ireland 6N warmdown and look ahead to RWC

Two years in a row!! Both tournaments have been close run, but this team has come on leaps and bounds in the time Schmidt has been in charge. The team is playing with a confidence that has rarely been seen as consistently as this from past Irish teams, we can vary the gameplan to meet the needs of the contest, the new combinations are starting to gell, and we have genuine competition in most positions around the pitch.

So rather than scurrying around the rest of the forum attempting to put out fires that try to feebly illegitimise the championship win, I think we can look back on another positive campaign showing real growth but with plenty of areas for improvement.

Six Nations
Comfortable if not spectacular for the most part. The team looked in control in games versus Italy and France without impressing two much, both results felt like a job done. Against England and Scotland were the real high points. Ireland's plan of attack put England on the back foot for most of the game with Sexton and Murray managing the game brilliantly. Against Scotland it was great to see us play positive and expansive stuff, it is good to know we can play that ball in hand game and have the players to do so. The low point was the Wales game, but even then I feel the territory and possession Ireland had was encouraging, but there are lessons to be learned about finishing chances and adapting to the ref (although credit also to the Welsh defense who were immense).

The Squad
Front Row: McGrath has shown more evidence he is an able replacement to Healy, for me he is not that far off now and was unlucky to lose his place. Rory Best is fantastic in the loose and at the breakdown, but at times his throws can be suspect and Cronin is a great option to bring on and run the ball. Total turnaround for Mike Ross, had a very strong campaign I thought, and great there is finally an able body to come on in Marty Moore
Lock: POC is absolutely vital to the cause and I worry about the impact of his loss more so than BOD. Toner has become a beast in the last two years, but I would love to see what Henderson is capable of starting for Ireland. Getting the best locks in Ireland fit at the right times (Touhy and Ryan are both useful options) has been a problem but these three currently are head and shoulders above the challengers.
Back Row: One of our strongest positions in quality and depth. SOB grew into the tournament, Heaslip and POM work incredibly hard. Honorable mention to Murphy for his early performances which were very positive.
Half Backs: Sexton and Murray have to be the form pair in the world right now, blip against Wales aside. The drop off in quality from those two is a concern, although Reddan had a very strong cameo against Wales. The position of understudy for 10 is still very much up for grabs between Madigan, Jackson and Keatley. I feel the team need to bring on Marmion more as well.
Centres: Starting to get to know each other's games. Henshaw has been absolute quality in all performances, reliably outstanding. Payne has grown into the role and really shone against Scotland. I think there  may be options in coming through in Olding, McCloskey, Marshall and eventually Ringrose, and I'd say Henshaw may eventually move to 13 in green, but I'd wager the incumbents go into the world cup as 12 and 13.
Wings: Another area of strength, with some great variety in the options. Zebo was unlucky to miss out against Scotland but Fitzgerald made a real difference. Bowe for me has been solid but I think Trimble has been missed. Earls for me should be competing for this spot rather than at centre and I would like to see Gilroy push on from his early promise. I have slight concerns about how the wingers are slowly losing their creativity as they come into the set up a la Zebo, and would like to see them try something other than take the soonest contact and recycle
Full Back: Not sure about Rob. Not pulling up and trees but hasn't let anyone down either. I don't know if Jones offers much else that Kearney doesn't. I'd say there are more creative options in the wings that can play fullback in the Pro 12 but against the other 6Ns fullbacks I don't know when they could be blooded. Payne at 15 maybe?

World Cup
Anything other than a semi-final appearance would be a huge disappointment following the last two years of progress. A semi-final win at Twickers against England is certainly doable but it would be a big ask. Despite the last showing at a World Cup I am confident Ireland can go further this time.

The interesting thing is which players who didn't feature in the Six Nations will make it into our 30-man squad and which will be disappointed, there is quite a large amount of competition in certain positions- especially the back three, out half and open side flanker. We probably have about 50+ players on the international radar. So winnowing that down to 30 will be quite difficult in certain positions.

Props
Cian Healy, Jack McGrath, James Cronin, Dave Kilcoyne, Mike Ross, Martin Moore, Rodney Ah You, Nathan White, Tadhg Furlong, Michael Bent

Hookers
Rory Best, Sean Cronin, Richardt Strauss, Rob Herring, Duncan Casey

Locks
Paul O'Connell, Devin Toner, Iain Henderson, Dan Tuohy, Donnacha Ryan, Mike McCarthy

Backrow
Peter O'Mahony, Rhys Ruddock, Sean O'Brien, Chris Henry, Tommy O'Donnell, Jordi Murphy, Jamie Heaslip, Robbie Diack, Dominic Ryan

Scrumhalf
Conor Murray, Eoin Reddan, Isaac Boss, Kieran Marmion

Outhalf
Johnny Sexton, Ian Madigan, Paddy Jackson, Ian Keatley

Centres
Robbie Henshaw, Stuart Olding, Luke Marshall, Gordon D'Arcy, Jared Payne, Darren Cave, Keith Earls

Back Three
Simon Zebo, Luke Fitzgerald, Tommy Bowe, Andrew Trimble, Fergus McFadden, Craig Gilroy, Dave Kearney, Rob Kearney, Felix Jones

It's really difficult, you'd be using Madigan and Fitzgerald as centre cover there. I hope they really have increased it to 31 or 32 this time around.

We have a number of warm up games.  I hope they're used to further 'warm up' a more direct, fast paced, aggressive, expansive, ball in hand, offloading game.  It needs more work, it needs more practice and it needs more video time that Schmidt and his crew can analyse.

We can revert to the 'safe' stuff for the WC in whatever games we might need it.  But we really do need to fine-tune that 'catch-up' speed game that we might need if the scores go against us early.  We need a robust chase game.

Kearney was ok on Saturday.  But he'll need to 'kick' on now for the rest of the Pro12 season and get every bit of his swagger back.

Wings I'd have an issue with.  Again, on Saturday fine - but we had two strong moments to make our intensity and pressure count with two more tries and they were blown by 'moments'.  That can't be happening at a World Cup.  Any points going there so close to the line will have to be more miserly wasted.  And we can't be giving intercepts a chance.

Sexton.  I think he needs O'Gara around him to keep his 'kicking for points' thoughts in the right places.  He wilted in confidence as the Championship went on, as ROG was busy doing his media stuff!
But it's much too serious to have him having off days there now.  He needs his head straight in all matches no matter how Big or small and no matter what the pressures.  Those points are priceless in keeping team moral up.  And I know O'Gara has his Racing contract..... but...............  we might need an O'Brien blank cheque to get him into the Irish squad as 'Sexton Mentality Correctional Coach'

Oh Centres?

The two of them are brooding nicely. Payne is doing just fine as he beds in.

Can Nathan White play both sides? If not then Schmidt has to either go with three props for both loosehead and tighthead or risk having to send a Healy or Ross home early for a short term injury.

If the squad size is 31 rather than 30, I can't see it making any difference to the backs - there will be 13 of them. Given that restriction I can't see Paddy Jackson going. He might be the best cover for Sexton but he offers no utility, so picking a player who hopefully won't play at all is too much of a luxury in such limited numbers. I'd pick Olding ahead of him who covers Centre, but also FB and 10 and is a place kicking option.

The attacking game has to be developed. If theres one positive from the Wales game its that the attack was very blunt and easily defended.

I'd like to see some fringe players step up. Martin Moore has started 1 game under Schmidt and been sub in nearly all the others. He is around Ross' level now and should be looking to surpass him between now and the world cup.

Its looking unlikely any more bolters will make the squad. McCloskey could be one of them but time is running out.

The Great Aukster wrote:Can Nathan White play both sides? If not then Schmidt has to either go with three props for both loosehead and tighthead or risk having to send a Healy or Ross home early for a short term injury.

It's worth noting that in 2011 we only brought 4 props. I don't think that is sustainable, but you can't have only two players capable of playing 10 either and I doubt Olding is viewed as being capable at 10 at this level having zero experience.

I would say Sexton and Jackson are going to be the 2 10s and then you have Madigan as a utility player who covers 10, 12 and 13.

So winnowing that down to 30 will be quite difficult in certain positions.

Notch I think the WC panel is 31 not 30 - so trick is to get balance rights between backs and forwards - 14-17 or 13-18. Think it has to be 13-18 given likely attrition among the forwards. Only real quibble I'd have with your selection is exclusion of Earls - his distribution and awareness of what's around him might be suspect at times but as a finisher he's tops

brennomac wrote:So winnowing that down to 30 will be quite difficult in certain positions.

Notch I think the WC panel is 31 not 30 - so trick is to get balance rights between backs and forwards - 14-17 or 13-18. Think it has to be 13-18 given likely attrition among the forwards.  Only real quibble I'd have with your selection is exclusion of Earls - his distribution and awareness of what's around him might be suspect at times but as a finisher he's tops

Yeah, it's really hard. Whatever you do some real quality players will be left out. I think O'Donnell will suffer from being too similar to O'Brien in terms of his style whilst Henry is a different kind of player and Murphy is more versatile. I think Earls and Fitzgerald could both go ahead of Zebo due to their versatility covering centres, but then we might need another fullback. Don't rule out Felix Jones and Dave Kearney. As I keep saying over and over again I would love to have Zebo at fullback a bit more though, a different kind of fullback to those first two.

Notch wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:Can Nathan White play both sides? If not then Schmidt has to either go with three props for both loosehead and tighthead or risk having to send a Healy or Ross home early for a short term injury.

It's worth noting that in 2011 we only brought 4 props. I don't think that is sustainable, but you can't have only two players capable of playing 10 either and I doubt Olding is viewed as being capable at 10 at this level having zero experience.

I would say Sexton and Jackson are going to be the 2 10s and then you have Madigan as a utility player who covers 10, 12 and 13.

In 2011, the match day squad was 22. You needed one prop that played both sides of the scrum.

I'd agree about Sexton & Jackson being the OHs - though Jackson's dead ball kicking will need practicised a lot more in pressure games. It will be interesting to see if himself or Pienaar do the kicking for Ulster.

I think the final reckoning will be in the World Cup warm-up games.

I think Tommy O'Donnell is well ahead of Chris Henry now (from the stats, best forward in the Italian and England game).

I'd say it will go:
No. 6: POM & Ruddock
No. 7: O'Brien & TOD
No. 8: Heislip & Murphy

Ireland need to start winning consecutive matches. Only one win from the last two matches......

Sin é wrote:I think Tommy O'Donnell is well ahead of Chris Henry now (from the stats, best forward in the Italian and England game).

I'd say it will go:
No. 6: POM & Ruddock
No. 7: O'Brien & TOD
No. 8: Heislip & Murphy

Yeah you might think it, but is there any point in taking three back rowers who essentially do the same thing as opposed to guys who have different skill sets? I wanted him to start at the weekend, although the selection of O'Brien was validated, but it seems like you'd only take two out of three of those highlighted. They all basically have the same role when selected at 7.

O'Donnell would be very unlucky, actually, because I would love to have him at Ulster and I rate him very highly. But this is exactly what we've always wanted. I think we have more than 40 players who are capable of excelling at test level now.

As a neutral what was most worrying from Ireland's win over England was the lack of manic aggression.

Most wins in the past we've been able to put down to you "wanting it more" or some Munsteresq controlled rage that we can't replicate.

But this years was just all about the gameplan, and the class at carrying it out to 100%.

I miss Manic Aggression. Not too much of it. Just a sprinkle in certain games. We could certainly have done with a few packs of it against Wales in that bloody first half!

Notch wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:Can Nathan White play both sides? If not then Schmidt has to either go with three props for both loosehead and tighthead or risk having to send a Healy or Ross home early for a short term injury.

It's worth noting that in 2011 we only brought 4 props. I don't think that is sustainable, but you can't have only two players capable of playing 10 either and I doubt Olding is viewed as being capable at 10 at this level having zero experience.

I would say Sexton and Jackson are going to be the 2 10s and then you have Madigan as a utility player who covers 10, 12 and 13.

It's also worth noting that one of those props was Tony Buckley with Tom Court offering the both sides option. The truth was that there were very few others who could even have been selected!
The difference now is that it is a requirement in the Laws to have adequate front row cover and that doesn't apply to any other position. In your squad you have selected only two looseheads, so if say Healy was to get a one week suspension against Romania, you would have to either replace him permanently in the squad with Kilcoyne/Cronin or have White as the loosehead replacement in the Italy game. So what option would you go for?

Sexton will obviously start most games with Madigan on the bench and Joe will want to give both significant game time in the pool stages. If there are no injuries to either, a third flyhalf will probably be on the pitch no more than a total of say 20 minutes off the bench against Romania or Italy. Jackson wouldn't be the second choice place kicker and doesn't offer the utility that Madigan does from the bench so he is definitely the third choice flyhalf barring injuries. Selecting someone who is unlikely to be used very much is a luxury with so restricted numbers. Ireland picked ROG and Paddy Wallace in 2007 with not even a third choice 10 in the rest of the squad so it isn't unheard of to skimp on the flyhalf position - especially when it's in the NH. I've no doubt that Jackson will train with the team during the warm-up games and be ready to be called up as a standby should either Sexton or Madigan have to leave the squad early.

The Great Aukster wrote:

Notch wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:Can Nathan White play both sides? If not then Schmidt has to either go with three props for both loosehead and tighthead or risk having to send a Healy or Ross home early for a short term injury.

It's worth noting that in 2011 we only brought 4 props. I don't think that is sustainable, but you can't have only two players capable of playing 10 either and I doubt Olding is viewed as being capable at 10 at this level having zero experience.

I would say Sexton and Jackson are going to be the 2 10s and then you have Madigan as a utility player who covers 10, 12 and 13.

It's also worth noting that one of those props was Tony Buckley with Tom Court offering the both sides option. The truth was that there were very few others who could even have been selected!
The difference now is that it is a requirement in the Laws to have adequate front row cover and that doesn't apply to any other position. In your squad you have selected only two looseheads, so if say Healy was to get a one week suspension against Romania, you would have to either replace him permanently in the squad with Kilcoyne/Cronin or have White as the loosehead replacement in the Italy game. So what option would you go for?

Sexton will obviously start most games with Madigan on the bench and Joe will want to give both significant game time in the pool stages. If there are no injuries to either, a third flyhalf will probably be on the pitch no more than a total of say 20 minutes off the bench against Romania or Italy. Jackson wouldn't be the second choice place kicker and doesn't offer the utility that Madigan does from the bench so he is definitely the third choice flyhalf barring injuries. Selecting someone who is unlikely to be used very much is a luxury with so restricted numbers. Ireland picked ROG and Paddy Wallace in 2007 with not even a third choice 10 in the rest of the squad so it isn't unheard of to skimp on the flyhalf position - especially when it's in the NH. I've no doubt that Jackson will train with the team during the warm-up games and be ready to be called up as a standby should either Sexton or Madigan have to leave the squad early.

Would it not depend on the forwards/backs split? I wouldn't be surprised to see an 18/13 split, with six props, three hookers, four locks and five backrows. Then you might have something like three scrum halves, two out halves, three centres, three wings and two fullbacks.

For argument's sake:

Props: Cian Healy, Jack McGrath, James Cronin, Mike Ross, Marty Moore, Nathan White.
Hookers: Rory Best, Sean Cronin, Richardt Strauss/Duncan Casey.
Locks: Paul O’Connell, Devin Toner, Iain Henderson, Donnacha Ryan/Dan Tuohy.
Back rows: Sean O’Brien, Peter O’Mahony, Jamie Heaslip, Jordi Murphy, Chris Henry (O'Donnell if Henry isn't fit)

Scrum-halves: Conor Murray, Eoin Reddan, Isaac Boss (I wish it was Marmion).
Out-halves: Johnny Sexton, Paddy Jackson
Centres: Robbie Henshaw, Jared Payne, Keith Earls.
Wings: Tommy Bowe, Luke Fitzgerald, Andrew Trimble.
Full backs: Rob Kearney, Felix Jones.

Jackson could be on the bench as outhalf cover, with either Fitzgerald or Earls as centre and back three cover. Madigan was needed last season when neither Earls or Fitzgerald were available to cover inside centre, but that need isn't there any longer.

Madigan isn't playing well and if Jackson comes back strong from injury I would back him at 10 rather than my fellow Leinsterman. The problem of course will be kicking off the tee, but Madigan isn't a great kicker from hand so there are problems picking either man.

I think most of the squad is picked by now.

I'd say the main questions remaining are:-

Who the 4th lock will be - Touhy, Donnacha Ryan or Foley? I'll say Touhy

In the backrow who from Henry, Murphy, Ruddock and O'Donnell? I fancy the 2 Leinster lads to make it.

Boss or Marmion as 3rd scrum half? I think Boss.

Take 3 fly halves - if so Keatley or Jackson, or risk 2? Not sure here.

Centre - only combinations Schmidt has really looked at involves Henshaw, Payne and D'arcy. Assuming Madigan covers 12 and 13, we still need another centre - Earls? Cave?

Back 3 - Will Felix Jones go, or will Zebo/Payne cover fullback? Assuming RK, Bowe, Fitzgerald and Trimble will all go.

It all looks pretty settled with plenty of options if injuries occur, which they will, so that's not a bad place to be.

Exiled Gael wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:

Notch wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:Can Nathan White play both sides? If not then Schmidt has to either go with three props for both loosehead and tighthead or risk having to send a Healy or Ross home early for a short term injury.

It's worth noting that in 2011 we only brought 4 props. I don't think that is sustainable, but you can't have only two players capable of playing 10 either and I doubt Olding is viewed as being capable at 10 at this level having zero experience.

I would say Sexton and Jackson are going to be the 2 10s and then you have Madigan as a utility player who covers 10, 12 and 13.

It's also worth noting that one of those props was Tony Buckley with Tom Court offering the both sides option. The truth was that there were very few others who could even have been selected!
The difference now is that it is a requirement in the Laws to have adequate front row cover and that doesn't apply to any other position. In your squad you have selected only two looseheads, so if say Healy was to get a one week suspension against Romania, you would have to either replace him permanently in the squad with Kilcoyne/Cronin or have White as the loosehead replacement in the Italy game. So what option would you go for?

Sexton will obviously start most games with Madigan on the bench and Joe will want to give both significant game time in the pool stages. If there are no injuries to either, a third flyhalf will probably be on the pitch no more than a total of say 20 minutes off the bench against Romania or Italy. Jackson wouldn't be the second choice place kicker and doesn't offer the utility that Madigan does from the bench so he is definitely the third choice flyhalf barring injuries. Selecting someone who is unlikely to be used very much is a luxury with so restricted numbers. Ireland picked ROG and Paddy Wallace in 2007 with not even a third choice 10 in the rest of the squad so it isn't unheard of to skimp on the flyhalf position - especially when it's in the NH. I've no doubt that Jackson will train with the team during the warm-up games and be ready to be called up as a standby should either Sexton or Madigan have to leave the squad early.

Would it not depend on the forwards/backs split?  I wouldn't be surprised to see an 18/13 split, with six props, three hookers, four locks and five backrows.  Then you might have something like three scrum halves, two out halves, three centres, three wings and two fullbacks.  

For argument's sake:

Props: Cian Healy, Jack McGrath, James Cronin, Mike Ross, Marty Moore, Nathan White.
Hookers: Rory Best, Sean Cronin, Richardt Strauss/Duncan Casey.
Locks: Paul O’Connell, Devin Toner, Iain Henderson, Donnacha Ryan/Dan Tuohy.
Back rows: Sean O’Brien, Peter O’Mahony, Jamie Heaslip, Jordi Murphy, Chris Henry (O'Donnell if Henry isn't fit)

Scrum-halves: Conor Murray, Eoin Reddan, Isaac Boss (I wish it was Marmion).
Out-halves: Johnny Sexton, Paddy Jackson
Centres: Robbie Henshaw, Jared Payne, Keith Earls.
Wings: Tommy Bowe, Luke Fitzgerald, Andrew Trimble.
Full backs: Rob Kearney, Felix Jones.

Jackson could be on the bench as outhalf cover, with either Fitzgerald or Earls as centre and back three cover.  Madigan was needed last season when neither Earls or Fitzgerald were available to cover inside centre, but that need isn't there any longer.  

Madigan isn't playing well and if Jackson comes back strong from injury I would back him at 10 rather than my fellow Leinsterman.  The problem of course will be kicking off the tee, but Madigan isn't a great kicker from hand so there are problems picking either man.  

EG - I agree with most of that - your only difference is picking Jackson over Madigan. You make a good point about Madigan's kicking from hand, but he is the better kicker from the tee. He may be out of form now but then we haven't seen Jackson return yet. Madigan though offers the better bench option because he covers more positions and his individual running game also has an X factor that Jackson doesn't have. Jackson has better game management and is known to be a leader and an executor of what the coach wants. Joe obviously isn't too sure about Madigan starting but likes him on the bench.
If it was a toss up between the two I'd still go with IM simply because (last kick at Murrayfield aside) he has the better placekicking record.

In terms of the back row contenders, one thing I would like to add is that Jordi Murphy has been a complete revelation. I see him as an open side flanker longterm, probably replacing O'Brien, but he is very versatile and probably one of the best support runners we have. He has shot himself up to 4th choice, hopefully putting a lot of pressure on Heaslip as well.

One of the Munster fans on here described him as a Leinster squad player and no more, well, based on his performances so far for both Leinster and Ireland I would say that person feels pretty silly now!

rodders wrote:I think most of the squad is picked by now.

I'd say the main questions remaining are:-

Who the 4th lock will be - Touhy, Donnacha Ryan or Foley? I'll say Touhy

In the backrow who from Henry, Murphy, Ruddock and O'Donnell? I fancy the 2 Leinster lads to make it.

I agree most of the squad is picked, and Joe has already played them in his teams.
There will be only 9 places for the back five forwards.
POC, Toner, Henderson, POM, SOB, Heaslip and Murphy are on the plane.
Much as I'd like Henry to go, he has to prove a lot before consideration - so does Donnacha Ryan. I'd go with Tuohy and O'Donnell right now.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:In terms of the back row contenders, one thing I would like to add is that Jordi Murphy has been a complete revelation. I see him as an open side flanker longterm, probably replacing O'Brien, but he is very versatile and probably one of the best support runners we have. He has shot himself up to 4th choice, hopefully putting a lot of pressure on Heaslip as well.

One of the Munster fans on here described him as a Leinster squad player and no more, well, based on his performances so far for both Leinster and Ireland I would say that person feels pretty silly now!

He's the ideal bench option too- wouldn't it be wonderful if he could be tempted North where he could be first choice number 8?

The Great Aukster wrote:

rodders wrote:I think most of the squad is picked by now.

I'd say the main questions remaining are:-

Who the 4th lock will be - Touhy, Donnacha Ryan or Foley? I'll say Touhy

In the backrow who from Henry, Murphy, Ruddock and O'Donnell? I fancy the 2 Leinster lads to make it.

I agree most of the squad is picked, and Joe has already played them in his teams.
There will be only 9 places for the back five forwards.
POC, Toner, Henderson, POM, SOB, Heaslip and Murphy are on the plane.
Much as I'd like Henry to go, he has to prove a lot before consideration - so does Donnacha Ryan. I'd go with Tuohy and O'Donnell right now.

Id say O'Donnell has more to prove than Henry given that Henry played in all 6 nations fixtures last year and stood out as one of our better players whereas TOD hasnt quite been tested as much in big games.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:In terms of the back row contenders, one thing I would like to add is that Jordi Murphy has been a complete revelation. I see him as an open side flanker longterm, probably replacing O'Brien, but he is very versatile and probably one of the best support runners we have. He has shot himself up to 4th choice, hopefully putting a lot of pressure on Heaslip as well.

One of the Munster fans on here described him as a Leinster squad player and no more, well, based on his performances so far for both Leinster and Ireland I would say that person feels pretty silly now!

The main theme amongst certain notoriously whingey Munster fans last campaign was how unjust it was to leave Zebo out for David Kearney. However, with the benefit of heinsight did Zebo really do much better or better at all than Kearney last year? Probably not given he was dropped for the last game whereas Kearney played all 5.

Personally I would have kept Zebo for the last game but I dont think he did any better than Kearney did last year. The truth is we have a variety of players waiting in the wings for each position who are up to the job.

CUT AND PASTED FROM PLANET RUGBY AS I CAN'T WRITE FOR TOFFEE

Back-to-back Six Nations titles for the Irish as they enter the home straight of 2015's World Cup preparations with a spring in their step.

While they fell short of the Grand Slam after defeat in Cardiff, we have to agree with Brian O'Driscoll that it was possibly a blessing in disguise that loss as they stay under the radar somewhat. That's not to say however they are not real challengers for the Webb Ellis trophy.

Compared to other teams, few would disagree that Ireland boast a favourable draw. Should they top Pool D ahead of France, Italy, Canada and Romania, they would likely face Argentina in a Cardiff quarter before going to Twickenham for a semi-final clash with the victor of 'Winner of Pool A versus Runner-up of Pool B'. No disrespect to others but avoiding New Zealand and South Africa until the final is a dream scenario.

So can they go all the way? They simply have to be the best bet from the home nations due to their run of results over the past thirteen months and of course the World Cup route available to them. They are 9/1 for glory which is over double what is offered on England, albeit the hosts.

Barring the aforementioned All Blacks, Ireland are the form team in Tier 1 rugby as added to their Six Nations titles are November 2014 fillips. They have now won eleven out of their last twelve internationals - beating Australia and the Boks to go with northern scalps - so it is plain to see that Joe Schmidt has built a squad that could go all the way in October. Their only blemish was that recent defeat to Wales.

Credit must go to the likes of Robbie Henshaw and Jared Payne as there hasn't been an O'Driscoll retirement hangover, while in Conor Murray and Jonathan Sexton, the Irish boast one of the more solid half-back combinations in world rugby. Technical and intelligent, they are vital to their World Cup hopes, as will be veteran forwards Paul O'Connell and Jamie Heaslip alongside Sean O'Brien, Peter O'Mahony and Rory Best.

Up front they have demonstrated priceless depth at prop where Mike Ross, Marty Moore, Cian Healy and Jack McGrath rotate perfectly, with the only position up in the air being a match-changing wing option off the bench. Simon Zebo* and the consistent Tommy Bowe should start when fit but will Schmidt stick with Felix Jones as his replacement or would he be better served by Craig Gilroy's X-factor in finely balanced games?

Away from the Six Nations, Keith Earls has enjoyed impressive performances for Munster as he returns from injury and surely can't be discounted due to his versatility. This is a good, minor headache to have for boss Schmidt following wins over Italy, France, England and Scotland, which turned out to be enough to keep Irish hands on the Six Nations trophy. In fact, like Wales, Ireland's 23 pretty much now picks itself.

Talk to any coach and such stability in selection is vital going into the World Cup, with a constantly-changing France their main pool rival before the knockouts. And with this kind of form coinciding with the PRO12 provinces all performing strongly in 2015, Ireland should fear no one later this year

* They really mean Andy Trimble

Comments, arguements and waffle below please.....

Firstly I'd like to say what a wonderfully put together topic by an obviously very attractive OP.
Secondly I would like to agree with the first point.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:In terms of the back row contenders, one thing I would like to add is that Jordi Murphy has been a complete revelation. I see him as an open side flanker longterm, probably replacing O'Brien, but he is very versatile and probably one of the best support runners we have. He has shot himself up to 4th choice, hopefully putting a lot of pressure on Heaslip as well.

One of the Munster fans on here described him as a Leinster squad player and no more, well, based on his performances so far for both Leinster and Ireland I would say that person feels pretty silly now!

That's a big call Rory and one that I don't necessarily disagree with but I would personally like to see him develop more as and 8 with a view to replacing Heaslip, in the future, rather than SOB. He has come on leaps and bounds and is really knocking on Heaslip's door now. In fact, I would have started him against Scotland over Heaslip.

Both Murphy and TOD should be in the RWC squad as both bring so much to the team. That said, I think it will be a straight choice between the two and I would not mind which will be selected.

Warm ups are pretty much the next test.

I wouldn't even think about the World Cup or deduce any form then from what we've seen in the now.  Months are months, and months can both change form and introduce injuries.  So deciding how we'll do in our Pool this far out is.... well it's dangerous.

We look - okay actually, in my eyes.  Just okay.  I think we looked more dangerous all round last year and mixed up our gamplans within gameplans more fluidly than we do now.  I think a good many of the players who played and won this year are still off their best form.  That might be a well planned system in operation.  I hope it is.

The warm ups.  If we lose one or two.  If we lose by a big enough score let's say against England or Wales???  Will the wheels of confidence stay on the bandwagon?  Will even those warm-ups test the resolve and have us really begin to question ourselves and begin to fret that we might have talked ourselves up into another false dawn?

I'd like us as a Nation to try to stay as grounded as we can - waiting for the let downs that might appear when least expected.

I trust Schmidt and his fellow coaches will do everything in their power to have us prepared for that World Cup - we'll certainly be match fit! (I think more warm-up games than most of our rivals leading in).

The only thing I keep feeling concern for is that level of all out speed stamina that teams like Wales and England are now showing.  I'm not sure we reached similar applied levels during this Six Nations.  I think we're still behind there.  And whatever structures the Welsh and English have in place to reach those levels, we're going to have to be in that space come the World Cup.  

It's all very well having the structures and tactics and skills to win... (I think we have those) - but that extra edge is the lungs and heart pump to play well beyond 80 at the highest tempo achievable.  It's the tempo that both Wales and England brought to their games that impressed me most; and Gatland is forever on about that aspect being key to him - having his players be the absolute fittest athletes in the game so that the gameplan is punishing in its persistence through an 80 minute period. It doesn't fall away due to fatigue.

I still think that is/might be our weak point through a series such as the WC - not being in the same stamina zone as Nations like England and Wales.

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:In terms of the back row contenders, one thing I would like to add is that Jordi Murphy has been a complete revelation. I see him as an open side flanker longterm, probably replacing O'Brien, but he is very versatile and probably one of the best support runners we have. He has shot himself up to 4th choice, hopefully putting a lot of pressure on Heaslip as well.

One of the Munster fans on here described him as a Leinster squad player and no more, well, based on his performances so far for both Leinster and Ireland I would say that person feels pretty silly now!

That's a big call Rory and one that I don't necessarily disagree with but I would personally like to see him develop more as and 8 with a view to replacing Heaslip, in the future, rather than SOB. He has come on leaps and bounds and is really knocking on Heaslip's door now. In fact, I would have started him against Scotland over Heaslip.

Both Murphy and TOD should be in the RWC squad as both bring so much to the team. That said, I think it will be a straight choice between the two and I would not mind which will be selected.

Yeah well you also said TOD should have started for SOB!!

Yes I did and I also credited SOB on a fine performance. I was wrong on that one, am also man enough to admit it.


Seriously GunsGerms, what is your problem? You seem a very angry person.

Anyways back on topic. The 9's and 10's.

10's : Sexton is far and away the incumbent but I feel a fit again Jackson is the second best option forcing Madigan to a utility position.

9's : Murray again is the incumbent with Red's as back up but I feel that Marmion should go with the squad ahead of Boss. I simply feel that Marmion is a better 9 and will only get better. Certainly worth a look in the warm up matches at least.

So this is where my wandering post ended up?

Oh well, it was a good idea Pete

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:Yes I did and I also credited SOB on a fine performance. I was wrong on that one, am also man enough to admit it.


Seriously GunsGerms, what is your problem? You seem a very angry person.

Im just a very grumpy person. Not particularly angry.

GunsGerms wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:

rodders wrote:I think most of the squad is picked by now.

I'd say the main questions remaining are:-

Who the 4th lock will be - Touhy, Donnacha Ryan or Foley? I'll say Touhy

In the backrow who from Henry, Murphy, Ruddock and O'Donnell? I fancy the 2 Leinster lads to make it.

I agree most of the squad is picked, and Joe has already played them in his teams.
There will be only 9 places for the back five forwards.
POC, Toner, Henderson, POM, SOB, Heaslip and Murphy are on the plane.
Much as I'd like Henry to go, he has to prove a lot before consideration - so does Donnacha Ryan. I'd go with Tuohy and O'Donnell right now.

Id say O'Donnell has more to prove than Henry given that Henry played in all 6 nations fixtures last year and stood out as one of our better players whereas TOD hasnt quite been tested as much in big games.

Ireland has yet to lose a game that O'Donnell has played including Wales last year and England this year (something that SOB or Henry hasn't done) and v South Africa last autumn.

TOD has never lost an international game.

Yeah but he has only started a few games so thats a completely pointless stat that you actually robbed from me cause I mentioned that a couple of weeks ago.

Jonathan Joseph has never lost a game against the All Blacks either.

GunsGerms wrote:Yeah but he has only started a few games so thats a completely pointless stat that you actually robbed from me cause I mentioned that a couple of weeks ago.

He subbed against England and he played for 60 minutes and had a great game. You know England who Ireland lost to the year before with Henry at openside ! You did claim that he hadn't played any big games!

Sin é wrote:[

Ireland has yet to lose a game that O'Donnell has played including Wales last year and England this year (something that SOB or Henry hasn't done) and v South Africa last autumn.

TOD has never lost an international game.

Sin é,

I really like TOD and think that he will be something special in the next few years. SOB, when on form, is easily first choice but if you had a choice between an in form Henry and an in form TOD, who would you choose?

Sin é wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:Yeah but he has only started a few games so thats a completely pointless stat that you actually robbed from me cause I mentioned that a couple of weeks ago.

He subbed against England and he played for 60 minutes and had a great game. You know England who Ireland lost to the year before with Henry at openside ! You did claim that he hadn't played any big games!

We lost by three points in Twickers. Hardly Chris Henry's fault.

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:

Sin é wrote:[

Ireland has yet to lose a game that O'Donnell has played including Wales last year and England this year (something that SOB or Henry hasn't done) and v South Africa last autumn.

TOD has never lost an international game.

Sin é,

I really like TOD and think that he will be something special in the next few years. SOB, when on form, is easily first choice but if you had a choice between an in form Henry and an in form TOD, who would you choose?

Thats like asking the Pope if he is catholic.

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:

Sin é wrote:[

Ireland has yet to lose a game that O'Donnell has played including Wales last year and England this year (something that SOB or Henry hasn't done) and v South Africa last autumn.

TOD has never lost an international game.

Sin é,

I really like TOD and think that he will be something special in the next few years. SOB, when on form, is easily first choice but if you had a choice between an in form Henry and an in form TOD, who would you choose?

I think he was hard done by to be dropped. What really annoys me about Schmidt's selections is that he keeps putting players in positions for what they can contribute elsewhere because others are lacking - for example, Best for his work at the breakdown (doesn't matter that his lineout throwing is very poor), then we have to have Toner to be able to offer some sort of secure lineout ball, which then because of his lack of mobillity, we have to have POM for his lineout prowess.

Don't get me started on having a team of fullbacks in the Backs! Ross, POC and the two half backs are probably the only players who are picked for what their core skill is.

GunsGerms wrote:

Sin é wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:Yeah but he has only started a few games so thats a completely pointless stat that you actually robbed from me cause I mentioned that a couple of weeks ago.

He subbed against England and he played for 60 minutes and had a great game. You know England who Ireland lost to the year before with Henry at openside ! You did claim that he hadn't played any big games!

We lost by three points in Twickers. Hardly Chris Henry's fault.

No, it wasn't Chris's fault. It was poor selection from Schmidt to have Dave Kearney on the wing who if he had a bit of pace would have run in for a try and not be outpaced by a lock.

But sin... Best is not there at the Breakdown? Who is?

Toner not there for the lineouts. Who is?

BTW, I don't think Murray is totally picked for his core skill - he's picked too because of his size and physicality.

But winning is winning. Is Best surplus to the breakdown?

Best is also the most consistent lineout thrower of the hookers in the Ireland squad besides his obvious strengths in the breakdown and scrum.

Positions don't have just one core skill nowadays. It is the era of the all-rounder. A hooker who only throws well into the line outs and does nothing else will need to improve the rest of his game to be considered.

But I don't think Best would be picked if he wasn't able to be consistent in the lineout, or at least better than the three guys who represent his competition in the squad.

Sin é wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:

Sin é wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:Yeah but he has only started a few games so thats a completely pointless stat that you actually robbed from me cause I mentioned that a couple of weeks ago.

He subbed against England and he played for 60 minutes and had a great game. You know England who Ireland lost to the year before with Henry at openside ! You did claim that he hadn't played any big games!

We lost by three points in Twickers. Hardly Chris Henry's fault.

No, it wasn't Chris's fault. It was poor selection from Schmidt to have Dave Kearney on the wing who if he had a bit of pace would have run in for a try and not be outpaced by a lock.

Kearney cut infield towards the said lock because thats where the space was. You cant be outpaced by someone you run towards. Idiotic comment.

Even dumber when you consider that Kearney arguably had a better tournament that Zebo did this year.

Rumour has it you were denied only your fourth ever grand slam by Wayne Barnes; what implications does this have for Ireland's RWC campaign?

The Saint wrote:Rumour has it you were denied only your fourth ever grand slam by Wayne Barnes; what implications does this have for Ireland's RWC campaign?

We just went ahead and won the Championship anyway, saint.  You can't be hanging around.  Things to do.  Places to go. Promises to keep.

Notch wrote:Best is also the most consistent lineout thrower of the hookers in the Ireland squad besides his obvious strengths in the breakdown and scrum.

That isn't saying a lot. His replacement hooker is there for his ball carrying.

Positions don't have just one core skill nowadays. It is the era of the all-rounder. A hooker who only throws well into the line outs and does nothing else will need to improve the rest of his game to be considered.

Some are very poor at their supposedly core skill, though, thats the problem. You end up compensating for everyone's weaknesses.

But I don't think Best would be picked if he wasn't able to be consistent in the lineout, or at least better than the three guys who represent his competition in the squad.

The competition is very poor when it comes to line out throwing though. The line out is just as important as the scrum.

As I said - it looks a mess to me.

SecretFly wrote:But sin... Best is not there at the Breakdown?  Who is?

Toner not there for the lineouts.  Who is?

BTW, I don't think Murray is totally picked for his core skill - he's picked too because of his size and physicality.

But winning is winning. Is Best surplus to the breakdown?

His core skills are good though.

I read (in his nomination for Player of the Tournament, I think) that he threw 100 more passes than everyone else!