Wales v England - 6 February 2015 - Match thread

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Wales v England
6 February 2015
Millennium Stadium, Cardiff
Kick off at 20.05

Referee: Jérôme Garcès (FFR)
AR1: Romain Poite (FFR)
AR2: Mathieu Raynal (FFR)
TMO: Simon McDowell (IRFU)

Live on BBC1

Wales

01. Gethin Jenkins
02. Richard Hibbard
03. Samson Lee
04. Alun Wyn Jones
05. Jake Ball
06. Dan Lydiate
07. Sam Warburton (c)
08. Toby Faletau

09. Rhys Webb
10. Dan Biggar
11. George North
12. Jamie Roberts
13. Jonathan Davies
14. Alex Cuthbert
15. Leigh Halfpenny

16. Scott Baldwin
17. Paul James
18. Aaron Jarvis
19. Luke Charteris
20. Justin Tipuric
21. Mike Phillips
22. Rhys Preistland
23. Liam Williams

England

15. Mike Brown
14. Anthony Watson
13. Jonathan Joseph
12. Luther Burrell
11. Jonny May
10. George Ford
09. Ben Youngs  

01. Joe Marler
02. Dylan Hartley
03. Dan Cole
04. David Attwood
05. George Kruis
06. James Haskell
07. Chris Robshaw (captain)
08. Billy Vunipola

16. Tom Youngs
17. Mako Vunipola
18. Kieran Brookes
19. Tom Croft
20. Nick Easter
21. Richard Wigglesworth
22. Danny Cipriani
23. Billy Twelvetrees

[yappysnap]

Getting back to the actual game for a minute, I'm looking forward to seeing Cips and Easter both get caps. Hopefully they'll both be able to bring their club games to the Int stage too.

[quinsforever]

Wales are obviously favourites.

But pressure can do funny things to people. If Webb and Biggar fail to launch then England can win.

Am going to be watching this one at home. Just in case we get spanked.

[nathan]

Just been watching rugby club, had to turn it off due to idiot barnes

[Guest]

Wales are obviously favourites.

But pressure can do funny things to people. If Webb and Biggar fail to launch then England can win.

Am going to be watching this one at home. Just in case we get spanked.

You are spot on. Pressure does funny things, especially to Wales it would seem. We are awful with the favourites tag. Worrying times.

[Gwlad]

Maesteg - Wales are favourites to win, why so desperate? It's no shame to beat (or lose to) an England A.

50 % of which England A stared v SA and narrowly lost.

[jimmyinthewell68]

We Welsh don't like being favorite's so can England be instead pretty please

[stub]

We Welsh don't like being favorite's so can England be instead    pretty please

No way Jimmy - you are firm favourites!!

[Gwlad]

Getting back to the actual game for a minute, I'm looking forward to seeing Cips and Easter both get caps. Hopefully they'll both be able to bring their club games to the Int stage too.

Serioulsy think Easter will struggle but Cips could be interesting if it is close in the last 1/3rd

[BamBam]

We Welsh don't like being favorite's so can England be instead    pretty please

All it takes is someone to ask nicely.. Course we can jimmy 

[Sgt_Pooly]

If we can be got at its in the lock department.

Kruis is a long way off an Int standard lock imo, I can't understand his inclusion. Wales are much stronger in the engine room, both in physicality and experience. We might be able to get at the line out but I'm unsure Kruis will add much here.

Let's be honest, it's a weakend England line up but it's still impressive bar the engine room. Injuries happen, you need to adapt and overcome, it's a squad game end of the day.

[Guest]

All those injuries and still 4/5 Lions on the bench. Must be such a hardship.

[LondonTiger]

All those injuries and still 4/5 Lions on the bench. Must be such a hardship.

Aye four there are, but plenty have said they are urine poor, and only taken to appease the English coaches and media

If we are counting the number of Lions in the two squads, what is it - 12:6? Please lord do not let that be the match score.

[Gwlad]

If and it is a big IF, England can get any quick ball, they could cause problems. Problem is i can't see them winning any of the collisions in the backs, so they will be forced to try and slow Welsh possession. Wales are favorites but England have a chance eif they can get anywhere near parity up front and win the scrum. I reckon we will know in the first 15 who will win.

[yappysnap]

Getting back to the actual game for a minute, I'm looking forward to seeing Cips and Easter both get caps. Hopefully they'll both be able to bring their club games to the Int stage too.

Serioulsy think Easter will struggle but Cips could be interesting if it is close in the last 1/3rd

I hope you're wrong but you may be right, he is after all 34 now, just pleased that he's getting the chance to have one last go. Hopefully it means his last actions for his country will not be media over hype of a throw away comment.

[Heaf]

If and it is a big IF, England can get any quick ball, they could cause problems. Problem is i can't see them winning any of the collisions in the backs, so they will be forced to try and slow Welsh possession. Wales are favorites but England have a chance eif they can get anywhere near parity up front and win the scrum. I reckon we will know in the first 15 who will win.

At least we'll have to wait to see - if Walsh was the ref we'd know already

[thomh]

If and it is a big IF, England can get any quick ball, they could cause problems. Problem is i can't see them winning any of the collisions in the backs, so they will be forced to try and slow Welsh possession. Wales are favorites but England have a chance eif they can get anywhere near parity up front and win the scrum. I reckon we will know in the first 15 who will win.

We're not going to win any front on collisions against Roberts etc, no. Burrell in particular is going to have to be clever. He's got enough pace and power to cause problems if he picks his lines right and Ford can put him and Joseph in space, but everyone knows he had a bad time against Roberts recently.

Assuming Cole is fit enough, I think our set piece will get parity. The back row will be more decisive. Haskell could be key with his tackle count. A big difference with 2 years is ago is also that we've now got a big carrying 8 in Vunipola, rather than a back row of flankers. He's struggled a bit to deal with the emotion of big games in the past, so he could go either way.

[lostinwales]

Getting back to the actual game for a minute, I'm looking forward to seeing Cips and Easter both get caps. Hopefully they'll both be able to bring their club games to the Int stage too.

Serioulsy think Easter will struggle but Cips could be interesting if it is close in the last 1/3rd

I hope you're wrong but you may be right, he is after all 34 now, just pleased that he's getting the chance to have one last go. Hopefully it means his last actions for his country will not be media over hype of a throw away comment.

36 not 34. He'll be fine. His brain wont be any slower, and we'd never notice if his legs are .

[Gwlad]

If and it is a big IF, England can get any quick ball, they could cause problems. Problem is i can't see them winning any of the collisions in the backs, so they will be forced to try and slow Welsh possession. Wales are favorites but England have a chance eif they can get anywhere near parity up front and win the scrum. I reckon we will know in the first 15 who will win.

At least we'll have to wait to see - if Walsh was the ref we'd know already

There is nothing more sad than to see a grown man blame the actions of a ref for losing a game 30 points to 3.

[Gwlad]

If and it is a big IF, England can get any quick ball, they could cause problems. Problem is i can't see them winning any of the collisions in the backs, so they will be forced to try and slow Welsh possession. Wales are favorites but England have a chance eif they can get anywhere near parity up front and win the scrum. I reckon we will know in the first 15 who will win.

We're not going to win any front on collisions against Roberts etc, no. Burrell in particular is going to have to be clever. He's got enough pace and power to cause problems if he picks his lines right and Ford can put him and Joseph in space, but everyone knows he had a bad time against Roberts recently.

Assuming Cole is fit enough, I think our set piece will get parity. The back row will be more decisive. Haskell could be key with his tackle count. A big difference with 2 years is ago is also that we've now got a big carrying 8 in Vunipola, rather than a back row of flankers. He's struggled a bit to deal with the emotion of big games in the past, so he could go either way.

Cole Hartley and Haskell are key, i expect the English line out to be not as good as usual, but if Cole and Hartley show the leadership they must and Haskell brings physicality and feet to the loose then i think the pack battle could get interesting, fact is Haskell is having the season of his life and though i still think he is a large tool, his tail will be up knowing this is his chance to stake a claim for the 6 spot for RWC

[GavinDragon]

lads lads lads, it all starts up front - if what is still a pretty experienced front row (and good bench) from England put the squeeze on us and Samson doesnt rise to the occasion or Gethin gets pinged again England win, if Wales get parity, Wales win.

I also think that despite Eng lack of experience in the second row they should target our - at times - creaky lineout

[TheRugbyMaster]

Game's not begun and you lads are bickering all ready. Is this a rugby forum or a sandpit?

[gregortree]

If and it is a big IF, England can get any quick ball, they could cause problems. Problem is i can't see them winning any of the collisions in the backs, so they will be forced to try and slow Welsh possession. Wales are favorites but England have a chance eif they can get anywhere near parity up front and win the scrum. I reckon we will know in the first 15 who will win.

At least we'll have to wait to see - if Walsh was the ref we'd know already

Collisions ? What collisions ? When Jonny May scored his dazzling try vs All Blacks there was no collision, bit like touch rugby without one touch.

[LondonTiger]

It's a funny thing about perceptions. I look at the Welsh set-piece and feel there is a weakness there prime for exploitation. Seems the Welsh fans however view their pack as far superior.

12 hours to go and we find out.

[beshocked]

Londontiger I agree. Two inexperienced Welsh players in that front five - Samson Lee and Jake Ball too.

Marler,Hartley and Cole are no mugs in the frontrow. Though saying that I would have started Mako Vunipola because he's been in very good form and adds another ball carrier in the pack.

Backrow is certainly good enough to surpass Wales. I have always thought that Lydiate was one of the most overrated backrowers on the planet.

Haskell,Robshaw and Billy is a strong backrow.

More worried about the backline than the pack.

The giant Welsh backs look like a formidable prospect - especially Roberts.

Need to stop them building momentum.

[LondonTiger]

We need to disrupt Webb. If Biggar gets back foot ball he could well struggle. If Webb plays well, we are in huge trouble.

[Exiledinborders]

If and it is a big IF, England can get any quick ball, they could cause problems. Problem is i can't see them winning any of the collisions in the backs, so they will be forced to try and slow Welsh possession. Wales are favorites but England have a chance eif they can get anywhere near parity up front and win the scrum. I reckon we will know in the first 15 who will win.

At least we'll have to wait to see - if Walsh was the ref we'd know already

Collisions ? What collisions ? When Jonny May scored his dazzling try vs All Blacks there was no collision, bit like touch rugby without one touch.

Jonathan Joseph also tends to score by running round rather than through players or by clever kicks. Certainly the Welsh style is to run at the opposition and hope to break the tackle. With players such as Jamie Roberts that is how they have to play.

There is more than one way to skin a cat.

[Allty]

[quote="LondonTiger"]It's a funny thing about perceptions. I look at the Welsh set-piece and feel there is a weakness there prime for exploitation. Seems the Welsh fans however view their pack as far superior.

12 hours to go and we find out. [/quote]


___________________

Not all Welsh fans LT. This game could go very wrong for Wales if our front 5 dont perform. I also think AWJ has had far too much rugby of late

[beshocked]

exileinborders

Jamie Roberts might only know one way to play but he's pretty good at it to be fair to him.

Londontiger agreed. Disrupting Webb will be key, Haskell and Robshaw will be the main men for that.

I believe that the England backrow is good enough to stop Wales at source.

[thomh]

Londontiger I agree. Two inexperienced Welsh players in that front five - Samson Lee and Jake Ball too.

Marler,Hartley and Cole are no mugs in the frontrow. Though saying that I would have started Mako Vunipola because he's been in very good form and adds another ball carrier in the pack.

Backrow is certainly good enough to surpass Wales. I have always thought that Lydiate was one of the most overrated backrowers on the planet.

Haskell,Robshaw and Billy is a strong backrow.

Depends what sort of day Warburton has. He's occasionally absolutely immense, more often OK. 

Am I right in thinking Davies is a bit short of gametime prior to the Saracens game? Has he been injured or just not selected? Joseph could have a good time on his outside shoulder if his match fitness is at all in question, and May and Watson will be the two fastest players on the pitch.

[BamBam]

Yeah I think JD2 was injured recently, and it was being questioned whether his form before the injury was up to scratch either, think some of the Welsh guys were hoping to see Scott Williams at 13.

Be interesting to see if that has any impact

[beshocked]

thomh perhaps but Robshaw is a very accomplished backrower, sometimes doesn't get the recognition he deserves, Billy is a wrecking ball if he gets going - he was rampaging vs Munster, Haskell has been in strong form for Wasps this season.

Are the likes of Warburton,Lydiate and Toby in good form?

Yes Davies was a bit short of game time but not sure now.

[thomh]

thomh perhaps but Robshaw is a very accomplished backrower, sometimes doesn't get the recognition he deserves, Billy is a wrecking ball if he gets going - he was rampaging vs Munster, Haskell has been in strong form for Wasps this season.

Are the likes of Warburton,Lydiate and Toby in good form?

Yes Davies was a bit short of game time but not sure now.

Oh I agree with all of that, it just might be tougher if Warburton has one of his good days as he's very quick over the ball. I don't really see the breakdown as a battle of back row v back row exclusively, so I think our pack as a whole will need to be quick to the breakdown in support. Wales can also counter attack so we really don't want to get turned over.

[beshocked]

thomh how good are Wales at the breakdown as a pack - player for player compared to England?

[The Saint]

RAC will be stationed at Leigh Delamere services tonight to assist with broken down chariots. Helpful.

[beshocked]

the saint can you give a serious answer please? How good are Jake Ball and Samson Lee at the breakdown for example? Are they particularly proficient in that area or is it a potential weakness?

What are the expected pack weights of the two sides?

[LondonTiger]

RAC will be stationed at Leigh Delamere services tonight to assist with broken down chariots. Helpful.

We expect to lose, so were travelling by train. then realised that you cannot get out of Cardiff on a Friday night, so staying at home. no chariot needed.

[The Saint]

the saint can you give a serious answer please? How good are Jake Ball and Samson Lee at the breakdown for example? Are they particularly proficient in that area or is it a potential weakness?

What are the expected pack weights of the two sides?

They're alright, not the standout performers at the breakdown. Both are good carriers and defenders. The breakdown specialists are the back-row and Jenkins. The pack is a very good unit, so long as we don't get any front row injuries.

*edit - not sure of the total weight. Pretty heavy, probably not as heavy as SA though.

[Nachos Jones]

For me, Wales are favourites to win but England do have a very solid team. Cipriani will cause havoc if he gets on, and the Welsh are tiring, around the 60min mark. I feel it will be a close physical game, just how England like it.

[Tattie Scones RRN]

Interesting article in the Torygraph about Phil Bennett's wind up talk before leading out Wales against England, full of "they have shut our mines", "they have bought all our houses and only live in them 2 weeks a year" the usual crap (even if some of it was true). He says he couldn't do that now, too many Englishmen in the side, about half of them were born here and not Wales. If you take parents and place of birth as 1/3 of nationality each. Half the Welsh side is 2/3s English.


     

He would also be charged with racism and get sacked.

Or would that only be if the English Captain spouted similar drivel about the Welsh? He'd be charged with "aggravated arrogance".

No he wouldn't.

[nobbled]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/england/11393144/Six-Nations-No-more-excuses-England-must-end-their-losing-streak.html

It's amazing what you can get from stats! According to the stats Martin Johnson was a more successful manager than Gatland....55% win rate to Johnson, only 50% for Gatland.



I know - but the point I'm making is stats can be made to say ANYTHING!!

[TightHEAD]

What does Gatland's stats against SH teams say then?

[flankertye]

I'm absolutely bricking it. Head says wales will cruise to a 25-14 win, with Joseph scoring for England.
However I had a fantastic dream last night that England came out and played with flair and ambition and the pack were smashing everything in a red shirt and it was a glorious victory.
One can hope.

[Duty281]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/england/11393144/Six-Nations-No-more-excuses-England-must-end-their-losing-streak.html

It's amazing what you can get from stats! According to the stats Martin Johnson was a more successful manager than Gatland....55% win rate to Johnson, only 50% for Gatland.



I know - but the point I'm making is stats can be made to say ANYTHING!!

Martin Johnson managed to get an English victory in Cardiff whilst playing Hape and Tindall as the centres.

The mind cannot comprehend such a miracle.

[doctor_grey]

Jeez, not sure what to make of this:

http://www.espnscrum.com/six-nations-2015/rugby/story/255297.html?CMP=OTC-RSS

OK, I do know what to make of this. Someone needs to change their nappy. Probably not changed in days. What a wasteful time-suck of non-reporting.

[gregortree]

exileinborders

Jamie Roberts might only know one way to play but he's pretty good at it to be fair to him.

Londontiger agreed. Disrupting Webb will be key, Haskell and Robshaw will be the main men for that.

I believe that the England backrow is good enough to stop Wales at source.

Worsley style. Bring back the Worzle to chop down Roberts.

[gregortree]

Interesting article in the Torygraph about Phil Bennett's wind up talk before leading out Wales against England, full of "they have shut our mines", "they have bought all our houses and only live in them 2 weeks a year" the usual crap (even if some of it was true). He says he couldn't do that now, too many Englishmen in the side, about half of them were born here and not Wales. If you take parents and place of birth as 1/3 of nationality each. Half the Welsh side is 2/3s English.


     

He would also be charged with racism and get sacked.

Or would that only be if the English Captain spouted similar drivel about the Welsh? He'd be charged with "aggravated arrogance".

No he wouldn't.

No, he would get tapped up by Nigel Farage to join UKIP.

[TightHEAD]

Nothing wrong with UKIP

[thomh]

Let's not get onto that

[gregortree]

Nothing wrong with Phil Bennett, give or take some racism about people from the East.

[TightHEAD]

I wonder what the Welsh camp will moan about next?

Edwards will probably moan that the England team bus has under inflated tyres so shouldn't be allowed on the road!

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