Welsh clubs back Anglo-French tournament

First topic message reminder :

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/24632135

Didn't see that coming, though I haven't been following this particularly closely.

Casartelli wrote:

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:Can we pause from IRFU accounts.....

No!  I'd like to hear more from quins.  Specifically, what accounting qualifications he holds and what 'finance' employer lets him spend all day on here???

not going to get into that. either what i said above is accurate or it isnt. get your own accountant to audit it

mcladyboy, i was specifically asked to explain by geoff and sin e. would certainly not have done it otherwise.

TJ wrote:Indeed asbo - why should the AP get 6 places as of right despite not doing well and the Irish get none or one despite doing well?

I did suggest a wider system of playoffs.  Say 3 english and french as of right, 1 each Irish, scots, Welsh, Italian and then the rest of the teams have to playoff for places in some format.

the playoff games would then mean even teams missing out would have some meaningfull games to play.

Playoff games for down the league clubs sound like a great idea. Only fly in the ointment is that some of them may be involved in the Amlin and the 5 and 6 in France are involved in the playoffs there.

Standulsterman Poorfour means a revenue advantage in the HC. Irish teams individually gain more e.g. I think they each get 1.5m whereas each French side gets about 750,000.

This adds up every year.

The two Scottish clubs gets 2.3m a year each and auto qualification every year for the HC yet claim to be hard done by. Can't blame them for voraciously defending their benefits packet though.

Most sides would love that kind of deal.

Sin é wrote:Quinns you are making a rather large assumption that the IRFU are not going to do anything about any deficit.......

In fairness to quins, he did say that his entire theory was based on the Irish just sitting there for the next decade and a half, watching the money run out. He also assumes that the 'reserves' are equal to cash/deposits and that income and expenditure will remain the same forever.

It was, by far, the most detailed post not to be based on anything that I've seen on here in a while.

quinsforever wrote:mcladyboy, i was specifically asked to explain by geoff and sin e. would certainly not have done it otherwise.

It wasn't me it. He started it Daddy.....

I just picked your post as it was the last one. Hope it all blows over soon so we can talk about rugby again.

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:Can we pause from IRFU accounts briefly to explore the issue of 'meritocratic qualification'?  The PRL/LNR believe that those two words mean qualification on a league basis, whereas the oppo (Celtic League) believe that it should be on a union basis - the compromise is clearly somewhere in the middle.  But actually, are things as clear cut as they seem?  Why should league qualification be any more valid than union qualification?  What if the 7th placed T14 team is clearly better (and hence more qualified) than the 6th placed AP team, for arguments sake?  Why is the fact that the Celtic league unions have a smaller professional playing base, and hence a smaller number of professional teams each, forcing them to come together to form a single league, of greater relevance?  Should the ideal not either be an agreed European-wide system of ranking, or instead be all pro teams into a hat with draws for a knockout competition from the get-go?  Thoughts?

Asbo, good stuff, mate.
I think a few people have already suggested a Euro-wide ranking, and I would like to see how it would work.  I don't know exactly how the current Euro rankings are calculated, so I don't know whether that is a good jumping off point or not.  I am sure there are a number of different ways to calculate it and would be great if someone was able to run a few different algorithms and see what we get.  I would still like to see a minimum of one team from each of the 6 Nations, however.    

Regarding the question of league standings leading to qualification to the Euro Cup, do you remember how it worked before Wales had the Regions?  Its hard to realise that was 10 years ago already.  I am not trying to make a point whether that was a good system or not.  I simply don't remember and don't have time at the moment to look it up.  Perhaps what was originally set up may provide a potential solution?

Regardless how the negotiations are concluded, I don't think we will have a perfect solution.  But if we are lucky, we have a solution most people can live with.

Casartelli wrote:

Sin é wrote:Quinns you are making a rather large assumption that the IRFU are not going to do anything about any deficit.......

In fairness to quins, he did say that his entire theory was based on the Irish just sitting there for the next decade and a half, watching the money run out.  He also assumes that the 'reserves' are equal to cash/deposits and that income and expenditure will remain the same forever.

It was, by far, the most detailed post not to be based on anything that I've seen on here in a while.

the point i have always been making, is that IRFU desperately need a european club competition. i didnt make any assumptions about anything i was trying to illustrate the interaction between a dynamic number (cash op prifit/loss) and a static number (reserves) as there seems to have been quite a lot of confusion about which was more important. the post was based on numbers that came straight from the IRFU - how is that not based on anything?

ok i get it. many of you would rather remain happily ignorant. no problem. i understand. i won't respond to demands for an explanation in future. no worries.

beshocked wrote:Standulsterman Poorfour means a revenue advantage in the HC. Irish teams individually gain more e.g. I think they each get 1.5m whereas each French side gets about 750,000.

This adds up every year.

The two Scottish clubs gets 2.3m a year each and auto qualification every year for the HC yet claim to be hard done by. Can't blame them for voraciously defending their benefits packet though.

Most sides would love that kind of deal.

If he does then his point is even worse then as we were discussing the playing advantages of the Irish sides and not mentioning money unless it reverts to wages of top players

doctor_grey wrote:

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:Can we pause from IRFU accounts briefly to explore the issue of 'meritocratic qualification'?  The PRL/LNR believe that those two words mean qualification on a league basis, whereas the oppo (Celtic League) believe that it should be on a union basis - the compromise is clearly somewhere in the middle.  But actually, are things as clear cut as they seem?  Why should league qualification be any more valid than union qualification?  What if the 7th placed T14 team is clearly better (and hence more qualified) than the 6th placed AP team, for arguments sake?  Why is the fact that the Celtic league unions have a smaller professional playing base, and hence a smaller number of professional teams each, forcing them to come together to form a single league, of greater relevance?  Should the ideal not either be an agreed European-wide system of ranking, or instead be all pro teams into a hat with draws for a knockout competition from the get-go?  Thoughts?

Asbo, good stuff, mate.
I think a few people have already suggested a Euro-wide ranking, and I would like to see how it would work.  I don't know exactly how the current Euro rankings are calculated, so I don't know whether that is a good jumping off point or not.  I am sure there are a number of different ways to calculate it and would be great if someone was able to run a few different algorithms and see what we get.  I would still like to see a minimum of one team from each of the 6 Nations, however.    

Regarding the question of league standings leading to qualification to the Euro Cup, do you remember how it worked before Wales had the Regions?  Its hard to realise that was 10 years ago already.  I am not trying to make a point whether that was a good system or not.  I simply don't remember and don't have time at the moment to look it up.  Perhaps what was originally set up may provide a potential solution?

Regardless how the negotiations are concluded, I don't think we will have a perfect solution.  But if we are lucky, we have a solution most people can live with.

There was another thread which looked at the eurorugby rankings

www.eurorugby.com

pretty good ranking system based on last 30 matches in all competitions, with each match weighted by the strength of the league/competition and in some cases, opposition.

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

Sin é wrote:Quinns you are making a rather large assumption that the IRFU are not going to do anything about any deficit.......

In fairness to quins, he did say that his entire theory was based on the Irish just sitting there for the next decade and a half, watching the money run out.  He also assumes that the 'reserves' are equal to cash/deposits and that income and expenditure will remain the same forever.

It was, by far, the most detailed post not to be based on anything that I've seen on here in a while.

the point i have always been making, is that IRFU desperately need a european club competition. i didnt make any assumptions about anything i was trying to illustrate the interaction between a dynamic number (cash op prifit/loss) and a static number (reserves) as there seems to have been quite a lot of confusion about which was more important. the post was based on numbers that came straight from the IRFU - how is that not based on anything?

ok i get it. many of you would rather remain happily ignorant. no problem. i understand. i won't respond to demands for an explanation in future. no worries.

Just answer yes/no - do you have any formal accounting qualifications? Passing an exam etc. Even at GCSE or AS level?

Casartelli wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

Sin é wrote:Quinns you are making a rather large assumption that the IRFU are not going to do anything about any deficit.......

In fairness to quins, he did say that his entire theory was based on the Irish just sitting there for the next decade and a half, watching the money run out.  He also assumes that the 'reserves' are equal to cash/deposits and that income and expenditure will remain the same forever.

It was, by far, the most detailed post not to be based on anything that I've seen on here in a while.

the point i have always been making, is that IRFU desperately need a european club competition. i didnt make any assumptions about anything i was trying to illustrate the interaction between a dynamic number (cash op prifit/loss) and a static number (reserves) as there seems to have been quite a lot of confusion about which was more important. the post was based on numbers that came straight from the IRFU - how is that not based on anything?

ok i get it. many of you would rather remain happily ignorant. no problem. i understand. i won't respond to demands for an explanation in future. no worries.

Just answer yes/no - do you have any formal accounting qualifications?  Passing an exam etc.  Even at GCSE or AS level?

oh dear. yes, Cas, i am a CFA charterholder.

There is an assumption here the Irish Provinces get all of the money from the HC - they don't some goes into the wider game so some of the figures quoted are false.

There also seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding around the finances with regard to the long term season tickets and how this impacts the financial stability of the Irish game.
It is a temporary shortfall caused by a lower take up than anticipated - the Irish game remains is rude financial healthy.

Before you ask Quins I hold the CITFA examination

As the IRFU are paying down the debt of course they are likely to be facing a cash shortfall but that does not mean they are making a loss.

Banks/investors will pay business money up front for a % of the debtors value which the company pay back when debtors pay usually for about 4% so cash will not be a problem.

Also on deserving to be there- Zebre beat the S10 champions by about 40pts so they are definately the second best team in italy with the next 4 competting in the Amlin. What about Italy's remaing 6 teams is it unfair that they get no places. And if we say that the S10 don't deserve to compete why not italy has 12 top teams not 2 as players from the S10 are in the italian squad.

I think that if we do have to join this club cup that the 4 rabo unions should demand 12 places each and the left over teams can go into the famed 3rd tier financed by the top tier. That would sort them out and we could get rid of the B&I cup.

Also no PRL/NRL has explained why if they are trying to grow rugby are they reducing places by 4 spots

geoff999rugby wrote:There is an assumption here the Irish Provinces get all of the money from the HC - they don't some goes into the wider game so some of the figures quoted are false.

There also seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding around the finances with regard to the long term season tickets and how this impacts the financial stability of the Irish game.
It is a temporary shortfall caused by a lower take up than anticipated - the Irish game remains is rude financial healthy.

Before you ask Quins I hold the CITFA examination

provinces get funded by the irfu to the tune of EUR22m (annual report p8, para5) so from my reading of it, the opposite holds true - more than all the money from all euro competitions (rabo and HC) is given by the IRFU to the provinces.

i never asked about your qualifications geoff, nor would i.

I think that if we do have to join this club cup that the 4 rabo unions should demand 12 places each and the left over teams can go into the famed 3rd tier financed by the top tier. That would sort them out and we could get rid of the B&I cup.

I like that idea. Again it shows the lack of logic behind the PRL proposals.

TJ wrote:I thought I would have a look at what qualification would be from the Pro12 under various rules.  top 6, one from each union +2, One from each union +4  last 3 years
2010-2011
top 6
Munster  Leinster   Ulster   Ospreys   Scarlets  Cardiff Blues
One each +2 (+4)
Munster Ospreys Edinburgh   Benetton Treviso + Leinster  Cardiff Blues (Scarlets Ulster)

2011-2012
top 6
 Leinster  Ospreys   Munster  Glasgow   Scarlets  Ulster
One each +2 (+4)
Leinster Ospreys Glasgow Benetton Treviso + Munster Scarlets (Cardiff Blues Connacht)

2012 – 2013
Ulster Leinster Glasgow Scarlets Ospreys Munster
One each +2 (+4) Ulster Glasgow Scarlets Benetton Treviso + Leinster Ospreys (Munster Connacht)

Makes for interesting reading  I am adamant that 4+4 is the only way this is reasonable.  otherwise you get a european cup missing some good teams and missing diversity

No more commnets on this? It took me minutes to work it out   

TJ, it inspired my questions, if that helps amtter?!?! I'd agree with Dr_G that representation is essential for any competition which claims to be the pre-eminent NH club cup tournie

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

Sin é wrote:Quinns you are making a rather large assumption that the IRFU are not going to do anything about any deficit.......

In fairness to quins, he did say that his entire theory was based on the Irish just sitting there for the next decade and a half, watching the money run out.  He also assumes that the 'reserves' are equal to cash/deposits and that income and expenditure will remain the same forever.

It was, by far, the most detailed post not to be based on anything that I've seen on here in a while.

the point i have always been making, is that IRFU desperately need a european club competition. i didnt make any assumptions about anything i was trying to illustrate the interaction between a dynamic number (cash op prifit/loss) and a static number (reserves) as there seems to have been quite a lot of confusion about which was more important. the post was based on numbers that came straight from the IRFU - how is that not based on anything?

ok i get it. many of you would rather remain happily ignorant. no problem. i understand. i won't respond to demands for an explanation in future. no worries.

Just answer yes/no - do you have any formal accounting qualifications?  Passing an exam etc.  Even at GCSE or AS level?

oh dear. yes, Cas, i am a CFA charterholder.

What's CFA? There's some good A level stuff online that explains about different types of reserves etc - I'll try and find the best one and post a link.

Only joshing but I think it helps make the point that with 6 places the Scots and Italians would be locked out unless one place is guaranteed and if its only 6 in total then they would never get a second team in. 8 from 12 means that the really weak teams would not be in but that the modest teams would have a chance

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

Sin é wrote:Quinns you are making a rather large assumption that the IRFU are not going to do anything about any deficit.......

In fairness to quins, he did say that his entire theory was based on the Irish just sitting there for the next decade and a half, watching the money run out.  He also assumes that the 'reserves' are equal to cash/deposits and that income and expenditure will remain the same forever.

It was, by far, the most detailed post not to be based on anything that I've seen on here in a while.

the point i have always been making, is that IRFU desperately need a european club competition. i didnt make any assumptions about anything i was trying to illustrate the interaction between a dynamic number (cash op prifit/loss) and a static number (reserves) as there seems to have been quite a lot of confusion about which was more important. the post was based on numbers that came straight from the IRFU - how is that not based on anything?

ok i get it. many of you would rather remain happily ignorant. no problem. i understand. i won't respond to demands for an explanation in future. no worries.

In the words of Tom Grace:

tom grace wrote:“Overall, if there’s a message coming through here it’s that the national team is the key provider for all activities undertaken by the union.

“Without the dividend this generates there would be no IRFU funding for provincial teams and consequently the branches would be relying on what they themselves can generate.

“There is absolutely no doubt that times are hard but we are extremely fortunate that we have managed our cash conservatively over the last number of years. The disappointing result with the sale of 10-year tickets reflects what is happening in the economy.

“I think, as a unit, we need to concentrate to develop again. If we don’t spend on the development of the game we can throw our hat at it,” said Grace in a speech to union members, including new president Pat Fitzgerald.

I'd imagine some touring SH teams might be willing to play a few games against the Provinces - like back in the good old days, not to mention a few rugby internationals in the autumn. 50K in the Aviva for a rugby international would be similar to what the Provinces would draw in for a home heineken cup match!

Casartelli wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

Sin é wrote:Quinns you are making a rather large assumption that the IRFU are not going to do anything about any deficit.......

In fairness to quins, he did say that his entire theory was based on the Irish just sitting there for the next decade and a half, watching the money run out.  He also assumes that the 'reserves' are equal to cash/deposits and that income and expenditure will remain the same forever.

It was, by far, the most detailed post not to be based on anything that I've seen on here in a while.

the point i have always been making, is that IRFU desperately need a european club competition. i didnt make any assumptions about anything i was trying to illustrate the interaction between a dynamic number (cash op prifit/loss) and a static number (reserves) as there seems to have been quite a lot of confusion about which was more important. the post was based on numbers that came straight from the IRFU - how is that not based on anything?

ok i get it. many of you would rather remain happily ignorant. no problem. i understand. i won't respond to demands for an explanation in future. no worries.

Just answer yes/no - do you have any formal accounting qualifications?  Passing an exam etc.  Even at GCSE or AS level?

oh dear. yes, Cas, i am a CFA charterholder.

What's CFA?  There's some good A level stuff online that explains about different types of reserves etc - I'll try and find the best one and post a link.

this is wiki's version:

In nonprofit accounting*, an "operating reserve" is commonly used to refer to unrestricted cash on hand available to sustain an organization, and nonprofit boards usually specify a target of maintaining several months of operating cash or a percentage of their annual income, called an Operating Reserve Ratio.

*IRFU is non-profit

Casartelli wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

Sin é wrote:Quinns you are making a rather large assumption that the IRFU are not going to do anything about any deficit.......

In fairness to quins, he did say that his entire theory was based on the Irish just sitting there for the next decade and a half, watching the money run out.  He also assumes that the 'reserves' are equal to cash/deposits and that income and expenditure will remain the same forever.

It was, by far, the most detailed post not to be based on anything that I've seen on here in a while.

the point i have always been making, is that IRFU desperately need a european club competition. i didnt make any assumptions about anything i was trying to illustrate the interaction between a dynamic number (cash op prifit/loss) and a static number (reserves) as there seems to have been quite a lot of confusion about which was more important. the post was based on numbers that came straight from the IRFU - how is that not based on anything?

ok i get it. many of you would rather remain happily ignorant. no problem. i understand. i won't respond to demands for an explanation in future. no worries.

Just answer yes/no - do you have any formal accounting qualifications?  Passing an exam etc.  Even at GCSE or AS level?

oh dear. yes, Cas, i am a CFA charterholder.

What's CFA?  There's some good A level stuff online that explains about different types of reserves etc - I'll try and find the best one and post a link.

 Chartered Financial Analyst. while i am used to looking at companies that use GAAP (and hence reserves do not exist as an accounting item apart from in Switzerland i believe in Europe) rather than not-for-profits, i am aware that reserves are a tax free buffer used to help a not-for-profit weather downturns and protect its viability. looks to me in this case that reserves are accumulated retained cash surpluses and deficits. feel free to correct me.

I do wonder if the 4 rabo unions offerred a month tour to the SH teams in november playing 6 matches would they take it.

You would feel you would get big attendances and good money for all the poor unions of the Rabo and SH

geoff999rugby wrote:
Before you ask Quins I hold the CITFA examination

Committee on Information Technology for Filipino Architects?

Brendan wrote:I do wonder if the 4 rabo unions offerred a month tour to the SH teams in november playing 6 matches would they take it.

You would feel you would get big attendances and good money for all the poor unions of the Rabo and SH

something along these lines is certainly a fall back option  Could even be a SH / Celts mini tourney Or get some super 15 teams to come and play against the Rabo teams

I still say bonus points in the CC for profits and large crowds.............

But looking at some of this recent stuff, I now add that Qualification Initials should also get bonus points.

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

Sin é wrote:Quinns you are making a rather large assumption that the IRFU are not going to do anything about any deficit.......

In fairness to quins, he did say that his entire theory was based on the Irish just sitting there for the next decade and a half, watching the money run out.  He also assumes that the 'reserves' are equal to cash/deposits and that income and expenditure will remain the same forever.

It was, by far, the most detailed post not to be based on anything that I've seen on here in a while.

the point i have always been making, is that IRFU desperately need a european club competition. i didnt make any assumptions about anything i was trying to illustrate the interaction between a dynamic number (cash op prifit/loss) and a static number (reserves) as there seems to have been quite a lot of confusion about which was more important. the post was based on numbers that came straight from the IRFU - how is that not based on anything?

ok i get it. many of you would rather remain happily ignorant. no problem. i understand. i won't respond to demands for an explanation in future. no worries.

Just answer yes/no - do you have any formal accounting qualifications?  Passing an exam etc.  Even at GCSE or AS level?

oh dear. yes, Cas, i am a CFA charterholder.

What's CFA?  There's some good A level stuff online that explains about different types of reserves etc - I'll try and find the best one and post a link.

 Chartered Financial Analyst. while i am used to looking at companies that use GAAP (and hence reserves do not exist as an accounting item apart from in Switzerland i believe in Europe) rather than not-for-profits, i am aware that reserves are a tax free buffer used to help a not-for-profit weather downturns and protect its viability. looks to me in this case that reserves are accumulated retained cash surpluses and deficits. feel free to correct me.

I've just undertaken some exhaustive online research into the CFA Institute.

So, just to confirm, you have no actual accounting qualifications.

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:What's CFA?

 Chartered Financial Analyst. while i am used to looking at companies that use GAAP

Grease and a parsnip?

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:What's CFA?

 Chartered Financial Analyst. while i am used to looking at companies that use GAAP

Grease and a parsnip?

generally agreed accounting principles. aims to make comparisons useful across companies and geographies.

quinsforever wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:What's CFA?

 Chartered Financial Analyst. while i am used to looking at companies that use GAAP

Grease and a parsnip?

generally agreed accounting principles. aims to make comparisons useful across companies and geographies.

Generally accepted accounting principles.

SecretFly wrote:I still say bonus points in the CC for profits and large crowds.............

But looking at some of this recent stuff, I now add that Qualification Initials should also get bonus points.

Great. We are the Edinburgh MFLs are we in?

Oooh if we're going for dodgy qualification names then I'm a mcse.

so do we now need to be qualified to post in here?

Or practice I suppose.

It's clear to me that most all of the combatants in the ERC row don't share many principles - including the Generally Accepted Accounting Principles...!

I'm a qualified MILF.

Casartelli wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Casartelli wrote:

Sin é wrote:Quinns you are making a rather large assumption that the IRFU are not going to do anything about any deficit.......

In fairness to quins, he did say that his entire theory was based on the Irish just sitting there for the next decade and a half, watching the money run out.  He also assumes that the 'reserves' are equal to cash/deposits and that income and expenditure will remain the same forever.

It was, by far, the most detailed post not to be based on anything that I've seen on here in a while.

the point i have always been making, is that IRFU desperately need a european club competition. i didnt make any assumptions about anything i was trying to illustrate the interaction between a dynamic number (cash op prifit/loss) and a static number (reserves) as there seems to have been quite a lot of confusion about which was more important. the post was based on numbers that came straight from the IRFU - how is that not based on anything?

ok i get it. many of you would rather remain happily ignorant. no problem. i understand. i won't respond to demands for an explanation in future. no worries.

Just answer yes/no - do you have any formal accounting qualifications?  Passing an exam etc.  Even at GCSE or AS level?

oh dear. yes, Cas, i am a CFA charterholder.

What's CFA?  There's some good A level stuff online that explains about different types of reserves etc - I'll try and find the best one and post a link.

 Chartered Financial Analyst. while i am used to looking at companies that use GAAP (and hence reserves do not exist as an accounting item apart from in Switzerland i believe in Europe) rather than not-for-profits, i am aware that reserves are a tax free buffer used to help a not-for-profit weather downturns and protect its viability. looks to me in this case that reserves are accumulated retained cash surpluses and deficits. feel free to correct me.

I've just undertaken some exhaustive online research into the CFA Institute.

So, just to confirm, you have no actual accounting qualifications.

correct, i am not an accountant. have not claimed to be. accountants prepare accounts, investors read and analyse them. which is what i do, and have been doing for 20 years. so if you wanted me to prepare the IRFU's accounts i would not be able to help you, but if you're after understanding them, i can do that for you.

about 1/3 of each of the 3 competitive exams required for the CFA are accounting-related. do you really think i'm just making this stuff up?   

TJ wrote:

SecretFly wrote:I still say bonus points in the CC for profits and large crowds.............

But looking at some of this recent stuff, I now add that Qualification Initials should also get bonus points.

Great.  We are the Edinburgh MFLs  are we in?

Three initials means three bonus points per game, TJ.

Congrats...
move along...
Next!

Latest piffle from the PRL

Bath chairman Bruce Craig has revealed the final two available spots in the proposed Rugby Champions Cup will be decided by a play-off.

Nice of him to tell us what is going to happen isn't it. Still no tourney to play in as of now and no agreement from anyone that the RCC is a goer

More desperate flannel from a busted flush

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I'm a qualified MILF.

Proof will be needed in pictures or videos, Luckless.

SecretFly wrote:

TJ wrote:

SecretFly wrote:I still say bonus points in the CC for profits and large crowds.............

But looking at some of this recent stuff, I now add that Qualification Initials should also get bonus points.

Great.  We are the Edinburgh MFLs  are we in?

Three initials means three bonus points per game, TJ.  

Congrats...
move along...
Next!

spotty dog! we are the greatest. Euro cup glory here we come

More from the wondercraig
"It is for certain there will be play-offs for one or two places in May," Craig told AFP. "The play-offs could be made up of the teams that finish seventh or eighth in their respective championships. The play-offs would be interesting matches, with something at stake, involving teams who normally by that stage of the season have nothing to play for."
Or does he mean as a sop to those teams robbed of a euro cup place? Plonker.  everytime he opens is mouth I hate him more.  Slimey toad

Shows how meaningful his "negotiations" are when he can tell us what will happen in the euro cup next year.

How is he able to give this sort of info and insight? Either, he's making it up (but why would he - this doesn't sound like a proposal, more like a finer detail). Or, agreement has been reached in principle by all nations but no-one has come out and told us so yet, and he's spilling the beans and giving away teasers.

Which is it? Or is there a 3rd possibility?

TJ wrote:More from the wondercraig
"It is for certain there will be play-offs for one or two places in May," Craig told AFP. "The play-offs could be made up of the teams that finish seventh or eighth in their respective championships. The play-offs would be interesting matches, with something at stake, involving teams who normally by that stage of the season have nothing to play for."
Or does he mean as a sop to those teams robbed of a euro cup place? Plonker.  everytime he opens is mouth I hate him more.  Slimey toad

Shows how meaningful his "negotiations" are when he can tell us what will happen in the euro cup next year.

So do you like him then?  

For Craig what he wants is what will happen. Everyone else has to agree with him. No one is allowed to differ.

Munchkin wrote:

So do you like him then?  

         

SecretFly wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I'm a qualified MILF.

Proof will be needed in pictures or videos, Luckless.

I'm not going to post anything here, Fly, but I will say this: remember Helen Daniels off Neighbours?

whole article and link. particularly love the line i have bolded below. undermines himself by being so definitive.

The final two spots in next season's proposed new Rugby Champions Cup will be decided by play-offs, one of the supporters of the competition said.

Bruce Craig, Bath chairman and vice-president of Premiership Rugby, told AFP they would happen in May to complete the 20 competing sides.

Following support from the Welsh regions, at present the Cup would involve those four teams and the England and France's best placed teams.

Craig was adamant that the rival tournament to the Heineken Cup would go ahead hence his announcement of the play-offs structure.

"It is for certain there will be play-offs for one or two places in May," said Craig.

At present the proposed make-up of the teams taking part in the breakaway tournament is six from the Aviva Premiership, six from the Top 14 and six from the RaboDirect PRO12.

"The play-offs could be made up of the teams that finish seventh or eighth in their respective championships," said Craig.

"The play-offs would be interesting matches, with something at stake, involving teams who normally by that stage of the season have nothing to play for."

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3825_8988122,00.html

Griff wrote:How is he able to give this sort of info and insight? Either, he's making it up (but why would he - this doesn't sound like a proposal, more like a finer detail). Or, agreement has been reached in principle by all nations but no-one has come out and told us so yet, and he's spilling the beans and giving away teasers.

Which is it? Or is there a 3rd possibility?

ERC members "We agree with you on everything, now wait until we all produce a statement together"
Craig to the press: "It is for certain............"

I'm not seeing it as something that seems to be coming from someone who has agreed that everyone agrees and is going to be mannerly about the way it is transmitted to the waiting public.

I could be wrong though...but I'd assume any announcement would be a joint announcement by some new body.

TJ wrote:

Munchkin wrote:

So do you like him then?  

         

  I'm guessing no