Loosehead choices for the Lions tour to Australia

by maestegmafia Thu 28 Mar 2013, 7:36 pm

Six nations is done. We are a year on since I last held one of these polls and the long term aim was to compare what we selected a year out, a month out and the final squad.

You can pick one player only as your first choice.

I think I have grabbed most of the names in the hat, though my apologies if anyone you consider worthy has been forgotten, if you ask nicely then I am sure one of our excellent moderators might take the time to be kind enough to offer their much valued assistance.

The players included either showed in the Six Nations squads or have been regularly talked of as prospects on the various threads on here.

Hookers - https://www.606v2.com/t42471-hooker-choices-for-the-lions-tour-to-australia

Tightheads - https://www.606v2.com/t42486-tighthead-choices-for-the-lions-tour-to-australia

Lock No. 4 - https://www.606v2.com/t42501-number-4-lock-choices-for-the-lions-tour-to-australia#1956467

Lock no. 5 - https://www.606v2.com/t42502-number-5-lock-choices-for-the-lions-tour-to-australia

Blindside Flanker - https://www.606v2.com/t42514-blindside-flanker-choices-for-the-lions-tour-to-australia

Openside Flanker - https://www.606v2.com/t42515-ospenside-flanker-choices-for-the-lions-tour-to-australia#1956975

Number 8 - https://www.606v2.com/t42518-number-eight-choices-for-the-lions-tour-to-australia#1958144

Scrumhalf - https://www.606v2.com/t42531-scrumhalf-choices-for-the-lions-tour-to-australia

Flyhalf - https://www.606v2.com/t42539-flyhalf-choices-for-the-lions-tour-to-australia#1958609

by **LondonTiger** Thu 28 Mar 2013, 8:52 pm

This is a better thread than the more limited one currently below this.

For me Paul James.

by bedfordwelsh Thu 28 Mar 2013, 9:00 pm

I am with LT for me it would be James but I guess it will be Healy or Jenkins

by Big Mac Michael Thu 28 Mar 2013, 9:07 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOPBwC0ZITs
You must be taking the P!$$,Healy has gotten man of the match against Australia everytime he's played them.

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 28 Mar 2013, 9:18 pm

Cian Healy would have been my 1st choice but he went down in my estimations for his stomping. Gethin had a great 6N but he'll be struggling for high intensity rugby between now and the tour.

Hence I voted for Grant, he had a great 6N, he is good in the scrum and puts a huge shift in when the ball is loose.

by **LondonTiger** Thu 28 Mar 2013, 9:24 pm

Big Mac Michael wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOPBwC0ZITs
You must be taking the P!$$,Healy has gotten man of the match against Australia everytime he's played them.

Cian Healy - 3 matches vs Aus, a win a draw and a loss.

really impressed that Healy got MotM in the drawn game where Ireland lost 3 of 7 scrums and Australia won all 7 of theres. He must have been a demon in loose play.
Shocked he got MoTM in the defeat where two tries and 4 penalties beat 5 Sexton penalties.
Could have sworn SOB got MoTM in the RWC win over Aus.

by **LondonTiger** Thu 28 Mar 2013, 9:28 pm

My reasons for Paul James:

I want a strong scrummaging frontg row. Healy is good, but more of an allrounder. Gethin really struggled in Paris while James was outstanding.

So my starting front row would have James and Jones propping and probably Best just ahead of Hibbard.

If we decide to go for all-rounders then I would have Healy with Hibbard and Cole.

However I expect to see Gethin selected - unless he is in the Toulon squad for the T14 play-offs, then he may have too much ground to make up by the time he joins the squad.

by Scrumdown Thu 28 Mar 2013, 9:31 pm

My token irishman for the Lions test xv is sexton. Tough on farrell but the thought of healy being taken to the cleaners by a pitiful aussie scrum would be just too much to stomach.

Has to be g jenkins.

by bedfordwelsh Thu 28 Mar 2013, 9:36 pm

LT,

I couldn't agree more, for me James is a far better technical scrummager tahn Healy or Jenkins but not as mobile in the loose.

That said a props main job is to scrum scrum then scrum again anything else is a bonus.

by maestegmafia Thu 28 Mar 2013, 9:56 pm

bedfordwelsh wrote:LT,

I couldn't agree more, for me James is a far better technical scrummager tahn Healy or Jenkins but not as mobile in the loose.

That said a props main job is to scrum scrum then scrum again anything else is a bonus.

James through his weight around well in the loose against the Scots. He has a good all round game. What he doesn't have on Jenkins is the intelligence that Jenkins has. Jenkins makes tries, scores tries, gives his team a chance.

Healy a mix of the two, I have seen him Scrummage well, also poorly. He can be a monster in the loose, probably a better ball carrier than James.

Tough call...

by bedfordwelsh Thu 28 Mar 2013, 10:00 pm

Despite James being my choice I dont think he will tour, I think it will be Healy Jenkins and Grant though Jenkins could miss out of course due to Toulon being involved in domestic competition

by **LondonTiger** Thu 28 Mar 2013, 10:03 pm

bedfordwelsh wrote:Despite James being my choice I dont think he will tour, I think it will be Healy Jenkins and Grant though Jenkins could miss out of course due to Toulon being involved in domestic competition

Agreed I doubt James will tour. Of course if he doesn't and we lose, well you and I can say I told you so Wink

by bedfordwelsh Thu 28 Mar 2013, 10:05 pm

LondonTiger wrote:
bedfordwelsh wrote:Despite James being my choice I dont think he will tour, I think it will be Healy Jenkins and Grant though Jenkins could miss out of course due to Toulon being involved in domestic competition

Agreed I doubt James will tour. Of course if he doesn't and we lose, well you and I can say I told you so

You bet LT Hug

by maestegmafia Thu 28 Mar 2013, 10:05 pm

bedfordwelsh wrote:Despite James being my choice I dont think he will tour, I think it will be Healy Jenkins and Grant though Jenkins could miss out of course due to Toulon being involved in domestic competition

They won't let us down any of those.

Must say though I think young Mako Vunipola is not a bad option, if for whatever reason those more experienced are unable. He has made some impressive performances this season for Saracens and has done ok in his bit part on the larger stage behind Marler.

Definitely one for the next Lions NZ Tour in 2017.

by **LondonTiger** Thu 28 Mar 2013, 10:07 pm

Mako still needs to work on fitness and technique at the scrum, but agreed by 2017 he could be a monster. (The sort of player the press often erroneously claimed Sheridan to be)

by UlstermaninGlasgow Thu 28 Mar 2013, 10:10 pm

Having seen how many tackles he made, and how he made short work of most of the 6N TH props, bar Jones, my vote goes to Ryan "Wolfman" Grant and his lumberjack beard...

In fact I'd go for Grant, Hibbard and Jones. Not only is it a damn destructive front row, but the hair would scare the bejeasus out of the Aussies!

by maestegmafia Thu 28 Mar 2013, 10:13 pm

LondonTiger wrote:Mako still needs to work on fitness and technique at the scrum, but agreed by 2017 he could be a monster. (The sort of player the press often erroneously claimed Sheridan to be)

Well they do look similar though Mako's hair is a shade or two darker than Sheri's mouse brown...

by maestegmafia Fri 29 Mar 2013, 7:58 am

The players I think we all thought would be favourites are taking the lead. Paul James is getting some valued support..

by Guest Fri 29 Mar 2013, 8:35 am

UlstermaninGlasgow wrote:In fact I'd go for Grant, Hibbard and Jones. Not only is it a damn destructive front row, but the hair would scare the bejeasus out of the Aussies!

Good reasoning laughing

. I'm on board.

by maestegmafia Fri 29 Mar 2013, 8:40 am

Risca Rev wrote:
UlstermaninGlasgow wrote:In fact I'd go for Grant, Hibbard and Jones. Not only is it a damn destructive front row, but the hair would scare the bejeasus out of the Aussies!

Good reasoning . I'm on board.

I was down there last year and the beard thing is very trendy in Sydney and Melbourne... We need more than just big hair

by geoff998rugby Fri 29 Mar 2013, 9:27 am

A lot depends on whether Corbo is fit or not

If he is I would take Healy, Grant, Corbo

If he isn't then one of the Welsh boys (not Bevington)

by maestegmafia Fri 29 Mar 2013, 9:39 am

geoff998rugby wrote:A lot depends on whether Corbo is fit or not

If he is I would take Healy, Grant, Corbo

If he isn't then one of the Welsh boys (not Bevington)

Have to agree about Corbisiero great player.

Grant too, there is a lot of good competition for spots at loosehead prop. I wouldn't write off the Welsh lads though. They did very well in the six nations.

Bevington is probably not so well known but is a good scrummager and a great loose player. A bit of a wildcard suggestion but his style could be very useful down under on hard pitches. Very quick for a prop too, ask the Ulster fans.

by maestegmafia Fri 29 Mar 2013, 5:49 pm

Here is last years poll

https://www.606v2.com/t26788-loosehead-prop-choices-of-the-home-nations?highlight=Choices+of+the+Home+Nations

by thebluesmancometh Fri 29 Mar 2013, 6:17 pm

Healy and Jenkins are pretty nailed on (despite ropy 6N form from both)

A third choice would be a difficult decision, Corbisiero hasn't played enough, and I wouldn't consider him, Grant is showing some real promise, but does he compare with James/Sheridan who are both destructive scrummagers???

I'd probably opt with James, purely because Sheridans been out of the int fold for too long, and James club form has been as good as anyones, very unlucky not to be starting over Jenkins for Wales!!!

by bedfordwelsh Fri 29 Mar 2013, 6:23 pm

Blues,

I said all through the 6 nations that James should have started for us and I would take him to Oz without shadow of a doubt but I have a sneaky feeling he won't go.

I wasn't a fan of Jenkins being picked over him as he came into the championship with very little gametime behind and that could be the same leading into the Lions.

That said I do think his performances improved every game so maybe if he can get a run of games for Toulon (unlikely I know) then he certainly still has theexperience and know how to de very well on the trip if he gets the nod (dependant on when Toulons season finishes)

by thebluesmancometh Fri 29 Mar 2013, 6:27 pm

bedfordwelsh wrote:Blues,

I said all through the 6 nations that James should have started for us and I would take him to Oz without shadow of a doubt but I have a sneaky feeling he won't go.

I wasn't a fan of Jenkins being picked over him as he came into the championship with very little gametime behind and that could be the same leading into the Lions.

That said I do think his ~~performances~~ conditioning improved every game so maybe if he can get a run of games for Toulon (unlikely I know) then he certainly still has theexperience and know how to de very well on the trip if he gets the nod (dependant on when Toulons season finishes)

Agree with every word except the changed one mate

Jenkins had 2 nightmare games in the AI's and finished strong, then was dire against Ireland, average the game after, showed some good signs then had a belter, it is so obvious his gametime has been the issue (not his quality) that IMHO the AI failures and First 40 minutes v Ireland have to be down to Howlers selection policy, same could be said of Warburton and Roberts who were all clearly unfit, untested and out of form! Tipuric and James have been overlooked for no reason, and James is still yet to get the chance to shine Tips has through sheer fortune!!

by reallybored Fri 29 Mar 2013, 7:39 pm

Healy and Jenkins are both nailed on, I think Healy shades it.

As back-up I'd go with Grant; more than solid in the scrum, grafts away in the loose and was part of the front-row that dominated Australia last summer for Scotland.

As dirt-tracker he'd be ideal, hasn't had a poor game in almost 12 months, will get on and do the job that's required.

by thebluesmancometh Fri 29 Mar 2013, 7:46 pm

reallybored wrote:and was part of the front-row that dominated Australia last summer for Scotland.

??? You mean the mudfest typhoon game where noone managed anything of any note?

by flyhalffactory Fri 29 Mar 2013, 8:27 pm

thebluesmancometh wrote:
reallybored wrote:and was part of the front-row that dominated Australia last summer for Scotland.

??? You mean the mudfest typhoon game where noone managed anything of any note?

Apart from us beating Australia you mean

by mikey_philVIII Fri 29 Mar 2013, 8:29 pm

I'd also opt for Healy, Jenkins and Grant. I like Marler but I don't think he has done enough to be considered for this tour.

by thebluesmancometh Fri 29 Mar 2013, 8:42 pm

flyhalffactory wrote:
thebluesmancometh wrote:
reallybored wrote:and was part of the front-row that dominated Australia last summer for Scotland.

??? You mean the mudfest typhoon game where noone managed anything of any note?

Apart from us beating Australia you mean

Yes thats the one, the game you played in a monsoon, against a double figure injury hit Australia team who rested no less than 8 starting team players for Wales the week after...

by maestegmafia Sat 30 Mar 2013, 2:07 pm

geoff998rugby wrote:A lot depends on whether Corbo is fit or not

If he is I would take Healy, Grant, Corbo

If he isn't then one of the Welsh boys (not Bevington)

What is the latest on Corbisiero ? ? ?

by maestegmafia Sat 30 Mar 2013, 6:17 pm

Despite all the furore around Healy a month or two ago, he seems to be very popular in this poll.

by Shifty Sat 30 Mar 2013, 6:42 pm

I'm taking a punt on Mako Vunipola Smile

by maestegmafia Sat 30 Mar 2013, 7:23 pm

Shifty wrote:I'm taking a punt on Mako Vunipola

Interesting call there Alun. Want to add some thoughts to your punt?

by flyhalffactory Sat 30 Mar 2013, 7:39 pm

thebluesmancometh wrote:
flyhalffactory wrote:
thebluesmancometh wrote:
reallybored wrote:and was part of the front-row that dominated Australia last summer for Scotland.

??? You mean the mudfest typhoon game where noone managed anything of any note?

Apart from us beating Australia you mean

Yes thats the one, the game you played in a monsoon, against a double figure injury hit Australia team who rested no less than 8 starting team players for Wales the week after...

So you mean the Oz tour side that we beat but you lost to (again.... still.....)

You can only play who is put in front of you............. excuses......... you can attempt to devalue it but the record will reveal how many SH sides we beat in the same time frame that you lost to

by maestegmafia Sun 31 Mar 2013, 8:21 am

THe Sheridan vote doesn't seem as strong here asa it does on other threads where his case is being plugged.

by maestegmafia Sun 31 Mar 2013, 1:57 pm

The Pack so far is looking like this

Cian Healy 41% 27
Rory Best 47% 28
Adam Jones 61% 30
Geoff Parling 15.4% 17
AW Jones 15.4% 17
Kelly Brown 28% 12
Justin Tipuric 43% 13
John Beattie 39% 12

by ChequeredJersey Sun 31 Mar 2013, 5:45 pm

Front row of Healey, Best, Jones for me, Cole, Grant and A.N Other on the bench

by ChequeredJersey Sun 31 Mar 2013, 5:46 pm

Ah, I see that's what the masses feel too

by maestegmafia Sun 31 Mar 2013, 6:00 pm

ChequeredJersey wrote:Ah, I see that's what the masses feel too

You are a smart man CJ. I would guess at that AN Other being Richard Hibbard looking at form and what the people say.

by maestegmafia Mon 01 Apr 2013, 1:19 pm

SYNOPSIS OF THE POLL SO FAR...

Forwards

Cian Healy 41% 31
Rory Best 49% 37
Adam Jones 62% 36
Richie Gray 16% 22
Geoff Parling 14% 23
Chris Robshaw 27% 16
Justin Tipuric 44% 22
John Beattie 37% 22 (Toby Faletau 1 vote short)

Backs

Ben Youngs 54% 27
Jonny Sexton 44% 18
Jamie Roberts is tied with Billy Twelvetrees 31% 4
Manu Tuilagi 50% 7 (Brian O'Driscoll is 1 vote short)

by maestegmafia Tue 02 Apr 2013, 7:56 am

Cian Heely out in front with a solid lead. Grant chasing him in second.

by maestegmafia Tue 02 Apr 2013, 6:03 pm

The poll is open until a week before the squad is announced, there is still a decent amount of rugby to be played and peoples thoughts and views may change. As it stands currently these are the Squad choices by the mob that contributes to 606V2.

I dont know the make up or how many he really will pick so i am just running with top three options...

Loosehead Prop 89 votes so far

Cian Healy 39
Ryan Grant 20
Gethin Jenkins 15

Hooker 92 votes so far

Rory Best 45
Richard Hibbard 21
Tom Youngs 11

Tighthead 74 votes so far

Adam Jones 47
Dan Cole 19
Euan Murray 4

Locks 144 votes so far over the two polls so averaging 72 Votes

Geoff Parling 29
Richie Gray 29
AWJ 21
Ian Evans 20

Blindeside Flankers 78 votes so far

Chris Robshaw 19
Kelly Brown 18
Sean O'Brien 17

Openside Flankers 74 votes so far

Justin Tipuric 33
Sam Warburton 14
Chris Robshaw 13 (leading the Blindside option)
Ross Rennie 8 (Next best after Robshaw)

Number Eight 73 votes so far

Toby Faletau 28
John Beattie 26
Ben Morgan 10

Scrumhalf 73 votes so far

Ben Youngs 38
Mike Phillips 20
Greig Laidlaw 10

Flyhalf 59 votes so far

Jonny Sexton 30
Owen Farrell 13
Dan Biggar 6

Inside Centre 53 votes so far

Billy Twelvetrees 11
Jonathan Davies 13 (Also 3rd in the outside centre Poll)
Matt Scott 11
Jamie Roberts & Luke Marshall 7 (If we were to consider JD2 at outside)

Outside Centre

Brian O'Driscoll 22
Manu Tuilagi 22
Jonathan Davies 9

Right Winger 44 Votes so far

Sean Maitland 22
Alex Cuthbert 11
Christian Wade 7

Left Winger 45 votes so far

George North 21
Tim Visser 8
Simon Zebo 5

Fullback 59 votes so far

Stuart Hogg 25
Leigh Halfpenny 22
Rob Keaney 7

by Pete C (Kiwireddevil) Wed 03 Apr 2013, 3:04 pm

The vote makes an interesting comparison with the London v2'ers drinks night selections https://www.606v2.com/t42351-v2-london-drinks-picks-the-lions-party-38

We weren't too far off the v2 combined wisdom! And people told us we were mad (well, we were drunk Wink

)!

(comments interspersed, preceded by ***)

maestegmafia wrote:The poll is open until a week before the squad is announced, there is still a decent amount of rugby to be played and peoples thoughts and views may change. As it stands currently these are the Squad choices by the mob that contributes to 606V2.

I dont know the make up or how many he really will pick so i am just running with top three options...

Loosehead Prop 89 votes so far

Cian Healy 39 *** Healy
Ryan Grant 20 *** Jenkins IF available
Gethin Jenkins 15 *** Grant

Hooker 92 votes so far

Rory Best 45 *** Hibbard
Richard Hibbard 21 *** Best
Tom Youngs 11 *** Youngs

Tighthead 74 votes so far

Adam Jones 47 ***Jones
Dan Cole 19 ***Cole
Euan Murray 4 *** we couldn't think of a 3rd one we liked so made a joke pick

Locks 144 votes so far over the two polls so averaging 72 Votes

Geoff Parling 29 ***Evans
Richie Gray 29 ***AWJ
AWJ 21 *** Launchbury
Ian Evans 20 ***Gray (if fit)/Hines

Blindside Flankers 78 votes so far

Chris Robshaw 19 *** Robshaw
Kelly Brown 18 *** SOB
Sean O'Brien 17 ***Brown

Openside Flankers 74 votes so far
*** we only picked 2 figuring on SOB/Robshaw/Brown covering both sides
Justin Tipuric 33 *** Tipuric
Sam Warburton 14 *** Rennie
Chris Robshaw 13 (leading the Blindside option)
Ross Rennie 8 (Next best after Robshaw)

Number Eight 73 votes so far
*** only picked 2
Toby Faletau 28 ***Easter
John Beattie 26 *** Beattie
Ben Morgan 10

Scrumhalf 73 votes so far

Ben Youngs 38 *** Youngs
Mike Phillips 20 *** Laiflaw
Greig Laidlaw 10 *** Care

Flyhalf 59 votes so far

Jonny Sexton 30 *** Sexton
Owen Farrell 13 *** Farrell
Dan Biggar 6 *** Biggar

Inside Centre 53 votes so far
*** Only picked 2, Twelvetreees and Roberts
Billy Twelvetrees 11
Jonathan Davies 13 (Also 3rd in the outside centre Poll)
Matt Scott 11
Jamie Roberts & Luke Marshall 7 (If we were to consider JD2 at outside)

Outside Centre
*** only picked 2, Bod and Davies
Brian O'Driscoll 22
Manu Tuilagi 22
Jonathan Davies 9

*** Our 7 for the back 3 were Halfpenny, Maitland, North, Brown, Kearney, Gilroy, Bowe
Right Winger 44 Votes so far

Sean Maitland 22
Alex Cuthbert 11
Christian Wade 7

Left Winger 45 votes so far

George North 21
Tim Visser 8
Simon Zebo 5

Fullback 59 votes so far

Stuart Hogg 25
Leigh Halfpenny 22
Rob Keaney 7

by maestegmafia Thu 04 Apr 2013, 7:14 am

How many of you out on the hell raising lash discussing this kinda thing?

by **George Carlin** Thu 04 Apr 2013, 8:20 am

I actually think that our options here are excellent and any of Healy, Gethin or Grant would eat young James Slipper for breakfast.

My preference is still for Stompy Stomperson but I am putting more and more stock in a calm head and experience and nobody in the front row has more test experience than Jenkins. Would be happy with either.

Ryan Grant is the most improved NH front row player of the past 5 years and won't let anyone down. He hasn't moved an inch against the Wallaby, Fijian, Samoan and Northampton front rows in the past year.

by Pete C (Kiwireddevil) Thu 04 Apr 2013, 10:35 am

maestegmafia wrote:How many of you out on the hell raising lash discussing this kinda thing?

That was 4 of us (myself, Asbo, Hound of Harrow & Hound's mate Andy). Any more cooks and the discussions might have gone on all week!

by **George Carlin** Thu 04 Apr 2013, 10:41 am

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:How many of you out on the hell raising lash discussing this kinda thing?

That was 4 of us (myself, Asbo, Hound of Harrow & Hound's mate Andy). Any more cooks and the discussions might have gone on all week!

Measured, Funny, Sarcastic and, er, Andy. That's just about all of the poster food groups covered.

by maestegmafia Fri 05 Apr 2013, 6:13 am

George Carlin wrote:
Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:How many of you out on the hell raising lash discussing this kinda thing?

That was 4 of us (myself, Asbo, Hound of Harrow & Hound's mate Andy). Any more cooks and the discussions might have gone on all week!
Measured, Funny, Sarcastic and, er, Andy. That's just about all of the poster food groups covered.

Sounds fun.

Keep us posted on the next if I'm in town ill pop along.

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