Glasgow and Edinburgh: Ongoing Banter Thread XII - Twelve Monkeys

[A Simply Mesmeric Try]

First topic message reminder :

A Brief History of Time-Wasting


https://www.606v2.com/t48240-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread
https://www.606v2.com/t51313-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-ii
https://www.606v2.com/t53119-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-iii
https://www.606v2.com/t54519-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-iv
https://www.606v2.com/t55409-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-v-the-fun-continues
https://www.606v2.com/t56913-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-vi-banter-boogaloo
https://www.606v2.com/t57946-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-vii
https://www.606v2.com/t58659-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-viii
https://www.606v2.com/t59409-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-ix
https://www.606v2.com/t60764-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-x-rated
https://www.606v2.com/t61904-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-xi-the-undiscovered-country

Edinburgh

1872 Champions

Edinburgh's Fixtures & Results (click to show):

Glasgow

1872 Runners-up

Glasgow Warrior's Fixtures & Results (click to show):

Ladies and Gents, Girls and Boys, it's season finale!

Guinness PRO12 Play Offs
Fri 20 May 19:45 - Semi Final
Leinster Rugby 30 - 18   Ulster Rugby - RDS Arena 19,100

Sat 21 May 18:30 - Semi Final
Connacht Rugby  16 - 11   Glasgow Warriors - Galway Sportsground 7,800

Sat 28 May 17:30 - Grand Final
Leinster Rugby  10 - 20  Connacht Rugby  - BT Murrayfield - 34,550

Cinderella story or what?! Congrats to the Galway posse who were the form team of the season!

[Nematode]

The big problem that everyone seems to have missed is that AS's style of play doesn't actually create much atmosphere so there is not much benefit of playing away in a smaller ground to increase the 'atmosphere'.

A typical Edinburgh match goes like this:

0 mins - "Good side, will probably do well tonight. Some exciting, attacking talent in Hoyland, Brown, Allen, Burleigh, SHC - should be some tries".

40 mins - Edinburgh smashed on the scoreboard like a hippo sitting on a deck chair. Ugly.

47 mins - A scrum penalty. Yay!!

59 mins - Another scrum penalty. Great...

63 mins - A rolling maul and penalty for sticks... yawn.

64 mins - Our saviour, the one who commands a crown not a bench, John Andress, comes on - we're in the money here! Oh wait. We're not.

65 mins - Andress penalised.

71 mins - Oh hang on - a good break! You're as excited as Attenborough spotting a panda (sorry, not too up on endangered species...) - and it's knocked on...

77 mins - Finally you wake from your snoooooze to the soothing notes of a wild Hugh Dan's voice echoing around the vast emptiness, reading his favourite book in Gaelic - "Shinty defeats the world" - as nobody would tell the difference, with a few "penas!" and "oooch"'s thrown in to disguise it.

[EWT Spoons]

Interesting that it was Watson's idea. Wonder how much Edinburgh are paying, or if Watson's proposed it maybe there is no cost other than some minor upkeep payments.

Anyway, will be interesting to see how it pans out.

[RDW]

I think Edinburgh have around 2000 ST holders, so at a bare minimum you'd need at least 2000 covered seats. Who would buy a ST to stand on a muddy hill in the rain?

But to allow for medium term growth that figure really needs to be around 3000  which would allow non-ST holders the chance of a covered seat - who would want to spend 20 quid standing on a muddy hill in the rain?

Whether that venue can accommodate 3000 covered seats I don't know.

HS is right in that we can't just take a short term view on this, with probably the next 5 years in mind. Edinburgh need to decide where they want to be on 5 years time in terms of STs and attendance and make sure the venue can cope with that.

[funnyExiledScot]

I think Edinburgh have around 2000 ST holders, so at a bare minimum you'd need at least 2000 covered seats. Who would buy a ST to stand on a muddy hill in the rain?

But to allow for medium term growth that figure really needs to be around 3000  which would allow non-ST holders the chance of a covered seat - who would want to spend 20 quid standing on a muddy hill in the rain?

Whether that venue can accommodate 3000 covered seats I don't know.

HS is right in that we can't just take a short term view on this, with probably the next 5 years in mind. Edinburgh need to decide where they want to be on 5 years time in terms of STs and attendance and make sure the venue can cope with that.

Agree on the long term view. The whole point is to build a home for the rugby team that is future proof, and this isn't it. I predict smaller crowds due to the location and size of stadium, which is a massive and ill-thought through compromise for a bit of atmosphere.

As Nematode points out, it's not like small stadium = atmosphere anyway. The way Edinburgh are playing rugby you could have them play in front of a full house at the Millenium and you'd still hear a pin drop, at least until they start chasing the game with 20 minutes to go and play some rugby.

[EWT Spoons]

The location isn't that bad, it's pretty easy to get there from town, not as easy as Murrayfield obviously, but easy enough.

Let's see how it pans out before we write it off.

I agree on the small stadium atmosphere point, it was the same at meggetland, but Solly is done at the end of next season (I really hope sooner), so by the time we officially move there full time, we hopefully will have a new coach who plays a more attacking game.

[jimbopip]

Listen well, oh my Luvvie brethren. It's deja vu all over again.

You've got a stadium that's totally unsuitable.
You've got a coach who has given you some steel and made you hard(er) to beat.
You can't see any way things will change.

This is what we more sophisticated rugby types in the west call , "The Toonie Moment".

Here's the blue print;
get a stadium, small enough that you can fill it, bland enough that you can stamp your identity on it
recruit a young hungry coach with a vision of how to play and the work ethic to set up the systems which will allow that to happen
reach out to your supporters, make them feel a genuine affection for the club (anyone who utters love sacks like, "I won't be renewing my season ticket if I have to walk further than the end of my road" can go fecc themselves)
Work hard
Develop a culture of honesty and integrity
Work hard

Oh yes, look on e-bay for a Magic Tombola.
Did I mention, Work Hard?

[TheMildlyFranticLlama]

I haven't been to Myreside in a very long time, isn't it pretty... how shall I put it.... ramshackle? Surely it would involve some pretty serious investment to get it to pro rugby standards? Are the SRU helping fund the improvements? Bit of a gamble for a trial run surely.

Out of interest what is the benefit to Myreside over Meggetland?

[RDW]

Meggetland was recently developed to a high standard but it is too small - 3300 capacity or something - with zero room for expansion on all 4 sides.

[funnyExiledScot]

The only thing I will say in favour of this decision is that we've been going round in circles on this for ages, and at least we now have a concrete proposal to move forward with. I suppose if it completely crashes and burns, we can always return to Murrayfield until another solution presents itself. I suspect the blazeratti felt they had to do something rather than continue to do nothing, and they saw Myreside as the least bad option (rightly or wrongly).

Time will tell. The next priority is to fix the coaching and find something else for Solomons to do.

[nickj]

On a slightly different note. Does anyone know if Alba or even BBC Sport Online will be showing the U20's next month? Sky seem to be the official broadcasters, but is it likely they will show any of the Scots games? I'm really keen to see how the likes of Fagerson, Cummings, Hastings, Ritchie, Smith, Nairn and Kinghorn get on http://www.worldrugby.org/u20/tournament-info/watch

[Tattie Scones RRN]

Serious question here, but if Bristol failed to win promotion again, would Andy Robinson be a viable option to come back?

[Hazel Sapling]

TS, would be a good candidate but I would prefer someone internal to step up if they are ready.

Did anyone see on FB that the Roddy Grant award for excellence in training went to Grant Shiells? If he was so good in training why did he barely see the pitch and get released?

[EWT Spoons]

TS, would be a good candidate but I would prefer someone internal to step up if they are ready.

Did anyone see on FB that the Roddy Grant award for excellence in training went to Grant Shiells? If he was so good in training why did he barely see the pitch and get released?

Alan Solomons. Think that covers it

[funnyExiledScot]

Perhaps the award was for training tirelessly with no reward of gametime whatsoever!

Either that or it's equivalent to the Al Kellock Leadership Award: ironic.

[IanBru]

Sean 'Fabulous Hudson Hornet' Lamont has signed for Glasgow for another year.

http://www.glasgowwarriors.org/news/16/05/11/lamont-signs-new-glasgow-deal

Yay.

[BigGee]

Yes the venerable Sean has signed on the line for one more year, I guess we all knew it was coming. Anyway you can't help but be pleased for the old ones. They really are going to have to drag him kicking and screaming into retirement!

Hopefully some sort of transitioning will be taking place as well, there was talk of a career in S&C for him post rugby. Much as he does not want it, surely this is going to be his last year.

[funnyExiledScot]

Typical Weegie sentimentality.

Will he still be the fastest player in the Glasgow squad at the age of 36? That's the question I want answering.

[Hazel Sapling]

Lamont is still a decent winger and is a great role model for the younger players. He is slowing up a bit but he has a role and, if Scotland finally move on, he will be good for Glasgow during the international periods.

[George Carlin]

Sean 'Fabulous Hudson Hornet' Lamont has signed for Glasgow for another year.

http://www.glasgowwarriors.org/news/16/05/11/lamont-signs-new-glasgow-deal

Yay.

"Secured" for another year. Fewf. Because I'm sure that Toulon and Sarries were circling ravenously.

Or perhaps they mean it in the same way as one "secures" chlamydia.

[123456789]

Do you think he's become a bit of a running joke for Dodson, Townsend et al?

I've got a vision of Dodson's wife leaving on a Saturday morning to go on a shopping trip with her pals, she leaves behind a list for BT Mark to do. But he doesn't want to go to the supermarket, nor pick up the dry cleaning and he certainly does not want to clean the dishes. Instead he wants to spend the day on the BTsofa, watching BT Sport and trying to ignore Scott Johnson's persuasive phone calls to his BT telephone asking to become honorary life president of Scottish rugby on account of coming 3rd in the 2013 Six Nations, so Mark Dodson calls up a certain Sean Lamont and says "I've heard you're looking for a new contract", Sean replies that he wants a new contract more than James Haskell wants attention, so Mark tells Sean that if he pops round fairly soon and does Mrs Dodson's 'to-do list' Dodson will get the paperwork written up.

[jimbopip]

The Schlong's got longer. Been extended.

[RDW]

Anyone making it to one of the Myreside consultation evenings?

You can be the V2 representative and take a list of questions from all of us (not the weegies) with you!

[des]

When and where are they scheduled? I haven't received anything yet but would be interested in going. I always cycle to games so it makes almost no difference to me but there was a distinct lack of railings to lock by bike up to.

More railings please Mr Petrie.

[des]

Better beer than the pish the sell at Murrayfield too.

[des]

Scratch that RDW

EDINBURGH RUGBY OPEN EVENINGS
from: Edinburgh Rugby <Edinburgh.Rugby@communicatoremail.com>
to: des@something.com
date: 12 May 2016 at 10:33

And the content:

Dear Season Ticket Holder,

Following the exciting news about our proposed relocation to Myreside on a trial basis from January 2017 onwards, we'd like to invite you to come along to one of two consultation events taking place on the following dates:

Tuesday 17 May, 7pm, Rowan Suite,
BT Murrayfield

Monday 23 May, 7pm, Rowan Suite, BT Murrayfield

You will be extremely welcome at these events, where we'll try to answer as many of your questions as possible at this stage.  These events will form part of a wide-reaching consultation where supporters will be able to share their feedback and tell us what you expect from the facilities, travel, public transport, seating and other important topics.  If the trial relocation to Myreside is a success we'll look to secure a permanent move from the start of the 2017/18 season.

To register your attendance please complete this form via the link below.  If you have a particular question about the move, please feel free to send us your comments in advance, and we'll do our best to answer as many queries as possible during each event.

We look forward to welcoming you to BT Murrayfield and hope that you share our excitement and optimism for the growth of our club.

Best wishes,
Jonny Petrie and the team at Edinburgh Rugby

[Tattie Scones RRN]

Bennett picked for Rio.

Hopefully it'll give him a bit of a chance to regain those silky running skills.

[A Simply Mesmeric Try]

Bennett picked for Rio.

Hopefully it'll give him a bit of a chance to regain those silky running skills.

5 of our boys are in the extended 25 man squad  

Full Great Britain sevens mens squad:
Scotland (5)
Jamie Farndale, Gavin Lowe, Scott Riddell, Mark Robertson (all Scotland Sevens), Mark Bennett (Glasgow Warriors)

Wales (5)
Luke Morgan, Luke Treharne, Sam Cross (all Wales Sevens), Cory Allen (Cardiff Blues), James Davies (Scarlets)

England (15)
Dan Bibby, Tom Bowen, Phil Burgess,  Alex Davis, Richard de Carpentier, Alex Gray, Charlie Hayter, Warwick Lahmert, Ruaridh McConnochie, Tom Mitchell, Dan Norton, James Rodwell (all England Sevens), Joe Simpson (Wasps), Marcus Watson (Newcastle Falcons), Ollie Lindsay-Hague (Harlequins)

The final 12 man squad is announced in July.

[RDW]

Ian Morrison usually talks a load of crap, but he spells out Edinburgh's season well in this article. I have generally been a Solomons supporter but even I think he needs to go - Stevie Scott to take over and Roddy Grant brought in his place to develop as an assistant coach.

It is a tough, uncompromising and at times brutal business professional sport – just ask the six players recently released by Edinburgh Rugby. There is no place for vegetarians where the law of the jungle holds sway: you either eat or get eaten.

Unless, of course, you have someone to watch over you. Scott Johnson originally hired Alan Solomons and Murrayfield’s director of rugby gave him a second contract extension when he should have handed the reins of Edinburgh Rugby to Steve Scott or Duncan Hodge along with a two-season deadline to get the club into the Champions Cup. Both Scottish assistant coaches are time-served and deserve the opportunity to emulate what Gregor Townsend has done with Glasgow Warriors.

I unearthed an article online that bewailed the fact that Edinburgh had missed their top-six target (and the Champions Cup rugby it guarantees) but went on to say that their South African coach was to be given another season. It was dated one year ago.

At least at the end of season 
2014-15 Murrayfield had the decency to wait until May 2015 before offering Solomons an extension; this season he got the nod for 2016-17 last December when his Edinburgh team were lying fifth in the Pro12. Wind the tape forward to last weekend and Edinburgh end the season in ninth place. Why extend the coach’s contract before the season has played out?

Admittedly there is some merit in continuity, especially at a club that has got through eight coaches in the last decade, but we know the top dog can have a dramatic effect on the playing pack. Pat Lam at Connacht, Rob Baxter at Exeter, Gregor Townsend and Steve Diamond, who has taken Sale Sharks into the Champions Cup with the lowest budget in the Aviva Premiership, all prove as much. Solomons has steadied the ship but three years on the SS Edinburgh Rugby is not so much steady as stuck, caught fast at the wrong end of the Pro12 table.

The coaching staff talk of the massive progress the club have made in recent years but in truth the club’s advance has been measured in baby steps. Edinburgh, we are told, is much better than it was under former coach Michael Bradley but since SRU boss Mark Dodson dubbed the club a “basket case” at the end of that era it’s fair to say the bar wasn’t set stratospherically high.

Here are Edinburgh’s statistics over the past four seasons.

Year Pos Wins Pts Tries Tries Pts off

for against sixth

*2012/13 10th 7 36 3 51 18

2013/14 8th 7 38 38 55 17

2014/15 8th 10 48 41 48 9

2015/16 9th 11 56 41 36 9

* under Michael Bradley

The above table indicates some positives. Genuine progress has been made in defence with tries conceded dropping from 55 in Solomons’ first calamitous season to just 36 in the latest league campaign and Edinburgh are inching closer to that top-six finish. Solomons is a decent man and a hard working coach but that shouldn’t exclude him from hitting performance targets and Edinburgh are playing well within themselves.

The club is no longer a basket case but nor should they be. Murrayfield are a little coy about handing out figures but given the long list of Southern Hemisphere players, many with Super Rugby experience, that have been brought in I’d guesstimate the current playing budget to be approximately £1-1.5 million more than Bradley’s spend, which buys you plenty imported beef.

The Irishman left Edinburgh in March of 2013 and just four players from his final match day squad remain with Edinburgh – WP Nel, Hamish Watson, Tom Brown and Dougie Fife, who was released at the end of this season. This Edinburgh squad is one of Solomons’ making with a host of imported talent at his disposal including two thirds of the current Super Rugby Champions’ back row, John Hardie and Nasi Manu, plus team-mate Phil Burleigh (all Highlanders), Andries Stauss (Sharks, Cheetahs), Cornell du Preez (Kings), Anton Bresler (Sharks) and Mike Coman (Hurricanes, briefly).

After three seasons, countless imports and goodness knows how much money, Solomons’ team is one position higher in the Pro12 table than Bradley’s “basket case” and yet the South African merits another kick at the ball!

“It is disappointing and Alan shares that disappointment and frustration of where we have ended up at the end of the season,” said Edinburgh’s managing director John Petrie last week, although on rugby matter he dances to Johnson’s tune.

“There is a view, and I subscribe to it, that we have moved forward over the period that Alan has been here but so have all the other clubs in the Pro12 and that is where we need to work hard to make that step change, to really take ourselves up the top end of the league…Alan remains massively passionate about taking this club forward and I see him as the right person to do that next year.”

It’s the fault of those pesky rivals who keep improving, dagnabbit! But that is the very essence of professional sport. If the All Blacks stood still Scotland would beat them within a decade. Improvement is natural in professional sport, although less obvious right now in the lacklustre Pro12 which failed to supply a single Champions Cup quarter-finalist. Edinburgh’s rivals enjoy very mixed fortunes: for every club like Connacht that is on an upwards trajectory there is another such as Munster who are headed in the opposite direction.

When he arrived Solomons infamously threw the club’s conditioning coach under the bus after his first, hapless season in charge and more recently he has blamed indiscipline, injuries and even the match officials when Edinburgh lost to the Scarlets in Wales.

He may be running out of excuses but Solomons’ forensic brain is adept at uncovering mitigating circumstances to lay before the jury. The opposition are invariably talked up like they were All Blacks in disguise, while the emphasis is put on Edinburgh’s long injury list, and the only purpose it serves is to undermine the confidence of his own players who read this stuff.

You can argue about their overly conservative playing style, the lack of rotation or the fact that the academy players are less integrated than they could be but all that would count for nothing if Edinburgh were fulfilling their obvious potential because at their best they are pretty handy, as they proved in the 1872 Cup, the only team to beat Glasgow twice in the league (with the help of two home ties).

In those two matches Edinburgh were highly physical, focused and utterly uncompromising in their approach, out-muscling Glasgow at the breakdown and smothering them in defence. It was a powerful statement and proof, if any were needed, that Edinburgh can compete with the best.

And you don’t need to go that far back. In their last outing of the season against the Blues, Edinburgh displayed the best and the worst of themselves, racing into a ten-point lead before tamely rolling over; ruthless, physical and focused in the first half, disjointed, uninterested and rudderless in the second.

“I am bitterly disappointed,” Solomons said after that particular implosion, as are we all, with one, glaring exception.

[VinceWLB]

It is a well written article, Solomons needs to go. He wont have his mates Andress, Coman and Strauss around him next season.

[RDW]

His excuses do wear thin, but it is a difficult one because a lot of the time they are valid - the problem is he brings them out all the time. We have had bad luck with injuries and that home touch judge call that ultimately lost of the Scarlets game was shocking, but we should have been home and dry that game and more than 3 points ahead anyway.

There really are no more excuses next season though.

[VinceWLB]

No his excuses are NOT valid, every teams have an injury list and the weather is the same for both sides and every teams suffer from poor decisions throughout the season. I think he is a joke. He needs to go, Tim Visser reinvented himself when leaving Edinburgh and i suspect the same will happen to Matt Scott and Dougie Fife.

[RDW]

By valid I meant factually correct - i.e. we did have a lot of injuries etc but you're right - that's what every club has to deal with over the course of a season.

Every loss he trots out excuses other than it being his fault or his players' fault - he's very like Mourinho in that regard!

[George Carlin]

Once again - how he did depends entirely on what standards and ambitions you have for the club. Can anyone really say he's done well?

[TJ]

NOpe. Its been a disappointing season for Edinburgh. Failed to qualify for europe. Lost too many soft games, played most of the season without a 10. I think its time for Solly to go

[123456789]

I think Solomons is more Van Gaal than Mourinho, he seems to have spent quite a considerable amount of money to tread water and in doing so has lost quite a considerable amount of his club's soul.
Edinburgh had a group of young players, many coming from the city, and Solomons has systematically replaced them,or drove them out, with journeymen from the southern hemisphere. I'd say that Edinburgh could have a team with a good Scottish players and a few imports instead of team with a mercenarial core and a few Scottish players.

[RDW]

I think Solomons is more Van Gaal than Mourinho, he seems to have spent quite a considerable amount of money to tread water and in doing so has lost quite a considerable amount of his club's soul.
Edinburgh had a group of young players, many coming from the city, and Solomons has systematically replaced them,or drove them out, with journeymen from the southern hemisphere. I'd say that Edinburgh could have a team with a good Scottish players and a few imports instead of team with a mercenarial core and a few Scottish players.

I don't think that is entirely fair given the likes of Sutherland, Ritchie, Bradbury Hidalgo-Clyne, Kinghorn and Hoyland etc have had plenty gametime this season and will be key players next season.

A lot of those players only got their chance because of injuries and he had no other choice, but I'm sure he'll still claim credit!

[funnyExiledScot]

I think Solomons is more Van Gaal than Mourinho, he seems to have spent quite a considerable amount of money to tread water and in doing so has lost quite a considerable amount of his club's soul.
Edinburgh had a group of young players, many coming from the city, and Solomons has systematically replaced them,or drove them out, with journeymen from the southern hemisphere. I'd say that Edinburgh could have a team with a good Scottish players and a few imports instead of team with a mercenarial core and a few Scottish players.

I don't think that is entirely fair given the likes of Sutherland, Ritchie, Bradbury Hidalgo-Clyne, Kinghorn and Hoyland etc have had plenty gametime this season and will be key players next season.

A lot of those players only got their chance because of injuries and he had no other choice, but I'm sure he'll still claim credit!

Agreed - I don't actually think Solomons has been bad at bringing through young players at all. Sutherland, Toolis, Ritchie, Watson, Bradbury, SH-C, Dean and Hoyland have all come through under Solomons, and some have received quite a bit of backing from him.

Without talking too much about Wendyball, the Van Gaal vs Mourinho is also wrong as well. Mourinho is notorious for ignoring younger players and bringing in expensive imports, whereas whatever your views of Van Gaal this season, he has blooded a whole host of young talent (Borthwick-Jackson, Blackett, Martial, Memphis, Lingard, Rashford).

Solomons main failings are two-fold: failure to rotate and keep the squad fresh, and negative tactics which, in my view, don't suit the players we have available.

[EWT Spoons]

I think Solomons is more Van Gaal than Mourinho, he seems to have spent quite a considerable amount of money to tread water and in doing so has lost quite a considerable amount of his club's soul.
Edinburgh had a group of young players, many coming from the city, and Solomons has systematically replaced them,or drove them out, with journeymen from the southern hemisphere. I'd say that Edinburgh could have a team with a good Scottish players and a few imports instead of team with a mercenarial core and a few Scottish players.

I don't think that is entirely fair given the likes of Sutherland, Ritchie, Bradbury Hidalgo-Clyne, Kinghorn and Hoyland etc have had plenty gametime this season and will be key players next season.

A lot of those players only got their chance because of injuries and he had no other choice, but I'm sure he'll still claim credit!

Agreed - I don't actually think Solomons has been bad at bringing through young players at all. Sutherland, Toolis, Ritchie, Watson, Bradbury, SH-C, Dean and Hoyland have all come through under Solomons, and some have received quite a bit of backing from him.

Without talking too much about Wendyball, the Van Gaal vs Mourinho is also wrong as well. Mourinho is notorious for ignoring younger players and bringing in expensive imports, whereas whatever your views of Van Gaal this season, he has blooded a whole host of young talent (Borthwick-Jackson, Blackett, Martial, Memphis, Lingard, Rashford).

Solomons main failings are two-fold: failure to rotate and keep the squad fresh, and negative tactics which, in my view, don't suit the players we have available.

Also agreed with the young local player chat, and I'm really not a fan of Solomons.

I guess the other criticism, is that he is giving young players a chance, but are they the right young players. I guess mostly yes, but Ritchie and Bradbury should have had their amount of gametime switched. That's not to say Ritchie isn't a good player, he might well be very good in the future and is certainly showing flashes, but he's not as big yet as Bradbury, who seems more ready for the rigors of first team rugby.

Plus he continues to ignore some other young players who should have been given more of a chance. Berghan for one, McInally (not quite as young) is another, he's played but hasn't played much and when he has, he normally comes on with Andress so everything becomes slightly worse anyway.

Anyway, to the main point, we're not seeing really any improvement, Solly has kept us pretty much at the bottom of the table and it's time for him to shuffle off to the retirement village that his family have been eyeing up for him.

[funnyExiledScot]

I forgot to add Kinghorn as well, who is possibly the most promising young player of all to be brought through by Solomons. He could have stuck with Jack Cuthbert, but instead realised that there wasn't a single thing Cuthbert did better than Kinghorn, so picked the youngster instead.

It's a fair point though re: odd selections. There have been quite a few this season. Each and every time I see Andries Strauss on the team sheet I have been left scratching my head, and once the decision was made for Andress to leave, it was very odd indeed that Berghan (who looks a better player anyway) wasn't promoted to bench duty.

[TJ]

Edinburgh had the opportunity to get into the top 6 and blew it. 9th is not acceptable and is no improvement. Edinburghs budget now is matching the welsh and Irish clubs wheras a few years ago it wasn't but we have not improved in relation to these teams.

For me the main error has been not having a 10 in the squad

[funnyExiledScot]

Edinburgh had the opportunity to get into the top 6 and blew it.  9th is not acceptable and is no improvement.  Edinburghs budget now is  matching the welsh and Irish clubs wheras a few years ago it wasn't but we have not improved in relation to these teams.

For me the main error has been not having a 10 in the squad

Very true. I do think Meatball will make a big difference for us next season. I have doubts as to whether he's an international calibre 10 (when I say doubts, I mean that I'm certain he's not), but he's a solid citizen at club level and will do a decent job for us. I'd still like us to retain Tovey as well though.

[RDW]

Tovey's chat on Twitter hasn't been overly positive in terms of signing news.

Does anyone actually think Solomons will quit? He's far too stubborn for that IMO.

I also can't see him being sacked any time soon because then Scott Johnson would have to admit that he made a mistake.

[funnyExiledScot]

Well the bigger concern is that if Solomons quits, we end up with Johnson is some caretaker role for a season. I'd rather have Bradley back frankly.

I can't see Solomons quitting either. I think he'll see out his contract.

The challenge with Tovey is that he'd presumably only stay for regular first team rugby, and Weir is clearly going to be first choice next season. I wouldn't stay if I were him.

[EWT Spoons]

Yeah there is no way that Solomons will walk away. Only way we'll see him go is if he's given the boot and as has been said that's not going to happen either as it would see SJ admitting he was wrong.

I guess though, does Solomons have any supporters left on his side? I've not seen anyone say that he should see out his last year.

[RDW]

Where else would tovey go though? I can't see there being a line of clubs queuing up to sign him. Not of the profile of Edinburgh anyway (which is still quite high all things considered!)

[EWT Spoons]

Rumours are that Dragons want him back, at least that was the rumour a couple of weeks ago.

[RDW]

Given what he said about them when he left that would be a frosty reception! He also wouldn't be guaranteed first choice there either (wrongly according to some Dragons fans).

[EWT Spoons]

I'm sure the chat was that he would be going back as first choice as Jones was moving on. Again this was all just rumours and could be a load of rubbish, but that's what was being said a few weeks ago, sadly I can't remember where though.

[funnyExiledScot]

The problem is that Tovey now knows that Solomons will never change his team, so once Weir is established as first choice Tovey won't get a look in unless Weir gets picked for Scotland, and only then it's just a few games here and there. It's a tough sell. I'm sure there's a Championship club in England looking for a player of Tovey's talents - I think he's quite good.

My hunch is that all will be forgiven and he'll go back to the Dragons. One of the few Pro12 teams representing a step-down from Edinburgh!

[VinceWLB]

Weir being selected instead of Tovey would sum up Solomons nicely.

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