Brexit

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Funniest thing to happen in years. Have been following the craziness on the FT. Despite the implications if our current crop of retards manage to push it through I can't remember when I've read the news everyday without fail and learned something new. What does everyone think of the possibility that we stay in the single market, retain freedom of movement. Pay into the EU coffers and lose our vote ??

Never Toppy, how dare you state that the SNP lied over economics (are stretched the truth just a tad).

Anyway, thought you all might like a laugh at this
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/straight-banana-woman-bbc-question-time_uk_58942debe4b076856215de0f

Of all the reasons i've heard that has to be the best ever

Had a look at the white paper Toppy? Either we're really really doomed or May is trying to make it so f*cking batshit crazy that even Farage would go running back to the EU at the last minute.

ShahenshahG wrote:Had a look at the white paper Toppy? Either we're really really doomed or May is trying to make it so f*cking batshit crazy that even Farage would go running back to the EU at the last minute.

Only the City AM '6 things we learnt' article.

I probably don't think it's as bad as you do Shah. Passporting for UK financial services is paramount and it looks like she's going to try get that. Transitional arrangements are a positive (spread the pain), clear we're trying to get a fair deal for EU nationals currently here and reciprocal for Brits abroad, which is good, but some a-hole bloc countries are making life difficult.

Haven't gone into much detail though tbh.

Indyref2 polling:

http://www.panelbase.com/media/polls/W7181w9tablesforpublication300117.pdf

On independence voting intention remains little changed from the 2014 referendum – 46% would vote YES, 54% would vote NO.

TopHat24/7 wrote:

ShahenshahG wrote:Had a look at the white paper Toppy? Either we're really really doomed or May is trying to make it so f*cking batshit crazy that even Farage would go running back to the EU at the last minute.

Only the City AM '6 things we learnt' article.

I probably don't think it's as bad as you do Shah. Passporting for UK financial services is paramount and it looks like she's going to try get that. Transitional arrangements are a positive (spread the pain), clear we're trying to get a fair deal for EU nationals currently here and reciprocal for Brits abroad, which is good, but some a-hole bloc countries are making life difficult.

Haven't gone into much detail though tbh.

Temporary stay of execution but word is banks and other financial services are looking for loopholes to continue business as is. Not a good idea as loopholes, equivalence can be be closed at the drop of a hat. It's in the Eu''s financial interest short term but to have its financial centre outside it's borders it's a pretty big risk. Unfortunately there seems to be a movement on euro denominated clearing that suggests an upcoming cap on the amount of clearing that can be done outside the EU. The ecb getting regulatory authority over it and certain other things like point of origin that might mean bad tidings. The cap will obviously be more than what the Americans clear but significantly less than what we clear.

I'm not entirely sure but I believe London was a great location because all of it could be done in one place. I think they will probably go wholesale to Germany or New York. Bad news for us in either case today or tomorrow. Similar for pharmaceutical industry because of equivalence rules.

Yeh Euro denominated clearing will be the main issue. London is so so far ahead of all Eurozone financial centres that there'll be no mass de-camping, just a shift of some operations (e.g. €-dom trades) probably to Paris or Frankfurt.

Neither of those wholesale options are remotely likely. New York lacks GMT and capacity (don't underestimate the ridiculous volume of office space being occupied, often with long leases in the UK).

Frankfurt - have ever BEEN to Frankfurt? Christ it is dull. And small. Be like moving ops to Sheffield. Schools aren't anything special either. Got to remember - profitable banks/FSIs require happy well rewarded employees. Frankfurt is more likely to have punitive taxes and remuneration controls in the future, there's a lack of top private schools for the maturer employees with families and an absence of anything to do for the young guns coming through.

Paris is a better bet but lacks the capacity. Eurostar may be what wins it the minor decampments.

Aye fair points but I think the gentleman who was tasked with overseeing the efficiency thing said it would most likely be moving en masses if it had to move at all. But yeah frankfurters despite the investment recently still has the charm of John major bumming Steve Davis.

Put this in context Shah, relocating 100,000 workers (which would not be the totality of Londons banking & FSI) would require 10 MILLION square feet of office accommodation assuming a tight ratio of 1:100. Banks will typically be that tight on trading floors but wholsesale relocation will require massive amounts of meeting, break out, conference space. So the figure could be 25% more.

In 2016 only 1.4 million square feet of office accommodation was built/completed, therefore it could take 8-10 years for Frankfurt to build enough accommodation to house the City of London and Canary Wharf even assuming the local government immediately approved all applications so there were no hold ups with planning AND assuming everything could be financed.

Hmm youre right there and the Irish have already been overwhelmed by the requests and will need a similar time frame to develop the infrastructure. So you reckon worst case scenario were looking at a piecemeal break up of our financial power?

No break up of power. But am sure there will be job losses. Just not sure whether one place will be able to attract all of them. Will the American banks prefer Ireland? For example.

Paris has limited stock and is very expensive, but has the best connections in Europe by a country mile and great schools etc.

Frankfurt is probably the #2 EU financial centre outside of London but has little else going for it.

My direct concern is pharmaceuticals although I have no worries about getting a job should I lose it here. I'm worried mostly about the European teams - they've just moved from here (prior to the referendum) into Cam/Beds/Herts offices - put in a seriously massive investment into jobs and recruiting local talent and it's likely they are going to move back into Europe and take our scientists with them. Deloitte and E&Y are making serious money, they've been here for 6 weeks and their auditing team finished weeks ago. Pharma has it's offices everywhere so moving won't be too disastrous for them but still a pain in the a*se.

Audit fees are epic.  Deloitte were getting something like £20m a year for RBS (which they just lost).  That was one of the few FTSE100 companies not audited by PWC.....

Would hope some serious research strength (Oxbridge etc) would keep major Pharma oppos here.

No doubt mate, but only UK Pharma which is not a lot when you can sell to the entire EU - similar to the finance sector in London. Like you said the sheer number of higher taxpayers leaving the economy will bite us in the a*se. Similar equivalence deals must be reached although it's called Mutual Recognition Agreements I believe. UK Patent laws are seriously prohibitive towards new medicine and NICE are a bunch of rank amateurs. My company was delighted when the European Patent was confirmed and thought it might lead to a more sustainable business practice and more reasonable prices for the NHS (obviously not for the NHS's benefits but for it's own sales). A couple of our drugs are reproduced by some fecking chancer in the Netherlands at a fraction of the cost - never having to bear the cost of the research involved. I remember the day the company lost the court case, just about to lock up and the HR director sat, with her shoulders slumped on the security desk. The Monday after that 120 people were sacked from a 300 staff office and hundreds besides all over the country.

Detailed ward by ward analysis of EU Ref voting patterns:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38762034

So basically just confirming Leave characterised by one or more of the following: uneducated, white, elderly, low income.

Remain vote essentially the opposite.

#democracy

So basically like a lot of other votes certain people thought it would be better for them, others thought the other side was better. (I'd be more interested to know the reasons behind a lot of the low income/elderly reasons behind this)

TopHat24/7 wrote:Detailed ward by ward analysis of EU Ref voting patterns:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38762034

So basically just confirming Leave characterised by one or more of the following: uneducated, white, elderly, low income.

Remain vote essentially the opposite.

#democracy

???

I didn't think those kind of people existed in the EU anymore?  That's a shock.  I must have been falling for to too much propaganda coming out of Brussels.

I thought the unemployed were offered night-school 're-training' classes to allow them to become part-time casual-workers with salaries of 80 grand a year?  
I thought all the 'White' people (no racism there btw) were declared illegal aliens in the EU and are either up for shipment out of the new EU or that a wall was being built between America and the EU to keep them out?  
I thought the elderly were being offered an option on their life insurance policies to be injected with quick acting medicine to make them go asleep (peacefully) so that their children can sell their assets and invest in wind-turbine companies?
I thought low-income was banned after all the cheap migrant workers upped the demands for better pay and conditions?

But you say the uneducated, the whites, the elderly and the low-incomed are actually the majority?  

Just goes to show you, the majority should be banned from voting.

Yawn.....

Got you again, Top

You produce the documents and I analyse them for you.

You made the mistake of forgetting that list of 'deplorables' you mentioned are also the majority that voted for Brexit.

Nice advert for the swish, city-slicker, young wealthy and happy image the EU have going for itself.

Yawn.

When you can provide a succinct answer or supported argument I might waste more time on you.

Otherwise just continue to WUM the forum. You look stupid, but I guess you don't care.

TopHat24/7 wrote:Yawn.

When you can provide a succinct answer or supported argument I might waste more time on you.

Otherwise just continue to WUM the forum.  You look stupid, but I guess you don't care.

You provided the evidence. You're the one that upped the document and seemed chuffed by the cute assumptions therein: that only unemployed white idiots and old people voted for Brexit. Yeah, they did, and won. Why are they in the majority in that referendum? What did the majority of voters not like about the EU?

You're the WUM. You'd ban voting tomorrow for the underclasses and 'has-been' classes (the old) if you could.

SecretFly wrote:that only unemployed white idiots and old people voted for Brexit.

FAKE NEWS!

JuliusHMarx wrote:

SecretFly wrote:that only unemployed white idiots and old people voted for Brexit.

FAKE NEWS!

Indeed. Some people are just too far up their own arris to recognise it.

JuliusHMarx wrote:

SecretFly wrote:that only unemployed white idiots and old people voted for Brexit.

FAKE NEWS!

Oh yeah sorry.  I'll correct that:

"that All unemployed white idiots (and probably all white people who are idiots) - and old people - voted for Brexit."  

Will Syria be opening its doors for the white idiot refugees (and the elderly) that I expect will be looking for a new home when Verhofstadt takes over the reins of the EU?

SecretFly wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:

SecretFly wrote:that only unemployed white idiots and old people voted for Brexit.

FAKE NEWS!

Oh yeah sorry.  I'll correct that and put some different fake news.

Fair enough.

JuliusHMarx wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

JuliusHMarx wrote:

SecretFly wrote:that only unemployed white idiots and old people voted for Brexit.

FAKE NEWS!

Oh yeah sorry.  I'll correct that and put some different fake news.

Fair enough.

Don't mention it, Julius. Anything to keep Fake News fans content.

Fake News content keeps fans content.

I wonder if the NHS stats qualify as fake news? I will leave Toppy to decide on that but surely in his realm they must be.

It's fake news, mate. Tories are doing a fantastic job.

Pr4wn wrote:It's fake news, mate. Tories are doing a fantastic job.

Think you missed the point. But don't let your vitriol get in the way of anything....

Pr4wn wrote:It's fake news, mate. Tories are doing a fantastic job.

They can be as incompetent as they like......May is a ditherer (Nearly ten u-turns already), NHS is a laughing stock (Hunt still there, really ??), Incompetently lost Britain its place in Europe by spending more time abusing Boris Johnson that discussing the issues...May is a hostage to Brexit the terms of withdrawal aren't in her hands (She doesn't hold the cards)....

Imagine what a Blair and Campbell could do to this load of garbage ??

But no......Labour have someone who would never be elected in a million years......It's Animal farm...Corbyn, Abbott et al have eighty sixed Farmer Jones (Blair) off the place and now realise they have to run it.......and it takes skill...

Thought Blair's government 97-2001 was excellent....Pretty much crap from Iraq onwards mind you...

Corbyn is what you get when you forget that Labour has a left wing.......Center is where you need to be but you have to take both wings on the journey !!...

Clinton lost a lot of blue collar vote............In fairness her Husband (Predator or not..very savvy)asked the campaign team "What are you doing about ordinary white working class?"..

Answer "Taking them for granted"..Corbyn is part of Blair's legacy too...

LOL

The classic Truss 'u-turn count' being brought out again. Meant f-all last time and f-all this time.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

Clinton lost a lot of blue collar vote............In fairness her Husband (Predator or not..very savvy)asked the campaign team "What are you doing about ordinary white working class?"..

Making fun of them?

Bill has some sense of perspectives - at least he knew the correct potion to use in an election.  BUT - that very question lets you know that his wife was merely an Image used to market some nonsense that nobody in the 'party' believed in but all of them wanted a say in.  She was going to be a puppet - doing the speeches around the world as the boys in the background kept the agenda they had going rumbling along without interruption.  

If the Candidate's husband has to ask the campaign team what the campaign stands for then you know America made the right choice with Trump.

Bill: "What is this campaign about?"
Campaign Team: "Well........................... em......................... ain't your wife a woman?  Would that do?"
Bill: (to Hillary after a long uneasy pause)  They say you're a woman."
Hillary (mad as Hell - i.e. reasonably calm for her)  "And what the f**k is that supposed to mean?  What difference does it make?  Don't they know that I dodged sniper fire in Bengasi as I tried to save some war kids by takin' them out of the country on the Lolita Express?"

Bill:  "We're f**ked."

TopHat24/7 wrote:LOL

The classic Truss 'u-turn count' being brought out again. Meant f-all last time and f-all this time.

I agree.....But she has made plenty and it points to a lack of competence..........

Now Major made plenty of U-turns and lost to Blair but I don't think it was the main reason he lost......Just a contributing factor...

Now repeat that back to me.....I want to make sure you understand !!

What are the 'nearly 10' U-turns she's made?

And how do you explain Tories increasing their mandate, with an unheralded majority, despite you counting something like four thousand u-turns during their coalition tenure??

Jeremy Corbyn and Ed Miliband plus the Brexit morons

I see Ivanka Trump has been managing Murdochs daughters fund. God almighty won't someone just kill this poisonous snake.

ShahenshahG wrote:I see Ivanka Trump has been managing Murdochs daughters fund. God almighty won't someone just kill this poisonous snake.

Ivanka? Trump? Murdoch's Daughter? Or the poisonous snake?

Ha. No. She's quite bummable. Rupert Murdoch is the poisonous snake.

Appeaser May is buying off individual councils now... God a lifetime of this.

Why not? She already bought off Nissan to try clean up Brexit votes mess (Sunderland should have been left to rot IMO).

See Corbyn doesn't work weekends or out of hours. True trade union socialist. If he 'HAS' to work, e.g. appearing on Question Time or the Marr Show (i.e. what he should be doing as a matter of course as a party leader) he takes time off in lieue to make up for it.

Very funny, Toppy, but the point stands. She's as bent as a 9-bob. But we all knew that anyway.

Also, top government officials appear to be communicating via text message in an attempt to bypass the Freedom of Information Act.

I thought the general idea was that people actually want Corbyn to work less?   No?

Damned if he does, and damned if he doesn't.

BTW, I wouldn't call talking working.  Those 12 hour 'working' days by the business-lunch lads.... nope, we don't fall for that crap.  Try 12 hours on a building site and then we'll discuss who the working-hour heroes are.

Pr4wn wrote:Very funny, Toppy, but the point stands. She's as bent as a 9-bob. But we all knew that anyway.

Also, top government officials appear to be communicating via text message in an attempt to bypass the Freedom of Information Act.

What fools they are then. Haven't they ever heard of Julian Assange?

Pr4wn wrote:It's fake news, mate. Tories are doing a fantastic job.

Must be. After all here we have (if you believe some) the utterly clueless and without a clue SNP out-performing the wondrous Westminster in running the NHS and that comes from the NHS stats. 

I mean if that were true it is a dispelling of a myth.

CaledonianCraig wrote:

Pr4wn wrote:It's fake news, mate. Tories are doing a fantastic job.

Must be. After all here we have (if you believe some) the utterly clueless and without a clue SNP out-performing the wondrous Westminster in running the NHS and that comes from the NHS stats. 

I mean if that were true it is a dispelling of a myth.

Next you'll be claiming to have oil off the coast of Scotland.

This fake news stuff has to stop now. It was fun for a bit but now it's just comical.

Pr4wn wrote:Very funny, Toppy, but the point stands. She's as bent as a 9-bob. But we all knew that anyway.

Also, top government officials appear to be communicating via text message in an attempt to bypass the Freedom of Information Act.

OK SuperFly......

SecretFly wrote:I thought the general idea was that people actually want Corbyn to work less?   No?

Eh? Or are you just failing at being funny again....??

TopHat24/7 wrote:

SecretFly wrote:I thought the general idea was that people actually want Corbyn to work less?   No?

Eh? Or are you just failing at being funny again....??

Caught again, Top?

Just text a Green Paper on any future public comments you intend to make and I'll give you a heads-up on my likely replies. That might get us back on a public even keel.

SecretFly wrote:

TopHat24/7 wrote:

SecretFly wrote:I thought the general idea was that people actually want Corbyn to work less?   No?

Eh? Or are you just failing at being funny again....??

Caught again, Top?

Just text a Green Paper on any future public comments you intend to make and I'll give you a heads-up on my likely replies.  That might get us back on a public even keel.

You truly are f*cking delinquent.