Ireland's Rugby World Cup 2015 Thread - "You're wrong on several counts..."

[Don Alfonso]

First topic message reminder :

Alright.

The time for whinging at the Welsh, sniping at the Scots and educating the English is done. Playtime is over. The bitterness is dialled up to ten, the eye-patches producing metaphorical one-eyedness are donned, chips are placed on shoulders – it’s time for some proper, down n’ dirty, internecine bickering.

Who will go to the 2015 Rugby World Cup to play for Ireland?

Who should go?



The players have the following opportunities to shine like a diamond for Joe:


Emerging Ireland Tbilisi Cup

Emerging Italy v Emerging Ireland
Saturday 13th June 14:00 BST

Uruguay v Emerging Ireland
Wednesday 17th June 14:00 BST

Georgia v Emerging Ireland
Sunday 21st June 16:00 BST


Ireland Matches

Wales v Ireland
Millennium Stadium
Saturday 8th August

Ireland v Scotland
Aviva Stadium
Saturday 15th August

Ireland v Wales
Aviva Stadium
Saturday 29th August

England v Ireland
Twickenham Stadium
Saturday 5th September


31 players.

A 17/14 split? Has Madigan played himself off the plane? Do Ruddock or Trimble have enough time to make it back? Can Rory’s darts be trusted? Does POM spend too much time on the wing? Are Payne and Strauss “Irish” enough? Why is Reddan there? Has Zebo been by-passed? Is Cave too slow? Why Felix Jones?

HAVE AT THEE!

[marty2086]

Decent Ireland team anounced. Excited to see how Earls does at 13.

In the ten minutes he has before getting injured

[Submachine]

It's a funny call alright Would have thought it was an ideal game to get Furlong some exposure or bring White in to see what he can do. Hard to see us not bringing 3 specialist tightheads.
Ryan and Henderson in the second row is a great shout. Think they will complement each other very well with Hendersons power and Ryans work rate. Delighted to see Trimble and Earls back in an Ireland team and Felix is nailed on for the 23 for all the big gmes.
Be interesting to see what happens in the backs if we get a few injuries with only two on the bench.

[munkian]

Earls at 13 ? Really ?

[GunsGerms]

Earls at 13 ? Really ?

Why not?

I actually think its great. Earls is a sublimely talented and attacking minded player. I think if any coach can bring the best out of him, Schmidt can. Excited to see how he plays.

[wolfball]

Starters at RWC:
Heaslip/Best

Fighting for starts at the RWC:
14. Andrew Trimble
4. Iain Henderson
3. Mike Ross
1. Jack McGrath
Chris Henry

Fighting for Bench at RWC:
15. Felix Jones,
13. Keith Earls
10. Paddy Jackson
9. Eoin Reddan;
6. Jordi Murphy

Fighting for Squad at RWC:
11. Fergus McFadden
7. Tommy O’Donnell
5. Donncha Ryan
2. Richardt Strauss,
Dave Kilcoyne
Michael Bent
Dan Tuohy
Ian Madigan
Simon Zebo

No hopes without injury at RWC:
Marmion (unfortunately)
Cave


Note, people may quibble on where I put trimble vs zebo - In my mind that is how Joe regards each player, Trimble if fit will play, and if he plays, that throws zebo down the pecking order alot.

[munkian]

Earls at 13 ? Really ?

Why not?

I actually think its great. Earls is a sublimely talented and attacking minded player. I think if any coach can bring the best out of him, Schmidt can. Excited to see how he plays.

You lost me at sublimely talented.

[Sin é]

If it was Zebo v Trimble for a spot, Trimble would be playing 11, not 14. Zebo never plays on the right side because he is left footed.

I'd say Zebo is there to be tried out at fullback.

[GoodinTightSpaces]

If it was Zebo v Trimble for a spot, Trimble would be playing 11, not 14. Zebo never plays on the right side because he is left footed.

I'd say Zebo is there to be tried out at fullback.

would like to Zebo there actually. think Kearney has been poor this year in my opinion. he either kicks the ball into the heavens are runs directly into players. never passes are brings other players into the game

[Sin é]

Starters at RWC:
Heaslip/Best

My view of what I think is going on:

Fighting for starts at the RWC:
14. Andrew Trimble / just fitness. He will be competing with Tommy Bowe for the right wing.
4. Iain Henderson / Being given a go at lock because he usually plays blindside.
3. Mike Ross / Mike Ross always needs a good few game to get going. I saw elsewhere that he has started every international game that Schmidt has coached.
1. Jack McGrath / Cian Healy will start.
Chris Henry / Sean O'Brien will start

Fighting for Bench at RWC:
15. Felix Jones, (agreed)
13. Keith Earls (I'll wait to see how he plays first. I don't think Jared Payne is a guaranteed starter)
10. Paddy Jackson (agreed)
9. Eoin Reddan; (agreed)
6. Jordi Murphy (agreed)

Fighting for Squad at RWC:
11. Fergus McFadden (agreed)
7. Tommy O’Donnell (agreed)
5. Donncha Ryan (don't agree. the fact that he put him with inexperienced Henderson suggests he is probably on the plane)
2. Richardt Strauss, think he will make squad
Dave Kilcoyne think he will make squad
Michael Bent don't think he will make squad
Dan Tuohy don't think he will make squad
Ian Madigan think he will make squad
Simon Zebo I think the left wing is between Luke & himself - will definately make plain

No hopes without injury at RWC:
Marmion (unfortunately) agreed
Cave agreed


Note, people may quibble on where I put trimble vs zebo - In my mind that is how Joe regards each player, Trimble if fit will play, and if he plays, that throws zebo down the pecking order alot.

[Marshes]

Surprised not to see Gilroy, what does his exclusion here put him up the pecking order? Unless he is injured i thought this would be a good opportunity for him

Ryan and Henderson will be exciting to see, and looking forward to Earls at 13, i think his versatility will keep a very decent winger off the plane

[wolfball]

Starters at RWC:
Heaslip/Best

My view of what I think is going on:

Fighting for starts at the RWC:
14. Andrew Trimble    /  just fitness. He will be competing with Tommy Bowe for the right wing.
4. Iain Henderson    /  Being given a go at lock because he usually plays blindside.
3. Mike Ross    /  Mike Ross always needs a good few game to get going. I saw elsewhere that he has started every international game that Schmidt has coached.
1. Jack McGrath  /  Cian Healy will start.
Chris Henry   /  Sean O'Brien will start

Fighting for Bench at RWC:
15. Felix Jones, (agreed)
13. Keith Earls (I'll wait to see how he plays first. I don't think Jared Payne is a guaranteed starter)
10. Paddy Jackson (agreed)
9. Eoin Reddan; (agreed)
6. Jordi Murphy (agreed)

Fighting for Squad at RWC:
11. Fergus McFadden (agreed)
7. Tommy O’Donnell (agreed)
5. Donncha Ryan (don't agree. the fact that he put him with inexperienced Henderson suggests he is probably on the plane)
2. Richardt Strauss, think he will make squad
Dave Kilcoyne think he will make squad
Michael Bent don't think he will make squad
Dan Tuohy don't think he will make squad
Ian Madigan think he will make squad
Simon Zebo  I think the left wing is between Luke & himself - will definately make plain

No hopes without injury at RWC:
Marmion (unfortunately)   agreed
Cave     agreed


Note, people may quibble on where I put trimble vs zebo - In my mind that is how Joe regards each player, Trimble if fit will play, and if he plays, that throws zebo down the pecking order alot.

On Ryan, I think this first match is too soon to know if he's going - ie Tuohy could be starting the next 3 for all we know, plus he has more familiarity with Henderson anyways.

On wings - if there are 6 props, there are only 3 places for out and out wings, 4 if there are 5 props.

RWing - Trimble, Bowe
LWing- Earls, Zebo, Luke, McFadden

I think its either Trimble/Bowe/Earls, or Trimble/Bowe/Earls/Zebo depending on props. Luke is still injured and so will discount him.

[wolfball]

the real problem is Felix, I would prefer Zebo/Earls to go and both cover FB and get another wing in like Gilroy/Luke then have Felix in there, but Joe adores him.

[The Great Aukster]

The left foot/left wing thing is archaic in the modern game. It's actually far easier kicking defensively to the left touchline with the right foot. Chipping ahead in attack is useful for a left wing to do so with his left foot but the wingers shouldn't be conceding possession like that normally. However left hand/left wing is maybe more accurate because it's the ability to pass inside that can make a good modern wing.

Guys like McFadden, and Trimble are adept at passing off both hands.

[Notch]

Surprised not to see Gilroy, what does his exclusion here put him up the pecking order? Unless he is injured i thought this would be a good opportunity for him

Ryan and Henderson will be exciting to see, and looking forward to Earls at 13, i think his versatility will keep a very decent winger off the plane

I don't think Gilroy will be involved in any of the games. Think about it- we have Zebo and Bowe who haven't had any game time. Fitzgerald who is rated highly enough to start the 6N decider. McFadden and Trimble start this weekend. Thats already a lot of wingers ahead of him- and Dave Kearney has more time under Schmidt than him as well.

There will be 5 or 6 players who won't be unless there are injuries. I'm guessing him, Rob Herring, Noel Reid, Jack Conan and possibly Dave Kearney. There is going to be a cut next week and that's who I think will be going. Maybe even a few more.

[Sin é]

The left foot/left wing thing is archaic in the modern game. It's actually far easier kicking defensively to the left touchline with the right foot. Chipping ahead in attack is useful for a left wing to do so with his left foot but the wingers shouldn't be conceding possession like that normally. However left hand/left wing is maybe more accurate because it's the ability to pass inside that can make a good modern wing.

Guys like McFadden, and Trimble are adept at passing off both hands.

Joe is big into the left foot/right foot thing and has spoken of how useful it to have a left footed player on the left wing because they can kick straight down the line. He also said the reason why he dropped Zebo for Luke in the Scotland game was because if he put Luke on the right wing he would have had 3 left footed players on the pitch at the same time.

McFadden is a terrible passer of the ball. Thats why he has been moved to wing. I haven't noticed Trimble, but that would have been one of the reasons why he didn't succeed as a centre.

[bedfordwelsh]

What's the overall feeling on the side for Saturday then boys? Seems like a good mix up of the squad bit like ours.

[Notch]

McFadden is a terrible passer of the ball. Thats why he has been moved to wing. I haven't noticed Trimble, but that would have been one of the reasons why he didn't succeed as a centre.

You would have to admit that he's developed a lot as a player since his time in the centre.

[Sin é]

Earls at 13 ? Really ?

Why not?

I actually think its great. Earls is a sublimely talented and attacking minded player. I think if any coach can bring the best out of him, Schmidt can. Excited to see how he plays.

You lost me at sublimely talented.

One of the Top Try scorers at 2011 World Cup (5 tries). Two more than ickle Shane and George North who only scored 3 each.

In the company of Adam Ashley-Cooper and Israel Dagg who also scored 5 tries each.

Ashton & Vincent Clerc scored 6.

[The Great Aukster]

McFadden is a terrible passer of the ball. Thats why he has been moved to wing. I haven't noticed Trimble, but that would have been one of the reasons why he didn't succeed as a centre.

You would have to admit that he's developed a lot as a player since his time in the centre.

Yes Trimble has improved his passing off both hands (and his kicking) from when he first came on the scene. He could easily operate in the centre now as he often plays as an auxiliary centre running lines in midfield - he couldn't do that if he wasn't able to pass. Earls is also carrying the tag of being a poor passer even though he too has improved his distribution. Haven't noticed that McFadden is a poor passer, thought he was moved to wing because his defence isn't as exposed there.

[mikey_dragon]

The Irish front 5 and bench seems a lot better than Wales'. I think you guys might win this one.

[Notch]

He could, but it's largely irrelevant. He can come off his wing and get involved just as much as he would be at centre as you say. Would be, I guess, able to provide emergency cover there during a game. I don't think he's a player who will be looked at as being versatile the way Earls is. If he shows his best form he both makes the plane and starts. If he doesn't hit the ground running he probably doesn't make the plane.

As for Earls, I'm still not sold on him in the centre and I know he's a great winger. I guess this selection is about having a guy who can cover centre as well as wing and we'll see if he can.

[mikey_dragon]

Earls at 13 ? Really ?

Why not?

I actually think its great. Earls is a sublimely talented and attacking minded player. I think if any coach can bring the best out of him, Schmidt can. Excited to see how he plays.

You lost me at sublimely talented.

One of the Top Try scorers at 2011 World Cup (5 tries). Two more than ickle Shane and George North who only scored 3 each.

In the company of Adam Ashley-Cooper and Israel Dagg who also scored 5 tries each.

Ashton & Vincent Clerc scored 6.

Our try-scorers were a bit more evenly spread through our team; well just the backs I think.

What's Earls best position? Like Ashley-Cooper too he can cover a few positions well. By now I would have expected him to nail down an Ireland spot, but I know he's had some time out with injury so maybe that has contributed to it.

Munkian I actually do think Earls is a very good player. If they were to say the same about Fitzgerald then you might have a point .

[Notch]

What's Earls best position?

The wing. Absolutely the wing- the guy has a natural nose for the try line. He has a huge amount of talent and some prominent weaknesses, but where you want to see him getting the ball- for me when he gets the ball in any kind of space down the touchline in the 22 you can rely on him to put away those chances and half-chances, even if he hasn't been involved much. He's pretty average in his all-round game a lot of the time compared to some of the other players but I think he is the best out and out finisher in the squad. Thats the one area I feel he has the edge on the multitude of other wingers, I feel several other players are better than him in the rest of the game but boy, the boy can finish.

As a centre- meh. Not a reliable decision maker, not overly physical in attack or defence, not always composed when he has multiple options. He has a lethal outside break if you let him show it and he is capable of flashes of brilliance but I have never seen him play consistently well with 13 on his back. Excited to see if Schmidt can change that.

[Gwlad]

Some ireland selections seem odd…Earls, Trimble for example, these are real veterans seems strange to have them in the side…same could be said of course for some of Wales selections.

[Notch]

Real veterans- but such is the competition in their position that both could easily miss out on the plane altogether. I would bring both players and both are experienced (Trimble with 57 caps, Earls with 39) but it's not inconceivable that they need big games to actually make the squad.

[Pete330v2]

Andy Trimble may be a veteran but pre-injury he was playing some of the best rugby in his career. There's no way of telling if his form will continue but he'll give nothing less than 100% to get on the final squad.
Earls' career has been blighted by never having nailed down what exactly he was. He definately has a huge amount of talent but there's always debate as to where he should be playing.

[Sin é]

Earls at 13 ? Really ?

Why not?

I actually think its great. Earls is a sublimely talented and attacking minded player. I think if any coach can bring the best out of him, Schmidt can. Excited to see how he plays.

You lost me at sublimely talented.

One of the Top Try scorers at 2011 World Cup (5 tries). Two more than ickle Shane and George North who only scored 3 each.

In the company of Adam Ashley-Cooper and Israel Dagg who also scored 5 tries each.

Ashton & Vincent Clerc scored 6.

Our try-scorers were a bit more evenly spread through our team; well just the backs I think.

What's Earls best position? Like Ashley-Cooper too he can cover a few positions well. By now I would have expected him to nail down an Ireland spot, but I know he's had some time out with injury so maybe that has contributed to it.

Munkian I actually do think Earls is a very good player. If they were to say the same about Fitzgerald then you might have a point .

He is pretty good in all positions. He gets criticised because people were calling for BOD to be dropped a few years ago when BOD was going through a bad patch and Ulster fans have it in for him because he was preferred to Andrew Trimble at the last world cup.

If Earls played for Leinster or Ulster, his name would be one of the first on their teamsheet in any of several positions.

Two cameos of Earls here (from end of last season after his long layoff).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vr7HAgAt7zY
http://www.balls.ie/rugby/238719-outstanding-keith-earls-try/238719

One thing he is really good at as well is rucking.

[Sin é]

Some ireland selections seem odd…Earls, Trimble for example, these are real veterans seems strange to have them in the side…same could be said of course for some of Wales selections.

Earls is the same age as Halfpenny - 27. Missed the last two seasons sorting out a few injuries (shoulder op and groin & knee problems). Seems to be flying now though.

[Notch]

Seems to be flying before kicking a ball in anger in a green shirt for the first time in years- must be an international window

[Pete330v2]

"Ulster fans have it in for him because he was preferred to Andrew Trimble at the last world cup"

Can you get us one quote there Sin é?
No?

I thought so.

I for one am a big fan of his yet I am an Ulster fan, hmmmm....

[mikey_dragon]

Some ireland selections seem odd…Earls, Trimble for example, these are real veterans seems strange to have them in the side…same could be said of course for some of Wales selections.

Earls is the same age as Halfpenny - 27. Missed the last two seasons sorting out a few injuries (shoulder op and groin & knee problems). Seems to be flying now though.

Halfpenny is 26.

[mikey_dragon]

And thanks for clearing that up Irish lads RE Earls. I believe when I first seen him play he was at stand-off, and had a fine game in the Munster 10 shirt. It will be interesting to see him tomorrow, he's opposite a very promising young centre on debut.

[Sin é]

"Ulster fans have it in for him because he was preferred to Andrew Trimble at the last world cup"

Can you get us one quote there Sin é?
No?

I thought so.

I for one am a big fan of his yet I am an Ulster fan, hmmmm....

I can ... plenty of material of this type on the UAFC website.

The Boo Radleys wrote:
Keith Earls. Why?

Discuss... (50 marks)

Around page 30 of a search for Keith Earls will get you Ulster fan comments about Earls around the 2011 world cup.

http://uafc.co.uk/index.php?i=search&mode=search&st=0&sk=t&sd=d&sr=posts&keywords=keith++%2Bearls&start=435

[Sin é]

Some ireland selections seem odd…Earls, Trimble for example, these are real veterans seems strange to have them in the side…same could be said of course for some of Wales selections.

Earls is the same age as Halfpenny - 27. Missed the last two seasons sorting out a few injuries (shoulder op and groin & knee problems). Seems to be flying now though.

Halfpenny is 26.

ok - they are around the same age. Earls became the youngest Lion when Halfpenny got injured in 2009.

[Pete330v2]

"Ulster fans have it in for him because he was preferred to Andrew Trimble at the last world cup"

Can you get us one quote there Sin é?
No?

I thought so.

I for one am a big fan of his yet I am an Ulster fan, hmmmm....

I can ... plenty of material of this type on the UAFC website.

   The Boo Radleys wrote:
   Keith Earls. Why?

   Discuss... (50 marks)

Around page 30 of a search for Keith Earls will get you Ulster fan comments about Earls around the 2011 world cup.

http://uafc.co.uk/index.php?i=search&mode=search&st=0&sk=t&sd=d&sr=posts&keywords=keith++%2Bearls&start=435

Sin é don't take a single comment from that forum to be indicative of any Ulster fans bar the thankfull very few extremists. They hate Jared Payne on there too, Paul Marshall gets plenty of abuse and that's only the tip of the iceberg. There's even a number of posters on there who have expressed their hatred of all things Glasgow, not just the rugby.

Don't let a few bad apples influence your opinion Sin é.

[Sin é]

Earls' career has been blighted by never having nailed down what exactly he was. He definately has a huge amount of talent but there's always debate as to where he should be playing.

Earls 'problem' is that he is too versatile. He is well able to nail down a spot at 13. Every coach he has ever had really rates. Jason Holland (who was the backs coach for Munster and is now the the Hurricanes backs coach suggested back in 2009 that BOD should be moved to 12 with Earls at 13.

He got John de Villiers benched at Munster (Earls was initially on wing with De Villiers & Mafi in the centre). Munster ended up with Earls at 13 & Mafi or De Villiers at 12. (Tony McGahan head coach. Jason Holland backs coach).

He started ahead of Casey Laulala at 13 (Rob Penney & Simon Mannix) until Doug Howlett got his career ending injury when he was moved out to the wing.

He was back at centre this season for Munster (first 6 games after his injury) until Munster had a rake of injuries in the backs and Andrew Smith was also injured. I've posted some of his cameos in that period wearing the 13 jersey. He took out 6 defenders and offloaded (2 of the Cardiff players actually tackled each other). He can create havoc. Ronan O'Gara said in his newspaper column this year that Earls is the only Irish player that challenged Brian O'Driscoll every time in training. Thats what we need in our midfield. Someone creating havoc in it.

[Sin é]

"Ulster fans have it in for him because he was preferred to Andrew Trimble at the last world cup"

Can you get us one quote there Sin é?
No?

I thought so.

I for one am a big fan of his yet I am an Ulster fan, hmmmm....

I can ... plenty of material of this type on the UAFC website.

   The Boo Radleys wrote:
   Keith Earls. Why?

   Discuss... (50 marks)

Around page 30 of a search for Keith Earls will get you Ulster fan comments about Earls around the 2011 world cup.

http://uafc.co.uk/index.php?i=search&mode=search&st=0&sk=t&sd=d&sr=posts&keywords=keith++%2Bearls&start=435

Sin é don't take a single comment from that forum to be indicative of any Ulster fans bar the thankfull very few extremists. They hate Jared Payne on there too, Paul Marshall gets plenty of abuse and that's only the tip of the iceberg. There's even a number of posters on there who have expressed their hatred of all things Glasgow, not just the rugby.

Don't let a few bad apples influence your opinion Sin é.

You said I couldn't come up with one There are hundreds of them!

[Pete330v2]

"Ulster fans have it in for him because he was preferred to Andrew Trimble at the last world cup"

Can you get us one quote there Sin é?
No?

I thought so.

I for one am a big fan of his yet I am an Ulster fan, hmmmm....

I can ... plenty of material of this type on the UAFC website.

   The Boo Radleys wrote:
   Keith Earls. Why?

   Discuss... (50 marks)

Around page 30 of a search for Keith Earls will get you Ulster fan comments about Earls around the 2011 world cup.

http://uafc.co.uk/index.php?i=search&mode=search&st=0&sk=t&sd=d&sr=posts&keywords=keith++%2Bearls&start=435

Sin é don't take a single comment from that forum to be indicative of any Ulster fans bar the thankfull very few extremists. They hate Jared Payne on there too, Paul Marshall gets plenty of abuse and that's only the tip of the iceberg. There's even a number of posters on there who have expressed their hatred of all things Glasgow, not just the rugby.

Don't let a few bad apples influence your opinion Sin é.

You said I couldn't come up with one  There are hundreds of them!

Well yes indeed, I suppose I should give credit where credit's due, well done Sin é.
You did cheat a bit though taking quotes from the 'special' forum

[Gwlad]

Some ireland selections seem odd…Earls, Trimble for example, these are real veterans seems strange to have them in the side…same could be said of course for some of Wales selections.

Earls is the same age as Halfpenny - 27. Missed the last two seasons sorting out a few injuries (shoulder op and groin & knee problems). Seems to be flying now though.

Seems like he has been around for 10 years already; wasn't he the bolter in the 09 Lions?

[Sin é]

Interesting tweet from BOD:

Brian O'Driscoll ‏@BrianODriscoll 12m12 minutes ago
Interesting Ireland team for the weekend. A few lads need monster games to sneak in. Earlsy & Donncha Ryan just need solid performances.

[the-goon]

I would love Earls to turn into a test quality centre, and would doff the cap to Sin for always believing it. But bar fits and bursts of quality, he hasn't really proved that he is international centre quality over any sustained period. Injuries have played their part, as well as the BOD-D'Arce partnership, but the point still stands.
He has scored some great tries, made great breaks, I'm not disputing it. I feel centre highlights his weaknesses, and wing maximizes his strengths.
He has been working on those weaknesses over the years, so fingers crossed they are no longer weaknesses.

[the-goon]

Also, anyone kinda wants to see D'Arcy doing a TOL and playing his way off the plane?
I feel bad saying that, but just don't see what he can add.

[Sin é]

I would love Earls to turn into a test quality centre, and would doff the cap to Sin for always believing it. But bar fits and bursts of quality, he hasn't really proved that he is international centre quality over any sustained period. Injuries have played their part, as well as the BOD-D'Arce partnership, but the point still stands.
He has scored some great tries, made great breaks, I'm not disputing it. I feel centre highlights his weaknesses, and wing maximizes his strengths.
He has been working on those weaknesses over the years, so fingers crossed they are no longer weaknesses.

He has mostly only had the odd game here and there in the centre internationally, generally with a different partner every time and in a backline that had little pace and was aging. The most he has ever played in the centre is 4 in a row in the 2012 Six Nations outside an ageing Darcy and a misfiring and injured Sexton and he was one of the standout players. It also happened to be a time when he was playing on the wing for Munster. Zebo's best season for Munster was when Earls was the 13.

And the curse of being versatile - he will probably make the 23, but won't be a starter which is a real shame.

I really don't get this reluctance about Earls as a centre. Payne, BOD & Darcy had serious limitations in their games as well particularly in the last year or so with regard to BOD & Darcy.

[The Great Aukster]

It has been obvious for some time that Ireland needed a successor to BOD. What I don't understand is why if Earls is such a world class 13 he wasn't playing there for Munster? Were Munster doing the pre-Enfield 'Munster first, second and third and maybe Ireland fourth'? McGahan, Penney and Foley have not seen him as the unquestionable 13 in their teams, neither did Kidney - were they all wrong?

Ireland could do with someone creating havoc in midfield, let's hope Schmidt is the sort of coach who finally gets that out of Earls.

[Sin é]

It has been obvious for some time that Ireland needed a successor to BOD. What I don't understand is why if Earls is such a world class 13 he wasn't playing there for Munster? Were Munster doing the pre-Enfield 'Munster first, second and third and maybe Ireland fourth'? McGahan, Penney and Foley have not seen him as the unquestionable 13 in their teams, neither did Kidney - were they all wrong?

Ireland could do with someone creating havoc in midfield, let's hope Schmidt is the sort of coach who finally gets that out of Earls.

eh, if you read my post above, you would know that both McGahan & Penney both selected Earls at 13 (Jean de Villiers and Casey Laulala both being benched with him starting 13) which was really odd since he was generally playing on the wing for Ireland (with BOD in residence).

What changed at Munster was that Doug Howlett got injured so Earls was moved to the right wing and Casey Laulala was put at centre which was around the time that BOD was out for a season and Earls ended up playing centre for Ireland.

Casey Laulala has 10 AB caps and Jean de Villiers 100+ caps for the Boks - credit where where is due - its some achievement to have been picked in the centre ahead of those two and Penney would have known Laulala pretty well as he was his coach back in NZ.

Edit: I think Earls was on the wing once for McGahan up to a few games before the 2011 World Cup when he was probably asked by Kidney to give him a few games on the wing.

[The Great Aukster]

Centre is a very influential position in the team, certainly more so than wing, so why would successive Munster coaches move their best 13 from the more influential position to the lesser?

[Guest]

The questions of Earls distribution skills, his awareness of those around him and his mental strength still remain, I think. I didn't see all that much of Earls last season, but what I did see was fairly impressive, although still not enough to convince me that he has it in him to make it as a centre for Ireland. That won't happen until he proves that he can by playing for Ireland.
Like Payne, Earls has to prove his worth. I had serious doubts that Payne could make it at centre and he proved my doubts wrong, so there's still a chance that Schmidt will have sprinkled his magic dust over Earls and made him the centre that many doubt he can be. He gets his chance to prove his doubters wrong in an hour. I honestly hope he does.

I'm really looking forward to seeing how Ryan and Henderson perform together. I'm not expecting great things from our back line but still think we should edge it to win by a score.

[wales606]

MATCH THREAD

https://www.606v2.com/t60047-wales-vs-ireland-match-thread#3105809

[Sin é]

Centre is a very influential position in the team, certainly more so than wing, so why would successive Munster coaches move their best 13 from the more influential position to the lesser?

To get all your best players on the pitch (though, with McGahan, Earls only played a few games on the wing coming up to the world cup).

Laulala was a Poopie winger. He could only play at 13. Think of Isa Nacewa. He got European Player of the Year at fullback for Leinster and when Kearney came back he was moved to the wing to facilitate Kearney.

[Cloggie]

Just to be correct, Sin é, Isa Nacewa never actually got European player of the year... He was shortlisted in 2011 but lost out to Sean O'Brien. The year after, Rob Kearney got it.

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