QF3: Ireland v Argentina, 18 October

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IRELAND v ARGENTINA

18 October 2015
KO: 13:00 BST (UTC+01)
Millennium Stadium, Cardiff

Live on [tbc]

Ref: Jerome Garcès (France)
ARs: Romain Poite (France)and Chris Pollock (NZ)
TMO: George Ayoub (Australia)

A. Head to Head

15 Played 15
10 Won 5
0 Drawn 0
5 Lost 15
331 Points 283

B. Recent Form

14 June 2014
Estadio Monumental José Fierro, Tucumán
17 – 23 to Ireland

7 June 2014
Estadio Centenario, Resistencia
17 – 29 to Ireland

24 November 2012
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
46 – 24 to Ireland

28 November 2010
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
29 – 9 to Ireland

22 November 2008
Croke Park, Dublin
17 – 3 to Ireland

30 September 2007
Parc des Princes, Paris, France
30 – 15 to Argentina

2 June 2007
Estadio José Amalfitani, Buenos Aires
16 – 0 to Argentina

C. TEAMS:

IRELAND


15. Rob Kearney (UCD/Leinster)
14. Tommy Bowe (Belfast Harlequins/Ulster)
13. Keith Earls (Young Munster/Munster)
12. Robbie Henshaw (Buccaneers/Connacht)
11. Dave Kearney (Lansdowne/Leinster)
10. Johnny Sexton (St Mary's College/Leinster)
9. Conor Murray (Garryowen/Munster)
1. Cian Healy (Clontarf/Leinster)
2. Rory Best (Banbridge/Ulster)
3. Mike Ross (Clontarf/Leinster)
4. Devin Toner (Lansdowne/Leinster)
5. Iain Henderson (Ballynahinch/Ulster)
6. Jordi Murphy (Lansdowne/Leinster)
7. Chris Henry (Malone/Ulster)
8. Jamie Heaslip (Dublin University/Leinster) captain

Replacements;
16. Richardt Strauss (Old Wesley/Leinster)
17. Jack McGrath (St Mary's College/Leinster)
18. Nathan White (Connacht)
19. Donnacha Ryan (Shannon/Munster)
20. Rhys Ruddock (St Mary's College/Leinster)
21. Eoin Reddan (Old Crescent/Leinster)
22. Ian Madigan (Blackrock/Leinster)
23. Luke Fitzgerald (Blackrock/Leinster)

ARGENTINA


15. Joaquin Tuculet
14. Santiago Cordero
13. Matías Moroni
12. Juan Martín Hernández
11. Juan Imhoff
10. Nicolás Sánchez
9. Martín Landajo
1. Marcos Ayerza
2. Agustín Creevy (c)
3. Ramiro Herrera
4. Guido Petti
5. Tomás Lavanini
6. Pablo Matera
7. Juan Martín Fernández Lobbe
8. Leonardo Senatore

Replacements:
16. Julián Montoya
17. Lucas Noguera
18. Juan Pablo Orlandi
19. Matías Alemanno
20. Facundo Isa
21. Tomás Cubelli
22. Jerónimo De La Fuente
23. Lucas González Amorosino

Exiled Gael wrote:Awk lads, that game fairly sobered me and my mates up. Gutted. The Argentinians did a real number on Schmidt and Kiss unfortunately. Madigan, Earls and Kearney all exposed. The pack ran themselves into the ground, Henry and Best went all day and didn't disgrace themselves. Totally exposed out wide by the Argentinians. Brilliantly coached and executed.

Well said. Ireland just came up against a wide with real belief, in top form and with a gameplan to suit. I don't think Ireland lost - Argentina won if you see what I mean.

Not kicking the ball much stopped Ireland winning the aerial battle, moving the ball wide asked questions of ireland that few other have done and speed to the breakdown was a lesson for all.

It takes two sides to make a cracking game and this was a cracker

Three of the tries were due to the Kearney brothers inability to tackle. Both of them were at fault for all three tries...unbelievably bad.

Only team to beat a SH team in the world cup so far is Japan... And they're basically a SANZAAJR side, right?

BamBam wrote:Memo to the Welsh

England and English players don't have to be brought into everything

Except it was to congat Heaslip on his class and courage with a direct comparison,

Memo to Bambam

I am from London, and English as much Welsh, but am a Welsh rugby fan, try to view things as they are instead of getting offended for no reason

Looks like some emotions are going to flow over here from certain posters.

Even as gutted as I am for Ireland going out, cant pay Argentina enough credit and I really did enjoy that match and the skills on hand from Argentina

ME-109 wrote:Three of the tries were due to the Kearney brothers inability to tackle. Both of them were at fault for all three tries...unbelievably bad.

They were, as was Madigan.

ME-109 wrote:Three of the tries were due to the Kearney brothers inability to tackle. Both of them were at fault for all three tries...unbelievably bad.

They weren't good at all, but boy did they had a lot of work to do. Think a little harder, there was another player close to them that put them under a lot of pressure...

Munchkin wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

eirebilly wrote:blah blah .

blah blah blah:

blah blah blah ..

waffle piffle mutter

mutter grumble groan

oh, and .....

guys - take a breath and calm down a bit - I think you are all taking too much out of the others remarks. Take a chill pill, have a glass of something nice and salute a good Argentinian team

Seemed like people were queueing up to deliver one of the cliches of the tournament - 'Argentina are better than you think lads!!' - and jumping on any positive Irish confidence to hammer home the point.

Well, an RC SH team

Except for two bits of individual effort from Luke Fitz it was clueless enough.

eirebilly wrote:Looks like some emotions are going to flow over here from certain posters.

Even as gutted as I am for Ireland going out, cant pay Argentina enough credit and I really did enjoy that match and the skills on hand from Argentina

I'm gutted, but not allowing my emotions to cloud my reason. My remarks about Radge are spot on.


Argentina are certainly a much improved side. Love how the play the game now, and certainly in with a shout of making the final, I would think.

Leaderless, rudderless, clueless really.

Suffering an intense game last week can be no excuse.  If you can't put in two energy deep games back to back then you really don't deserve to be at a World Cup.  Lots of serious rethinking to be done in Ireland - particularly in this shabby idea that offloading is too risky.  The guys can't even attempt it at this stage it's so rusty a skill set.

Congratulations to Argentina - blew us out of the water.

Joe nailed on for four years ...and let's get this f**king thing right, for once.

So far, the only Northern hemisphere side to beat a Rugby Championship side in this year's tournament is Japan.

Notch wrote:

JmD wrote:And another try on that wing. We have been well and truly exposed. Earls and Kearney just not good enough at this level. Ireland need to go back to the drawing board when the 6N comes around.

That won't matter. We could win a Grand Slam with this game plan and these players. But when it comes to taking on the Rugby Championship sides in a full competitive game, the level of rugby played in a Six Nations is as big as the gulf between the Pro12 and the Six Nations. We will simply never play a team this fast, skilful and accurate in the Six Nations. Six Nations is B-standard rugby in the international game.

Thats the thing - we haven't been able to win a grandslam with these players or gameplan.

Well another classic world cup game from Ireland!


Time for Schmidt to have a good long rethink.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

ME-109 wrote:Three of the tries were due to the Kearney brothers inability to tackle. Both of them were at fault for all three tries...unbelievably bad.

They weren't good at all, but boy did they had a lot of work to do. Think a little harder, there was another player close to them that put them under a lot of pressure...

Maybe but for all three of those tries there were straight up tackles...

TJ wrote:

Munchkin wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

eirebilly wrote:blah blah .

blah blah blah:

blah blah blah ..

waffle piffle mutter

mutter grumble groan

oh, and .....

guys - take a breath and calm down a bit - I think you are all taking too much out of the others remarks.  Take a chill pill, have a glass of something nice and salute a good Argentinian team

If it were merely an offhand comment with no history then it wouldn't have wound anyone up, but there were a few silly remarks made by Radge earlier in the week where he tried to accuse the Irish posters of arrogantly dismissing Argentina and showing them no respect. I had a bad feeling he would try and squeeze it in if we lost this game.

For the guy who claimed we had no respect for Argentina, he shown a total lack of it today. It is disappointing. Maybe that comes across as an overreaction, but when you have just lost the game it isn't nice to see such a needless dig, even if I did see it coming.

LondonTiger wrote:Even what was in the end a big win can hinge on tiny moments. Two spring to mind:

1) Garces and Ayoub deciding that the ruck clearout by the Argentina TH did not warrant his second YC

2) Madigan missing the chance to draw Ireland level.


Either of those go the other way and Ireland probably win.

3. Argentina scoring 20 point in the first 15 mins

4. Argentina scoring 20 points in the last 15 mins.

RDW_Scotland wrote:Could have been so much more for Ireland - even taking away the ref bottling the red card call Ireland has enough ball and enough chances to win that - just too many mistakes and bad decisions

Red card for what, the Irish didnt deserve a red card.

Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

ME-109 wrote:Three of the tries were due to the Kearney brothers inability to tackle. Both of them were at fault for all three tries...unbelievably bad.

Ah come on now... it was Dave's inability to position himself in defence and Rob's inability to tackle!

Exiled Gael wrote:Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

Good post.

What's really crazy is that half of this Argentine side played in the Vodacom Cup as the Pampas Two years ago. That's third tier District rugby in South Africa.

Went unbeaten though, and weren't actually challenged the whole tournament, but still.

Munchkin wrote:

eirebilly wrote:Looks like some emotions are going to flow over here from certain posters.

Even as gutted as I am for Ireland going out, cant pay Argentina enough credit and I really did enjoy that match and the skills on hand from Argentina

I'm gutted, but not allowing my emotions to cloud my reason. My remarks about Radge are spot on.


Argentina are certainly a much improved side. Love how the play the game now, and certainly in with a shout of making the final, I would think.

Listening the radio and watching the game on tv, I felt the media gave a total lack of respect to Argentina who for me, along with New Zealand, have looked the two best teams in the tournament so far. Australia have looked good against England and Wales in the last two weeks.

The bad thing for the northern hemisphere teams is that Argentina are only going to get stronger being in the Rugby Championship and having a Super Rugby franchise on the way.

I think it is time European rugby took a look at itself and maybe introduce a Super Rugby/ NFL style tournament?

We can't tackle because our supposed high grade conditioning and strength people only gives us one Big Game a tournament.

It's a laugh.  

In our first few games we were well off the levels required to be coming into a World Cup at.  That went on and on - was partially responsible for some of our important injuries and told the tale today... being bounced around like ragdolls...and run around like old men.  

And still we persist in a massive physical game that we just don't have the players to service.

Munchkin wrote:

Exiled Gael wrote:Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

Good post.

Wrong....we lost because Argentina have a better game than us. Also when did we try to offload....maybe in the last five minutes but that was it.

Exiled Gael wrote:Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

We didn't have the players to change it at halftime to be honest. Fitzgerald was already on for the injured Bowe. Only other option would have been to bring Jackson on and push Madigan and Henshaw out one. Would that have been better? I doubt it.

We do need to look at a bit of a shake up in this Irish contingent. There are a few young bright prospects who need brought in to both pressurise the senior players and also potentially take the jerseys themselves. McCloskey, Olding, Ringrose, Van der Flier etc. Gilroy needs to come in as well. There are a lot of players to be excited about, and some of them have the cutting edge we need.

Cracking game Argies worth the win but with O'Brien and O' Mahoney you' d suspect it would have been different.

JmD wrote:

ME-109 wrote:Three of the tries were due to the Kearney brothers inability to tackle. Both of them were at fault for all three tries...unbelievably bad.

Ah come on now... it was Dave's inability to position himself in defence and Rob's inability to tackle!

Ireland back three coming in for a lot of criticism here, but the wide channel defence issues were not solely their fault. For ARG's second last try, for instance, the root of the problem was that there were five Ireland forwards defending the blindside even though there were no Argentinians opposite them. Hence Ireland outside centre and wing had to defend against five Argentinians!

Exiled Gael wrote:Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

I'm right, I'm not wrong. I'm right. I said when we try it it's laughable in its tentativeness and edginess. You always expect a drop or a fluff because it's rushed rather than natural. Why? Because we have turned our backs on it for two solid years...

I think you finally arrived at the curve Fly

Exiled Gael wrote:Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

And how could they have sorted that one at half time? Bring on Eoin Reddan and put him on the wing?

The big problem was that Zebo should have been on the left wing, not D Kearney who is just too slow to deal with Argentina's pacy wingers.

I imagine the plan was to bring Luke Fitz on for Earls at 50 mins. as he has had a very heavy workload having started all 5 world cup games.

Thanks Ruby. You were waiting for that moment all week Well dropped.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

Exiled Gael wrote:Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

We didn't have the players to change it at halftime to be honest. Fitzgerald was already on for the injured Bowe. Only other option would have been to bring Jackson on and push Madigan and Henshaw out one. Would that have been better? I doubt it.

We do need to look at a bit of a shake up in this Irish contingent. There are a few young bright prospects who need brought in to both pressurise the senior players and also potentially take the jerseys themselves. McCloskey, Olding, Ringrose, Van der Flier etc. Gilroy needs to come in as well. There are a lot of players to be excited about, and some of them have the cutting edge we need.

Yup, I'm with you. You can't throw the baby out with the bath water as people will after this defeat and try and bin everyone 28 and older. But our backline was extremely green and were rudderless. That has nothing to do with the coaches and gameplan. It's players with a lack of experience who can't draw on occasions when they have had to change things themselves on the pitch. The backs were looking around the. For someone to give them instructions and there wasn't anyone there to do it. Murray tried to stand up and take control but there was a limit to what he could do. We ask need a genuine backup 10- Madigan just hadn't got it for the highest level matches. We need leadership in the centres. Would Payne have made any difference? Doubtful. Kearney is a hard working player and credit to him. But he isn't good enough for these sorts of matches. We just don't currently have the real depth when we miss four or five key players.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

Exiled Gael wrote:Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

We didn't have the players to change it at halftime to be honest. Fitzgerald was already on for the injured Bowe. Only other option would have been to bring Jackson on and push Madigan and Henshaw out one. Would that have been better? I doubt it.

We do need to look at a bit of a shake up in this Irish contingent. There are a few young bright prospects who need brought in to both pressurise the senior players and also potentially take the jerseys themselves. McCloskey, Olding, Ringrose, Van der Flier etc. Gilroy needs to come in as well. There are a lot of players to be excited about, and some of them have the cutting edge we need.

Joe has succeeded in killing Zebo's spark, so I doubt if any of those will manage any better than him.

Right. Well then. Ahhh. Flip

Well played argentina.

Looking forward, who do we see coming into the squad for the 6 national s?
For me I want to see McCloskey, Healy, marimon

Commiserations guys.

If we somehow manage to beat Scotland in this last QF, it would have been nice going for the RWC "Super Grand Slam" against Ireland next weekend.

But alas... it was not to be. You've now gone and ruined that possibility.

Sin é wrote:

Exiled Gael wrote:Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

And how could they have sorted that one at half time? Bring on Eoin Reddan and put him on the wing?

The big problem was that Zebo should have been on the left wing, not D Kearney who is just too slow to deal with Argentina's pacy wingers.

I imagine the plan was to bring Luke Fitz on for Earls at 50 mins. as he has had a very heavy workload having started all 5 world cup games.

Try and not make this a Munster thing for once even when it goes against every bone in your body. Zebo wouldn't have made a lick of difference, not a lick. Our wingers and 13 were exposed by sheer weight of numbers time and time again.

The coaches could easily have changed it at halftime- it doesn't require a change of personnel. We have seen Kiss and Schmidt sort out passive defences at halftime by ensuring greater line speed. They could have ensured that we didn't try and defend so narrow and fan out more. Simple. They didn't do it. It was a coaching mistake.

What young forwards are there who are showing promise?

Exiled Gael wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

Exiled Gael wrote:Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

We didn't have the players to change it at halftime to be honest. Fitzgerald was already on for the injured Bowe. Only other option would have been to bring Jackson on and push Madigan and Henshaw out one. Would that have been better? I doubt it.

We do need to look at a bit of a shake up in this Irish contingent. There are a few young bright prospects who need brought in to both pressurise the senior players and also potentially take the jerseys themselves. McCloskey, Olding, Ringrose, Van der Flier etc. Gilroy needs to come in as well. There are a lot of players to be excited about, and some of them have the cutting edge we need.

Yup, I'm with you. You can't throw the baby out with the bath water as people will after this defeat and try and bin everyone 28 and older. But our backline was extremely green and were rudderless. That has nothing to do with the coaches and gameplan. It's players with a lack of experience who can't draw on occasions when they have had to change things themselves on the pitch. The backs were looking around the. For someone to give them instructions and there wasn't anyone there to do it. Murray tried to stand up and take control but there was a limit to what he could do. We ask need a genuine backup 10- Madigan just hadn't got it for the highest level matches. We need leadership in the centres. Would Payne have made any difference? Doubtful. Kearney is a hard working player and credit to him. But he isn't good enough for these sorts of matches. We just don't currently have the real depth when we miss four or five key players.

Zebo was sitting in the stands. Andrew Trimble on his couch in Belfast.

Argentina just seemed stronger from 1-15 especially in the contact area. Because of their reputation as strong scrummagers people often ignore the power skill and subtlety they have behind. They are a complete team as they showed v NZ a few weeks ago. Ireland were corouageous with that comeback but when Argentina regained their structure and composure they were just too powerful and took their try's well.

Exiled Gael wrote:

Sin é wrote:

Exiled Gael wrote:Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

And how could they have sorted that one at half time? Bring on Eoin Reddan and put him on the wing?

The big problem was that Zebo should have been on the left wing, not D Kearney who is just too slow to deal with Argentina's pacy wingers.

I imagine the plan was to bring Luke Fitz on for Earls at 50 mins. as he has had a very heavy workload having started all 5 world cup games.

Try and not make this a Munster thing for once even when it goes against every bone in your body. Zebo wouldn't have made a lick of difference, not a lick. Our wingers and 13 were exposed by sheer weight of numbers time and time again.

The coaches could easily have changed it at halftime- it doesn't require a change of personnel. We have seen Kiss and Schmidt sort out passive defences at halftime by ensuring greater line speed. They could have ensured that we didn't try and defend so narrow and fan out more. Simple. They didn't do it. It was a coaching mistake.

I get it, you don't like Munster players, but at least Zebo has pace and big game mentality. We badly missed O'Mahony (unfortunately another Munster player) for his defence in the wider channels. Jordi Murphy just too inexperienced at this level.

RubyGuby wrote:Argentina just seemed stronger from 1-15 especially in the contact area. Because of their reputation as strong scrummagers people often ignore the power skill and subtlety they have behind. They are a complete team as they showed v NZ a few weeks ago. Ireland were corouageous with that comeback but when Argentina regained their structure and composure they were just too powerful and took their try's well.

In the past, Argentina would have lost control and imploded under the early Irish pressure in the second half. What made me stand up was their composure when under pressure, this has come from playing against the SANZAR teams on a regular basis.

Gutted but not grumpy as Argentina showed all the skill and composure required to win such big matches, well done to them.

TJ wrote:

Munchkin wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

eirebilly wrote:blah blah .

blah blah blah:

blah blah blah ..

waffle piffle mutter

mutter grumble groan

oh, and .....

guys - take a breath and calm down a bit - I think you are all taking too much out of the others remarks.  Take a chill pill, have a glass of something nice and salute a good Argentinian team

I was simply replying to Radge trolling, and I was for leaving it at that. As I will.

I'm gutted and grumpy. We should all be grumpy. Argentina proved the gulf between the hemispheres is as wide as ever. Even just playing alongside the others has allowed them to become (at least) the fourth best team in the world within a few seasons. As top tier rugby nation, we are in trouble. The six nations need to improve massively, and provide decent competition for one another. Hopefully France finally appoint a half competant coach this time around.

Sin é wrote:

Exiled Gael wrote:

Sin é wrote:

Exiled Gael wrote:Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

And how could they have sorted that one at half time? Bring on Eoin Reddan and put him on the wing?

The big problem was that Zebo should have been on the left wing, not D Kearney who is just too slow to deal with Argentina's pacy wingers.

I imagine the plan was to bring Luke Fitz on for Earls at 50 mins. as he has had a very heavy workload having started all 5 world cup games.

Try and not make this a Munster thing for once even when it goes against every bone in your body. Zebo wouldn't have made a lick of difference, not a lick. Our wingers and 13 were exposed by sheer weight of numbers time and time again.

The coaches could easily have changed it at halftime- it doesn't require a change of personnel. We have seen Kiss and Schmidt sort out passive defences at halftime by ensuring greater line speed. They could have ensured that we didn't try and defend so narrow and fan out more. Simple. They didn't do it. It was a coaching mistake.

I get it, you don't like Munster players, but at least Zebo has pace and big game mentality. We badly missed O'Mahony (unfortunately another Munster player) for his defence in the wider channels. Jordi Murphy just too inexperienced at this level.

Pathetic moronic garbage. Of course I like Munster players. I just don't bring Munster into every post. I'm not queuing up to put the boot into players and coaches because I'm not a bitter, twisted small minded person who takes pleasure in our defeat just so I can say something about Munster players not selected or something about Kidney. You're not a credible poster and not a credible person. You don't see it, people laugh at you here because you are a parody of a fan. Schmidt putting out Zebo's spark? What a pile of horse excrement.

We massively missed POM, of course we do. He is an excellent defender out wide and is a pack leader.

Zebo is not good enough at this level. Kearney has outperformed him in green.

Trimble wasn't fit enough to be in the squad.

Exiled Gael wrote:

Sin é wrote:

Exiled Gael wrote:

Sin é wrote:

Exiled Gael wrote:Lads, over the top hyperbole. Why did we lose? Two reasons- the Argentinians spotted we were weak from 13 to the wing channels and exposed us brilliantly. A big problem is the coaches didn't change it at half time and the players in the backline didn't have the experience and leadership to change it on the pitch.

Second issue, we weren't accurate. Fly, you are wrong- we tried to offload but we were horribly inaccurate. The Argentinians made practically everything stick. They made good choice, we made bad choices. Three things happens. No point in going over the top in an emotional blame game.

And how could they have sorted that one at half time? Bring on Eoin Reddan and put him on the wing?

The big problem was that Zebo should have been on the left wing, not D Kearney who is just too slow to deal with Argentina's pacy wingers.

I imagine the plan was to bring Luke Fitz on for Earls at 50 mins. as he has had a very heavy workload having started all 5 world cup games.

Try and not make this a Munster thing for once even when it goes against every bone in your body. Zebo wouldn't have made a lick of difference, not a lick. Our wingers and 13 were exposed by sheer weight of numbers time and time again.

The coaches could easily have changed it at halftime- it doesn't require a change of personnel. We have seen Kiss and Schmidt sort out passive defences at halftime by ensuring greater line speed. They could have ensured that we didn't try and defend so narrow and fan out more. Simple. They didn't do it. It was a coaching mistake.

I get it, you don't like Munster players, but at least Zebo has pace and big game mentality. We badly missed O'Mahony (unfortunately another Munster player) for his defence in the wider channels. Jordi Murphy just too inexperienced at this level.

Pathetic moronic garbage. Of course I like Munster players. I just don't bring Munster into every post. I'm not queuing up to put the boot into players and coaches because I'm not a bitter, twisted small minded person who takes pleasure in our defeat just so I can say something about Munster players not selected or something about Kidney. You're not a credible poster and not a credible person. You don't see it, people laugh at you here because you are a parody of a fan. Schmidt putting out Zebo's spark? What a pile of horse excrement.

We massively missed POM, of course we do. He is an excellent defender out wide and is a pack leader.

Zebo is not good enough at this level. Kearney has outperformed him in green.

Trimble wasn't fit enough to be in the squad.

He really did today....9 tackles of which he missed five...

I presume that makes you a credible poster then...

Anyone happen to know what odds you would have got pre-RWC on Scotland being the last NH nation standing (however briefly it may be)?

Oh excellent, the Munster twosome. You must be delighted we lost today. It'll keep you going for a day or two.

Kearney has outperformed Zebo in green and thus was picked today. Had a terrible game today unfortunately. Try and use some intelligence if you can find some. You never know, you might even like it.