Khan side stepping Alexander for Mayweather....

First topic message reminder :

stupid.... because he will be out of the ring for a total of 13 months by the time he meets Floyd in May 2014

wise... because its too dangerous a fight to take when he could miss out on a potential £10 million payday

hypercritical... because he has always claimed to be the best in the division but this represents a clear duck

In my view Khan needs to face and beat Alexander in December. He still has not proven himself imo. Winning a belt and looseing it just as quickly does not make him a genuine p4p contender. According to the Mirror the Alexander fight is truely off and Khan will now wait for Money May.

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

TopHat24/7 wrote:

STC wrote:

azania wrote:It isn't feasible for him to fight middleweights. He isn't even a lmw.

How is it feasible for Roberto Duran to fight Hagler in 1983 for the world middleweight titles but not for Mayweather to do it now?

Do different rules apply to Mayweather than to other great fighters?

 

Because Duran was way past his best and would fight anyone for the right money at that time. A better question would be why didn't Marvin Hagler step up to LH in his prime?

Way past his best?

He must have been a walking corpse 6 years later then when he beat Iran Barkley to win the WBC middleweight title.

But it's different for all the other fighters, they can fight bigger men, Mayweather can't though (even though he just has). He can fight smaller men like Marquez, that's ok.

Martinez is not a large middleweight anyway. But we can't expect Floyd to concede anything to an opponent. That's not fair, it's asking too much of the best fighter of his generation.

Mayweather has been fighting 'bigger men' for the best part of the last 10 years. He just beat a guy that supposedly outweighed him by 20 lbs!

Duran started at LW and fought at MW.
Mayweather started at FW and fights at LMW.

Let's face it some people won't be happy until he loses. If Floyd beat Golovkin and Martinez those same people would be calling for him to fight Ward or Froch. Making the best P4P fighter take circus fights against much bigger men cheapens the whole sport.

Straw man argument.

If he can fight Alvarez no problem, he can fight Martinez too. Fighters have been fighting opponents above their weight class since the sport began, it's nothing new. Asking Mayweather to fight Martinez is entirely reasonable.

Nobody is calling for him to go any higher than that and you suggesting that they will is ridiculous.

Rum do when fans are more concerned with what is physically viable for a fighter than seeing them in exciting, risky fights.

catchweight wrote:It seems like people are just afraid Mayweather will lose and dont want him to test himself. Hes a class fighter so surely people should want to see just how far he can go and how brilliant he can be. Instead they seem more concerned about where places in some fictional list and how taking a risky fight might jeopardise this. He beat Alvarez easily despite being outweighed. Why not Golovkin or Martinez?

Exactly.

There are no competitive fights at welterweight or light middleweight. Martinez is a real test, a 50/50 fight. That's what boxing fans should be asking for, a competitve fight.

Is fighting the likes of Khan really what people want to see? Mayweather isn't going to be around for much longer. We've already been denied the Pacquiao fight(s). We have the opportunity to see one of the world's greatest fighters in some great fights. Some people just don't want to see them though.

TopHat24/7 wrote:

azania wrote:It isn't feasible for him to fight middleweights. He isn't even a lmw.

As someone went to great lengths to emphasise on another thread, LMW is everything between 147 and 154, Floyd comfortably fits into that category.  He may be a small LMW but he is a LMW - he is certainly not a small WW, that's just you doing your classic wumming again, needing to push a point a mile to the extreme to gain an inch to the reasonable.  The fact he had a several inch reach advantage fighting a fully fledged LMW in his last fight tells you that.

Ideally Floyd will want to fight at WW because he can comfortably make 147 and then be big at the weight, that makes plenty of sense, but that doesn't mean he's not a LMW.

I would agree with Az here, in todays climate Mayweather is more of a light welterweight than a welterweight, if 150lbs is big at welterweight I do not know what you've been watching for the past 10 years. Clottey, Margarito and Williams were big for Welterweight, weighing in anywhere between 155lbs and absurdly about 165lbs when Williams fought Quintana first time out.

I'd have seen it as 50:50 a few years back. One guy looks as good as ever, one looks kippered to me. Genuinely think manny and khan might be more competitive.

Having said that, I still think its a viable fight and would add to floyd's legacy... if he gives a monkey's about such things

Hammersmith harrier wrote:

TopHat24/7 wrote:

azania wrote:It isn't feasible for him to fight middleweights. He isn't even a lmw.

As someone went to great lengths to emphasise on another thread, LMW is everything between 147 and 154, Floyd comfortably fits into that category.  He may be a small LMW but he is a LMW - he is certainly not a small WW, that's just you doing your classic wumming again, needing to push a point a mile to the extreme to gain an inch to the reasonable.  The fact he had a several inch reach advantage fighting a fully fledged LMW in his last fight tells you that.

Ideally Floyd will want to fight at WW because he can comfortably make 147 and then be big at the weight, that makes plenty of sense, but that doesn't mean he's not a LMW.

I would agree with Az here, in todays climate Mayweather is more of a light welterweight than a welterweight, if 150lbs is big at welterweight I do not know what you've been watching for the past 10 years. Clottey, Margarito and Williams were big for Welterweight, weighing in anywhere between 155lbs and absurdly about 165lbs when Williams fought Quintana first time out.

Alvarez was the first fight I've seen in a long time where Floyd looked 'small'. He looked physically matched/equal (or better) in Guerrero, Ortiz, Cotto, Mosley and Hatton and certainly the bigger man in JMM. He's fully matured into his physique as a WW now.

TopHat24/7 wrote:

Hammersmith harrier wrote:

TopHat24/7 wrote:

azania wrote:It isn't feasible for him to fight middleweights. He isn't even a lmw.

As someone went to great lengths to emphasise on another thread, LMW is everything between 147 and 154, Floyd comfortably fits into that category.  He may be a small LMW but he is a LMW - he is certainly not a small WW, that's just you doing your classic wumming again, needing to push a point a mile to the extreme to gain an inch to the reasonable.  The fact he had a several inch reach advantage fighting a fully fledged LMW in his last fight tells you that.

Ideally Floyd will want to fight at WW because he can comfortably make 147 and then be big at the weight, that makes plenty of sense, but that doesn't mean he's not a LMW.

I would agree with Az here, in todays climate Mayweather is more of a light welterweight than a welterweight, if 150lbs is big at welterweight I do not know what you've been watching for the past 10 years. Clottey, Margarito and Williams were big for Welterweight, weighing in anywhere between 155lbs and absurdly about 165lbs when Williams fought Quintana first time out.

Alvarez was the first fight I've seen in a long time where Floyd looked 'small'.  He looked physically matched/equal (or better) in Guerrero, Ortiz, Cotto, Mosley and Hatton and certainly the bigger man in JMM.  He's fully matured into his physique as a WW now.

Mayweather rehydrates to 150lbs at the highest now Cotto, Ortiz, Mosley and Hatton all rehydrate to within 155lbs and 164lbs in Ortiz case.

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

TopHat24/7 wrote:

STC wrote:

azania wrote:It isn't feasible for him to fight middleweights. He isn't even a lmw.

How is it feasible for Roberto Duran to fight Hagler in 1983 for the world middleweight titles but not for Mayweather to do it now?

Do different rules apply to Mayweather than to other great fighters?

 

Because Duran was way past his best and would fight anyone for the right money at that time. A better question would be why didn't Marvin Hagler step up to LH in his prime?

Way past his best?

He must have been a walking corpse 6 years later then when he beat Iran Barkley to win the WBC middleweight title.

But it's different for all the other fighters, they can fight bigger men, Mayweather can't though (even though he just has). He can fight smaller men like Marquez, that's ok.

Martinez is not a large middleweight anyway. But we can't expect Floyd to concede anything to an opponent. That's not fair, it's asking too much of the best fighter of his generation.

Mayweather has been fighting 'bigger men' for the best part of the last 10 years. He just beat a guy that supposedly outweighed him by 20 lbs!

Duran started at LW and fought at MW.
Mayweather started at FW and fights at LMW.

For the sake of argument,

Duran's first fight was at 119 aged 16.
Mayweather's first fight was at 131 aged 19.

At 19 Duran was fighting at 130-133.
He fought for the 135 title at 21.
Mayweather at 25.

Duran fought for the 147 title at 29.
Mayweather fought for the 147 title at 29.

Duran fought for the 154 title at 30.
Mayweather fought for the 154 title at 30.

There's nothing between them.

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

TopHat24/7 wrote:

STC wrote:

azania wrote:It isn't feasible for him to fight middleweights. He isn't even a lmw.

How is it feasible for Roberto Duran to fight Hagler in 1983 for the world middleweight titles but not for Mayweather to do it now?

Do different rules apply to Mayweather than to other great fighters?

 

Because Duran was way past his best and would fight anyone for the right money at that time. A better question would be why didn't Marvin Hagler step up to LH in his prime?

Way past his best?

He must have been a walking corpse 6 years later then when he beat Iran Barkley to win the WBC middleweight title.

But it's different for all the other fighters, they can fight bigger men, Mayweather can't though (even though he just has). He can fight smaller men like Marquez, that's ok.

Martinez is not a large middleweight anyway. But we can't expect Floyd to concede anything to an opponent. That's not fair, it's asking too much of the best fighter of his generation.

Mayweather has been fighting 'bigger men' for the best part of the last 10 years. He just beat a guy that supposedly outweighed him by 20 lbs!

Duran started at LW and fought at MW.
Mayweather started at FW and fights at LMW.

For the sake of argument,

Duran's first fight was at 119 aged 16.
Mayweather's first fight was at 131 aged 19.

At 19 Duran was fighting at 130-133.
He fought for the 135 title at 21.
Mayweather at 25.

Duran fought for the 147 title at 29.
Mayweather fought for the 147 title at 29.

Duran fought for the 154 title at 30.
Mayweather fought for the 154 title at 30.

There's nothing between them.

And if Mayweather's career derails the same way as Duran's did then maybe we'll see him step up to MW.

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

TopHat24/7 wrote:

STC wrote:

azania wrote:It isn't feasible for him to fight middleweights. He isn't even a lmw.

How is it feasible for Roberto Duran to fight Hagler in 1983 for the world middleweight titles but not for Mayweather to do it now?

Do different rules apply to Mayweather than to other great fighters?

 

Because Duran was way past his best and would fight anyone for the right money at that time. A better question would be why didn't Marvin Hagler step up to LH in his prime?

Way past his best?

He must have been a walking corpse 6 years later then when he beat Iran Barkley to win the WBC middleweight title.

But it's different for all the other fighters, they can fight bigger men, Mayweather can't though (even though he just has). He can fight smaller men like Marquez, that's ok.

Martinez is not a large middleweight anyway. But we can't expect Floyd to concede anything to an opponent. That's not fair, it's asking too much of the best fighter of his generation.

Mayweather has been fighting 'bigger men' for the best part of the last 10 years. He just beat a guy that supposedly outweighed him by 20 lbs!

Duran started at LW and fought at MW.
Mayweather started at FW and fights at LMW.

For the sake of argument,

Duran's first fight was at 119 aged 16.
Mayweather's first fight was at 131 aged 19.

At 19 Duran was fighting at 130-133.
He fought for the 135 title at 21.
Mayweather at 25.

Duran fought for the 147 title at 29.
Mayweather fought for the 147 title at 29.

Duran fought for the 154 title at 30.
Mayweather fought for the 154 title at 30.

There's nothing between them.

And if Mayweather's career derails the same way as Duran's did then maybe we'll see him step up to MW.

Maybe we'll see it because Mayweather wants a challenge and another world title in another weight division.

Maybe we'll see him KO Amir Khan in 4 rounds.

Look at the condition Duran was in at middleweight and the success he had there, he was barely ever a welterweight and instead of growing into the higher weights he just got fatter.

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

TopHat24/7 wrote:

STC wrote:

azania wrote:It isn't feasible for him to fight middleweights. He isn't even a lmw.

How is it feasible for Roberto Duran to fight Hagler in 1983 for the world middleweight titles but not for Mayweather to do it now?

Do different rules apply to Mayweather than to other great fighters?

 

Because Duran was way past his best and would fight anyone for the right money at that time. A better question would be why didn't Marvin Hagler step up to LH in his prime?

Way past his best?

He must have been a walking corpse 6 years later then when he beat Iran Barkley to win the WBC middleweight title.

But it's different for all the other fighters, they can fight bigger men, Mayweather can't though (even though he just has). He can fight smaller men like Marquez, that's ok.

Martinez is not a large middleweight anyway. But we can't expect Floyd to concede anything to an opponent. That's not fair, it's asking too much of the best fighter of his generation.

Mayweather has been fighting 'bigger men' for the best part of the last 10 years. He just beat a guy that supposedly outweighed him by 20 lbs!

Duran started at LW and fought at MW.
Mayweather started at FW and fights at LMW.

Let's face it some people won't be happy until he loses. If Floyd beat Golovkin and Martinez those same people would be calling for him to fight Ward or Froch. Making the best P4P fighter take circus fights against much bigger men cheapens the whole sport.

Straw man argument.

If he can fight Alvarez no problem, he can fight Martinez too. Fighters have been fighting opponents above their weight class since the sport began, it's nothing new. Asking Mayweather to fight Martinez is entirely reasonable.

Nobody is calling for him to go any higher than that and you suggesting that they will is ridiculous.

No, the weight (20lbs difference) was a big deal vs Alvarez remember? Now people are asking Floyd to step up again. It is plainly ridiculous to expect the P4P#1, who happens to be a natural 140/147 lb'er to step up to 160lbs to fight a has-been and/or a virtual novice.

Using a clearly on the slide Duran as comparison, now that's a straw arguement.

Hammersmith harrier wrote:Look at the condition Duran was in at middleweight and the success he had there, he was barely ever a welterweight and instead of growing into the higher weights he just got fatter.

I know.

Imagine a fat Mayweather at middleweight. It's be like a mini version of James Toney at HW= embarrassing for Boxing.

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

TopHat24/7 wrote:

STC wrote:

azania wrote:It isn't feasible for him to fight middleweights. He isn't even a lmw.

How is it feasible for Roberto Duran to fight Hagler in 1983 for the world middleweight titles but not for Mayweather to do it now?

Do different rules apply to Mayweather than to other great fighters?

 

Because Duran was way past his best and would fight anyone for the right money at that time. A better question would be why didn't Marvin Hagler step up to LH in his prime?

Way past his best?

He must have been a walking corpse 6 years later then when he beat Iran Barkley to win the WBC middleweight title.

But it's different for all the other fighters, they can fight bigger men, Mayweather can't though (even though he just has). He can fight smaller men like Marquez, that's ok.

Martinez is not a large middleweight anyway. But we can't expect Floyd to concede anything to an opponent. That's not fair, it's asking too much of the best fighter of his generation.

Mayweather has been fighting 'bigger men' for the best part of the last 10 years. He just beat a guy that supposedly outweighed him by 20 lbs!

Duran started at LW and fought at MW.
Mayweather started at FW and fights at LMW.

For the sake of argument,

Duran's first fight was at 119 aged 16.
Mayweather's first fight was at 131 aged 19.

At 19 Duran was fighting at 130-133.
He fought for the 135 title at 21.
Mayweather at 25.

Duran fought for the 147 title at 29.
Mayweather fought for the 147 title at 29.

Duran fought for the 154 title at 30.
Mayweather fought for the 154 title at 30.

There's nothing between them.

And if Mayweather's career derails the same way as Duran's did then maybe we'll see him step up to MW.

Maybe we'll see it because Mayweather wants a challenge and another world title in another weight division.

Maybe we'll see him KO Amir Khan in 4 rounds.

Maybe we'll see it if Amir Khan beats him in May. Perhaps if the Russian circus are in town they could do a double feature.

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

TopHat24/7 wrote:

STC wrote:

azania wrote:It isn't feasible for him to fight middleweights. He isn't even a lmw.

How is it feasible for Roberto Duran to fight Hagler in 1983 for the world middleweight titles but not for Mayweather to do it now?

Do different rules apply to Mayweather than to other great fighters?

 

Because Duran was way past his best and would fight anyone for the right money at that time. A better question would be why didn't Marvin Hagler step up to LH in his prime?

Way past his best?

He must have been a walking corpse 6 years later then when he beat Iran Barkley to win the WBC middleweight title.

But it's different for all the other fighters, they can fight bigger men, Mayweather can't though (even though he just has). He can fight smaller men like Marquez, that's ok.

Martinez is not a large middleweight anyway. But we can't expect Floyd to concede anything to an opponent. That's not fair, it's asking too much of the best fighter of his generation.

Mayweather has been fighting 'bigger men' for the best part of the last 10 years. He just beat a guy that supposedly outweighed him by 20 lbs!

Duran started at LW and fought at MW.
Mayweather started at FW and fights at LMW.

Let's face it some people won't be happy until he loses. If Floyd beat Golovkin and Martinez those same people would be calling for him to fight Ward or Froch. Making the best P4P fighter take circus fights against much bigger men cheapens the whole sport.

Straw man argument.

If he can fight Alvarez no problem, he can fight Martinez too. Fighters have been fighting opponents above their weight class since the sport began, it's nothing new. Asking Mayweather to fight Martinez is entirely reasonable.

Nobody is calling for him to go any higher than that and you suggesting that they will is ridiculous.

No, the weight (20lbs difference) was a big deal vs Alvarez remember? Now people are asking Floyd to step up again. It is plainly ridiculous to expect the P4P#1, who happens to be a natural 140/147 lb'er to step up to 160lbs to fight a has-been and/or a virtual novice.

Using a clearly on the slide Duran as comparison, now that's a straw arguement.

It's an example of another fighter doing the same thing.

He may have been on the slide and above his natural weight but he gave one of the best middleweights in history a very close fight over 15 rounds.

Mayweather could do exactly the same. He could quite conceivably beat Martinez and claim the WBC middleweight crown, and he could do it weighing 150lbs. That's the whole point.

Hammersmith harrier wrote:Look at the condition Duran was in at middleweight and the success he had there, he was barely ever a welterweight and instead of growing into the higher weights he just got fatter.

Yeah look at the little fat Duran nearly beating Hagler over 15 rounds.

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

TopHat24/7 wrote:

STC wrote:

azania wrote:It isn't feasible for him to fight middleweights. He isn't even a lmw.

How is it feasible for Roberto Duran to fight Hagler in 1983 for the world middleweight titles but not for Mayweather to do it now?

Do different rules apply to Mayweather than to other great fighters?

 

Because Duran was way past his best and would fight anyone for the right money at that time. A better question would be why didn't Marvin Hagler step up to LH in his prime?

Way past his best?

He must have been a walking corpse 6 years later then when he beat Iran Barkley to win the WBC middleweight title.

But it's different for all the other fighters, they can fight bigger men, Mayweather can't though (even though he just has). He can fight smaller men like Marquez, that's ok.

Martinez is not a large middleweight anyway. But we can't expect Floyd to concede anything to an opponent. That's not fair, it's asking too much of the best fighter of his generation.

Mayweather has been fighting 'bigger men' for the best part of the last 10 years. He just beat a guy that supposedly outweighed him by 20 lbs!

Duran started at LW and fought at MW.
Mayweather started at FW and fights at LMW.

Let's face it some people won't be happy until he loses. If Floyd beat Golovkin and Martinez those same people would be calling for him to fight Ward or Froch. Making the best P4P fighter take circus fights against much bigger men cheapens the whole sport.

Straw man argument.

If he can fight Alvarez no problem, he can fight Martinez too. Fighters have been fighting opponents above their weight class since the sport began, it's nothing new. Asking Mayweather to fight Martinez is entirely reasonable.

Nobody is calling for him to go any higher than that and you suggesting that they will is ridiculous.

No, the weight (20lbs difference) was a big deal vs Alvarez remember? Now people are asking Floyd to step up again. It is plainly ridiculous to expect the P4P#1, who happens to be a natural 140/147 lb'er to step up to 160lbs to fight a has-been and/or a virtual novice.

Using a clearly on the slide Duran as comparison, now that's a straw arguement.

It's an example of another fighter doing the same thing.

He may have been on the slide and above his natural weight but he gave one of the best middleweights in history a very close fight over 15 rounds.

Mayweather could do exactly the same. He could quite conceivably beat Martinez and claim the WBC middleweight crown, and he could do it weighing 150lbs. That's the whole point.

No, he really couldn't.

Anyway you never answered my question. Should Hagler have stepped up to LHW instead of fighting small guys?

He could conceivably do it for sure...........Leonard used to stuff weights into his tracksuit to make him weigh more and make his opponent think he was bigger..........

As long as Martinez weighed between 154/160...........Why not..

It is not the same thing though is it. Duran had nothing at WW, he was a beaten man - several times over. Stepping up to MW was the last throw of the dice for his career. If he was still WW champ he'd have never even considered it. Floyd is #1 in the whole of boxing, no one can expect him to put himself at a huge disadvantage just to make a fight more exciting. If right at the end of his career Mayweather did step up to MW he would deserve MASSIVE credit.

Duran only lost once at welterweight Mate.......

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:He could conceivably do it for sure...........Leonard used to stuff weights into his tracksuit to make him weigh more and make his opponent think he was bigger..........

As long as Martinez weighed between 154/160...........Why not..

...beacause any less than 160 and the fight wouldn't be at MW.

..what would you have then, a weigh drained 40 year old clearly on the slide, fighting at a weight he hasn't made in 5 years, all for a LMW title that Floyd already has. win lose or draw, neither would get any credit.

154 to 160 is middleweight..

It's not about what's fair though. When guy's go up in weight beyond their natural age/growth range, it's not about making sure they weigh the same. It's about whether the smaller guy is good enough to overcome the disadvantage of fighting a bigger guy.

There's no protocol that says you have to do it... usually the only protocol is money, sometimes its ego and often a combination of the two.

Hagler didn't need to fight spinks to prove himself a great middle. Considering his big fights were against guys moving up, a good performance against spinks would have helped his 'legacy' among people like ourselves. Similarly, mayweather doesn't need to fight martinez, he gets well paid whoever he fights, but a win would certainly help demonstrate his greatness.

Martinez claims he can make light middle, but i agree then we're into the whole weight drained excuse territory.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:154 to 160 is middleweight..

yes of course it is. was thinking of SMW....which of course would be Mayweathers next big challenge going by some.

milkyboy wrote:It's not about what's fair though. When guy's go up in weight beyond their natural age/growth range, it's not about making sure they weigh the same. It's about whether the smaller guy is good enough to overcome the disadvantage of fighting a bigger guy.

There's no protocol that says you have to do it... usually the only protocol is money, sometimes its ego and often a combination of the two.

Hagler didn't need to fight spinks to prove himself a great middle. Considering his big fights were against guys moving up, a good performance against spinks would have helped his 'legacy' among people like ourselves. Similarly, mayweather doesn't need to fight martinez, he gets well paid whoever he fights, but a win would certainly help demonstrate his greatness.

Martinez claims he can make light middle, but i agree then we're into the whole weight drained excuse territory.

agreed.

It is possible, but not something we should just expect.

The likes of Golovkin and Martinez are not worthy Mayweather opponents if they can't make Mayweathers weight.

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:154 to 160 is middleweight..

yes of course it is. was thinking of SMW....which of course would be Mayweathers next big challenge going by some.

andre ward beckons:whistle: 

milkyboy wrote:It's not about what's fair though. When guy's go up in weight beyond their natural age/growth range, it's not about making sure they weigh the same. It's about whether the smaller guy is good enough to overcome the disadvantage of fighting a bigger guy.

At least someone gets this milky. The whole idea is Floyd is at a physical disadvantage. If his last few fights have proven anything it is that because of his brilliance nobody at his weight or lower is capable of challenging him or making things competitive or dramatic. In terms of skills he is probably in front of everyone else in the world so the drama comes from him putting himself behind the eight ball physically.

Doesn't have to do it by any means but as a fan would love to see him try because I want to see competitive exciting fights I look forward to.

Mayweather can't win no matter who he fights.........Think a more creditable way of smashing a top 5 list would be to defend against stiffs for 4 years and get his 20 years at the top badge because as we know............

Martinez - Will be past it.........

GGG - Will be green.

Garcia - Ordinary.....

Manny - Avoided him at his best......

Trout - Beaten by Canelo

Khan - Well he's Khan.........

Vitali - His head was in the Senate.......

Darth Vader - Already beaten by luke Skywalker........

Michael Myers - Lost a split to Jamie lee curtis........

Jason - Still grieving over his Mother........

Freddie Krueger - referee kept deducting points for scratching.......

Jaws - Looked like a fish out of water on the night..........

Get my drift...........

Rowley wrote:

milkyboy wrote:It's not about what's fair though. When guy's go up in weight beyond their natural age/growth range, it's not about making sure they weigh the same. It's about whether the smaller guy is good enough to overcome the disadvantage of fighting a bigger guy.

At least someone gets this milky. The whole idea is Floyd is at a physical disadvantage. If his last few fights have proven anything it is that because of his brilliance nobody at his weight or lower is capable of challenging him or making things competitive or dramatic. In terms of skills he is probably in front of everyone else in the world so the drama comes from him putting himself behind the eight ball physically.

Doesn't have to do it by any means but as a fan would love to see him try because I want to see competitive exciting fights I look forward to.

indeed rowley, i just want to see him pushed. Actually for two reasons, part of me wants to see the smug little git get a slapping, part of me wants to revel in his genius at overcoming the disadvantages.

wanting to see him in tough fights, doesnt mean you feel he's obliged to take them. We just want fighters to really test themselves... when in reality mayweather is good enough and smart enough to make millions without risking his health too much, which on many levels is creditable when you see what most ex pugs end up like.

 

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Mayweather can't win no matter who he fights.........Think a more creditable way of smashing a top 5 list would be to defend against stiffs for 4 years and get his 20 years at the top badge because as we know............

Martinez - Will be past it.........

GGG       - Will be green.

Garcia   -  Ordinary.....

Manny   -  Avoided him at his best......

Trout     - Beaten by Canelo

Khan     -  Well he's Khan.........

Vitali     - His head was in the Senate.......

Darth Vader -  Already beaten by luke Skywalker........

Michael Myers  -  Lost a split to Jamie lee curtis........

Jason   -   Still grieving over his Mother........

Freddie Krueger -  referee kept deducting points for scratching.......

Jaws   -   Looked like a fish out of water on the night..........

Get my drift...........

Why do people keep spouting this line? Mayweather gets huge credit for beating Alvarez - and rightfully so. I've barely seen anyone downgrading the performance and what it means to his legacy. This seems to be a fashionable thing to say now.

If he fights the WW contenders like Garcia and Khan etc then fair enough. He's done enough to be a great. But, as a boxing fan, I can't get excited about those fights because I think they'll be one sided. But, don't kid anyone, if he were to fight and beat Martinez or Golovkin, it would be a big deal.

No he doesn't Mate...............Thomas hauser and many on here..........Moan that Alvarez was overrated or look at the catchweight.....

You're naive or something else..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:No he doesn't Mate...............Thomas hauser and many on here..........Moan that Alvarez was overrated or look at the catchweight.....

You're naive or something else..

Definitely the minority.

I'd like to think so.......but his personality dictates he will always have his detractors no matter what he does Mate..

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

STC wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

TopHat24/7 wrote:

STC wrote:

azania wrote:It isn't feasible for him to fight middleweights. He isn't even a lmw.

How is it feasible for Roberto Duran to fight Hagler in 1983 for the world middleweight titles but not for Mayweather to do it now?

Do different rules apply to Mayweather than to other great fighters?

 

Because Duran was way past his best and would fight anyone for the right money at that time. A better question would be why didn't Marvin Hagler step up to LH in his prime?

Way past his best?

He must have been a walking corpse 6 years later then when he beat Iran Barkley to win the WBC middleweight title.

But it's different for all the other fighters, they can fight bigger men, Mayweather can't though (even though he just has). He can fight smaller men like Marquez, that's ok.

Martinez is not a large middleweight anyway. But we can't expect Floyd to concede anything to an opponent. That's not fair, it's asking too much of the best fighter of his generation.

Mayweather has been fighting 'bigger men' for the best part of the last 10 years. He just beat a guy that supposedly outweighed him by 20 lbs!

Duran started at LW and fought at MW.
Mayweather started at FW and fights at LMW.

Let's face it some people won't be happy until he loses. If Floyd beat Golovkin and Martinez those same people would be calling for him to fight Ward or Froch. Making the best P4P fighter take circus fights against much bigger men cheapens the whole sport.

Straw man argument.

If he can fight Alvarez no problem, he can fight Martinez too. Fighters have been fighting opponents above their weight class since the sport began, it's nothing new. Asking Mayweather to fight Martinez is entirely reasonable.

Nobody is calling for him to go any higher than that and you suggesting that they will is ridiculous.

No, the weight (20lbs difference) was a big deal vs Alvarez remember? Now people are asking Floyd to step up again. It is plainly ridiculous to expect the P4P#1, who happens to be a natural 140/147 lb'er to step up to 160lbs to fight a has-been and/or a virtual novice.

Using a clearly on the slide Duran as comparison, now that's a straw arguement.

It's an example of another fighter doing the same thing.

He may have been on the slide and above his natural weight but he gave one of the best middleweights in history a very close fight over 15 rounds.

Mayweather could do exactly the same. He could quite conceivably beat Martinez and claim the WBC middleweight crown, and he could do it weighing 150lbs. That's the whole point.

No, he really couldn't.

Anyway you never answered my question. Should Hagler have stepped up to LHW instead of fighting small guys?

In your opinion he couldn't. I think he could and I'm not alone in thinking that. Pacquiao gave away huge numbers in weight to fight Margarito. Haye gives away poundage and size to fight the bigger heavies. Lots of fighters do and lots have done so in the past. Why is Mayweather different?

Hagler was a career middleweight. All his challenges were at middleweight. He had no need to go up in weight. The point about Mayweather, as has already been pointed out, is that he has no challenges at WW or LMW. No Tommy Hearns, no Ray Leonard to wait around for. The point of him moving up to MW is for the challenge. Also, he's a fighter whose career has been defined by how many titles at different weights he has won. He has the opportunity to go one more step further, against a HOF fighter who is barely any bigger than his last opponent, and it's an achievable goal that elevate him to another level. Surely that's something that interests him.

That's the fight I want to see. I'll settle for Garcia, Khan, Bradley, Pacquiao, Broner, but they aren't going to challenge him and we're are not going to see anything that we haven't seen many times before.

I meant he couldn't do it weighing 150lbs. He'd have to be at least 154+ to fight at MW. Would Mayweather beat Martinez, yeah I definitely think so. Martinez is a bit shot. Mayweather probably be a good 1/3 betting favourite. The Martinez of a few years back would have been a great match-up, he had the speed to give Mayweather real problems. I think only Khan has that now though.

The original debate was who deserves a shot at Mayweather not which opponent would make the best fight.