Regional A teams

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It looks like the superclubs have now hijacked the B&I Cup for themselves now that the LV is over.

Richard Holland is about as slimy as you get. Look at the email he sent. What a tool.

LordDowlais wrote:Yes I have seen all this because I have actually been over to PYS. But not everybody has, and when they watch Scarlets or Dragons or Blues on the tele, they will ask themselves, what is the difference ?

So you are aware that there are some subtle things being done, as well as larger things being done too. So that just brings us down to the colour of the kit. The thing is if it is someone watching it on telly then they are only realistically likely to attend a game if a) they know somebody else who is going and has tickets, b) they like the style of rugby being played, c) they feel they have an affinity to the team. I really can not see how the Blues or Scarlets playing in White and Black (Pontypridd & Pembroke Dock Quins) will make anyone sitting at home say 'oh look that is our colours, lets get off our rumps at turn up to a game'.

Without being too graphic...

If it's brown like a turd, looks like a turd, smells like a turd, and tastes like a turd, who gives a flying monkeys where it comes from!

And I think that's the reason most, if not all the regions are viewed as clubs pretending. They all look, smell and taste like the previous clubs, so everyone else in the region is happy to underplay and dismiss the work they do around the regions.

First thing the regions have to do is give the rest of the region something, it doesn't have to be handing over the keys to regional rugby, for example if the regions played B&I cup games at an alternative venue (If and when it becomes a regional A side tournament), or encorporate another clubs colours into a kit, or use a similar colour for the away kit. What people want is a token, for all those not involved you bet you bottom dollar they want to be, if only they were gven the opportunity!!

Fanster wrote:Without being too graphic...

If it's brown like a turd, looks like a turd, smells like a turd, and tastes like a turd, who gives a flying monkeys where it comes from!

And I think that's the reason most, if not all the regions are viewed as clubs pretending. They all look, smell and taste like the previous clubs, so everyone else in the region is happy to underplay and dismiss the work they do around the regions.

First thing the regions have to do is give the rest of the region something, it doesn't have to be handing over the keys to regional rugby, for example if the regions played B&I cup games at an alternative venue (If and when it becomes a regional A side tournament), or encorporate another clubs colours into a kit, or use a similar colour for the away kit. What people want is a token, for all those not involved you bet you bottom dollar they want to be, if only they were gven the opportunity!!

I think what also helps people to feel involve is not having other people constantly telling them that they are not actually involved.

LordDowlais wrote:Dragons still play in Newport they still where the same coulours and the what not

You've already been shown up on the kit thing, but are you seriously suggesting that Gwent's regional side shouldn't be playing in Gwent's biggest and best-equipped stadium?

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Fanster wrote:Without being too graphic...

If it's brown like a turd, looks like a turd, smells like a turd, and tastes like a turd, who gives a flying monkeys where it comes from!

And I think that's the reason most, if not all the regions are viewed as clubs pretending. They all look, smell and taste like the previous clubs, so everyone else in the region is happy to underplay and dismiss the work they do around the regions.

First thing the regions have to do is give the rest of the region something, it doesn't have to be handing over the keys to regional rugby, for example if the regions played B&I cup games at an alternative venue (If and when it becomes a regional A side tournament), or encorporate another clubs colours into a kit, or use a similar colour for the away kit. What people want is a token, for all those not involved you bet you bottom dollar they want to be, if only they were gven the opportunity!!

I think what also helps people to feel involve is not having other people constantly telling them that they are not actually involved.

You and others here can feel however you want to feel, I just go off my interactions with fans, and wannabe fans from the real world. If theyre not involved I ask why, and the same responses are pretty critical to them.

Those I've met from West just don't want to participate in Llanelli rugby, with all their histry, Scarlet kits and the 2 fingers up to the rest of the West by building the stadium just up the road in Llanelli. Now thats not my feeling, as I care for Scarlets as much as I do for the other 3 as in it's pro Welsh rugby, but defend them as ferociously as you like, your trying to convince people who have been left in the cold that they are wrong, they are not. The fact they have been left in the cold (All over Wales) isn't their opinion, or their feeling, it is their fact!

Fanster wrote:First thing the regions have to do is give the rest of the region something, it doesn't have to be handing over the keys to regional rugby, for example if the regions played B&I cup games at an alternative venue (If and when it becomes a regional A side tournament)

'The Dragons reached swift consensus with Ebbw Vale, Cross Keys, Bedwas and Newport regarding the British and Irish Cup after extremely cordial meetings involving head coach Kingsley Jones and elite performance manager Huw Bevan.

They are set to play a group game at each of Eugene Cross Park, Pandy Park and Bridge Field and any knockout games at Rodney Parade.

It has been suggested that team could play in the old Monmouthshire colours – similar to the Dragons’ away jersey on 2013/14 – with players donning club socks.'

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/rugby/latest/13343183.Premiership_Select_XVs_set_to_be_rubber_stamped_for_the_BIC/

Will that do?

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Dragons still play in Newport they still where the same coulours and the what not

You've already been shown up on the kit thing, but are you seriously suggesting that Gwent's regional side shouldn't be playing in Gwent's biggest and best-equipped stadium?

It's not really a non issue though is it? I stil affiliate the Dragons kit with Newport as it has always traditionally had Black and Amber there in some form. I'm not sure why blue was decided as a better choice for an away strip than say Green and red maybe, which would involve Ebbw a touch?

I understand Ebbw walking away at the start was damaging, but was it any more damaging than Llanelli refusing to combine, or Warriors going under? Maybe it's time to build bridges with a whole heart instead of doing the minimum and then condemning the rest for not making an effort?

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

Fanster wrote:First thing the regions have to do is give the rest of the region something, it doesn't have to be handing over the keys to regional rugby, for example if the regions played B&I cup games at an alternative venue (If and when it becomes a regional A side tournament)

'The Dragons reached swift consensus with Ebbw Vale, Cross Keys, Bedwas and Newport regarding the British and Irish Cup after extremely cordial meetings involving head coach Kingsley Jones and elite performance manager Huw Bevan.

They are set to play a group game at each of Eugene Cross Park, Pandy Park and Bridge Field and any knockout games at Rodney Parade.

It has been suggested that team could play in the old Monmouthshire colours – similar to the Dragons’ away jersey on 2013/14 – with players donning club socks.'

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/rugby/latest/13343183.Premiership_Select_XVs_set_to_be_rubber_stamped_for_the_BIC/

Will that do?

That is a great start and something that has to be applauded for all involved!!!

Fanster, I shall have to take your word for that, but it is not anything I have heard before in the west before.

I have talked to a number of people who are not likely to ever attend PYS or watch the Scarlets on telly though. The only reasons I have heard for people not supporting the Scarlets is that they were Swansea/Neath fans before, or the Scarlets can't win poopie, or they are not into egg chasing. Not once have I heard the name, ground, or shirt colour mentioned.

As for the ground the Scarlets play at

http://www.scarlets.co.uk/eng/news/7033.php#.VZJ9J03bK70

Scarlets pre-season fixtures 2015;
Saturday 15th August, Jersey v Scarlets at St Peter's Jersey
Friday 21st August, Newport Gwent Dragons v Scarlets at Rodney Parade
Saturday 29th August, Scarlets v Bedford Blues at Church Bank, Llandovery

Fanster wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Dragons still play in Newport they still where the same coulours and the what not

You've already been shown up on the kit thing, but are you seriously suggesting that Gwent's regional side shouldn't be playing in Gwent's biggest and best-equipped stadium?

It's not really a non issue though is it? I stil affiliate the Dragons kit with Newport as it has always traditionally had Black and Amber there in some form. I'm not sure why blue was decided as a better choice for an away strip than say Green and red maybe, which would involve Ebbw a touch?

I understand Ebbw walking away at the start was damaging, but was it any more damaging than Llanelli refusing to combine, or Warriors going under? Maybe it's time to build bridges with a whole heart instead of doing the minimum and then condemning the rest for not making an effort?

Nonsense. Are Newport the only team that plays in those colours within Gwent? I know of at least two more teams. Should we also chuck some maroon on the kit too, so Abergavenny feel represented?

Nonsense again. Why should Dragons be all give give give? There has to be a bit in return from "the rest". Though I'm not sure who exactly is condemning.

You seem to be on Welsh rugby threads with one purpose.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:As for the ground the Scarlets play at

http://www.scarlets.co.uk/eng/news/7033.php#.VZJ9J03bK70

Scarlets pre-season fixtures 2015;
Saturday 15th August, Jersey v Scarlets at St Peter's Jersey
Friday 21st August, Newport Gwent Dragons v Scarlets at Rodney Parade
Saturday 29th August, Scarlets v Bedford Blues at Church Bank, Llandovery

Well thats clearly it, light the beacons West Wales has been united in a friendly game, pre season, against a team noone cares about, where the result noone cares about, of which the teams fielded will be a mixed batch of everyone and noone.

Face it the damage was done with the dodgy fundings and accounts of Camarthenshire council who near funded half the stadium, gave the club free land usage, then allowed it to sell that free land usage, while forwarding money from the Stradey projected earnings...

A pre season friendly doesn't make up for huge council losses thus far to the region in its entirity, let alone the rest. Come on.

Fanster wrote:A pre season friendly doesn't make up for huge council losses thus far to the region in its entirity, let alone the rest.

Who said it did?

Gangster, just be honest. Nothing will be good enough.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Gangster, just be honest.  Nothing will be good enough.

Damn auto correct. That was meant for you Fanster

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Gangster, just be honest.  Nothing will be good enough.

Damn auto correct.  That was meant for you Fanster

I think I prefer gangster

You may well be right, and there may be no coming back from the mess regional rugby has caused, but it's nice to hear some acknowledgement of the problem.

I knew people would get all defensive on here about this, look it is just my point of view, the regions cannot have it all ways. They cannot pretend to be a region, then hark back to the days of old when they were beating the All Blacks and what ever else, also, why cant Dragons play a few games at Ebbw Vale ? Just because it's the biggest and best equipped stadium, it does not mean it is the only one you can use.

LordDowlais wrote:I knew people would get all defensive on here about this, look it is just my point of view, the regions cannot have it all ways. They cannot pretend to be a region, then hark back to the days of old when they were beating the All Blacks and what ever else, also, why cant Dragons play a few games at Ebbw Vale ? Just because it's the biggest and best equipped stadium, it does not mean it is the only one you can use.

Havn't that just been adressed with regional clubs agreeing B&I cup pitch usage and potentially playing in Monmouth colours?

LordDowlais wrote:I knew people would get all defensive on here about this, look it is just my point of view, the regions cannot have it all ways. They cannot pretend to be a region, then hark back to the days of old when they were beating the All Blacks and what ever else, also, why cant Dragons play a few games at Ebbw Vale ? Just because it's the biggest and best equipped stadium, it does not mean it is the only one you can use.

It's a while since the Ospreys played a meaningful home game away from the Liberty, but I don't hear you moaning about that.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:It's a while since the Ospreys played a meaningful home game away from the Liberty, but I don't hear you moaning about that.

cough, cough. Perhaps you should be a little more thorough when you accuse people of things I mentioned the following on this thread earlier.

LordDowlais wrote:I agree that there is only one side that looks anything like a region, but they are still playing in Swansea.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:I knew people would get all defensive on here about this, look it is just my point of view, the regions cannot have it all ways. They cannot pretend to be a region, then hark back to the days of old when they were beating the All Blacks and what ever else, also, why cant Dragons play a few games at Ebbw Vale ? Just because it's the biggest and best equipped stadium, it does not mean it is the only one you can use.

It's a while since the Ospreys played a meaningful home game away from the Liberty, but I don't hear you moaning about that.

I'm pretty sure he was meaning that also, he has mentioned 'the regions' and taking games away from Rodney parade. Why must you try to derail what people are saying, instead of responding?

All 4 regions are guilty of not taking games away from their old club grounds / purpose built regional stadium (I nearly pee'd typing that). Do you think they should not? What point are you trying to make with your comment above, aside from trying to push his buttons?

LordDowlais wrote:I knew people would get all defensive on here about this, look it is just my point of view, the regions cannot have it all ways. They cannot pretend to be a region, then hark back to the days of old when they were beating the All Blacks and what ever else, also, why cant Dragons play a few games at Ebbw Vale ? Just because it's the biggest and best equipped stadium, it does not mean it is the only one you can use.

I've already told you, Dragons don't do that for your first bit and for your second, would you turn down income gained off hospitality etc that we would lose from going to a ground with less facilities? Not much of a business decision, is it just to try appealing to some people up the Valley.

Fanster wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:I knew people would get all defensive on here about this, look it is just my point of view, the regions cannot have it all ways. They cannot pretend to be a region, then hark back to the days of old when they were beating the All Blacks and what ever else, also, why cant Dragons play a few games at Ebbw Vale ? Just because it's the biggest and best equipped stadium, it does not mean it is the only one you can use.

It's a while since the Ospreys played a meaningful home game away from the Liberty, but I don't hear you moaning about that.

I'm pretty sure he was meaning that also, he has mentioned 'the regions' and taking games away from Rodney parade. Why must you try to derail what people are saying, instead of responding?

All 4 regions are guilty of not taking games away from their old club grounds / purpose built regional stadium (I nearly pee'd typing that). Do you think they should not? What point are you trying to make with your comment above, aside from trying to push his buttons?

Cheers Fanster, at least you know what point I am trying to make. Look, it is human nature for the die hard regional fans to defend their own, I accept that, but it is these die hard regional fans that will not accept the points of view of the fans who do not want anything to do with the regions. Ah well, we have what we have now, so I just go and cherry pick what games I fancy, I have no real affiliation to any of the regions, what I do feel an affiliation to though is Welsh rugby, and I will support any Welsh team against anybody, even against each other.

Fanster wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:I knew people would get all defensive on here about this, look it is just my point of view, the regions cannot have it all ways. They cannot pretend to be a region, then hark back to the days of old when they were beating the All Blacks and what ever else, also, why cant Dragons play a few games at Ebbw Vale ? Just because it's the biggest and best equipped stadium, it does not mean it is the only one you can use.

It's a while since the Ospreys played a meaningful home game away from the Liberty, but I don't hear you moaning about that.

I'm pretty sure he was meaning that also, he has mentioned 'the regions' and taking games away from Rodney parade. Why must you try to derail what people are saying, instead of responding?

All 4 regions are guilty of not taking games away from their old club grounds / purpose built regional stadium (I nearly pee'd typing that). Do you think they should not? What point are you trying to make with your comment above, aside from trying to push his buttons?

The point I'm making is that Dowlais seems to have it in for the Dragons, while giving the Ospreys an easy ride.

Dowlais, you may have mentioned the Ospreys not playing away from the Liberty, but I'm afraid it's easy to miss something like that when many of your posts just repeat points you've already made several times.

Risca Rev wrote:is it just to try appealing to some people up the Valley.

Those people are supposed to be part of the region, no wonder most of them want nothing to do with Newport Gwent Dragons when their fans have that attitude towards them.

So we should concede proper home advantage/extra income etc to pander to fans who don't want anything to do with the region? I get you.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Dowlais, you may have mentioned the Ospreys not playing away from the Liberty, but I'm afraid it's easy to miss something like that when many of your posts just repeat points you've already made several times.

It's ok.

LordDowlais wrote:These die hard regional fans that will not accept the points of view of the fans who do not want anything to do with the regions.

If these fans don't want anything to do with the regions, why should the regions knowingly lose money by taking games to other grounds?

LordDowlais wrote:

Risca Rev wrote:is it just to try appealing to some people up the Valley.

Those people are supposed to be part of the region, no wonder most of them want nothing to do with Newport Gwent Dragons when their fans have that attitude towards them.

Nice selective quoting. You're apparently a businessman. You would honestly expect Dragons to lose income off hospitality etc and playing away from their merchandise store etc? It makes no sense to me, but I guess I'm a blinkered, die hard regional fan.

Risca Rev wrote:So we should concede proper home advantage/extra income etc to pander to fans who don't want anything to do with the region? I get you.

Risca, if more effort was made, then perhaps they would WANT to have something to do with the region, take a game up there, show "people up the valleys" a token gesture, perhaps they will take an olive branch and then go down to Newport, but unless you just see them as you have said earlier then it sounds to me as though you do not care about everybody in your region, just as long as you are alright.

I think that die hards seem to feel the duty to defend their club/region to the hilt, which is natural, but I wouldn't say it's all one way, there are others who seem to enjoy being 'disenfranchised', what I don't see much of is people in the centre, who see both sides of the argument and could actually be the vessells for ideas to take club rugby in Wales forward.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:These die hard regional fans that will not accept the points of view of the fans who do not want anything to do with the regions.

If these fans don't want anything to do with the regions, why should the regions knowingly lose money by taking games to other grounds?

Because that is what the regions were made for, embracing the WHOLE of the region, if they are not even bothering to try and appease the fans who feel left out, then for me the regions deserve all they get. If this is how they feel then they should just come out and be honest about it, and call themselves their club names.

LordDowlais wrote:

Risca Rev wrote:So we should concede proper home advantage/extra income etc to pander to fans who don't want anything to do with the region? I get you.

Risca, if more effort was made, then perhaps they would WANT to have something to do with the region, take a game up there, show "people up the valleys" a token gesture, perhaps they will take an olive branch and then go down to Newport, but unless you just see them as you have said earlier then it sounds to me as though you do not care about everybody in your region, just as long as you are alright.

Supposition again. So we lose a definite in income in exchange for a possibility. I'll pass it on to the Dragons board.

No I don't care for everybody in my region. I don't know the vast majority of them for a start. What a strange thing to say.

LordDowlais wrote:

Risca Rev wrote:So we should concede proper home advantage/extra income etc to pander to fans who don't want anything to do with the region? I get you.

Risca, if more effort was made, then perhaps they would WANT to have something to do with the region, take a game up there, show "people up the valleys" a token gesture, perhaps they will take an olive branch and then go down to Newport, but unless you just see them as you have said earlier then it sounds to me as though you do not care about everybody in your region, just as long as you are alright.

They know the Dragons exist, they know where they play, they know that one of the head coaches is a former captain of Ebbw Vale, they've probably heard Lyn Jones calling us the Gwent Dragons. Many people from north Gwent do come down to watch the Dragons. If others don't want to, then fair enough. You can't expect everyone in a given area to support a particular team.

Fanster wrote:I think that die hards seem to feel the duty to defend their club/region to the hilt, which is natural, but I wouldn't say it's all one way, there are others who seem to enjoy being 'disenfranchised', what I don't see much of is people in the centre, who see both sides of the argument and could actually be the vessells for ideas to take club rugby in Wales forward.

Yes I agree with this, there are fans who want nothing to do with the regions, even if their region was playing in their back garden they would close the curtains, but it is the people in the center we should be talking about, those are the people who the regions should be targeting. They should take themselves to them, not expect them to come to the regions. These people might have a little interest but not enough to travel into the cities/town to go and watch them, if they took their product to those people, they might get them hooked.

Risca Rev wrote:No I don't care for everybody in my region. I don't know the vast majority of them for a start. What a strange thing to say.

Well then, if that is the case, I will not see you having a go of the fans on here who will not support their region, like you do to the Pontypridd fans.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

Risca Rev wrote:So we should concede proper home advantage/extra income etc to pander to fans who don't want anything to do with the region? I get you.

Risca, if more effort was made, then perhaps they would WANT to have something to do with the region, take a game up there, show "people up the valleys" a token gesture, perhaps they will take an olive branch and then go down to Newport, but unless you just see them as you have said earlier then it sounds to me as though you do not care about everybody in your region, just as long as you are alright.

They know the Dragons exist, they know where they play, they know that one of the head coaches is a former captain of Ebbw Vale, they've probably heard Lyn Jones calling us the Gwent Dragons. Many people from north Gwent do come down to watch the Dragons. If others don't want to, then fair enough. You can't expect everyone in a given area to support a particular team.

+1 pretty much to all of that.

The other thing I would like to know is how many fans really do stay away from the regions because they feel like they are not part of them (and not just the assumed 'loads of potential fans' but realistic numbers based on club attendances/financial situation of the area etc). Also when I say fans who do not feel part of the region, I mean the fans who would attend if the games were played outside of the regional headquarters, and not the ones who don't attend due to cash issues, or timing clashes, or nagging partners etc, as these people will not turn up even if it were played in the local park.

LordDowlais wrote:

Fanster wrote:I think that die hards seem to feel the duty to defend their club/region to the hilt, which is natural, but I wouldn't say it's all one way, there are others who seem to enjoy being 'disenfranchised', what I don't see much of is people in the centre, who see both sides of the argument and could actually be the vessells for ideas to take club rugby in Wales forward.

Yes I agree with this, there are fans who want nothing to do with the regions, even if their region was playing in their back garden they would close the curtains, but it is the people in the center we should be talking about, those are the people who the regions should be targeting. They should take themselves to them, not expect them to come to the regions. These people might have a little interest but not enough to travel into the cities/town to go and watch them, if they took their product to those people, they might get them hooked.

I see your point Lord. But as has been shown already, the Dragons played the Saints at EXP last season, the Scarlets are playing in Llandovery this season. And this gets met with 'big whoop' type reactions. Then there was even the time the Blues tried to play at Sardis and got told to sod off. The Ospreys have had marginal success at playing in the Brewery Field, but I have heard grumbles on here along the lines of 'so what it is only LV='. Efforts are being made, and they are being scoffed at. It must put people off trying a second/third time.

Well, yes the regions could take more meaningful games to the masses, the odd league game would not go a miss. The "big whoop" reactions you are getting is because of the back handedness of a friendly being played there, or an LV= game. I see no reason why a game against the Italians could not be played at another ground, other than it would upset the fans who only like going to their main grounds.

Especially when, as has been pointed out, the regions lose money every time they do it. They're not exactly flush.

LordDowlais wrote:Well, yes the regions could take more meaningful games to the masses, the odd league game would not go a miss. The "big whoop" reactions you are getting is because of the back handedness of a friendly being played there, or an LV= game. I see no reason why a game against the Italians could not be played at another ground, other than it would upset the fans who only like going to their main grounds.

1) So you'd have the regions take a home game against the Italians, historically the poorest-attended home games, to a ground where they'd have even fewer people attending? The Italians are never a draw, regardless of where we play them.

2) Who are these 'masses'?

LordDowlais wrote:Well, yes the regions could take more meaningful games to the masses, the odd league game would not go a miss. The "big whoop" reactions you are getting is because of the back handedness of a friendly being played there, or an LV= game. I see no reason why a game against the Italians could not be played at another ground, other than it would upset the fans who only like going to their main grounds.

Or maybe just maybe there is an issue with capacity, Church Bank (bigger than the Carm Quins) ground has a capacity of 3,000. Seeing as the attendance for the Zebre game at PYS was 5,342 and the Treviso game was 5,791, Church Bank is too small a ground for these games.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
1) So you'd have the regions take a home game against the Italians, historically the poorest-attended home games, to a ground where they'd have even fewer people attending? The Italians are never a draw, regardless of where we play them.

At least the games have some meaning.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:2) Who are these 'masses'?

The thousands of people living in Gwent who feel no affiliation to the rugby team that is supposed to representing them.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Well, yes the regions could take more meaningful games to the masses, the odd league game would not go a miss. The "big whoop" reactions you are getting is because of the back handedness of a friendly being played there, or an LV= game. I see no reason why a game against the Italians could not be played at another ground, other than it would upset the fans who only like going to their main grounds.

1) So you'd have the regions take a home game against the Italians, historically the poorest-attended home games, to a ground where they'd have even fewer people attending? The Italians are never a draw, regardless of where we play them.

2) Who are these 'masses'?

As soon as someone can come up with some evidence to support these claims the better. So far this debate has had numerous reasons why these masses will not attend (and some sound made up to me), and reasons why the regions are not trying hard enough. Even when evidence of the regions try is brought up it is dismissed, yet there is no evidence of these masses, or even of their supposed issues with the regions.

LordDowlais wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:2) Who are these 'masses'?

The thousands of people living in Gwent who feel no affiliation to the rugby team that is supposed to representing them.

Any proof to back up that claim?

There are other reasons that 'disenfranchisement' for people not attending
1) ticket cost
2) attend local games (village/kids)
3) nagging partner not wanting them to go to rugby
4) poor health
5) work
6) no interest in rugby
7) poor weather
8) ......

Just because there is a certain sized population, and technically they are all potential attendees, it does not meant that realistically that many of them will be. If it is only 25% that would be doing well IMO.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:when evidence of the regions try is brought up it is dismissed

Who has "dismissed" anything ?

LordDowlais wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:2) Who are these 'masses'?

The thousands of people living in Gwent who feel no affiliation to the rugby team that is supposed to representing them.

The majority of which still wouldn't care if we played the odd home game elsewhere. If they don't follow rugby, playing the odd home game away from Rodney Parade won't change that. If they do follow rugby and don't want to support the Dragons, then again I doubt taking a game or two to EXP would make a difference.

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink; if it really, really doesn't want to drink, then it won't even if you take the water to it.

Same old anti regional arguments, debunked year after year after year.

The fact is that thousands of people in Wales are apathetic towards any form of rugby that isn't Wales. They'll leave their hoses for a match in Cardiff. With them having 10 pints before and afterwards. The "rugby mad welsh public" as they are coined claim to love the sport. But they don't. They'll happily moan about it. Have all the solutions. Watch it from their armchair. But when it comes to supporting it, they majority won't, no matter what the teams are called or what colours they play in.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Just because there is a certain sized population, and technically they are all potential attendees, it does not meant that realistically that many of them will be. If it is only 25% that would be doing well IMO.

And we never will get them if the regions expect to just open their doors and for these people to come to them, this is not field of dreams, just because it has been built, it does not mean they will come. You have to give them a taste so that they can see if they like it first, you never know, it hook people, and if it only gets you one extra fan, it should be seen as a success. At least if you take the product to these people, other cannot say that you have not tried.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:2) Who are these 'masses'?

The thousands of people living in Gwent who feel no affiliation to the rugby team that is supposed to representing them.

Any proof to back up that claim?  

There are other reasons that 'disenfranchisement' for people not attending
1) ticket cost
2) attend local games (village/kids)
3) nagging partner not wanting them to go to rugby
4) poor health
5) work
6) no interest in rugby
7) poor weather
8) ......

Just because there is a certain sized population, and technically they are all potential attendees, it does not meant that realistically that many of them will be.  If it is only 25% that would be doing well IMO.

It's the same flawed logic that sees how well-supported the national team is and assumes that all these people care about rugby the rest of the time and the regions are to blame that they don't attend regional games. Well actually, loads of people just don't care about rugby below international level, and there's nothing the regions or anyone else can do about it.