Australia vs New Zealand: Match thread, pondering and pontificating.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 16 Aug 2014, 9:38 am

First topic message reminder :

It's almost upon us. Two teams geared up for this one. It's finally here.

Good luck to both sides and here's hoping for a cracker.

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 8:59 am

NZ are playing pretty fast and loose at rucktime, surprised they didn't start the game a bit vore conservative!

mccaw, Read and Franks have all been a bit cheap, and I think Poite is just trying to stamp some of thst out. Difficult yellow to take though.

Tomua, and Crotty having pearlers.

NZ have controlled this 10 beautifully, thats how to neutralize a yellow card.

Don't like the venom fromthe crowd though as Beale lines his kicks up.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:01 am

Let's see how Australia do with their man off.

by disneychilly Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:03 am

That's how to play with your skip off for ten. Brilliant. Aussie has to react now with Simmons in the bin for a deserved card too. Sloppy around the ruck base though NZ have kicked balls through or let Aussie kick it to turn over pill.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:06 am

Monster scrum! Retallick floored Poite with that run.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:07 am

Another monster shove. That felt good. A man down but still impressive.

by disneychilly Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:08 am

That penalty try was given really early early-did I hear Poite say "Oh, they scored!" before they packed down? Probably knew that situation would happen from the last scrum and didn't feck around.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:10 am

That's another one for the end to end to end thread.

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:11 am

NZ dominant and just as I'm about to give them the benefit Folau gets clotheslined at the nose and NZ go down the other end to score, as superior as NZ are Aus must be gutted to not get that kind of decision, I think it shouldve been yellw too, it was a 2 on 2 to score.

by disneychilly Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:12 am

Ouch. Great skills rubbish defence by NZ, brilliant break by Folau, bad option taking by Oz that screwed two tries, and the typical NZ counterattack that puts 7 up down the other end.

by **Rugby Fan** Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:13 am

Australia look out for the count now.

They concede 3 points with a man advantage, concede a penalty try when a man down, and then concede a try after one of their best try-scoring opportunities goes begging.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:13 am

Folau should've passed out to the man on his left but I agree it was a high tackle.

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:15 am

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Folau should've passed out to the man on his left but I agree it was a high tackle.

From where i'V sitting Folau was stepping JAne to allow the offload, if Jane doesn't hit him illegaly Folau probably gets the offload away as Smith is going low, thats yellow for me.

Hard to see anything but a big NZ win now.

by disneychilly Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:18 am

Didn't Jane get hit high before that? If so horses for courses for mine-was consistent.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:19 am

Fair enough.

Messam has bombed a few passes which were tries if he held on.

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:22 am

disneychilly wrote:Didn't Jane get hit high before that? If so horses for courses for mine-was consistent.

No he wasn't, he kicked under pressure and the defender who jumped to block it collided with him, perfectly fine.

mccaw lucky to win that penalty then, wrestling for the ball right in front of the ref with his knee on the floor.

maybe Poite has decided to go easy on NZ after all the comotion pre game Laugh

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:23 am

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Fair enough.

Messam has bombed a few passes which were tries if he held on.

Yeppers, NZ prob should have another 2 tries. In reality theyre dominating this game, they can't throw it away now.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:23 am

That was a sweet little backline play from the Wallabies. Entertaining half. Quick pace and that will tell in the last quarter. Have been impressed with Crotty. He's looked good on attack as well as defence. Nonu's and Kaino's absence haven't been felt much.

by disneychilly Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:24 am

I'd have liked another try for NZ-feel they were that dominant. They can't afford to think about bonus points yet but if they get a third early on then I can imagine them kicking for touch from penalties.

Too right about Messam. Mammaries for hands. Cruden's putting of people into space has been magnificent.

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:26 am

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:That was a sweet little backline play from the Wallabies. Entertaining half. Quick pace and that will tell in the last quarter. Have been impressed with Crotty. He's looked good on attack as well as defence. Nonu's and Kaino's absence haven't been felt much.

I think Nonu is too 1 dimensional, you know what he's going to do at all times, Crotty is far more rounded similar style player to Conrad, I think they compliment each other pretty well. Have to say Conrad makes a huge difference in the backline, Savea must love playing outside a player of that class!

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:30 am

A bonus point for 4 tries must be the target. We have to make up ground for that draw.

by disneychilly Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:32 am

Disagree about Nonu, noone has better distribution skills than he does-Savea, Smith and Jane wouldn't have the tries they do without him passing at some stage. Check Dagg's winning try in Soweto as an example too. Crotty has been great though. Real polish and a lot more physically imposing than I expected. Mind you he is a smart footballer so knows what lines to run to target weak shoulders. Could we see Fekitoa for the last 20?

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:33 am

He's on now. Crotty with a cheekbone injury.

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:38 am

disneychilly wrote:Disagree about Nonu, noone has better distribution skills than he does-Savea, Smith and Jane wouldn't have the tries they do without him passing at some stage. Check Dagg's winning try in Soweto as an example too. Crotty has been great though. Real polish and a lot more physically imposing than I expected. Mind you he is a smart footballer so knows what lines to run to target weak shoulders. Could we see Fekitoa for the last 20?

I'm out, can't argue with that kind of logic!

Retallick shouldve been penalised under his own posts there for not releasing, mccaw at the breakdown previous for going off his feet...

I think I'm watching NZ way too carefully now Laugh

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:40 am

Beale knock on?!?!?!? It was clearly kicked into him it's a charge down if ever I saw one...

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:42 am

What a break! AAC takes a bum to the face and it's hurt.

Great work by Savea, great play by Cruden!

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:43 am

Fekitoa needed to pass and then got isolated. He's a bit green in game awareness.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:46 am

In that play Fekitoa passed too early. But good work from forwards to get to that ball and they finished it off.

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:48 am

mccaw is actually amazing, he gets himself into the worst positions, and puts a hand on the ball at every ruck.

I have a still on my screen of him lying on Beale, both elbows and knee on the floor, when he gets cleared left and hits the ground he has the most beautifull touch with the foot back to Read. HE is incredible.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:50 am

Bonus point and I've got a hard on.

by disneychilly Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:51 am

Game over. All about the bonus point now.

Hansen's showing great learning skills-breaking down sides' gameplans as time goes on. Only thing wrong with that is that you usually only play a team once at a WC so no chance to apply anything!

Scratch that-bonus point done. Now shoot for 50. Shut everyone up. Though Britain's media has made more noise about a potential Wallaby win than the Aussies.

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:52 am

BP after 55, NZ are totally dominant, Aus won't come back from this, theres little heart there, and I see this getting nasty.

Whats been interesting is that last week Aus had problems with first phase ball, baut saw success in the wider channells, NZ havn't changed anything but today Aus have been all about securing first phase ball and offered no threat because it's so secure.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:54 am

That was comical scrambling with Savea crawling on his knees to get to the ball. It may be because I'm drunker than a skunk but that amused the hell out of me.

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:54 am

disneychilly wrote:Game over. All about the bonus point now.

Hansen's showing great learning skills-breaking down sides' gameplans as time goes on. Only thing wrong with that is that you usually only play a team once at a WC so no chance to apply anything!

Scratch that-bonus point done. Now shoot for 50. Shut everyone up. Though Britain's media has made more noise about a potential Wallaby win than the Aussies.

I think you'll find Britains media has one thing on it's mind only, Premiership football. I've seen 2 articles donated toward TRC and both gave NZ a 25 point win.

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:55 am

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Bonus point and I've got a hard on.

That amused the hell out of me...

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:56 am

I want 50. Get them angry for SA!

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:58 am

Folau took 3 inside passes in that build up, then scored on the 3rd. NZ just switched off a touch after the game overing try, hopefully that will wake them up a bit.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:59 am

Just giving them confidence for SA. Now to make them angry again.

by disneychilly Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:59 am

Check out the Guardian Neutralee. That and the Telegraph have a bit on there.

Well done Folau. ABs a bit passive there-waiting to get the ball back so they can have some more fun.

This is a hell of a "Sit Down" by NZ...

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 10:01 am

disneychilly wrote:Check out the Guardian Neutralee. That and the Telegraph have a bit on there.

Well done Folau. ABs a bit passive there-waiting to get the ball back so they can have some more fun.

This is a hell of a "Sit Down" by NZ...

I've not seen that, however they do not make the 'British media'.

Second Aus try? What are NZ doing?! They are totally passive now!

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 10:02 am

OK laying on the confidence giving too strong now...

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 10:13 am

Barrett, the intercept hunter!!!

by Neutralee Sat 23 Aug 2014, 10:14 am

Biggest cheer of the night Barretts drag down of Folau, absolute textbook defending!

Own the space, manipulate the attackers direction and hold on for dear life, just incredible.

by Guest Sat 23 Aug 2014, 10:20 am

Well there you go, well done boys!! clap

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 10:21 am

Credit to Australia. They never gave up and Hooper didn't let heads bow. But fitting NZ get the last word. That was a hungry performance. Losing out on records has its pluses.

Speaking of hungry, I'm going to cook up some grease.

by **Biltong** Sat 23 Aug 2014, 11:09 am

Well done to New Zealand, that was a comprehensive performance, scoring from counter, line out, scrum, set phase, they did it all.

I am very impressed with the manner in which they get the ball out wide on the counter and the pace at which they attack then.

by **Rugby Fan** Sat 23 Aug 2014, 1:18 pm

I think England have had forwards capable of doing to a Wallaby side what the New Zealand pack did today. However, we've never had the all round game to dominate them like the whole side did today.

It's not about having decent backs, it's about the way the fifteen players on on the same wavelength.

by disneychilly Sat 23 Aug 2014, 7:26 pm

One thing that I saw that I really liked was something that bell end Ashton could learn from. Look at the concentration on Savea's face as he gassed his way to the line from halfway. No gloating, no waving his finger up in the air like an idiot and no swallow dive risking losing the ball. The big grin and celebration only came the moment he dotted the ball down. Very impressed with that.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 23 Aug 2014, 9:55 pm

I think the hype on Fekitoa has died down and I'm willing to admit that Crotty has impressed me more this year at test level and should be centre cover next year. Not saying the kid won't make it like the failed Saili experiment but he's too green like Ardie Savea to bring in now for the RWC. I still think he should get game time because you never know if he'll be needed but with all centres available and SBW fit to return I'd still have Crotty behind Nonu and Smith.

It'd be nice to have Romano back. Luatua at lock is risky. Retallick is fast becoming a great combination with Whitelock. Dane Coles has grown this year and the Lineout is immaculate and the scrum seems more solid. Will be interesting to see how it goes against Argentina.

In the second half, it fell away for a while. There were injury changes and substitutions. For me it was more the concentration rather than the shape and that was very pleasing. We had Barrett to the wing and first receiver, Fekitoa to 12, Perenara on the wing, Luatua to lock and it didn't fall apart. That speaks to what Rugby Fan alluded to: this squad is malleable to fit different styles and positions and everyone is aware of what the other is doing and what is required of each player.

It was a very satisfying win after last week's very unsatisfying draw. NZ aren't as good as they were made to look today and not as bad as what they were made to look last week. But one thing's for sure. You need to play at your best to beat this NZ side and the same can't be said about NZ for them to win. I guess that's encouraging but it also speaks to the power of motivation and how you can't artificially create hunger in players week in week out. We fell away after the Ellis Park test. Let's see how they perform now against Argentina. That's the challenge to maintain consistency and seek improvement. NZ very rarely put in poor back to back performances. It's very hard though to put in consecutive dominant displays like we saw today.

by Allty Sat 23 Aug 2014, 10:10 pm

A most enjoyable game and a credit to rugby. If only we could play like this in Wales. We used to.

by disneychilly Sat 23 Aug 2014, 10:23 pm

The peaks and troughs come in the games themselves, not just game to game. Riding out troughs is just as important as cashing in.

It's so impressive that NZ can play at a pace that not even Australia, masters of playing at pace themselves, can live with. This team passes every bit as well, if not better, than the great Aussie side at the turn of the millenium.

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