Wales vs South Africa match buildup.

First topic message reminder :

OK boys, this weekend Wales and South Africa will both attempt to begin their Autumn Internationals with a win.

Both teams for different reasons.

Wales will want to build on their Six Nations form of the last two years, they will want to confirm to themselves that the British and Irish Lions tour was won because of their players, and they will want to progress from being Northern Hemisphere kings, to a team that has the ability to beat South Africa, New Zealand and Australia.

In my view, and possibly in the view of their supporters the time is now, it has been a while since Wales has been so dominant in Europe, the only thing missing before they can call themselves world beaters is to take the next step.

How much of it is mental, how much of it is due to the fact that they struggle to put 80 minute performances together I cannot be certain of, but what I do know is they have the ability, sadly it seems Cuthbert and Roberts will not be part of what I deem as the most talented and dangerous backline in Europe. For two reasons I might add, it is the most settled back line in Europe, and also very experienced.

Since the World Cup in 2011, Wales have won 9 of their 10 Six Nations matches, undoubtedly a very good record, however their problem was the seven match losing streak in between the two Six Nations.

South Africa on the other hand, has a new coach, been there for near two full seasons and he has made a difference.

Still not yet consistent, the concern is always how will Meyer ensure that the springboks perform on a consistent basis. In the past 18 months under Heyneke Meyer the boks had their fair share of poor games.

Last year out of the twelve test matches played the springboks managed to win 7 tests, drew 2 and lost three.

Although the three tests they lost were against New Zealand (twice) and Australia, there were a number of other performances that were not up to par. England in the third test at home, Argentina in Mendoza and New Zealand at home, those were poor performances by South Africa.

Although they went through the Autumn internationals unbeaten the were less than convincing.

I suppose the positive out of the performances were even when they played poorly, they managed to be on the right side of the scoreboard most of the time.

Although South Africa has shown improvement this year, the consistency is still under question.

The one aspect of their game that has improved immeasurably is their positive approach to attacking play, looking at the number of tries scored this year in comparison to last year it makes for astounding reading, in 2012 during 12 matches South Africa managed only 23 tries, conceding 16. This year in 9 tests they have managed 39 tries, conceding 18 tries.

Only New Zealand have managed to score regular tries against SA, totalling 15 tries in the last two years, the rest of their opponents only managed 19 tries in 17 matches.

Wales during 2012 managed to score 20 tries in conceding 17 in their 13 matches. During 2013 in their seven tests to date, they managed 11 tries, conceding 7.

If South Africa continues with their positive approach  to attacking plays I believe Wales will be hard pressed, their defence will have to be up to par, there is no doubt Wales will have a positive approach to the game, so from that perspective it should be an entertaining match.

There are some questions over the selections Meyer will make, will he bring Jaque Fourie, JP Pietersen and Bakkies Botha in for the first tour match, which would add significantly to the experience of the team, or will he give debutant Pieter Steph du Toit his first cap?

Of course Willie le Roux and JJ Engelbrecht may yet be inexperienced, but in my view it would be unfair to summarily dismiss them in favour of the old hands.

Wales have a few selection issues as well, who will replace Cuthbert and Roberts, and the ultimate question, will Phillips’ disciplinary record affect his chances for selection?

I still wonder who is the best fly half in Wales.

Come what may, this match should be a tough encounter, will SA prove they have made the step up and show consistency, or will Wales make the next leap towards world domination?

Springbok team for Wales.

The Springbok team to face Wales in Cardiff is:

15. Pat Lambie 29 caps 55 points
14. JP Pietersen 48 caps 70 points
13. Jaque Fourie 69 caps 160 points
12. Jean de Villiers (captain) 93 caps 120 points
11. Bryan Habana 92 caps 265 points
10. Morné Steyn 51 caps 618 points
9. Fourie du Preez 65 caps 70 points
8. Duane Vermeulen 13 caps 5 points
7. Willem Alberts 27 caps 30 points
6. Francois Louw 25 caps 25 points
5. Flip van der Merwe 31 caps 5 points
4. Eben Etzebeth 20 caps 0 points
3. Frans Malberhe 0 caps 0 points
2. Bismarck du Plessis (v-captain) 54 caps 40 points
1. Tendai Mtawarira 50 caps 10 points
Replacements:
16. Adriaan Strauss 30 caps 25 points
17. Gurthrö Steenkamp 46 caps 30 points
18. Coenie Oosthuizen 11 caps 5 points
19. Pieter-Steph du Toit 0 caps 0 points
20. Siya Kolisi 8 caps 0 points
21. Ruan Pienaar 71 caps 130 points
22. JJ Engelbrecht 10 caps 20 points
23. Willie le Roux 9 caps 15 points

Wales team for South Africa
Wales

15 Leigh Halfpenny,
14 George North,
13 Jonathan Davies,
12 Scott Williams,
11 Eli Walker,
10 Rhys Priestland,
9 Mike Phillips,
8 Toby Faletau,
7 Sam Warburton (captain),
6 Dan Lydiate,
5 Alun Wyn Jones,
4 Bradley Davies,
3 Adam Jones,
2 Richard Hibbard,
1 Gethin Jenkins

Substitutes: 16 Ken Owens, 17 Paul James, 18 Scott Andrews, 19 Luke Charteris, 20 Justin Tipuric, 21 Lloyd Williams, 22 James Hook, 23 Liam Williams

jimmyinthewell68 wrote:anyway i just hope Wales keep within a score near the end and you never know .

Wales are the 6 nations Champs they should be able to knock over a 2nd rate SA team, have some faith.  

fa0019 wrote:George North ain't Lomu... you know the guy who destroyed everyone but failed to score against the boks in 12 attempts.

Nope George surpassed Jonah on his first international outing, scoring 2 tries more against the Boks than Lomu did in 12. SO I guess that means George North is 12 times better than Lomu?  

lets hope there be plenty         Saturday

Scrumpy wrote:

jimmyinthewell68 wrote:anyway i just hope Wales keep within a score near the end and you never know .

Wales are the 6 nations Champs they should be able to knock over a 2nd rate SA team, have some faith.  

Wales should definitely be able to beat a second rate Bok team.
































This aint a second rate Bok team though.

But they did come 2nd in the Championship.  

That they did, but you lost 3 zip to the team that came second last year.

Well this thread has just gone up a gear.

Don't know why everyone moans or is so shocked about the team selection. Everyone knew what 99% of the teams were gonna be anyway,so nothing has Changed in that respect. It's not like the.boks had 15 superhumans hidden for 30 years and the whole world thought Wales would be playing a bunch of 5'5 10 stone team,come on, jeez

ruggerbugger wrote:More like I demolished his braai

I assume you insisted on grilling Salmon and Halloumi on his braai... always leaves a mark and a permanent smell. Never good.

Yes

The boks I'm sure are liking this positivity from the Welsh. In the old days, when the boks came to town, their was no expectations and nobody got hurt... these days the pain of defeat will cut that much deeper.

I can't see Wales winning but I think they are good enough to win. Home advantage is a big thing... if this team is serious about mounting a real challenge for the RWC then its games like these they have to start winning.... no good saying, on our day we can compete.

England's last victory should stick in the mind, they played badly... they still won.
Victory is required, rain or shine, performance or not.

Yes, but it helped England's cause that the Wallabies didn't play that well either. I can't see the Boks putting in a performance like that.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Yes, but it helped England's cause that the Wallabies didn't play that well either. I can't see the Boks putting in a performance like that.

It's not often Farrell has an off day with the boot either, But we all know England can win ugly, can Wales?

Good luck for Saturday by the way

Well I know how I would play a 930kg pack... run them ragged. Build that lactic acid in their muscles... make Alberts work for every 120kg he has to lump around.

Scrumpy wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Yes, but it helped England's cause that the Wallabies didn't play that well either. I can't see the Boks putting in a performance like that.

It's not often Farrell has an off day with the boot either, But we all know England can win ugly, can Wales?

Good luck for Saturday by the way

Not too sure, but I know we can lose damn pretty

Good luck Wales. Hope you win this one too. As Gibbo would say, believe!!

Scrumpy wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Yes, but it helped England's cause that the Wallabies didn't play that well either. I can't see the Boks putting in a performance like that.

But we all know England can win ugly, can Wales?

We did so for 3/5 Six Nations games last season

 

fa0019 wrote:Well I know how I would play a 930kg pack... run them ragged. Build that lactic acid in their muscles... make Alberts work for every 120kg he has to lump around.

Its all fun and games until the 930kg pack is recycling the ball and taking it in turns to run at U

Keeping the Boks pegged back as far from the 22 as possible comes as a strong recommendation but is easier said than done. They are quite possibly the worst team in the world to invite to camp on your own tryline and take it through the forwards. Wales could perhaps get away with it against many other sides but not against SA. If we try I might just resort to banging my head repeatedly against the nearest wall until the game's over or I lose consciousness, whichever comes first.

fa0019 wrote:

ruggerbugger wrote:Can't wait for the Welsh to shut the boks up. I hope that arrogant bully boy team get a tuning.  Let's see how 'physical' the steroid boks are when north destroys Albert's like he did folau.  

I think you'll be waiting a little longer then the weekend.

George North ain't Lomu... you know the guy who destroyed everyone but failed to score against the boks in 12 attempts.

Least Georgie got that monkey off his back on debut

Should be a good game. I do think we lose a fair bit of weight in the back five aye, hence the pack weights probably being correct. Be interesting to see our tactics.

Risca Rev wrote:"...........Be interesting to see our tactics."

Gatland tactics are always the same.  There is no plan B.

Knowsit17 wrote:Keeping the Boks pegged back as far from the 22 as possible comes as a strong recommendation but is easier said than done. They are quite possibly the worst team in the world to invite to camp on your own tryline and take it through the forwards. Wales could perhaps get away with it against many other sides but not against SA. If we try I might just resort to banging my head repeatedly against the nearest wall until the game's over or I lose consciousness, whichever comes first.

Can just see it now.. Alberts takes it up, chopped down by Lydiate .. recycled to Etzebeth .. recycled to Vermeulen .. recycled to Louw .. then the Beast .. and just when you think you've stopped them, up pops that small chap Bismarck to finish it off

BamBam wrote:

Knowsit17 wrote:Keeping the Boks pegged back as far from the 22 as possible comes as a strong recommendation but is easier said than done. They are quite possibly the worst team in the world to invite to camp on your own tryline and take it through the forwards. Wales could perhaps get away with it against many other sides but not against SA. If we try I might just resort to banging my head repeatedly against the nearest wall until the game's over or I lose consciousness, whichever comes first.

Can just see it now.. Alberts takes it up, chopped down by Lydiate .. recycled to Etzebeth .. recycled to Vermeulen .. recycled to Louw .. then the Beast .. and just when you think you've stopped them, up pops that small chap Bismarck to finish it off

Problem with that theory is that in the past year our backs have outscored our forwards by 3 tries to one.

Wasn't the team i expected. Why the hell did they leave out Le Roux and Bakkies but i'm not moaning. I guess they went for Pieterson though to try match the power of North
Still a strong team, let's give them a run for their money huh.

Pietersen for me is top class, for ages we have criticised the Wales kick and chase or lack of chase, Pietersen chases everything and never stops.

casarteli, you are right, as we all know, no plan b.

and i read today rp is liked becaue he sticks to the plan.

in other words, if it ain't working, carry on . don't you dare think for yourself.

no wonder biggar is not in favour, he thinks too much and goes off plan , plays whats in front of him, how DARE he !!!!!

Hope Wales win, and whilst they have the quality to do just that, I don't think they will.

Something about their mindset against the big 3 SH teams. Hope I'm wrong though.

Seriously strong Boks team.
But Wales just need to stop the chit chat and just leather the crap out of them,
Hit rucks like they would, they don't care they are out to hurt you much more!
They don't really respect you at all,so don't respect them and don't sit in awe of them.

Wales need to be more like England,they need to be arrogant toward the the SA,NZ and Aus.
Don't respect them view them as lower than you and think it's cheeky of them to your ground and win!

  how very dare them

Wales backs need to get a bit of the spirit of 05 about them. Move the ball and make the boks chase shadows. That won't happen though. They'll use North add a batwing team in midfield and wonder why they lost.

gavstar wrote:I read today rp is liked becaue he sticks to the plan.

in other words, if it ain't working, carry on . don't you dare think for yourself.

no wonder biggar is not in favour, he thinks too much and goes off plan , plays whats in front of him, how DARE he !!!!!

Yes, and James Hook is renowned for sticking to the script.  

On your point about Priestland being liked because he sticks to the plan, have you got a link or a quotation for that? Because first of all I'd like to know who said it, and it would also be helpful to know what's meant by 'the plan'. If 'the plan' turns out to be playing in the right areas unless it's on to run it, then I'd say Priestland is the better ten for that. Biggar's all-round game has developed, no question, but Priestland's still the more natural / instinctive heads-up outside half of the two. But there's less in it than there used to be.

LP it was Simon Thomas

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/analysis-dan-biggar-major-victim-6274099

Thanks, Trev.

'Gatland has always liked the way Priestland takes the ball up to the line, with that having brought the best out of the likes of Jamie Roberts in the past.

'And there’s generally been a feeling that he sticks to the game-plan and executes it well.

'The rule of thumb has been that when Priestland plays well, Wales play well and he has been backed to have that catalytic effect this weekend.

'With a summer’s rest and recuperation behind him, he has returned as good as new.

'He certainly seems more chilled out and relaxed now, with a smile back on his face, and that has translated into his performances on the field.

'Arguably the outstanding regional result of the season so far has been the Scarlets’ Heineken Cup win away to Harlequins and Priestland played a pivotal part in that 33-26 success.

'He set the tone early on, as he was twice involved in the sweeping attack that led to the opening try from his half-back partner Rhodri Williams.

'And he pulled the strings expertly throughout, looking back to his very best as he conquered the Stoop.

'That performance must have played a big part in his recall, while the fact that fellow Scarlets Scott Williams and Jonathan Davies are occupying the Wales centre berths can’t have hurt his chances.'

------------

In short, nothing there about Biggar being punished for being too much of a free spirit. The idea that Biggar is some kind of maverick fly-half is laughable, to be honest.

Im happy to see priestland in the team but it would have been nice to see biggar on bench . fair play to hook he must surely know now he always be on bench unless Wales have crazy injures but he still turns up wanting to play for his country . If there was a introduction of the 24th man like the other thread talking about then i think his versatile skills won't be needed and would end his career with Wales  

Priestland is much more 'creative' than Biggar and CAN play some lovely running rugby.

Only thing is, hes a confidence player. He does seem highly motivated though, hope he gets the backs going like the Turk team that took apart the Harlequins

'Meyer had hoped the Millennium Stadium roof would be open on Saturday evening to simulate the conditions his players are likely to encounter in the World Cup, but the decision rests with Wales because the Test is a friendly and he is expecting it to be closed with more rain forecast.'

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2013/nov/06/jaque-fourie-south-africa-wales

Weld the bloody thing permanently closed and have done with the bloody seasonal "will it, won't it" debates!

It's obvious the Welsh would love to have it always closed, no matter who shows up. Just close it permanently.

SecretFly wrote:Weld the bloody thing permanently closed and have done with the bloody seasonal "will it, won't it" debates!

It's obvious the Welsh would love to have it always closed, no matter who shows up.  Just close it permanently.

Excellent point !!! same thing year in year out . Same with the haka debate when NZ comes up north

The pitch is ropey enough as it is, can you imagine how bad it would be if it got no sunlight whatsoever?

Did you see how badly it was cutting up in the RL match?

Great stadium - but the playing surface has been an unmitigated disaster.

Yep, because the playing surface was so low on the list of priorities when they designed it.

scrum time should be a nightmare then .

Eli Walker out!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/24853220

breaking news walker injured liam in

Gutting for him, especially after he missed the last Six Nations.

Christ, lucky he's not playing, he'd die under a Saffa ruck  

Who bets Sanjay put in a rough tackle against him ? #DirtyTurk

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

gavstar wrote:I read today rp is liked becaue he sticks to the plan.

in other words, if it ain't working, carry on . don't you dare think for yourself.

no wonder biggar is not in favour, he thinks too much and goes off plan , plays whats in front of him, how DARE he !!!!!

Yes, and James Hook is renowned for sticking to the script.  

On your point about Priestland being liked because he sticks to the plan, have you got a link or a quotation for that? Because first of all I'd like to know who said it, and it would also be helpful to know what's meant by 'the plan'. If 'the plan' turns out to be playing in the right areas unless it's on to run it, then I'd say Priestland is the better ten for that. Biggar's all-round game has developed, no question, but Priestland's still the more natural / instinctive heads-up outside half of the two. But there's less in it than there used to be.

Priestland said it himself. When he was having the meltdown and he kicked a ball away with a three man overlap - after the match he said it was because the instruction from Howley was to always kick the ball when in his own half.

Has the pitch been replaced again?

Ashley Beck coming onto the bench for Liam Williams isn't exactly like-for-like. Who's covering the back three? Tipuric?