UEFA Champions & Europa League 2014-15 Season Thread

[Guest]

First topic message reminder :

Messi is no Harry Kane.

[Jermaine2015]

Real Madrid need to sort out their defence. Iker is finished and needs to retire. Sergio Ramos is almost as terrible as Jerome Boateng...And a better left back would help as well.

I don't see what Casillas did wrong in the match, he probably had the best match of any Real player pulling off two crucial saves. The save on Morata in the second half was a great save. Real's defense is awful, Ramos for me is not very good and Pepe is possibly worse. Varane is the only good CB they have. And I actually think Marcelo is pretty good he gives them a lot of pace and work rate down that side.

I'm talking in general about Iker. Your keeper should give your defence confidence, these days Iker can only do that once in a blue moon.

[socal1976]

Real Madrid need to sort out their defence. Iker is finished and needs to retire. Sergio Ramos is almost as terrible as Jerome Boateng...And a better left back would help as well.

I don't see what Casillas did wrong in the match, he probably had the best match of any Real player pulling off two crucial saves. The save on Morata in the second half was a great save. Real's defense is awful, Ramos for me is not very good and Pepe is possibly worse. Varane is the only good CB they have. And I actually think Marcelo is pretty good he gives them a lot of pace and work rate down that side.

I'm talking in general about Iker. Your keeper should give your defence confidence, these days Iker can only do that once in a blue moon.

Yeah I know but I think he really does get let down by his defense as you yourself alluded to. I think he isn't as good as his reputation has been but I still think he is a quality keeper.

[Guest]

Well that's Carlo gone, for sure. City?

Bale to be scapegoated is the easy option, but it's clear Ronaldo is in decline now too, something I expect Madrid fans don't want to accept.

[Jermaine2015]

Real Madrid need to sort out their defence. Iker is finished and needs to retire. Sergio Ramos is almost as terrible as Jerome Boateng...And a better left back would help as well.

I don't see what Casillas did wrong in the match, he probably had the best match of any Real player pulling off two crucial saves. The save on Morata in the second half was a great save. Real's defense is awful, Ramos for me is not very good and Pepe is possibly worse. Varane is the only good CB they have. And I actually think Marcelo is pretty good he gives them a lot of pace and work rate down that side.

I'm talking in general about Iker. Your keeper should give your defence confidence, these days Iker can only do that once in a blue moon.

Yeah I know but I think he really does get let down by his defense as you yourself alluded to. I think he isn't as good as his reputation has been but I still think he is a quality keeper.

They need to find a suitable partner for Varane to protect Iker better, if he does indeed stay on. Maybe Aymeric Laporte, two Frenchmen would probably do better than the kamikaze duo of Pepe and Sergio Ramos.

[socal1976]

Real Madrid need to sort out their defence. Iker is finished and needs to retire. Sergio Ramos is almost as terrible as Jerome Boateng...And a better left back would help as well.

I don't see what Casillas did wrong in the match, he probably had the best match of any Real player pulling off two crucial saves. The save on Morata in the second half was a great save. Real's defense is awful, Ramos for me is not very good and Pepe is possibly worse. Varane is the only good CB they have. And I actually think Marcelo is pretty good he gives them a lot of pace and work rate down that side.

I'm talking in general about Iker. Your keeper should give your defence confidence, these days Iker can only do that once in a blue moon.

Yeah I know but I think he really does get let down by his defense as you yourself alluded to. I think he isn't as good as his reputation has been but I still think he is a quality keeper.

They need to find a suitable partner for Varane to protect Iker better, if he does indeed stay on. Maybe Aymeric Laporte, two Frenchmen would probably do better than the kamikaze duo of Pepe and Sergio Ramos.

Yeah for the life of me I don't understand how they have kept Ramos in there for so long with their resources they got to be able to upgrade on Pepe and Ramos.

[Jermaine2015]

Real Madrid need to sort out their defence. Iker is finished and needs to retire. Sergio Ramos is almost as terrible as Jerome Boateng...And a better left back would help as well.

I don't see what Casillas did wrong in the match, he probably had the best match of any Real player pulling off two crucial saves. The save on Morata in the second half was a great save. Real's defense is awful, Ramos for me is not very good and Pepe is possibly worse. Varane is the only good CB they have. And I actually think Marcelo is pretty good he gives them a lot of pace and work rate down that side.

I'm talking in general about Iker. Your keeper should give your defence confidence, these days Iker can only do that once in a blue moon.

Yeah I know but I think he really does get let down by his defense as you yourself alluded to. I think he isn't as good as his reputation has been but I still think he is a quality keeper.

They need to find a suitable partner for Varane to protect Iker better, if he does indeed stay on. Maybe Aymeric Laporte, two Frenchmen would probably do better than the kamikaze duo of Pepe and Sergio Ramos.

Yeah for the life of me I don't understand how they have kept Ramos in there for so long with their resources they got to be able to upgrade on Pepe and Ramos.

Unless I'm mistaken, Real paid an absurd transfer fee for Sergio Ramos(something like 30-35m Euros), so they seem likely to stick with him come hell or high water. I remember FC Bayern wanted to sign Ramos a couple of years ago, thank heavens we didn't!

I don't understand the logic behind Pepe's continual selection. He's more interested in hurting opposition players than actually defending.

[socal1976]

Real Madrid need to sort out their defence. Iker is finished and needs to retire. Sergio Ramos is almost as terrible as Jerome Boateng...And a better left back would help as well.

I don't see what Casillas did wrong in the match, he probably had the best match of any Real player pulling off two crucial saves. The save on Morata in the second half was a great save. Real's defense is awful, Ramos for me is not very good and Pepe is possibly worse. Varane is the only good CB they have. And I actually think Marcelo is pretty good he gives them a lot of pace and work rate down that side.

I'm talking in general about Iker. Your keeper should give your defence confidence, these days Iker can only do that once in a blue moon.

Yeah I know but I think he really does get let down by his defense as you yourself alluded to. I think he isn't as good as his reputation has been but I still think he is a quality keeper.

They need to find a suitable partner for Varane to protect Iker better, if he does indeed stay on. Maybe Aymeric Laporte, two Frenchmen would probably do better than the kamikaze duo of Pepe and Sergio Ramos.

Yeah for the life of me I don't understand how they have kept Ramos in there for so long with their resources they got to be able to upgrade on Pepe and Ramos.

Unless I'm mistaken, Real paid an absurd transfer fee for Sergio Ramos(something like 30-35m Euros), so they seem likely to stick with him come hell or high water. I remember FC Bayern wanted to sign Ramos a couple of years ago, thank heavens we didn't!

I don't understand the logic behind Pepe's continual selection. He's more interested in hurting opposition players than actually defending.

It can't be that much can it, I mean he has been there forever so the transfer would have to have been many years ago. I think if they spent a fraction of what they paid for Bale, Isco, James etc. in their defense we would see a team that would be very difficult to deal with. They won't ever be the second coming of Jose's Chelsea because their club culture and their fans not only demand winning but winning with style. So they will always get up the pitch and try to score more. But to me with all the grief that Casillas gets the two weak links in their entire team are Ramos and Pepe. Both like you said are red cards waiting to happen. Frankly I am surprised Pepe doesn't get more cards.

[kingraf]

Glad I missed this. Took one of those power naps which end up taking eight hours.

Rather problematic, but worth remembering that no one has ever retained the Champions League, and better squads than ours have given it a Crack. It's not the end of the world. It's not even a trophyless season, if you're kind and give us our minor trophy double. A bit like Bayern, I think too much negayivity is being thrown around reaching a champions league semi final. That's a damn tough thing to do, and really shouldn't constitute a failed season.

As for Bale, think it's a little easy to blame the boo boys. Everyone gets booed at try Bern. Happened to Ronnie, happened to Zizou, and they produce genius in industrial quantities. He hasn't risen to the challenge. He's been poor this season, and was only 7/10 the one before. At his cost, that's not good enough. Don't think it has anything to do with him stealing Ronaldo's shine either. Higuain put up better numbers, and he got loved just fine. Something about Bale doesn't appeal to Madrilenno sensibilities

Haven't watched, but congratulations to Juve. I'm caught in a bit of a quandary for the final because hating Barça is genetically encoded... But I've never quite forgiven Juve for the match fixing... Will be supporting the ref at full tilt

[socal1976]

Glad I missed this. Took one of those power naps which end up taking eight hours.

Rather problematic, but worth remembering that no one has ever retained the Champions League, and better squads than ours have given it a Crack. It's not the end of the world. It's not even a trophyless season, if you're kind and give us our minor trophy double. A bit like Bayern, I think too much negayivity is being thrown around reaching a champions league semi final. That's a damn tough thing to do, and really shouldn't constitute a failed season.

As for Bale, think it's a little easy to blame the boo boys. Everyone gets booed at try Bern. Happened to Ronnie, happened to Zizou, and they produce genius in industrial quantities. He hasn't risen to the challenge. He's been poor this season, and was only 7/10 the one before. At his cost, that's not good enough. Don't think it has anything to do with him stealing Ronaldo's shine either. Higuain put up better numbers, and he got loved just fine. Something about Bale doesn't appeal to Madrilenno sensibilities

Haven't watched, but congratulations to Juve. I'm caught in a bit of a quandary for the final because hating Barça is genetically encoded... But I've never quite forgiven Juve for the match fixing... Will be supporting the ref at full tilt

I don't know KR, how you can call this season anything but a total failure. Like Barca last year not winning any trophies. I mean this is Real f---ing Madrid. They have the highest or near highest payroll, the biggest or near biggest transfer budget, the richest club in the world. the Ballon D'or winner and a star studded line up. Expectations as you know are different at every club and Real failed miserably to meet even a reduced level of expectation.

As for Bale I think he has been hurt by injuries, and certainly Real as a team has suffered a bit this year. I also think that he is not being utilized well at Real Madrid. He has hit two incredible long range strikes with his left in the last two matches which resulted in great saves from great keepers both against Valenica and against Juve. Frankly, a bit unlucky in both those cases as those were highlight reel goals in huge games that were kept out by incredible keepers. He has the ability to do much more. And I don't think it is just his fault. I think Real are too geared just for Ronaldo, especially the last couple of years. I mean if Ronaldo doesn't get the pass he thinks he deserves and Bale shoots instead he vocally and visibly shows his displeasure. To me this is one of the big qualitative differences between Ronaldo and Messi. Messi makes the players around him better and Ronaldo really doesn't. Isco, Kroos, Bale haven't really flourished in Ronaldo's shadow like Neymar and Suarez have. Ronnie should be smart enough to realize that with the expenditure they made on Bale that if Bale doesn't succeed it is hard for the team to hit its full potential. Instead of helping him adjust he has added to the pressure. He should look at himself after missing a penalty kick that could have cost them the league title.

[kingraf]

It's not a failure though. Is it what we were aiming for? No. But to call this season a failure defeats logic. That's the reason so many managers get one or two seasons at big clubs. It's self defeating. The problem lies in the fact that at the halfway stage of the season we were in the middle of a super run. Scored goals for fun etc. When you win 6/6 in the group stages, and are leading the League by Four points with a game in hand at the winter break, to basically hand la Liga over, and crawl to the semis isn't good enough.

Re Ronaldo, when the team isn't doing well, we look to Ronaldo to bail us out. Same as Barça. That's a symptom, though. Not the cause. You only have to look to the winning streak, or the first half of the season in general to see that when the team plays well, Ronaldo is a mere cog, the central cog, but a cog nonetheless. He's cracked nearly twenty assists while scoring 60 goals this season. I don't understand why he keeps getting blamed for the way the season has gone. His gesticulating is who he is, but he showed in the quarters that he isn't foreign to the idea of putting in a pass. It's inconceivable for a guy with 60 goals and 20ish assists to be the problem. 80 got involvements? There are teams that don't put out such numbers. Even if he was guilty of being to centralised... the figures justify it

[socal1976]

Cmon KR, I don't buy it. I am not saying Ronaldo doesn't pass, that isn't even my criticism. My criticism is that he doesn't make players around him better. By the way both Messi and Suarez have more assists than Ronaldo this season. In a team that scores as much as Real and a player who has the ball as much as Ronaldo you are going to get a healthy chunk of assists. I think it is damaging that when he doesn't get the pass he likes or when someone has a bad miss for him to him gesticulating and berating the guy. Especially if like Bale that individual is under a lot of pressure from the media and fans already. Kroos was better at Bayern, Bale was better before he came to Madrid, and the same can be said for Isco. You can't lay that all on Ronaldo, but I think Ronaldo is part of the reason. For example he really shouldn't be taking any free kicks those are opportunities that one of his teammates could excel at that he takes away.

As for Real's season I am sorry they underachieved for the defending European champions and for the money they spent and the payroll they have. That doesn't mean I agree with getting rid of Ancellotti or bringing in a wave of new players. However I think it is burying your head in the sand if you think their defense is adequate. It is time find better replacements for Ramos and Pepe, they freaking stink. The Morata goal is a perfect example. Just outside the six yard box Morata has time to chest the ball down, take a bite of ham sandwich, send a text to his girlfriend, check the stock quotes and then blast it by Casillas. Where the F was Ramos and Varane? Varane is a good defender, but Ramos and pepe are garbage. And even Varane for the money they spend in their attack they could easily have defender better than him as well. Juventus hardly even attacked but they had the best chances in that match on the road. For Real Madrid's standards their center halves just don't cut it.

[Guest]

They've known Iker needs replacing, along with the centre defence. Problem is, that's not how Madrid is run, once the politics interrupts decisions, they by-pass their issues & focus on something entirely different. James was a prime example, the signing of Danilo, purely to scupper Barcelona was another. Ozil & Di Maria, you can go on.....

As for Ronaldo, its clear to me the slow decline is well underway & Madrid needs to make big decisions rather soon about what direction it wants to go in. Stick with Ronaldo or back the long term option of Bale & hope the absence of Ronaldo sparks players like Gareth, James & Isco to come out of the shadow of the Portuguese man.

[Hammersmith harrier]

Real Madrid are run as if you're playing football manager, pack the team with the best and most expensive players available without taking into consideration the team as a whole.

[Ent]

James has done well this year and wouldn't say he is in ronaldos shadow. Same with Isco.

Bale just lacks the mentality to be a top top player, alright doing it for Spurs every few games but you need to do it every week at the big clubs.

[Azzy]

What's happened to Illaramendi?

[Guest]

Illarramendi is average, that's what happened to him. I know people love James Rodriguez, I don't really get it personally with him, pretty anonymous in the big games I've seen him play. As for Ronaldo, I personally just think he's on crusade now to beat Messi & that's his sole focus. Might be age, but he doesn't' even come deep & run past three or four players now, he basically sits in & around the box nowadays & just expects the work to be done by the rest for his goals, that's why we've seen a recurrance of the strops, because his ability is dwindling & he's reliant upon others now to make his goals, instead of basically carrying Madrid, like he used to. Apart from a 1 yard header & a penalty, over both legs, he was pretty much anonymous.

[SecretFly]

Real Madrid are run as if you're playing football manager, pack the team with the best and most expensive players available without taking into consideration the team as a whole.

Balancing Talent versus Ego. Correct. Sometimes Ego will stall all the talent working as an honest unit.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

He's going at about a goal every other game for Madrid. In a team where Ronaldo is the goal machine, and everyone else is there to remind the world how good Ronaldo is. If there were any long term planning in Madrid then Ronaldo would be gone and a team would be built.

[Ent]

When would you have got rid of Ronaldo for long term planning?

In the last 2 years when he was world player of the year? Before that when he was 27/28?

Seems ridiculous to want rid of a guy scoring 50 a season consistently.

[socal1976]

Illarramendi is average, that's what happened to him. I know people love James Rodriguez, I don't really get it personally with him, pretty anonymous in the big games I've seen him play. As for Ronaldo, I personally just think he's on crusade now to beat Messi & that's his sole focus. Might be age, but he doesn't' even come deep & run past three or four players now, he basically sits in & around the box nowadays & just expects the work to be done by the rest for his goals, that's why we've seen a recurrance of the strops, because his ability is dwindling & he's reliant upon others now to make his goals, instead of basically carrying Madrid, like he used to. Apart from a 1 yard header & a penalty, over both legs, he was pretty much anonymous.

I agree about this crusade to win the pichichi over Messi driving Ronaldo. At the end of the day I think Ronaldo's biggest goal is to score more than Messi and Messi's biggest goal is to win the biggest titles in club football. He really didn't do much against Juve but the statistics show that he averaged a goal a game, but he was no where near that influential.

[socal1976]

If they go into next season with Ramos and Pepe as two of their three central defenders they aren't going to win anything against Barca in Spain or against the giants of Europe. They can buy all the attackers they like.

As for Bale I think Bale, can be very good at Real Madrid he has had a lot of injuries in his first two seasons he is still young relatively so I think he can make it at this level. Ronaldo should realize that if Bale flops at Real Madrid it will hurt him and the rest of the club as well. Maybe try to get the guy rolling by finding him more deferring to him in the middle of the pitch for the free kicks, and not being so publically displeased on the pitch when the guy makes a mistake.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

When would you have got rid of Ronaldo for long term planning?

In the last 2 years when he was world player of the year? Before that when he was 27/28?

Seems ridiculous to want rid of a guy scoring 50 a season consistently.

Maybe around about now. Or next season. Contingency. But I'm not sure Madrid will find their best side if Ronaldo remains the centre of it. I guess the reality of it is they don't need the Ronaldo sale money to go out and spend loads anyway.

[Guest]

But he could be the bait to capture De Gea & have their no.1 position solved for the next decade.

They can keep Ronaldo & he would probably still bang 50+ against the likes of Córdoba & Almeria types, I just think his level or influence in key European games is fading away now & isn't that the point of Real Madrid, domination in Europe? I'm not sure Ronaldo can deliver that now for Madrid, while holding back the other attacking options around him. Barca are no longer solely Messi are they.......

[Hammersmith harrier]

I used to be in the very pro Ronaldo camp but this season has shown one thing and it's that Messi is much more than just goalscorer whereas Ronny hasn't been for some time now.

I'd love to see him back at Old Trafford every week but you can get a better indication of a players true ability when they're on the wane, adapting their game to overcome lesser physical capabilities.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Dybala has chosen Juve so the final may be Tevez's swan song. Come back Carlitos!

[Guest]

Juve just protecting themselves. Tevez is contracted & stated he will see out his contract until 2016, so I can't see him joining Boca, although winning the champions league might change his mind & him thinking there is nothing left to achieve. Also, no guarantee that Morata doesn't change his mind & actually want Madrid to take up the buy back clause they have in him.

[Ent]

But he could be the bait to capture De Gea & have their no.1 position solved for the next decade.

They can keep Ronaldo & he would probably still bang 50+ against the likes of Córdoba & Almeria types, I just think his level or influence in key European games is fading away now & isn't that the point of Real Madrid, domination in Europe? I'm not sure Ronaldo can deliver that now for Madrid, while holding back the other attacking options around him. Barca are no longer solely Messi are they.......

Don't really know where this is coming from, this season he has scored home and away against barca and Sevilla, away against valencia and in two home games against atletico. Thats la ligas top 4 sides apart from real.

In cl he scored home and away in last 16 and semis, assisted only goal in 1/4s.

Love to know what constitutes a real contribution to big games.

Real hadnt won cl for 12 years if you remember.

Reals problems are a poor goal keeper, poor defenders and unbalanced midfield- not a 50 goal a season forward.

Also Barca were never just messi, in their pomp they had 7 of Spain's World Cup winning side in their team - including 2 all time greats in. Xavi and iniesta.

[Guest]

Europa League Final

Sevilla v Dnipro

[Nakatomi Plaza]

Dnipro 1-0 up. Former Blackburn man Kalinic with a header from eight yards.

[Fernando]

Dnipro 1-1 Sevilla - Gregorz Krychowiak

[Nakatomi Plaza]

Great comeback from Seville - Chewy puts them ahead

[Fernando]

Dnipro 1-2 Sevilla - Carlos Bacca rounded the keeper.

[Fernando]

Dnipro 2-2 Sevilla - Rotan

Was a lovely FK

[Nakatomi Plaza]

Cracking free kick from Rotan to equalise for Dnipro. What a game this is!

[compelling and rich]

cracking final this, can normally be a bit cagey but this has been class

[Duty281]

Dnipro are outstanding. 500/1 to win this tournament at one point!

[Fernando]

It's Zenit St Petersburg all over again this really. Cmon Dnipro

[Fernando]

Dnipro 2-3 Sevilla - Carlos Bacca

I don't think Dnipro will come back from this.

[Nakatomi Plaza]

Great finish by the Wookie. Sevilla back in front again.

[Fernando]

6 goals in 10 shots on target for Carlos Bacca in the Europa League.

That's ridiculous efficiency

[Fernando]

Dnipro player has collapsed on the pitch.

[Nakatomi Plaza]

Jesus, this doesn't look good at all. Dnipro player collapses with no one around him.

[Fernando]

FT Dnipro 2-3 Sevilla

Unai Emery - Europa League master

[Nakatomi Plaza]

Worthy winners. Really enjoyable match. Hopefully the Dnipro player who collapsed is ok, the replays showed he took a bang on the head shortly before collapsing, so that may be the cause of his injury.

Sevilla qualify for the Champions League, meaning there could be five Spanish teams in next seasons group stage.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Heard on Twitter that the Dnipro player has a broken nose. Worst of his injuries

[nadeem2099]

Chiellini out injured for the final.

[Duty281]

Juventus are a superb team. Tearing up Italy, with a squad comprised of Buffon, Pirlo, Chilleini, Pogba, Tevez, and Llorente.

10/1 to win the Champions League is an absolute dream.

I posted this just before the second leg of Juventus' quarter-final - don't let me down tomorrow after coming so far!

[NickisBHAFC]

Evra to score and wind Suarez up would be absolute scenes

[Fernando]

Juventus 0-1 Barca - Rakitic

Gunna be a long night for Juventus.

[kingraf]

Was like a training drill.

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