Do Wales have the psychological edge over this England team?

First topic message reminder :

Although England clearly have the better players, does last year's mauling at the hands of Steve Welsh and the Welsh team give them a distinct edge going in to next week's encounter?
It may be universally accepted that Steve Walsh had a huge hand in the result, but the scars of that defeat must run deep. Or perhaps has Ireland's battering of Wales and then their subsequent loss to England redressed this imbalance?

Rainbow I agree it was poor. Mainly because teams like Wales, France and Scotland were abject.

In answer to the OP - clearly not.
Many people commented on Wales illegal scrummaging and were pilloried. When the ref acted upon it the game was up for Wales. Wales strategy needs good ball from the set piece.

Interesting looking at the stats before the game, before this match England had won 12 of their last 14 vs Wales at Twickenham. When you take that stat, Wales were always going to face an uphill battle.

When England lost to Wales last year they were in poor form with a full back on the wing and a blindside flanker playing no 8.

This year England were in decent form with a 15 on fire (probably favourite for player of tournament).

In the end you could say the difference was the halfbacks. Whilst England's controlled the game, Wales' wilted.

Isnt hindsight just great.

I would say that Wales did manage to manufacture a couple of really solid chances that another team could have put away, but all over the pitch they looked slow in mind and body.

lostinwales wrote:Isnt hindsight just great.

I would say that Wales did manage to manufacture a couple of really solid chances that another team could have put away, but all over the pitch they looked slow in mind and body.

While I haven't seen all of Wales matches, my impression from what I have seen is that that description applies to all except the France match.

There is still largely a very good team for Wales, although they probably do need to bite the bullet and accept Gethin's age has finally caught up with him. Second and back rows are still good, as are the backs from 11 to 15 (potentially the back 3 is better than just 'good', but tactics at the moment don't give them enough opportunities to show it), but half backs are an issue. Webb was good against France behind a pack playing well, but poor v England where they were struggling at the breakdown, thile the debate about the 10 jersey is of course the Welsh obsession.

Have Wales spent too much time and energy on finding ways to get a penalty at scrum time and not enough on finding ways to play positive winning rugby. Jenkins asking to be stood down during his sin bin should be the end of him in a Wales shirt. How could anyone not want to play for their country?

I assume he didn't want to go back on (if such was his request) for the benefit of his team in that he knew he was never going to please Poite.

A little low to suggest a Welsh player like Jenkins didn't want to play for his country, glory.

If Gatland is the running 'joke' after the Welsh collapse because of his words before the game then so be it - but don't slight honest players just trying to do their job and paying the price with the humiliation that follows a notable loss.

SecretFly wrote:I assume he didn't want to go back on (if such was his request) for the benefit of his team in that he knew he was never going to please Poite.

A little low to suggest a Welsh player like Jenkins didn't want to play for his country, glory.
If Gatland is the running 'joke' after the Welsh collapse because of his words before the game then so be it - but don't slight honest players just trying to do their job and paying the price with the humiliation that follows a notable loss.

+ 1  

Theres quite a few Welsh lining up to suggest he shouldnt be mind

Pending Ireland's win in France, England will be exactly where they started, 2nd in the 6 nations, AGAIN. Then a nice trip down to NZ should show them exactly what progress they have made.   

Has it been reported that Jenkins asked "to be stood down"? That would surprise me.

englandglory4ever wrote:Have Wales spent too much time and energy on finding ways to get a penalty at scrum time and not enough on finding ways to play positive winning rugby. Jenkins asking to be stood down during his sin bin should be the end of him in a Wales shirt. How could anyone not want to play for their country?

What is the source of this revelation?

It's all over the media. He suggested to Gatland  that he shouldn't go back. What player wouldn't want to run on to the pitch again after exactly10minutes? Jenkins bottled it. If I was Gatland he'd never play for Wales again.

unless jenkins decided for whatever reason that he felt he would keep being pinged for driving at 90degrees and didnt want to cost any more penalties.

englandglory4ever wrote:It's all over the media. He suggested to Gatland  that he shouldn't go back. What player wouldn't want to run on to the pitch again after exactly10minutes? Jenkins bottled it. If I was Gatland he'd never play for Wales again.

If you were Gatland i should think Gethin would have retired.

scratch you used to be funny. maybe you should take a little break, get a bit of distance. time is a great healer you know.

quinsforever wrote:scratch you used to be funny. maybe you should take a little break, get a bit of distance. time is a great healer you know.

quins you've never been funny. No amount of time off will ever address that.   

bit too much bite scratch. let the scars heal and the detached ironic self can come to the fore once more...

quinsforever wrote:scratch you used to be funny.

Source?

LOL.

i still think your toby mug gag is the best i have read on 606. kudos!

quinsforever wrote:bit too much bite scratch. let the scars heal and the detached ironic self can come to the fore once more...

Like i said, i'll say it again, you are a humor free zone. PSW is funnier and he thinks sarcasm is the highest form of wit.

shining whit scratch. no spoonerism intended.

Runners-up again?

That's some consistency at least against rivals whose results are up and down more frequently than a lady of loose morals's drawers.

OK guys, enough of the personal jibes.

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:Runners-up again?

That's some consistency at least against rivals whose results are up and down more frequently than a lady of loose morals's drawers.

well at least that means she is getting it occasionally…..as opposed to england who get their skirts lifted and swiftly dropped again despite all the promises of slam action, always the bridesmaid and never the bride.

oh dear. brian moore spotted that jenkins wasnt straight on the very first scrum. not sure what the IRB will say other than good decisions by Poite.

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/464085/Wales-question-Gethin-Jenkins-sin-bin-after-Twickenham-defeat

quinsforever wrote:oh dear. brian moore spotted that jenkins wasnt straight on the very first scrum. not sure what the IRB will say other than good decisions by Poite.

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/464085/Wales-question-Gethin-Jenkins-sin-bin-after-Twickenham-defeat

and while he's at it he can ask why Hartley wasn't yellow carded for taking Faletau out in the air

Scratch wrote:

quinsforever wrote:oh dear. brian moore spotted that jenkins wasnt straight on the very first scrum. not sure what the IRB will say other than good decisions by Poite.

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/464085/Wales-question-Gethin-Jenkins-sin-bin-after-Twickenham-defeat

and while he's at it he can ask why Hartley wasn't yellow carded for taking Faletau out in the air

And if he does, he will probably get the answer "because it wasn't dangerous and because the reason Faletau was in the air was that he jumped towards Hartley, who was already committed to the tackle." Check the laws. It wasn't dangerous play, it wasn't foul play, it wasn't unfair play and it wasn't a repeat of the same offence, which are the instances in which the referee can give a yellow card. It was a penalty, and so a penalty was awarded.

An equally valid question would be why North was allowed to catch Nowell in the air and pretty much carry him into touch, with no sanction. Just as illegal, far more intentional.

An equally valid question would be why North was allowed to catch Nowell in the air and pretty much carry him into touch, with no sanction. Just as illegal, far more intentional

I agree with that, the replay clearly showed Nowell was still in the air.

SecretFly wrote:I assume he didn't want to go back on (if such was his request) for the benefit of his team in that he knew he was never going to please Poite.

A little low to suggest a Welsh player like Jenkins didn't want to play for his country, glory.

If Gatland is the running 'joke' after the Welsh collapse because of his words before the game then so be it - but don't slight honest players just trying to do their job and paying the price with the humiliation that follows a notable loss.

  

Gethin knew that poite had his number & was watching him closely. Jenkins had been repeatedly warned for not driving straight & deliberately wheeling (which he was doing every scrum). He knew that if he went back on and continued to attract poites attention he was looking at another yellow/red card. This definitely would not have helped Wales so better to make the change. A sensible decision by Gethin.

You'll remember that Vickery had the same problem on the Lions tour to SA.

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:Runners-up again?

That's some consistency at least against rivals whose results are up and down more frequently than a lady of loose morals's drawers.

Back to back champions pretty consistent add Grand Slams, think you'll find that is far far FAR better than the chariot who's wheels falls off more times than limbs at a lepper colony.

Can't wait for them to come to NZ see another whitewash, as I recall England left without scoring a try last time.  

rainbow-warrior wrote:

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:Runners-up again?

That's some consistency at least against rivals whose results are up and down more frequently than a lady of loose morals's drawers.

Back to back champions pretty consistent add Grand Slams, think you'll find that is far far FAR better than the chariot who's wheels falls off more times than limbs at a lepper colony.

Can't wait for them to come to NZ see another whitewash, as I recall England left without scoring a try last time.  

You're on thin ice calling on England's record against the ABs there pal. If I were you as a Welshman I'd be keeping very quite on that one