Madigan v Jackson as back-up 10 for Ireland

First topic message reminder :

At risk of this thread degenerating into a Leinster-Ulster slanging match, there might be some discussion on whether Jackson or Madigan should be the back-up to Jonny Sexton next year.

Putting provincial bias aside, Madigan was one of the few Irish players to emerge with some credit from last weekend's fiasco in Rome and was one of the few Irish players to pose an attacking threat to the Italians. Jackson, apart from kicking his goals, was poor and whether he was following instructions or not, standing 10 metres or more deep from scrums and rucks meant that we never stood any chance of posing an attacking threat. Jackson has, however, been getting regular game time for Ulster but isn't trusted to take the goal kicks except Pienaar isn't playing.

Madigan, in contrast, only starts for Leinster when Sexton is either on international duty or injured, but he will get a lot more game time next season when Sexton is in France. When he does play either from the start or from the bench he is invariably very good, playing flat and getting the back line moving, scoring tries regularly (15 for Leinster in Rabo and HC in past two years) and a consistent goal kicker. Madigan's one weakness might be his line kicking and generally kicking out of hand.

Each one has strengths and weaknesses, but for me Madigan has fewer weaknesses and has aspects to his game that (try scoring) that Jackson doesn't have. This isn't meant to be a putdown of a young player, but Jackson does not inspire confidence and I think Madigan will bring more variety and speed to the 10 position for Ireland. Ulster folk will no doubt disagree but if you do, please detail where you believe Jackson is a superior player to Madigan.

The Great Aukster wrote:First of all I thought it was disgraceful how O'Shea set out to undermine Jackson with his review. I don't recall him commenting on how far back Sexton stood against South Africa or ROG all his career. Maybe Kidney told Jackson to stand there because that was where Murray was used to passing the ball! What was so hypocritical of O'Shea was that when Jackson came in he was the cheerleader for giving the young guy support for the remaining games.

Of course Kidney should have picked Madigan for the Scotland game, but Deccie obviously bottled it, as he couldn't drop ROG for a second string Leinster 10, but he might just get away with picking the Ulster starter. Thankfully PJ is a resilient player and that is why he will be great.

The coaches obviously see something in Jackson that they don't see in others. He was Ruddock's first choice in the U20s, Humphreys' choice at Ulster (over his brother), and Kidney's choice as backup. The only logical reason is that the coaches see him as someone who delivers their gameplan.

OTOH Madigan looks far more a maverick, with inevitable peaks and troughs in performance. The All Blacks picked Mehrtens over the ridiculously talented Spencer, because they needed his consistency and ability to deliver the plan rather than go off on a whim. Right now Madigan looks far more of a 12 than a 10, but that's not to say with the experience and responsibility that he will get next year (especially with Goperth around) that he could become an exceptional outhalf.

Right now Ireland should go with the more experienced 10 () as back-up - Jackson.

Didn't read or hear O'Sheas comments as I've decided to boycott all Irish rugby related media/propaganda but thats an excellent post Aukster .

On O'Shea...hate to do this folks (well actually it's rather a nice feeling) but I did tell you all so when he was being stuffed with praise as he sits in command of the RTE studio discussions tut tutting Hook, Pope and any other poor normal mortal soul that turns up to spin an opinion. Em, Hook may bluster and do the histionics...Hook has also been much more accurate about the rights and wrongs of this Irish side than O'Shea has ever come close to being.

O'Shea is comfortable, he waffles, he knows he doesn't want to fix anything with an Irish tag on it, he knows he has it made in England (well, until England crumbled to the Welsh....!).

Anyway, the whole Irish media have gone mad contradicting themselves.

Tony Ward said if was a disgrace the abuse and pressure Kidney is picking up for his coaching frailties.... and he then goes on to pinpoint 5 or 6 things that needs to change if Ireland are to succeed. One of them is that Kidney must now realise his time is up..we have to move on.

That's all most of the 'abusers' have been saying. That's all I've heard. I don't do the twitters and facebook - maybe it's more cruel there - but all I've heard is frustrations that Kidney must go based on the continuing downhill roll of the International team.

But Tony is right in his assessment and we're wrong in our opinions

Have to say O'Shea came across as a bit of a tool in that review - which was very disappointing.

Obviously been spending too much time with Hook and McGurk

At least Hook is funny

McGurk on the other has no redeeming features...waste of good oxygen imv

geoff998rugby wrote:Have to say O'Shea came across as a bit of a tool in that review - which was very disappointing.

Obviously been spending too much time with Hook and McGurk

At least Hook is funny

McGurk on the other has no redeeming features...waste of good oxygen imv

No, he's been spending too much time mis-reading games. I've always found it so easy to understand why he's a director rather than the on-field coach. But maybe that's just me and my foibles.