morne Steyn, Patrick Lambie, Bryan Habana, Bjorn Basson.

The form and ability of Kruger comes as no surprise to me being a Northampton Saints fan. A second row combination of him and Bekker is one to build the SA pack around in my opinion.

[aucklandlaurie]

Thank god to the person that thought about giving points for the draw,With the Blues having a draw this week it means they double their points.

[Rory_Gallagher]

Who are the standout performers overall so far in the Super XV? I know it is a bit early to ask, but I am interested to hear

[Biltong]

You talking team or players?

[Rory_Gallagher]

Players - who should us up north be fearing?

[aucklandlaurie]

Rory
You got nothing to fear from the Blues.

[Biltong]

Supersport does a Super XV team after every weekends performance, they also do a Bokbarometer of the South Africanse that performed according to them on that weekend.

Here are the two lists for last weekend.

Super XV for week 4:
15. Riaan Viljoen (Sharks) 14. Cory Jane (Hurricanes) 13. Tamati Ellison (Highlanders) 12. Sonny Bill Williams (Chiefs) 11. Willie le Roux (Cheetahs) 10. James O’Connor (Rebels) 9. TJ Perenara (Hurricanes) 8. Matt Hodgson (Force) 7. David Pocock (Force) 6. Adam Thomson (Highlanders) 5. Brodie Retallick (Chiefs) 4. Eben Etsebeth (Stormers) 3. Ben Tameifuna (Chiefs) 2. Bismarck du Plessis (Sharks) 1 Arizona Taumalolo.

Bok Barometer for week 4:
15. Riaan Viljoen (Sharks) 14. Bryan Habana (Stormers)* 13. Robert Ebersohn (Cheetahs), 12. Jean de Villiers (Stormers) 11. Willie le Roux (Cheetahs) 10. Johan Goosen (Cheetahs) 9. Charl McLeod (Sharks) 8. Keegan Daniel (Sharks) 7. Duane Vermeulen (Stormers) 6. Heinrich Brussow (Cheetahs) 5. Andries Bekker (Stormers) 4. Eben Etsebeth (Stormers) 3. Jannie du Plessis (Sharks) 2. Bismarck du Plessis (Sharks) 1. Steven Kitshoff (Stormers)


Thos past weekend there were a number of other South Africans that I expect to be in the Bok barometer after this weekend.

Morne Steyn, Pierre Spies, Juandre Kruger, Dewald Duvenhage

[aucklandlaurie]

Biltong is that you guys discriminating against the coloureds again-No one from the Reds or the Blues.

[Biltong]

rory if you want to know more and read the superwraps of previous weekends to keep tabs on which players are showing form or had a good weekend then here is a link.

SUPERWRAP

[Rory_Gallagher]

Hmm I find it strange that Daniel is playing at 8.. Alberts, Kankowski, Deysel, all those guys seem way more suited there than Daniel? Always thought he was a 7 (or 6, for you guys ). Interesting to hear that Pierre Spies has played well, I have never been really impressed by him. Seems to be so many more talented back rowers for SA.

Also I think Duane Vermeulen is a good player, has he any chance of starting for the boks XV?

[Biltong]

Biltong is that you guys discriminating against the coloureds again-No one from the Reds or the Blues.

Laurie, I'll speak to them and tell them it doesn't matter if the Blues and Reds are struggling, they should still select 3 from each team.

[Rory_Gallagher]

rory if you want to know more and read the superwraps of previous weekends to keep tabs on which players are showing form or had a good weekend then here is a link.

SUPERWRAP

Thanks a bunch!

[aucklandlaurie]

Thats what we want ,equal opportunity,because this on merit criteria aint working.

[Biltong]

Hmm I find it strange that Daniel is playing at 8.. Alberts, Kankowski, Deysel, all those guys seem way more suited there than Daniel? Always thought he was a 7 (or 6, for you guys ). Interesting to hear that Pierre Spies has played well, I have never been really impressed by him. Seems to be so many more talented back rowers for SA.

Also I think Duane Vermeulen is a good player, has he any chance of starting for the boks XV?

Back row is a problem in the sense that there are so many.

Historically PDV picked Schalk Burger, Heinrich brussow, Pierre Spies, Ryan Kankowski, Ashley Johnson, Juan Smith, Franscois Louw, Willem Alberts, Jean Deysel, Duane Vermeulen and the retired Danie Rossouw, there are a number of new kids on the block as well, Josh Strauss and a few others.

The big question is whether Heyneke Meyer is going to look for a specialist fetcher or 3 allround mobile backrowers.

It depends on his view. Combinations will most likely be the most important factor.

[fa0019]

I find it amazing how the reds get 1 or 2 injuries and suddenly the S15 champs are conceding 60 points to a not so thought of team (at the moment).

The bulls took their chances but you have to question the heart of the reds... it wasn't even a contest come the 60th min. A social side would have put piled on the points to that red's side.

In terms of the SA players the question is if you're good enough should you be capped if you're only in your first season for instance?

Kitsoff & Estebeth are quickly showing themselves to be up there with the best props & locks respectively in the competition let alone SA.... is it too early for them for test honours??? Kitsoff is only 19.

Perhaps a little too early for the ENG series & the 4N but they should certainly be blooded on the AI tour to gain vital experience. Remember Frans Steyn touring Europe in 06.... without which I doubt he could have gone on to have the impact he did just one year later.

I'm not particulaly worried about next week and the bulls coming to the Cape. Ok they played well but I'd fancy our pack to dominate the bulls and when that happens the bulls become pretty impotent.

When was the last time anyone said that about the stormers... amazing how a few tweaks here and there can have significant impacts on results.

[Biltong]

Thats what we want ,equal opportunity,because this on merit criteria aint working.

I think here in the good R S of A we have had enough of equal opportunity, we want merit, WE WANT MERIT.

[aucklandlaurie]

how about it merits an opportunity?

[Biltong]

You are going to have to be a little more convincing with your argument.

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