We Go Again! The 2014/15 Premier League Thread

[Guest]

First topic message reminder :

Dirty, scheming, diving sh!thouse.

[sportform]

Just seen this comment left of the BBC website and it made me laugh.

"Before everyone starts reeling off lists of rubbish players like Wes Brown who have won more Premiership winners medals than Steven Gerrard, let me ask you how many Champions League medals those players have. I think you will find it's considerably fewer. Better luck next time trolls..."

Er Wes Brown has 2 Champions League medals!!!

[mystiroakey]

It was all about the composure of the second goal.. the turn and then the wait and then the pass into the back of the goal.

it was just shear class- the type of goal you expect from zlatan, henry or berkamp.(But as we all know one swallow doesn't make a summer)

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Can't believe we're gonna have to put up with 5 months of media guff around Gerrard, its like he's died or something, he's just a footballer moving clubs!!

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

He's also said he won't go to a club that will face Liverpool

So he might be going to somebody who plays in the Champions League then

[mystiroakey]

well if he goes to NYC he may be shoe horned in as a sub at city which would be hilarious..

And its how he should be used- just like lamps- 30 mins every other game etc

[Guest]

He's also said he won't go to a club that will face Liverpool

So he might be going to somebody who plays in the Champions League then

Harsh!

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

He's also said he won't go to a club that will face Liverpool

So he might be going to somebody who plays in the Champions League then

Harsh!

He's gonna have to go some to top Carraghers near 30 yard thunderbolt in his final game tho.

(Also some members of the actual print media are calling him the greatest one club player....on the day he has announced he is moving to another club.  )

[super_realist]

He's only been a one club player because he didn't have enough ambition to join a club that might have actually won something.

Staying at Liverpool all his life isn't something he should be applauded for, he should get pelters because for all but one year it was a waste of time and a waste of a career.

[Guest]

He's only been a one club player because he didn't have enough ambition to join a club that might have actually won something.

Staying at Liverpool all his life isn't something he should be applauded for, he should get pelters because for all but one year it was a waste of time and a waste of a career.

what a load of absolute nonsense. won everything in the game basically, bar the PL title. waste of career? yeah, multiple f.a cups/league cups, uefa cup, champions league & 100+ caps for england

[super_realist]

Who cares about FA Cups these days? He won two, barely multiple, and three of the tinpot League Cups which no one cares about.

Staying at one club is irrelevant in regards to his England caps. Like 99% of England players, he hasn't had a good career internationally.

Yes, he won the Champions League *(which I alluded to), in a long career as a very good club player, he should have been looking for more and to be in a better side, staying at Liverpool his entire career (thus far) is lazy and unambitious.
He could easily have played for Real, Barcelona, Munich, AC Milan, but stayed at Liv"ing in the past"erpool.

Could have had an epic career, instead took the lazy route.

[Ent]

He's only been a one club player because he didn't have enough ambition to join a club that might have actually won something.

Staying at Liverpool all his life isn't something he should be applauded for, he should get pelters because for all but one year it was a waste of time and a waste of a career.

what a load of absolute nonsense. won everything in the game basically, bar the PL title. waste of career? yeah, multiple f.a cups/league cups, uefa cup, champions league & 100+ caps for england

When he finishes this year he'll have spent 10 years at Liverpool post cl win. Winning an fa cup and a league cup. Missed out on cl for 5 years.

I suppose you've got to question this as he has spent his peak years doing very little with Liverpool given the clubs he had the opportunity to join.

[Guest]

Who cares about FA Cups these days?  He won two, barely multiple, and three of the tinpot League Cups which no one cares about.

[super_realist]

Absolutely, his early career was excellent, but really, he's not achieved much in the last ten years apart from being a big fish in a small pond. Look at what his peers (and those above him in ability) have achieved and where they play.

There was a point when he pretty much could have signed for anyone, but the British way is to take the comfortable route.
Very good career in a team which over-achieved for much, but he could have been a truly top class player if he'd shown a bit of ambition.

[Ent]

Although he should have left I think he just had false dawns with Liverpool.

Fa cup in 06. Cl final in 07. Title challenge in 09. He was 30 by this point.

Also all these rumours of death threats and local gangsters etc.

[super_realist]

Who cares about FA Cups these days?  He won two, barely multiple, and three of the tinpot League Cups which no one cares about.

Yeah, I'm sure Xavi, Iniesta, Ronaldo, Messi, Zlatan etc (not that Gerrard is in their class) would swap their multiple league titles for those.

Gerrard could probably have played in the same teams as those guys

[Guest]

Ashley Cole Honours

Arsenal
Premier League (2): 2001–02, 2003–04
FA Cup (3): 2001–02, 2002–03, 2004–05
FA Community Shield (2): 2002, 2004

Chelsea
Premier League (1): 2009–10
FA Cup (4): 2006–07, 2008–09, 2009–10, 2011–12
League Cup (1): 2006–07
FA Community Shield (1): 2009
UEFA Champions League (1): 2011–12
UEFA Europa League (1): 2012–13

Ashley Cole didn't win much then, if we go by your rules

[super_realist]

Ha ha, Community Shield? Ha ha.

Ashley Cole, loathesome as he is, at least had the balls to try playing his football elsewhere, that shows a bit of ambition, and it paid off by winning considerably more than Gerrard.
If Gerrard had won 1 or 2 league titles in addition to his Champions League then I think we could say he had a pretty stellar career, however, his insistence at staying at a team who would never win the League and in all reality had very little chance to do so is always going to be a huge gap.

Cole, has had a far better career than Mr No Forehead.

[Guest]

If Gerrard had won 1 or 2 league titles in addition to his Champions League then I think we could say he had a pretty stellar career, however, his insistence at staying at a team who would never win the League and in all reality had very little chance to do so is always going to be a huge gap.

Except on two occasions, one under Benitez & one last year with Rodgers. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

[Ent]

3 leagues and 5 fa cups more, 2 doubles in that too.

I'm sure he would have wanted more trophies at chelsea but arsenal have won 1 fa cup in that time I believe so definitely the right decision for him to leave and you have to say he has had a better career than gerrard.

[Ent]

If Gerrard had won 1 or 2 league titles in addition to his Champions League then I think we could say he had a pretty stellar career, however, his insistence at staying at a team who would never win the League and in all reality had very little chance to do so is always going to be a huge gap.

Except on two occasions, one under Benitez & one last year with Rodgers. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Unexpected runs though those 2 seasons and United did win the league by 4 points in 09.

[super_realist]

I can see Jim Bowen turning up on his retirement. "And here's what you could have won"

He's made millions, and if he hadn't been a footballer, would probably be a jailbird, but his career, as reasonable as it is by English standards should have been so much better if he had the balls to move to a bigger club, for which he certainly had the talent, but sadly for him, not the ambition.

[CFCNick]

Can't believe we're gonna have to put up with 5 months of media guff around Gerrard, its like he's died or something, he's just a footballer moving clubs!!

Can we have a Lebron style sit down in June when Stevie will tell the world where he is taking his talents next?

[Dolphin Ziggler]

I'm so surprised Super_Realist would be the one to pour urine over someone for staying at a club they love.

Yes Gerrard could have left, and he obviously came very close to it, but I bet hes been happier where he is. FA Cups are important to fans, so I'd imagine he'll be happy with that. Especially when he sits back, remembers his dreams as a kid and thinks of the final he rescued for Liverpool.

[mystiroakey]

Well you dont know him then- we have had the discussion 10 times probally spanning 5 years.. i am well out of this one.. he is like a dog with a bone when it comes to gerrard

[super_realist]

I'm so surprised Super_Realist would be the one to pour urine over someone for staying at a club they love.

Yes Gerrard could have left, and he obviously came very close to it, but I bet hes been happier where he is. FA Cups are important to fans, so I'd imagine he'll be happy with that. Especially when he sits back, remembers his dreams as a kid and thinks of the final he rescued for Liverpool.

No one is saying he hasn't had a decent career, but has he shown as much ambition and won as much as his much touted talent should have?
Unquestionably no, but it isn't just Gerrard, it's very much the British mentality, you could say the same for scores of British players who haven't achieved what they should have in the game.

[Stella]

Gerrard was the best all round English midfielder for a few years, as well as being a loyal man, who gave it all on the field. The 2006 FA cup final was one of many a game where he made something happen when it was needed. Not many actually do that more than once.

[Stella]

I'm so surprised Super_Realist would be the one to pour urine over someone for staying at a club they love.

Yes Gerrard could have left, and he obviously came very close to it, but I bet hes been happier where he is. FA Cups are important to fans, so I'd imagine he'll be happy with that. Especially when he sits back, remembers his dreams as a kid and thinks of the final he rescued for Liverpool.

No one is saying he hasn't had a decent career, but has he shown as much ambition and won as much as his much touted talent should have?
Unquestionably no, but it isn't just Gerrard, it's very much the British mentality, you could say the same for scores of British players who haven't  achieved what they should have in the game.

I know this has been mentioned before, but wasn't it the scouse mafia who asked him politely to stay?

[super_realist]

I keep hearing that, but come on, to think footballers can't afford security is absurd.
Probably the club he went to would have sorted him for that, I'm sure they guard their star players pretty well.

Rubbish excuse.

[mystiroakey]

he went to chelsea and was about to sign- then his family got threatened.. and he didnt sign..

I dont know what's true- but you have to take the action of him going to chelsea as a big clue as to him wanting the move- and family is way more important than the club he played for..It is well documented that this happened and that Gerrard has been a character witness for scouse villans before.

anyway why am i getting dragged back into this.

[Guest]

anyway why am i getting dragged back into this.

Because you love a good ding-dong?

[super_realist]

Nothing to get dragged into Oakey, his career hasn't been as good as it probably should have been, the last ten years being pretty dry for a player of his standard.

That's it.

Good player, should have achieved more and played for a bigger club.

[westisbest]

Who cares about FA Cups these days?  He won two, barely multiple, and three of the tinpot League Cups which no one cares about.

Those 'tinpot' cups get you a place in europe.

[mystiroakey]

Who cares about FA Cups these days?  He won two, barely multiple, and three of the tinpot League Cups which no one cares about.

Those 'tinpot' cups get you a place in europe.

yeah and what happens when you get in to the UEFA cup hey...

This year may be different as the prize for the win is so great.... but it was just a huge distraction before

[super_realist]

Who cares about FA Cups these days?  He won two, barely multiple, and three of the tinpot League Cups which no one cares about.

Those 'tinpot' cups get you a place in europe.

Says it all doesn't it? The Europa League, only slightly more desirable than The League Cup, but probably more of a distraction.

Surely someone like Mr No Forehead ought to have been targetting Champions League, not the Eurochump.

[westisbest]

Just pointing out that there is more than just a cup at the end.

So for those teams in the lower half of the prem and below, more reason.

[super_realist]

Well exactly, if Gerrard is settling for second rate Europe through the back door of FA Cup and League Cups then it says a lot about his ambition of the level he is content to play at.

Let's not forget the teams which won these cups lately (Wigan), as well as who as made the final (Millwall) and the standard of teams that big clubs put out in them. They aren't taken anywhere near as seriously as they used to be and are better suited to lesser teams and lesser players as a target.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

"@JonnyGabriel: Steven Gerrard's habit of needlessly shooting will see him fit right in over in America."

Oof

[mystiroakey]

Just pointing out that there is more than just a cup at the end.

So for those teams in the lower half of the prem and below, more reason.

swansea got in and almost got relegated the next season..

everton were smashing it up in the uefa(possibly played the best football in the whole cup so far) yet losing big pl games after.. Tottenham have only just started getting there true form back in the PL since the European window has been over..

it hurts clubs..

[Ent]

Better get used to it If you have ambitions of playing champions league football.

[mystiroakey]

All i care about is playing PL football.

When is pardew going to sign !! ffs

[Dolphin Ziggler]

The FA Cup means more to players than you think.

And he was so close to winning the title with Liverpool. That would have meant more to him than 5 PL titles with Chelsea. People forget that footballers are human beings. There is barely a human alive who couldnt better himself at work by moving somewhere away from where he is happy, where his family is happy. Take teaching for example; the theory would be that everyone should just get up to London because the pay is better and you get taken far more seriously in your career if you achieve results in London (even though the funding for schools actually means its easier). You should always progress and then keep an eye out to look on.

[westisbest]

Cant speak for other fans, but I enjoyed us being in europe.

Miss those days and they are a very long way off.

But was enjoyable. Beating Inter Milan 1-0 at VP to even it out at 1-1 on agg.
Then disposing of them on pens.

Ah, great memories.

[mystiroakey]

When looking back  on his career(Stevie G) he will allways remember that come back to win the CL final, in which he played the biggest hand in the victory.

There is only one thing that tops that and that is to win a WC or EC and be the major  player..

He has that. Its a  lot more than JT for instance- that pretended to have played in the final with his strip on underneath his tracksuit

there isn't another English player during the last 20 years that has as good of a memory as the one he has... so fair play to him.. Maybe teddy Sheringham's performance for man u's win is close to equalling it.. but that's about it.

[Ent]

Was gerrard not stuck on the right wing for the second half as Liverpool were getting over run in midfield (hamamn came on I think)

Or was he moved infield in the second half, I can't remember.

[super_realist]

The FA Cup means more to players than you think.

And he was so close to winning the title with Liverpool. That would have meant more to him than 5 PL titles with Chelsea. People forget that footballers are human beings. There is barely a human alive who couldnt better himself at work by moving somewhere away from where he is happy, where his family is happy. Take teaching for example; the theory would be that everyone should just get up to London because the pay is better and you get taken far more seriously in your career if you achieve results in London (even though the funding for schools actually means its easier). You should always progress and then keep an eye out to look on.

No one says you should move your teaching job to London. Teachers pay is scheisse, and with the extortionate cost of living in London, the meager London uplift actually makes your pay WORSE in real terms.
I know a few teachers in London who still live like bloody students, sharing houses with people.

It's a poor comparison, sport is about winning as much as you can at the top level and being the absolute best, if you aren't willing to make sacrifices to achieve that, then you aren't a true winner or a top sportsman and are simply living out a journeyman lifestyle, not that Gerrard has been a journeyman so to speak, but he's not made many sacrifices to achieve what he might have done.

In 10 years people will look back just like they have with Owen, Gascoigne, Shearer etc and will say they didn't win as much as they should. All three played at clubs which limited their career chances. Gerrard is no different. Terry too.

[Stella]

Gascoigne did go to Italy, at least. It was as shame for him that he was never as good after his reckless final against Forest.

[hampo17]

Owen also went to Madrid to sit on the bench, would have been better off staying at Liverpool.

[Stella]

Owen also went to Madrid to sit on the bench, would have been better off staying at Liverpool.

At least he tried. He actually had a pretty good goal/game ratio with Madrid, I think.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

The FA Cup means more to players than you think.

And he was so close to winning the title with Liverpool. That would have meant more to him than 5 PL titles with Chelsea. People forget that footballers are human beings. There is barely a human alive who couldnt better himself at work by moving somewhere away from where he is happy, where his family is happy. Take teaching for example; the theory would be that everyone should just get up to London because the pay is better and you get taken far more seriously in your career if you achieve results in London (even though the funding for schools actually means its easier). You should always progress and then keep an eye out to look on.

No one says you should move your teaching job to London. Teachers pay is scheisse, and with the extortionate cost of living in London, the meager London uplift actually makes your pay WORSE in real terms.
I know a few teachers in London who still live like bloody students, sharing houses with people.

It's a poor comparison, sport is about winning as much as you can at the top level and being the absolute best, if you aren't willing to make sacrifices to achieve that, then you aren't a true winner or a top sportsman and are simply living out a journeyman lifestyle, not that Gerrard has been a journeyman so to speak, but he's not made many sacrifices to achieve what he might have done.

In 10 years people will look back just like they have with Owen, Gascoigne, Shearer etc and will say they didn't win as much as they should. All three played at clubs which limited their career chances. Gerrard is no different. Terry too.

It was a loose comparison, obviously, and I won't go further on cos theres reasons why it works but its just, more than anything, not that interesting.

However, none of the rest of what you have said is true. Its nonsense. It is so obviously a misunderstanding of why people love sport that I would guess you don't enjoy team sports at all.

[hampo17]

He did, no doubting that Stella but the big question a player should be asking is "am I going to play?" Madrid had Raul and Ronaldo upfront at the time and Owen didn't really stand a chance of getting in front of those two.

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