Whats Going On In Wales Part 3

First topic message reminder :

Understand but if the EGM had gone a certain way his position would have been untenable.

Thats not going to happen now.

Did I hear correctly that a joint statement is due by WRU and RRW concerrning central/joint contracts.
Also heard something about an East/West split within RRW but they may be just groundless gossip

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Over fifty players being considered for dual contracts...!

http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/29161459

Its a shame that a certain poster (who had a real distaste for non-welsh players at the regions) is no longer here, as he could have given us a nice long list of who the 50 players were.

SS, I seen a list of about 50 players a few weeks ago, cannot remember where, I just hope they have looked at ALL available home based players and whittled it down to the 50.
As you more than likely know, Gatland said today it is 10 to 15 players and as WRUburton is on £275000, if you divide that into £3.3M that is 12 players, therefore if it goes up to 15 players some will be on more than others, that could be divisive as is the fact when it was to be 10 players with 4 Blues, 3 Scarlets, 2 Ospreys and 1 Dragon it proved controversial, it needs careful handling and if the Dodger is involved, that will obviously not be the case

Wayne - I read somewhere that the regions and wru will need to agree upon the 'market value' of the player and that if they can not agree an external body will value the player.

Also the union will only be stumping up around £165k for WRUburton (really didn't expect that name to stick) as the ownership of the of the players contract is going to be 60:40. So that should mean there is enough cash in the coffers to sign a few players

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Wayne - I read somewhere that the regions and wru will need to agree upon the 'market value' of the player and that if they can not agree an external body will value the player.

Also the union will only be stumping up around £165k for WRUburton (really didn't expect that name to stick) as the ownership of the of the players contract is going to be 60:40.  So that should mean there is enough cash in the coffers to sign a few players

SS, WRUburtons CC was for £275000, the total amount was £3.3M, that is £2M WRU and £1.3M RRW, those figures correspond to a 60/40 split, and if you divide the £3.3M by £275000 that is 12 players, unless as you say market forces prevail, don't forget a lot of these players will have the same agents (Derwyn, God help us), if as I suspect he is involved in the negotiations this could go on for as long as the WRU, RRW dispute.

maestegmafia wrote:I think Anscombe has proved talented enough in the super XV to warrant investing. He qualifies through family not residency.

We will have to wait and see as even the BBC reports are just supposition at the moment.

I know he is talented and from what i have seen of him he does look sharp. I know he has a Welsh mam aswell but i think there are players who we could joint contract ahead of him. Lee, Ball, Patchell, Allen, S.Williams and their ilk. Players who have been here for a while. Done well in their regional colours and have earnt their place. I dislike that he may be dropped straight in to the national team. Let him play a season for the Blues first before he is joint contracted.

Coleman wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:I think Anscombe has proved talented enough in the super XV to warrant investing. He qualifies through family not residency.

We will have to wait and see as even the BBC reports are just supposition at the moment.

I know he is talented and from what i have seen of him he does look sharp. I know he has a Welsh mam aswell but i think there are players who we could joint contract ahead of him. Lee, Ball, Patchell, Allen, S.Williams and their ilk. Players who have been here for a while. Done well in their regional colours and have earnt their place. I dislike that he may be dropped straight in to the national team. Let him play a season for the Blues first before he is joint contracted.

Coleman, I can understand your annoyance, when considering the players that have been parachuted in and not delivered in the past (Harris and Hughes), the player IMO that should NOT be in there is Gethin, he will not be available for the 2019 WC, it is the youngsters or people who will be available for that that should be DC, also in that list there are 2 OH, if there are say 12 players DC, that is 4 positions without DC possibly playing for Wales, that will harness team harmony wont it

Personally I don't give a flying fig what Anscombe has done in the SH he should just walk into a dual contract at the expense of say Cory Allen.

Let him prove it over here as well first.

I agree about Gethin too long in the tooth now. We have to be targeting the players for 2019 as you said. If we get players who are in their early to mid 20's we will get more players signed then if we targeted the guys in their late 20's early 30's. Will this fund be increasing yearly to allow more players to be signed or is it static until the end of this agreement?

Coleman wrote:I agree about Gethin too long in the tooth now. We have to be targeting the players for 2019 as you said. If we get players who are in their early to mid 20's we will get more players signed then if we targeted the guys in their late 20's early 30's. Will this fund be increasing yearly to allow more players to be signed or is it static until the end of this agreement?

From what I understand, that fund is static every year, it could be they'll change some of the players EVERY YEAR, that list IMO apart from Gethin, will be available until 2019, so apart from Gethin and Anscombe, I have no problem with that list.

Coleman wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:I think Anscombe has proved talented enough in the super XV to warrant investing. He qualifies through family not residency.

We will have to wait and see as even the BBC reports are just supposition at the moment.

I know he is talented and from what i have seen of him he does look sharp. I know he has a Welsh mam aswell but i think there are players who we could joint contract ahead of him. Lee, Ball, Patchell, Allen, S.Williams and their ilk. Players who have been here for a while. Done well in their regional colours and have earnt their place. I dislike that he may be dropped straight in to the national team. Let him play a season for the Blues first before he is joint contracted.

Today it was announced that there will be around fifty dual contracts offered over the next year. I am sure that all players in the welsh squad and a few extras will be included.

Anscombe has not been offered a contract yet. It is pure supposition that he will be. He turns up next month and we will likely see him before the details are finalised.

I think he is a great signing for the blues, far better than players like Sam Norton Knight or Dan Parks were previous.

maestegmafia wrote:

Coleman wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:I think Anscombe has proved talented enough in the super XV to warrant investing. He qualifies through family not residency.

We will have to wait and see as even the BBC reports are just supposition at the moment.

I know he is talented and from what i have seen of him he does look sharp. I know he has a Welsh mam aswell but i think there are players who we could joint contract ahead of him. Lee, Ball, Patchell, Allen, S.Williams and their ilk. Players who have been here for a while. Done well in their regional colours and have earnt their place. I dislike that he may be dropped straight in to the national team. Let him play a season for the Blues first before he is joint contracted.

Today it was announced that there will be around fifty dual contracts offered over the next year. I am sure that all players in the welsh squad and a few extras will be included.

Anscombe has not been offered a contract yet. It is pure supposition that he will be. He turns up next month and we will likely see him before the details are finalised.

I think he is a great signing for the blues, far better than players like Sam Norton Knight or Dan Parks were previous.

Maes, I don't know where you read that, Gatland said today they are DC 10 to 15 players, and the Dodger said they are looking at around 50 players, if they DC 50 players that £3.3M will work out at £66000 per player, that will not keep anybody in Wales. I think they are whittling the numbers down from 50 to 10/15

wayne wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

Coleman wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:I think Anscombe has proved talented enough in the super XV to warrant investing. He qualifies through family not residency.

We will have to wait and see as even the BBC reports are just supposition at the moment.

I know he is talented and from what i have seen of him he does look sharp. I know he has a Welsh mam aswell but i think there are players who we could joint contract ahead of him. Lee, Ball, Patchell, Allen, S.Williams and their ilk. Players who have been here for a while. Done well in their regional colours and have earnt their place. I dislike that he may be dropped straight in to the national team. Let him play a season for the Blues first before he is joint contracted.

Today it was announced that there will be around fifty dual contracts offered over the next year. I am sure that all players in the welsh squad and a few extras will be included.

Anscombe has not been offered a contract yet. It is pure supposition that he will be. He turns up next month and we will likely see him before the details are finalised.

I think he is a great signing for the blues, far better than players like Sam Norton Knight or Dan Parks were previous.

Maes, I don't know where you read that, Gatland said today they are DC 10 to 15 players, and the Dodger said they are looking at around 50 players, if they DC 50 players that £3.3M will work out at £66000 per player, that will not keep anybody in Wales. I think they are whittling the numbers down from 50 to 10/15

I would hazard a guess that the players won't be on an equal wage

They aren't offering 50 contracts. They're considering fifty players and are likely to offer 10-15 contracts.

Read the article a bit more carefully maestegmafia http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/29161459

Especially this bit.

More than 50 players are being considered for dual contracts, Welsh Rugby Union (WRU) boss Roger Lewis says.

Of those players, 10 to 15 are expected to be awarded a contract as part of a deal between the WRU and the regions.

Yeah 50 considered, is prob all four regions wq first xv players inc Phil John etc

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Yeah 50 considered, is prob all four regions wq first xv players inc Phil John etc

SS, has he actually ever won a Welsh cap, I ask, because Adam has said on a couple of occasions how he has had tough battles with Phil, and when questioned about scrummaging against Gethin he says he can handle him fine.

Nope don't think he has ever been capped.

Pretty sure he has been capped, but to be honest my point was across the four regions first choice xv there are prob around 50 wq players, and even the older less reputable players would have to be considered, if only for a few seconds

Wiki says no

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_John_(rugby_union_born_1981)

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Pretty sure he has been capped, but to be honest my point was across the four regions first choice xv there are prob around 50 wq players, and even the older less reputable players would have to be considered, if only for a few seconds

SS, in our squad for last weeks game there were only 4 NOT now eligible for Wales, Hassler, Matafesi, Bernardo and Ardron and with Bernardo reputedly a time signing that could be three, plus all the others that are rested or injured, there is going to be a lot more than 50 across the whole squad IMO. I've just checked there are another 20 in our squad not eligible or not selected that is 39 in total Welsh qualified ATM, so if the same applies at the other Regions, there are over 150 Welsh qualified players at the Regions, if Lewis can be believed they have already whittled it down from 150 to 50 that is the easy part, getting it down to 10 to 15 will be extremely difficult IMO.

Pinched from SF;

"Nigel Short on the RSA

£1.25m per team per year for league tv / sponsorship
4.2% indexation - well above inflation
Exceptional circumstances, excellent service to Wales, no problem leaving for 2 years
4th AI - contract for next 2/3 years, then a commitment to move the game to be the first game
PRGB - no power to govern international game or change financial distribution
Sam Warburton moved to a dual contract
6 players sign dual contract before Gatland's Law kicks in
if £2m for dual contracts not spent, money re distributed to regions
£3.3m available for dual contracts, 15 to 20 over time
16 games minimum for dual contracts, play offs extra
Region and WRU agree market value of player, if no agreement, independent board
£42m to £63m european distributions up this year
European distributions hopefully up to over £100m in 4 years
5 partner sponsors for european competition, Heineken committed for 3 years, 6 other sponsors in discussions. 2 or 3 this year, more next year.
Nigel Short stepping down from RRW to concentrate on Scarlets"

Why not just share out the £2m and not bother with the DC minefield?

Because the WRU clearly don't trust the money on keeping the 'stars'. Only reason I can think of for that rather than just game limits for a selected squad, like the EPS agreement in England.

HammerofThunor wrote:Because the WRU clearly don't trust the money on keeping the 'stars'. Only reason I can think of for that rather than just game limits for a selected squad, like the EPS agreement in England.

No trust then basically. If that's the case then change is needed asap.

wayne wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Pretty sure he has been capped, but to be honest my point was across the four regions first choice xv there are prob around 50 wq players, and even the older less reputable players would have to be considered, if only for a few seconds

SS, in our squad for last weeks game there were only 4 NOT now eligible for Wales, Hassler, Matafesi, Bernardo and Ardron and with Bernardo reputedly a time signing that could be three, plus all the others that are rested or injured, there is going to be a lot more than 50 across the whole squad IMO. I've just checked there are another 20 in our squad not eligible or not selected that is 39 in total Welsh qualified ATM, so if the same applies at the other Regions, there are over 150 Welsh qualified players at the Regions, if Lewis can be believed they have already whittled it down from 150 to 50 that is the easy part, getting it down to 10 to 15 will be extremely difficult IMO.

Really? Not for a coach as blinkered and committed to Plan A as Cement is.

Picking he 10 best Gatlandball players in Wales fairly easy imo.

Cardiff Dave wrote:Pinched from SF;

"Nigel Short on the RSA

£1.25m per team per year for league tv / sponsorship
4.2% indexation - well above inflation
Exceptional circumstances, excellent service to Wales, no problem leaving for 2 years
4th AI - contract for next 2/3 years, then a commitment to move the game to be the first game
PRGB - no power to govern international game or change financial distribution
Sam Warburton moved to a dual contract
6 players sign dual contract before Gatland's Law kicks in
if £2m for dual contracts not spent, money re distributed to regions
£3.3m available for dual contracts, 15 to 20 over time
16 games minimum for dual contracts, play offs extra
Region and WRU agree market value of player, if no agreement, independent board
£42m to £63m european distributions up this year
European distributions hopefully up to over £100m in 4 years
5 partner sponsors for european competition, Heineken committed for 3 years, 6 other sponsors in discussions. 2 or 3 this year, more next year.
Nigel Short stepping down from RRW to concentrate on Scarlets"

Why not just share out the £2m and not bother with the DC minefield?

Say the WRU offer the Dragons £X towards bringing Lydiate home. WTF is the point in the region agreeing, when they could put £X towards a top class nwq tight head prop that would benefit the development of all the Welsh players in the team and academy no end?

Stone Motif wrote:Say the WRU offer the Dragons £X towards bringing Lydiate home.  WTF is the point in the region agreeing, when they could put £X towards a top class nwq tight head prop that would benefit the development of all the Welsh players in the team and academy no end?

Maybe this is the conundrum.... Dragons choose NWQ. Lydiate doesn't come home. Gatland refuses to have Lydiate on his selections leading into the world cup. Wales disappoint in the WC. Recriminations about the players that should have been picked and weren't. Dragons blamed for allowing the regional selfishness to kill a potential Golden Goose of a Welsh WC win. War again between WRU, Regions and fans.

SecretFly wrote:

Stone Motif wrote:Say the WRU offer the Dragons £X towards bringing Lydiate home.  WTF is the point in the region agreeing, when they could put £X towards a top class nwq tight head prop that would benefit the development of all the Welsh players in the team and academy no end?

Maybe this is the conundrum.... Dragons choose NWQ.  Lydiate doesn't come home.  Gatland refuses to have Lydiate on his selections leading into the world cup.  Wales disappoint in the WC.  Recriminations about the players that should have been picked and weren't.  Dragons blamed for allowing the regional selfishness to kill a potential Golden Goose of a Welsh WC win.  War again between WRU, Regions and fans.

More like Lydiate decides to come home, wants to go to the Dragons on a dual contract, but the Dragons decide that he is not required (for the amount he would want), he ends up playing at the Blues or Ospreys. The Dragons fans start complaining about being shafted by the way the union gets involved in placing players on central contracts.

(or for that matter Foxy, North to the Scarlets, or even Phillips to the Ospreys)

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

Stone Motif wrote:Say the WRU offer the Dragons £X towards bringing Lydiate home.  WTF is the point in the region agreeing, when they could put £X towards a top class nwq tight head prop that would benefit the development of all the Welsh players in the team and academy no end?

Maybe this is the conundrum.... Dragons choose NWQ.  Lydiate doesn't come home.  Gatland refuses to have Lydiate on his selections leading into the world cup.  Wales disappoint in the WC.  Recriminations about the players that should have been picked and weren't.  Dragons blamed for allowing the regional selfishness to kill a potential Golden Goose of a Welsh WC win.  War again between WRU, Regions and fans.

More like Lydiate decides to come home, wants to go to the Dragons on a dual contract, but the Dragons decide that he is not required (for the amount he would want), he ends up playing at the Blues or Ospreys.  The Dragons fans start complaining about being shafted by the way the union gets involved in placing players on central contracts.

(or for that matter Foxy, North to the Scarlets, or even Phillips to the Ospreys)

My conclusion still works... war again between the WRU, the regions and the fans

Stone Motif wrote:

Cardiff Dave wrote:Pinched from SF;

"Nigel Short on the RSA

£1.25m per team per year for league tv / sponsorship
4.2% indexation - well above inflation
Exceptional circumstances, excellent service to Wales, no problem leaving for 2 years
4th AI - contract for next 2/3 years, then a commitment to move the game to be the first game
PRGB - no power to govern international game or change financial distribution
Sam Warburton moved to a dual contract
6 players sign dual contract before Gatland's Law kicks in
if £2m for dual contracts not spent, money re distributed to regions
£3.3m available for dual contracts, 15 to 20 over time
16 games minimum for dual contracts, play offs extra
Region and WRU agree market value of player, if no agreement, independent board
£42m to £63m european distributions up this year
European distributions hopefully up to over £100m in 4 years
5 partner sponsors for european competition, Heineken committed for 3 years, 6 other sponsors in discussions. 2 or 3 this year, more next year.
Nigel Short stepping down from RRW to concentrate on Scarlets"

Why not just share out the £2m and not bother with the DC minefield?

Say the WRU offer the Dragons £X towards bringing Lydiate home.  WTF is the point in the region agreeing, when they could put £X towards a top class nwq tight head prop that would benefit the development of all the Welsh players in the team and academy no end?

You mean invest in the future like? Sounds like a good idea.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

Stone Motif wrote:Say the WRU offer the Dragons £X towards bringing Lydiate home.  WTF is the point in the region agreeing, when they could put £X towards a top class nwq tight head prop that would benefit the development of all the Welsh players in the team and academy no end?

Maybe this is the conundrum.... Dragons choose NWQ.  Lydiate doesn't come home.  Gatland refuses to have Lydiate on his selections leading into the world cup.  Wales disappoint in the WC.  Recriminations about the players that should have been picked and weren't.  Dragons blamed for allowing the regional selfishness to kill a potential Golden Goose of a Welsh WC win.  War again between WRU, Regions and fans.

More like Lydiate decides to come home, wants to go to the Dragons on a dual contract, but the Dragons decide that he is not required (for the amount he would want), he ends up playing at the Blues or Ospreys.  The Dragons fans start complaining about being shafted by the way the union gets involved in placing players on central contracts.

(or for that matter Foxy, North to the Scarlets, or even Phillips to the Ospreys)

SS, there are 3 ex Os, 1 recently returned to Wales, 1 who plays just over the border and another that plays his club rugby in France, that I have on good authority will NEVER play for us again, one because of his attitude when playing for us, another for what he did after leaving us and the other for breaking promises. Make of that what you will.

If the three are the three I am thinking of (well actually 4, 1 in the championship too), three of them had international falls from grace supposedly due to their non-rugby antics being discovered by a coach. And the other has burnt a few bridges with most places he has been.

Dai Prickering is gone, Gareth Davies in!!!
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/shock-chairman-david-pickering-voted-7763511

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Dai Prickering is gone, Gareth Davies in!!!
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/shock-chairman-david-pickering-voted-7763511

Absolutely Fantastic News, we only need the Dodger gone now and some of the executive pared to fetch it into a good business model and everything will be onwards and upwards.

Have a feeling Dai was keeping the Dodger in a job, so fingers crossed

YES!

One small step for a Welshman, one giant leap for Welsh rugby....hopefully.
Yippee ki fecking yay!!!

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Have a feeling Dai was keeping the Dodger in a job, so fingers crossed

Listening to his response on the radio this afternoon, you're probably right.

wayne wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

Stone Motif wrote:Say the WRU offer the Dragons £X towards bringing Lydiate home.  WTF is the point in the region agreeing, when they could put £X towards a top class nwq tight head prop that would benefit the development of all the Welsh players in the team and academy no end?

Maybe this is the conundrum.... Dragons choose NWQ.  Lydiate doesn't come home.  Gatland refuses to have Lydiate on his selections leading into the world cup.  Wales disappoint in the WC.  Recriminations about the players that should have been picked and weren't.  Dragons blamed for allowing the regional selfishness to kill a potential Golden Goose of a Welsh WC win.  War again between WRU, Regions and fans.

More like Lydiate decides to come home, wants to go to the Dragons on a dual contract, but the Dragons decide that he is not required (for the amount he would want), he ends up playing at the Blues or Ospreys.  The Dragons fans start complaining about being shafted by the way the union gets involved in placing players on central contracts.

(or for that matter Foxy, North to the Scarlets, or even Phillips to the Ospreys)

SS, there are 3 ex Os, 1 recently returned to Wales, 1 who plays just over the border and another that plays his club rugby in France, that I have on good authority will NEVER play for us again, one because of his attitude when playing for us, another for what he did after leaving us and the other for breaking promises. Make of that what you will.

I think I have the one who had attitude.  I think I have the one who did things after leaving..................  I'm caught on the 'breaking promises' guy. Well, I probably know him but not the 'breaking promises' bit.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Have a feeling Dai was keeping the Dodger in a job, so fingers crossed

If Roger does go, do you reckon he'll jump before he's pushed?

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Have a feeling Dai was keeping the Dodger in a job, so fingers crossed

If Roger does go, do you reckon he'll jump before he's pushed?

Maybe he will try and sneak into politics full time, any elections between now and October?

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Have a feeling Dai was keeping the Dodger in a job, so fingers crossed

If Roger does go, do you reckon he'll jump before he's pushed?

Maybe he will try and sneak into politics full time, any elections between now and October?

If he does go let's hope he goes to Westminster rather than Cardiff prior to the welsh voting for independence by 2020

maestegmafia wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Have a feeling Dai was keeping the Dodger in a job, so fingers crossed

If Roger does go, do you reckon he'll jump before he's pushed?

Maybe he will try and sneak into politics full time, any elections between now and October?

If he does go let's hope he goes to Westminster rather than Cardiff prior to the welsh voting for independence by 2020

He would be great for the pro independence vote, after all 90% of the public lap up all his bs. So with him on board there would be no need to torch holiday homes this time.

SecretFly wrote:

wayne wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

Stone Motif wrote:Say the WRU offer the Dragons £X towards bringing Lydiate home.  WTF is the point in the region agreeing, when they could put £X towards a top class nwq tight head prop that would benefit the development of all the Welsh players in the team and academy no end?

Maybe this is the conundrum.... Dragons choose NWQ.  Lydiate doesn't come home.  Gatland refuses to have Lydiate on his selections leading into the world cup.  Wales disappoint in the WC.  Recriminations about the players that should have been picked and weren't.  Dragons blamed for allowing the regional selfishness to kill a potential Golden Goose of a Welsh WC win.  War again between WRU, Regions and fans.

More like Lydiate decides to come home, wants to go to the Dragons on a dual contract, but the Dragons decide that he is not required (for the amount he would want), he ends up playing at the Blues or Ospreys.  The Dragons fans start complaining about being shafted by the way the union gets involved in placing players on central contracts.

(or for that matter Foxy, North to the Scarlets, or even Phillips to the Ospreys)

SS, there are 3 ex Os, 1 recently returned to Wales, 1 who plays just over the border and another that plays his club rugby in France, that I have on good authority will NEVER play for us again, one because of his attitude when playing for us, another for what he did after leaving us and the other for breaking promises. Make of that what you will.

I think I have the one who had attitude.  I think I have the one who did things after leaving..................  I'm caught on the 'breaking promises' guy.  Well, I probably know him but not the 'breaking promises' bit.

Fly, you definitely know the coloured one, he was very close to one of the MDs, who has also left that position, when he wanted a break the MD said on a number of occasions that he would come back to us, which obviously he didn't.

Why would Gatland refuse to pick Lydiate though. There is no (and never was) a 'Gatlands Law' he has given himself a get out clause if he needed it by saying he will select players in exceptional circumstances if need be.

Players who are already outsid Wales will be selected as when required as they already have been, the new deal and subsequent talk of a Gatlands Law is to try and detract other from going.

bedfordwelsh wrote:Why would Gatland refuse to pick Lydiate though. There is no (and never was) a 'Gatlands Law' he has given himself a get out clause if he needed it by saying he will select players in exceptional circumstances if need be.

Players who are already outsid Wales will be selected as when required as they already have been, the new deal and subsequent talk of a Gatlands Law is to try and detract other from going.

BW, the problem I have is after their present contracts, any player already playing abroad and are young enough to be available for the 2019 WC, if they are not prepared to play in Wales, on a contract of over £200,000 per year you forfeit the right to play for Wales, is Lydiate or any other player so good that he cannot be dropped, remember WRUburton and Tipuric playing very well together, there is IMO not a position in Wales that is not contestable especially after last night when Baker totally eclipsed Toby, I could go on with players like Samson, Ken Owens, Cory Allen etc.
So IMO Gatlands law should be implemented.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Have a feeling Dai was keeping the Dodger in a job, so fingers crossed

If Roger does go, do you reckon he'll jump before he's pushed?

Maybe he will try and sneak into politics full time, any elections between now and October?

If he does go let's hope he goes to Westminster rather than Cardiff prior to the welsh voting for independence by 2020

He would be great for the pro independence vote, after all 90% of the public lap up all his bs.  So with him on board there would be no need to torch holiday homes this time.

Oh c'mon, a bit of a bonfire always goes down well with everyone in the village.... Be a shame not to, and it keeps house prices down.

wayne wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Why would Gatland refuse to pick Lydiate though. There is no (and never was) a 'Gatlands Law' he has given himself a get out clause if he needed it by saying he will select players in exceptional circumstances if need be.

Players who are already outsid Wales will be selected as when required as they already have been, the new deal and subsequent talk of a Gatlands Law is to try and detract other from going.

BW, the problem I have is after their present contracts, any player already playing abroad and are young enough to be available for the 2019 WC, if they are not prepared to play in Wales, on a contract of over £200,000 per year you forfeit the right to play for Wales, is Lydiate or any other player so good that he cannot be dropped, remember WRUburton and Tipuric playing very well together, there is IMO not a position in Wales that is not contestable especially after last night when Baker totally eclipsed Toby, I could go on with players like Samson, Ken Owens, Cory Allen etc.
So IMO Gatlands law should be implemented.    

The flipside being that not letting top players go abroad stops talent like Samson, Ken Owens, Cory Allen from coming through...!

I think the system looks good.

maestegmafia wrote:

wayne wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Why would Gatland refuse to pick Lydiate though. There is no (and never was) a 'Gatlands Law' he has given himself a get out clause if he needed it by saying he will select players in exceptional circumstances if need be.

Players who are already outsid Wales will be selected as when required as they already have been, the new deal and subsequent talk of a Gatlands Law is to try and detract other from going.

BW, the problem I have is after their present contracts, any player already playing abroad and are young enough to be available for the 2019 WC, if they are not prepared to play in Wales, on a contract of over £200,000 per year you forfeit the right to play for Wales, is Lydiate or any other player so good that he cannot be dropped, remember WRUburton and Tipuric playing very well together, there is IMO not a position in Wales that is not contestable especially after last night when Baker totally eclipsed Toby, I could go on with players like Samson, Ken Owens, Cory Allen etc.
So IMO Gatlands law should be implemented.    

The flipside being that not letting top players go abroad stops talent like Samson, Ken Owens, Cory Allen from coming through...!

I think the system looks good.

Not really. Ken had Smiler in front of him and still made it. Samson is currently competing for the Scarlets tighthead shirt with fellow welsh international tighthead Rhodri Jones. And Cory Allen was coming through as a future star before Roberts left.

wayne wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Why would Gatland refuse to pick Lydiate though. There is no (and never was) a 'Gatlands Law' he has given himself a get out clause if he needed it by saying he will select players in exceptional circumstances if need be.

Players who are already outsid Wales will be selected as when required as they already have been, the new deal and subsequent talk of a Gatlands Law is to try and detract other from going.

BW, the problem I have is after their present contracts, any player already playing abroad and are young enough to be available for the 2019 WC, if they are not prepared to play in Wales, on a contract of over £200,000 per year you forfeit the right to play for Wales, is Lydiate or any other player so good that he cannot be dropped, remember WRUburton and Tipuric playing very well together, there is IMO not a position in Wales that is not contestable especially after last night when Baker totally eclipsed Toby, I could go on with players like Samson, Ken Owens, Cory Allen etc.
So IMO Gatlands law should be implemented.    

Wayne,

I don't disagree altogether but I still think we shouldn't cut our nose off to spite fce etc. Lets say Lydiate decides to sign a contract extension then for me if he is still considered our best option we would be silly to ignore him. In the WoS today there is an article with Josh Turnbull and is says he has been told to challenge Dan for the No6 shirt, well if he does and he is playing better than Lydiate I hope he gets the nod and that irrelevant of where Lydiate is playing.

In general (Jenkins and Phillips (maybe) aside) the players overseas who Gatland picked last year were playing better than any other option in Wales and I don't have a problem with that. As for Baker totally eclipsing Faletau well we must have been watching different games or both watching with our respective Regional blinkers on, I thought they were quite evenly matched with neither really setting game alight.

Baker made more ground than Faletau, but then we were stupid and going too high on him in the tackle. Time will tell with those two, but competition for places can only be a good thing.

Agree but totally eclipsing him is taking it a bit to far, as you said though LP competiton for places is whats needed and hopefully Powell can do that to Faletau at the Dragons as well.

I'm not getting into an argument about this, yes we obviously saw different matches, it was highlighted on the programme that with the same number of carries Baker, IIRC carried over 100 metres more than Toby, and as most of you were saying you would win the back row battle, that was a very significant battle in the course of that match, and to me a prime reason we won that game.