Ireland vs Scotland

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Ireland v Scotland

Aviva Stadium, Dublin
Sunday, 2 Feb 2014
Kick-off: 15:00

Referee: Craig Joubert (SARU)
Assistant referee: Jaco Peyper (SARU)
Assistant referee: Mike Fraser (NZR)
TMO: Carlo Damasco (FIR)

A. Squads

1. Ireland

Backs:
Simon Zebo (Cork Constitution/Munster), Craig Gilroy (Dungannon/Ulster), Isaac Boss (Terenure College/Leinster), Darren Cave (Belfast Harlequins/Ulster), Gordon D'Arcy (Lansdowne/Leinster), Keith Earls (Young Munster/Munster), Luke Fitzgerald (Blackrock College/Leinster), Robbie Henshaw (Buccaneers/Connacht), Paddy Jackson (Dungannon/Ulster), Felix Jones (Shannon/Munster), David Kearney (Lansdowne/Leinster), Rob Kearney (UCD/Leinster), Ian Keatley (Young Munster/Munster), Ian Madigan (Blackrock College/Leinster), Kieran Marmion (Corinthians/Connacht) *, Luke Marshall (Ballynahinch/Ulster), Fergus McFadden (Old Belvedere/Leinster), Conor Murray (Garryowen/Munster), Brian O'Driscoll (UCD/Leinster), Eoin Reddan (Lansdowne/Leinster), Jonathan Sexton (Racing Metro 92), Andrew Trimble (Ballymena/Ulster)

Forwards:
Rodney Ah You (Buccaneers/Connacht) *, Stephen Archer (Cork Constitution/Munster), Rory Best (Banbridge/Ulster), Robin Copeland (Cardiff Blues) *, Sean Cronin (St. Mary's College/Leinster), Robbie Diack (Malone/Ulster) *, Cian Healy (Clontarf/Leinster), Jamie Heaslip (Dublin University/Leinster), Iain Henderson (Ballynahinch/Ulster), Chris Henry (Malone/Ulster), Rob Herring (Ballynahinch/Ulster) *, David Kilcoyne (UL Bohemians/Munster), Mike McCarthy (Leinster), Jack McGrath (St. Mary's College/Leinster), Martin Moore (Lansdowne/Leinster) *, Jordi Murphy (Lansdowne/Leinster) *, Paul O'Connell (Young Munster/Munster), Tommy O'Donnell (UL Bohemians/Munster), Peter O'Mahony (Cork Constitution/Munster), Mike Ross (Clontarf/Leinster), Rhys Ruddock (St. Mary's College/Leinster), Devin Toner (Lansdowne/Leinster), Dan Tuohy (Ballymena/Ulster), Damien Varley (Garryowen/Munster)

* Uncapped player

2. Scotland

Forwards:
John Beattie (Montpellier), Kelly Brown (Saracens), Geoff Cross, David Denton, Alasdair Dickinson, Ross Ford (all Edinburgh Rugby), Chris Fusaro (Glasgow Warriors), Grant Gilchrist (Edinburgh Rugby), Ryan Grant, Jonny Gray (both Glasgow Warriors), Richie Gray (Castres), Jim Hamilton (Montpellier), Robert Harley (Glasgow Warriors), Scott Lawson (Newcastle Falcons), Kieran Low (London Irish), Moray Low, Pat MacArthur (both Glasgow Warriors), Ross Rennie (Edinburgh Rugby) Alasdair Strokosch (Perpignan), Tim Swinson and Ryan Wilson (both Glasgow Warriors).

Backs:
Chris Cusiter (Glasgow Warriors), Nick De Luca (Edinburgh Rugby), Alex Dunbar (Glasgow Warriors), Max Evans (Castres), Dougie Fife (Edinburgh Rugby), Stuart Hogg, Ruaridh Jackson, Sean Lamont (all Glasgow Warriors), Greig Laidlaw (Edinburgh Rugby), Sean Maitland (Glasgow Warriors), Matt Scott (Edinburgh Rugby), Tommy Seymour (Glasgow Warriors), Duncan Taylor (Saracens), Greig Tonks (Edinburgh Rugby) and Duncan Weir (Glasgow Warriors).

B. Head To Head

127 Played 127
57 Wins 65
65 Losses 57
5 Draws 5
203 Tries 210
104 Conversions 109
111 Penalties 131
17 Drop Goals 38
1,344 Points 1,303

C. Recent Form

24 February 2013
Scotland 12–8 Ireland

10 March 2012
Ireland 32–14  Scotland

27 February 2011
Scotland 18–21  Ireland

D. Teams

1. Ireland



15. Rob Kearney (UCD/Leinster) 49
14. Dave Kearney (Lansdowne/Leinster) 2
13. Brian O'Driscoll (UCD/Leinster) 128
12. Luke Marshall (Ballynahinch/Ulster) 4
11. Andrew Trimble (Ballymena/Ulster) 50
10. Jonathan Sexton (Racing Metro 92) 38
9. Conor Murray (Garryowen/Munster) 22
1. Cian Healy (Clontarf/Leinster) 42
2. Rory Best (Banbridge/Ulster) 70
3. Mike Ross (Clontarf/Leinster) 34
4. Devin Toner (Lansdowne/Leinster) 10
5. Paul O'Connell (Young Munster/Munster) (capt) 88
6. Peter O'Mahony (Cork Constitution/Munster) 19
7. Chris Henry (Malone/Ulster) 9
8. Jamie Heaslip (Dublin University/Leinster) 60

Replacements:

16. Sean Cronin (St. Mary's College/Leinster) 30
17. Jack McGrath (St. Mary's College/Leinster) 3
18. Martin Moore (Lansdowne/Leinster) *
19. Dan Tuohy (Ballymena/Ulster) 7
20. Tommy O'Donnell (UL Bohemians/Munster) 2
21. Isaac Boss (Terenure College/Leinster) 17
22. Paddy Jackson (Dungannon/Ulster) 5
23. Fergus McFadden (Old Belvedere/Leinster) 21

* Denotes uncapped player

2. Scotland




15 Stuart Hogg (Glasgow Warriors) 15 caps, 3 tries, 15 points
14 Sean Maitland (Glasgow Warriors) 8 caps, 1 try, 5 points
13 Alex Dunbar (Glasgow Warriors) 3 caps, 1 try, 5 points
12 Duncan Taylor (Saracens) 6 caps
11 Sean Lamont (Glasgow Warriors) 82 caps, 12 tries, 60 points
10 Duncan Weir (Glasgow Warriors) 8 caps, 1 try, 2 conversions, 9 points
9 Greig Laidlaw (Edinburgh Rugby) 24 caps, 3 tries, 23 conversions, 54 penalties, 223 points
1 Ryan Grant (Glasgow Warriors) 13 caps
2 Ross Ford (Edinburgh Rugby) 71 caps, 2 tries, 10 points
3 Moray Low (Glasgow Warriors) 23 caps
4 Tim Swinson (Glasgow Warriors) 3 caps
5 Jim Hamilton (Montpellier) 50 caps, 1 try, 5 points
6 Ryan Wilson (Glasgow Warriors) 4 caps
7 Kelly Brown (Saracens) CAPTAIN 60 caps, 4 tries, 20 points
8 David Denton (Edinburgh Rugby) 17 caps

Replacements:

16 Pat MacArthur (Glasgow Warriors) 3 caps
17 Alasdair Dickinson (Edinburgh Rugby) 30 caps, 2 tries, 10 points
18 Geoff Cross (Edinburgh Rugby) 23 caps, 1 try, 5 points
19 Richie Gray (Castres) 33 caps, 1 try, 5 points
20 Johnnie Beattie (Montpellier) 26 caps, 3 tries, 15 points
21 Chris Cusiter (Glasgow Warriors) 64 caps, 3 tries, 15 points
22 Matt Scott (Edinburgh Rugby) 16 caps, 3 tries, 15 points
23 Max Evans (Castres) 37 caps, 3 tries, 15 points

This is Ireland's first outing in the 6 nations this year. We've a new coach and we've new players being exposed to the 6 nations. It's gonna take time to adjust, things don't just happen because you want them to. Nearly every player went into the game today with something to prove, no way were they being selective about gears.

ME-109 wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

Notch wrote:I'm not saying we went out there to deliberately try and play in second or third gear SF. More that we just did. We can and should play much better next week!

I don't think we were holding back, it just took us a little time to get our game going after a few months away which is fairly normal.

Ah...............  I'm just tired of Ireland and their gears, Notch.  Massive improvement needed before next week (as indeed Wales need massive improvement too)  But which side will actually achieve it?  
Next week is a very dicey prospect now and it is dicey because our players looked nervous again.  If they don't genuinely believe in their ability then we'll struggle again.  They've got to start believing from the get-go.  There is no time for belief warm-ups in this contest. 80 minutes is too short for belief warm-up periods.

There was me thinking it was the previous Coach was the problem..at least that is what everyone was saying....or maybe its like with the current Government where they blame the previous shower for all the problems.

ME...you'll hear enough about the coach from me if he fails in his role.  Don't worry about that...not that I heard much from you about the past one when he started to fail.  
I told you about all this in the beginning.  I said he (Schmidt) would find no hiding place from me but that I'd give him the time I gave Kidney - which this site can prove was about 2 years.  
And here I am today, already one of the few who doesn't buy the idea that the Irish performance was a good one.  I speak my mind - always.  And you'll hear enough about Schmidt if he doesn't match up to the role.

Fair enough Fly...am of the same mind...will give him more time to see if he can transition some of the stalwarts out of the team......

Anyhow main concern today was the complete lack of penetration in the backline...seemed like the same old...in reality since EOS we havent had much going for us in that area...

Scotland were poor. Next week will reveal much more about Ireland.

Interview with Trimby and Tuohy. Was the try really Trimble's first touch of the ball? Also, nice to see Tuohy interviewed - gives us more of an idea who this english buck is. I like the cut of his jib! Top bloke.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/26012012

Haven't read back...

Solid team performance from Ireland with some very good individual displays. The backrow were excellent in the second half, especially Heaslip and Henry. Touhy had a good game in the second row in O'Connell's absence and the lineout went encouragingly well after O'Connell pulling out.

In the backs Sexton ran he show with strong performances across the 2/4 line. Great to see BOD look so fit and sharp and delighter for Trimble who was very solid and confident on the right wing without doing anything spectacular. Kearney looked back to his best and was my motm. Murray didn't have his best game and the pace quickened noticeably when Boss came on.

I think Schmidt will be thinking about bringing in McFadden and D'arcy next week, however I think this would be a mistake - Marshall and Trimble bring an extra physical presence which we'll need next week against a huge Welsh 3/4 line. I'd go with the same side plus O'Connell.

Scotland were very disappointing, after a strong start they just seemed to fall away.

Overall a decent start but I think we'll need a massive improvement next week. Wales were fairly poor against Italy but the firepower they have in the backs is pretty scary and their back row will be a handful for ours.

1. Healy 7.5
2. Best 7
3. Ross 5
4. Toner 6
5. Tuohy 7
6. POM 8
7. Henry 7.5
8. Heaslip 7.5

9. Murray 6
10. Sexton 6.5
11. D Kearney 6
12. Marshall 6
13. BOD 6
14. Trimble 7
15. R Kearney 7.5

Moore to get the nod over Ross for Wales?

I thought Best had an excellent game too - surprised at some comments up the thread suggesting he didn't. He carried more than usual and he and Heaslip led the back well in O'Connell's absence.

Overall I think a comprehensive win over Scotland isn't to be sniffed at. On paper we have the 4th best side in the championship, and a tough set of fixtures, so anything above 3rd is a positive outcome, some people need a sense of perspective and patience and Schmidt rebuilds this side.

At this stage England look very powerful but France now have one hand on the trophy with Wales and Ireland at home.

For me Moore in place of Ross, POC in place of Toner, D'Arcy in place of Marshall.

geoff998rugby wrote:For me Moore in place of Ross, POC in place of Toner, D'Arcy in place of Marshall.

Really Geoff, you'd replace Marshall? I think Schmidt will and D'arcy is having a great season but I have grave concerns about this. Roberts has really caused big problems for D'arcy in recent seasons - both D'arcy and McFadden do struggle to defend against big men, whereas Marshall, Trimble and even Dave Kearney don't.

Marshall had a very strong game and I really hope Schmidt keeps faith with this backline because it presents the best chance of beating Wales imo.

It's no real insult to say Ireland played poorly and won. It's true.

Had the Ireland that massacred the NZ and choked at the end came out Scotland would have been defeated in the first half.

The mods do a great job. (Except RDW)    So give them a break.

Rodders I think he will mix and match 12 between the two players and given the 6 day turn round I think that has merit.

Don't get me wrong it is a marginal call as is TH.

To be honest if POC is in for Toner and that is it I would not have an issue

Weird game which wasn't totally satisfying yet I'd have paid good money for that final score line in the end.

Positives:
1) Defense was awesome
2) Basic handling was a massive improvement
3) Breakdown was pretty darn good
4) Both set pieces (scrum/lineout) were very impressive
5) Really good reserve front row impact

Negatives:
1) While willing to attack it was still pretty naive
2) Murray produced pretty slow ball
3) I'd love better and more support lines
4) We kicked a lot

Healy- 6.5
Good scrummaging, went through his opposite number. Good few carries and buried in rucks.

Best- 6.5
Better lineout throwing, good tight work and carried well. Really effective in the rucks.

Ross- 6
Did well in the scrums too and upped his work at the breakdowns a fair bit. Still pretty lathargic but an improvement.

Tuohy- 6.5
Massive defense, big workrate, got owned in the carrying department but with grunt stuff he excelled.

Toner- 7
Really impressive in loose work and epicentres of mauls. His work in the rucks was really good I felt in terms of disruption. Also lots of tackles.

POM- 7
I thought he was strong when carried, weak when tackling and strong when on the floor. Overall a good game, would love to see him tackling a bit lower (Hogg bounced him!)

Henry- 6.5
Good link play and really good to see his dog work coming to the fore, really slowed down their ball.

Heaslip- 7.5
Carried for 66m (2nd was 35m, 3rd was 15m), he made 11 tackles (2nd). Captaincy wise did well.

Murray- 5.5
I thought his service was pretty damn slow, but his kicking and tackling were real impressive.

Sexton- 7.5
Very accomplished performance. High kicks were good, wrap plays were effective, long passing good. Nice wee run too

Kearney- 5
I was crying for him to come into the line more. Pretty disappointed in that regard.

Marshall- 6
Didn't get enough ball and his carrying was met with solid resistance. Good handling and good defense but against wanted him to be involved more.

BOD- 6
Made 12 tackles (1st), and ran relatively well. His little tactical kicks were pretty good. Not amazing but good work overall.

Trimble- 6
Like Kearney, I'd love to have seen him come in between 10-12 or 12-13. Disappointing this didn't happen more. His main weapon is his physicality, he needs to use it.

Kearney- 7.5
Good basics. Good line kicking. Good running back a lot. One of his better games I felt.


Cronin struck one against the head. McGrath and Moore made big impacts. Henderson looked ok. Surprised POM came off for TOD and not Henry but didn't impact too much. Boss sped the game up. Jackson looked ok. McFadden looked very strong.

Ps: changes wise....

Fitz could and really should come back in if fit. I didn't think either winger was exceptional and Fitz is more in form than either, a better defender and generally busier.

Moore could be a good shout to start BUT he does offer considerably more off the bench than Ross.

POC should come in but I'm not sure if for Tuohy or Toner. I'd possibly suggest Tuohy so Toner can try to combat Charteris in the lineout and Tuohy has more impact in terms of hits and carries later in the game.

I think I'd keep Marshall.

Tuohy stole 2 Scottish lineout - he should start and if he is not in the 23 I would be digusted

I didn't mean any disrespect to Scotland- I've probably been to about 20-30 home games for Scotland when I lived there, always cheering for them except when Ireland were in town, and I always support them anytime they are not playing Ireland.

I don't think any of the teams hit the upper heights of what they are capable of, and it's very unusual for any team to peak in Round 1 of the Six Nations. I was a lot more happy than disappointed with Ireland given that its Round 1 but there's no Head Coach thinking 'we've got it sorted'- I think we still have a long way to go but so do the other 5 teams.

Notch wrote:I didn't mean any disrespect to Scotland.

I don't think the majority of folk thought you did and what you said was probably accurate anyway.

clivemcl wrote:Interview with Trimby and Tuohy. Was the try really Trimble's first touch of the ball? Also, nice to see Tuohy interviewed - gives us more of an idea who this english buck is. I like the cut of his jib! Top bloke.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/26012012

No way it was Trimbles first touch,I definitely remember him catching the 2nd garryowen Sexton put up,he chased kicks really well and got involved more than Kearney jnr. He can be happy with that display as it wasn't a game where a winger could really shine but he did well.

I thought Trimble had an excellent game - defended well, made a couple of strong runs, hit rucks and was excellent under the high ball ... a try on top was a bonus. Not quite up there with his best Ulster form but I think both he an Joe will be happy when they review his performance.

There was one occasion when Trimby probably pushed out a little too wide on defence and BOD was narrow, led to BOD having to make the tackle and get up, push out and make the second tackle in the space Trimble could have been occupying. A very animated exchange of views took place between 13 and 14. Other than that, he and David Kearney looked very well drilled and solid. Not spectacular enough to be nailed on given the competition for places on the wing, but I would not be concerned if either of them were to start upcoming games.

rodders wrote:I thought Trimble had an excellent game - defended well, made a couple of strong runs, hit rucks and was excellent under the high ball ... a try on top was a bonus. Not quite up there with his best Ulster form but I think both he an Joe will be happy when they review his performance.

GunsGerms wrote:Im happy with that team. Great depth in the front row. Good to see Trimble back in green, I suspect he will score a try.

Knew he would score. Wish I'd put money on it.

The team will need zip for Wales and I'd like to see McFadden have a shot. He's an impatient player, always on edge - but I think we need that kind of spirit next week.
We need more players that want to create the sparks that ignite the team, like Sexton's sudden burst of pace yesterday. Those energy injections are so so important.

Notch wrote:There was one occasion when Trimby probably pushed out a little too wide on defence and BOD was narrow, led to BOD having to make the tackle and get up, push out and make the second tackle in the space Trimble could have been occupying. A very animated exchange of views took place between 13 and 14. Other than that, he and David Kearney looked very well drilled and solid. Not spectacular enough to be nailed on given the competition for places on the wing, but I would not be concerned if either of them were to start upcoming games.

I think Kearney and Marshall will drop out of the team for the next match. Darcy and Bowe (if fit again to replace)

Hopefully POC will be back too.

SecretFly wrote:The team will need zip for Wales and I'd like to see McFadden have a shot.  He's an impatient player, always on edge - but I think we need that kind of spirit next week.  
We need more players that want to create the sparks that ignite the team, like Sexton's sudden burst of pace yesterday.  Those energy injections are so so important.

McFadden is probably too small to start on the wing v Cuthbert or North. I reckon if Bowe is at all fit he and Trimble will start.

I wouldn't rate it as a size thing at all. I'd be much more interested in attitude.  Other wings are solid rather than the instinctive shape shifters that McFadden can be.  We definitely need more inventiveness on the wings and I wouldn't worry about McFadden's size at all.

The minute sides try to replicate Welsh obsession with size, that gives them a moral high ground they don't deserve.  There are more ways to kill their goose than in simply trying to match them size for size.

Bowe won't be playing in the next match, he'll play for Ulster on Friday though hopefully.

Notch wrote:A very animated exchange of views took place between 13 and 14.

BOD and Trimble don't get on so that's not surprising. In terms of who was at fault well that's one for the defensive coaches but generally it's the inside man's responsibility to push put rather than vice versa - if he's too slow well that's his problem. BOD did struggle to get into the line a few times in the second half I noticed.

SecretFly wrote:I wouldn't rate it as a size thing at all.  I'd be much more interested in attitude.  Other wings are solid rather than the instinctive shape shifters that McFadden can be.  We definitely need more inventiveness on the wings and I wouldn't worry about McFadden's size at all.

The minute sides try to replicate Welsh obsession with size, that gives them a moral high ground they don't deserve.  There are more ways to kill their goose than in simply trying to match them size for size.

Well I would be slightly worried about his size given that a couple of years ago he was absolutley steam rolled by North for a key try in this fixture.

This is exactly the sort of game Wales will play v ireland.

SecretFly wrote:I wouldn't rate it as a size thing at all.

I would - and a technique thing. For all McFadden's endeavour he's been trampled far too many times by the Welsh 3/4 line to get the nod, he's the last person I'd start next week. Fitzgerald or Kearney on the left and Trimble on the right other wise we may gave them a 14 point head start.

As stated Bowe will be playing for Ulster not Ireland.
Schmidt has already pencilled in England as his come back game.

As Rodders said Trimble and BOD are not best buddies so no surprise they had a disagreement

GunsGerms wrote:

rodders wrote:I thought Trimble had an excellent game - defended well, made a couple of strong runs, hit rucks and was excellent under the high ball ... a try on top was a bonus. Not quite up there with his best Ulster form but I think both he an Joe will be happy when they review his performance.

GunsGerms wrote:Im happy with that team. Great depth in the front row. Good to see Trimble back in green, I suspect he will score a try.

Knew he would score. Wish I'd put money on it.

I did

Notch wrote:Bowe won't be playing in the next match, he'll play for Ulster on Friday though hopefully.

How do you know?

If fit he will pay for Ulster - been told.

Also Schmidt said anyone not in his 32 man squad will not play in the first 2 games so Bowe will not be considered.
Given his layoff it would madness to play him but as I said he wont be.

Because the 34-man squad announced for the first two games doesn't include Bowe and Schmidt has constantly stated that he wants returning players to get game time at their provinces to get up to match sharpness.

Ok fair enough. His tackling v NZ on Savea in particular was incredible. We could do with him v Wales.

rodders wrote:

SecretFly wrote:I wouldn't rate it as a size thing at all.

I would - and a technique thing. For all McFadden's endeavour he's been trampled far too many times by the Welsh 3/4 line to get the nod, he's the last person I'd start next week. Fitzgerald or Kearney on the left and Trimble on the right other wise we may gave them a 14 point head start.

Correct me if I'm wrong but more than him have been getting steamrolled by the Welsh in recent years?  Correct?

This is supposedly the new Ireland where players will have more tools at their disposal than lining themselves up to be taken out by the big bad Welshies
Nope, Shane Williams proved that a devious turn of pace and good hips can cancel out small man disadvantages....and McFadden is only two inches shorter than Trimble and one shorter than Fitz - he's not as small as he seems to look to many!
McFadden would be my man.

Zebo would have made a huge differenece to our other wise blunt back play. He is the most exciting back in the country and can make something from nothing. You might not like some off his off the pitch antics but to me that does not matter one iota!

On another point how long is sensible joe going to persist with bod? Yes he does the basics averagely but he starting hide more and more at the breakdown instead of opening up defences probably because he does not have the pace anymore. We need to look at future and try new players there.

We will be trting news player in the Summer - Henshaw, maybe Cave, and in the Autumn - Payne.

BOD will stick around till the end of the 6N

BlueMuff wrote:
On another point how long is sensible joe going to persist with bod?

Four more games or less? Is that too much? He was everywhere in defence yesterday..and according to sensible Joe's own words, he doesn't seem to be ready to retire him just yet.

The whole team made mistakes and were collectively about a 6. The half backs were generally too indecisive to release the 3/4s but that may have been a combination of rustiness and the Scottish backrow being allowed to stand a yard offside. Their kicking range was also either too short or too long for the chasers.

In the calls for the Wales games, I'd keep Toner over Tuohy. Dan outplayed Dev in pretty much every area (hardly noticed the absence of POC), but having Toner in the lineout gives the whole team a sense of security that is probably needed - some of the ball 'off the top' was just perfect.

I thought Marshall had a really good game, constantly assessing the play and moving to the right areas, he was really solid in defence and always made yards to suck in the defence. D'Arcy is playing well and there is so little between them that I'd give Marshall the week off because Gordon will be fresh.
Of course if that argument were to be followed through then it should be maybe BOD who gets a rest. Then again yesterday was probably the last time I'll have seen him in the flesh on a rugby pitch, so I can't deny others their opportunity.

The Great Aukster wrote:The whole team made mistakes and were collectively about a 6. The half backs were generally too indecisive to release the 3/4s but that may have been a combination of rustiness and the Scottish backrow being allowed to stand a yard offside. Their kicking range was also either too short or too long for the chasers.

In the calls for the Wales games, I'd keep Toner over Tuohy. Dan outplayed Dev in pretty much every area (hardly noticed the absence of POC), but having Toner in the lineout gives the whole team a sense of security that is probably needed - some of the ball 'off the top' was just perfect.

I thought Marshall had a really good game, constantly assessing the play and moving to the right areas, he was really solid in defence and always made yards to suck in the defence. D'Arcy is playing well and there is so little between them that I'd give Marshall the week off because Gordon will be fresh.
Of course if that argument were to be followed through then it should be maybe BOD who gets a rest. Then again yesterday was probably the last time I'll have seen him in the flesh on a rugby pitch, so I can't deny others their opportunity.

I will sum it up for you to make it easier....we were boring, lacked cutting edge but efficient.

SecretFly wrote:

rodders wrote:

SecretFly wrote:I wouldn't rate it as a size thing at all.

I would - and a technique thing. For all McFadden's endeavour he's been trampled far too many times by the Welsh 3/4 line to get the nod, he's the last person I'd start next week. Fitzgerald or Kearney on the left and Trimble on the right other wise we may gave them a 14 point head start.

Correct me if I'm wrong but more than him have been getting steamrolled by the Welsh in recent years?  Correct?

No you're correct fly...D'arcy has been steamrollered too..... which is why I'd pick neither.....

I'll give you another reason, both North and Cuthbert are poor defenders and can be beaten on the outside, McFadden prefers to attack up the middle where Wales aren't so vulnerable. This is the wrong game for McFadden.

There might not be much between Trimble and McFadden in terms of size on paper but defensively they are miles apart.

BlueMuff wrote:Zebo would have made a huge differenece to our other wise blunt back play. He is the most exciting back in the country and can make something from nothing. You might not like some off his off the pitch antics but to me that does not matter one iota!

On another point how long is sensible joe going to persist with bod? Yes he does the basics averagely but he starting hide more and more at the breakdown instead of opening up defences probably because he does not have the pace anymore. We need to look at future and try new players there.

Our wings were two of our better players so not sure Zebo would have made much difference.

GunsGerms wrote:

BlueMuff wrote:Zebo would have made a huge differenece to our other wise blunt back play. He is the most exciting back in the country and can make something from nothing. You might not like some off his off the pitch antics but to me that does not matter one iota!

On another point how long is sensible joe going to persist with bod? Yes he does the basics averagely but he starting hide more and more at the breakdown instead of opening up defences probably because he does not have the pace anymore. We need to look at future and try new players there.

Our wings were two of our better players so not sure Zebo would have made much difference.

Healy beat more defenders than both put together and made as many metres as each individual winger. Plus he made more tackles and missed less. Seems like he would be a more effective winger for us....  

Yes and it would free up a spot for Kilcoyne, we know your game ME.

rodders wrote:Yes and it would free up a spot for Kilcoyne, we know your game ME.

I think Cronins better.

ME-109 wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:

BlueMuff wrote:Zebo would have made a huge differenece to our other wise blunt back play. He is the most exciting back in the country and can make something from nothing. You might not like some off his off the pitch antics but to me that does not matter one iota!

On another point how long is sensible joe going to persist with bod? Yes he does the basics averagely but he starting hide more and more at the breakdown instead of opening up defences probably because he does not have the pace anymore. We need to look at future and try new players there.

Our wings were two of our better players so not sure Zebo would have made much difference.

Healy beat more defenders than both put together and made as many metres as each individual winger. Plus he made more tackles and missed less. Seems like he would be a more effective winger for us....  

Healy also had way more ball than either of the wingers. It is usually a forward that makes most tackles too. Your stats arent really all that surprising ME-109. Not sure they would have been much different with Zebo playing. I'm sure if he knuckles down and focuses on rugby he will be back in the squad soon enough.

GunsGerms wrote:

ME-109 wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:

BlueMuff wrote:Zebo would have made a huge differenece to our other wise blunt back play. He is the most exciting back in the country and can make something from nothing. You might not like some off his off the pitch antics but to me that does not matter one iota!

On another point how long is sensible joe going to persist with bod? Yes he does the basics averagely but he starting hide more and more at the breakdown instead of opening up defences probably because he does not have the pace anymore. We need to look at future and try new players there.

Our wings were two of our better players so not sure Zebo would have made much difference.

Healy beat more defenders than both put together and made as many metres as each individual winger. Plus he made more tackles and missed less. Seems like he would be a more effective winger for us....  

Healy also had way more ball than either of the wingers. It is usually a forward that makes most tackles too. Your stats arent really all that surprising ME-109. Not sure they would have been much different with Zebo playing. I'm sure if he knuckles down and focuses on rugby he will be back in the squad soon enough.

Or maybe Joe is going to try to bore the opposition into submission...its not going to be through the backs after yesterdays showing...

Anything would be more exciting than the way we played under Kidney. Scotland came with a game plan to spoil everything. It worked everywhere bar the score board.

They were effective at the breakdown in slowing everything down plus Joubert did his very best to waste as much time at scrum time as possible. It was at times painful. As a result the match had no tempo and continuity was hard to come by. Not sure this has a lot to do with Schmidt. Marshall and BOD were poor but all other backs did well under the circumstances.

Worst comes to worst we could put Peter O'Mahony on the wing as he has played there lots of times before and lets face it he was the real MOTM be some distance on Saturday. The man can do no wrong.

Nobody else think that Fitzgerald should nearly automatically get a wing spot????

In better form than others. Best defender. Most productive (goes looking for ball). Quick and elusive enough to get outside/inside North/Cuthbert