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First topic message reminder :

Welcome to the 4th season of the fantasy aviva premiership game


Opening Weekend fixtures; Leicester Tigers vs Exeter Chiefs ; London Irish vs Harlequins ; Newcastle Falcons vs Bath ; Northampton vs Gloucester ; Saracens vs London Wasps ; Worcester Warriors vs Sale Sharks

This Weeks match thread(s) :- https://www.606v2.com/t8662-fixtures-3#245781

Season One Homepage (Archived)

Season Two Homepage Part One(Archived)

Season Two Homepage Part Two(Archived)

Rules

Fixture/Results list

League Table

Top Points Scorers

Top Try Scorers

European Homepage

LV Anglo Welsh Cup Homepage

Transfer Homepage

Press Releases

Unavailable Players

Waiting list for a team

1. Sam
2. pullthestrings
3. Bathite

Teams
Bath RFC
Manager:- 207bars

Exeter Chiefs
Manager:- RugbyDriver

Gloucester
Manager:- Anonmattyt

Harlequins
Manager:- Steve_sharks

Leicester Tigers
Manager:- LukeLovesLuka

London Irish
Manager:- stnick88

London Wasps
Manager:- Arry

Newcastle Falcons
Manager:- PoolyPunk

Northampton Saints
Manager:- Dammit_Chris

Sale Sharks
Manager:- SirJohnnyEnglish

Saracens
Manager:- LDCPete]

Worcester Warriors
Manager - Prop_Lyd

can we move on from the giteau debate now please?

SirJohnnyEnglish wrote:Sorry Chris but your argument for Giteau holds no ground.

Giteau's last proper run at flyhalf for Oz was in 2009. As you can see from Pete's post above the Oz props were considered the form props in the world! A strong 2nd row with Sharpe, Chisholm and Horwill (in the best form of his career!). Elsom, Palu, Smith and an emerging Pocock in the back row. You stated that Gits looked poor for Oz because of a poor pack. Does that look like a poor pack? Oz had arguably the form pack in the world at the time!!! Giteua played poorly and got shifted to 12 with Cooper coming in. The poor form continued and Barnes has his spot now. If he starts at the world cup it will only be because of Barnes medical issues.

Giteau has been poor for 2 years now. He is not this top world class flyhalf you are making him out to be at all! Maybe 3 or 4 years ago but not anymore.

dammit_chris wrote:Pete, I played rugby to a pretty high standard when I was 17-21 and my position was a 10 and 12, so like to think I know about that position - for me I'd always have the order for internationals as Carter, Giteau, Cooper as top three with Wilkinson, Sexton and Steyn following behind. Giteau had a rudey poo time of it 6-12 months ago, but some of his performances have been awesome since then. Put him behind a pack as good as the Reds and he'd be spoken about in the same light as Cooper is. He's played for teams with a poor pack for years, whether thats at international level or at club.

Where have I twisted your words Chris? You quite cleary stated Giteau is a top 3 flyhalf in the world. Does that not equate to a top world class flyhalf as I said above?

He has been average for two years now Chris an opinion not just held by me looking at the ongoing discussion of this. You used the aussie pack, which you have qualified to be the front 5 as the reason for his poor form at 10. The Aussies had possibly the form front 5 in the world at the time of his last stint at 10 with Robinson, Alexander, Moore, Horwill all coming to the fore. So its not really an excuse for me.

I didnt mention the NH packs of the time at all did I? But if we take your view of them being the worst the NH has had to offer in the pro era why was Giteau so poor at 10? Surely he should have been playing the best rugby of his career against such limited opponents?

Instead he was playing poorly enough to be shifted for Cooper... Then Barnes... Now he will only get into the Aussie side if Barnes doesnt get over his medical conditions and even then its not a foregone conclusion with Faainga being considered as well

Thats the ned of the Giteau debate from me Nick mate! Think you all know m opinion on him at the moment now

I agree Nick, think it's run it's course and nobody is likely to stand down. We all rate how we rate, it's not like we all don't watch any rugby, the knowledge of players on here is pretty impressive.

Tweaking:

HK Tom Lindsay (England)
HK Joe Duffey (England)
PR Craig Mitchell (Wales)
PR Rodrigo Roncero (LH) (Argentina)
PR Boris Stankovich(LH) (England)
LK Ed Slater (England)
LK Juandre Kruger (South Africa)
FL Ben Woods (England)
FL Ben Skirving (England)
SH Michael Claassens (South Africa)
CE Dan Hipkiss (England)
CE Alex Crockett (England)
WG Luke Fitzgerald (Ireland)
WG Miles Benjamin (England)
WG Riki Sheriff (England)
WG Topsy Ojo (England)

everybody over rates there own players and players they like in real life.
i've done it in the past with steffon armitage, though him leaving irish has annoyed me a bit! him moving to toulon will probably boost his rating for me though.

Anyone got a decent hooker, not going to the World Cup that they want to sell?

Nick. Depende on whether steffan plays that much and how he goes. might affect his rating as not many people will see him.

Personally i think he is very average and never rate him. that said there are a few irish fans on here like pete who maybe over rate him so swings and roundabouts.

he will be there starting 7 I imagine. they were desperate to get him and in rugby terms paid alot of money for him.

I've seen him week in week out for years and he is always one of irish's best performers. same with you and qera matt.

I think we all hold our club players quite high, except me and Driver as Falcons are pump

I like both Qera and Steffon and rate them around the same level, good Prem players.

Thing is nick every time i have seen him come up against a top 7 like qera he has been obliterated. I saw him play on the wing once which was weird.

Thing is Qera has been to a world cup and been the best 7 there. steffan will never step up like that.

Fair enough Matt but I've seen Armitage get the better of George Smith, Moody and players of that calibre.
The stats he racked up season before last were immense, in the top 10 for tries, metres made, defenders beaten and turnovers.

I wouldn't say Qera was a top 7, good AP player though.

Qera is a very very good physical player, but at times for me can be found lacking in the top two inches department, which means he will never be up there with the best 7's in the world on a consistent basis.

In any one of game, he could match or better McCaw, Pocock etc on the day, but over a period of 10 games against one of the top players, I would expect them to better him 8 or 9 times out of 10.

He certainly know the way to the line which is a useful trait. do you see him replacing George Smith for Toulon??

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Qera at 2007 world cup was in almost every team of the tournament. Typical islander in that his fitness can go and he can balloon. Genuinely world class on his day but agree with Pete on his consistency.

LAst year he was tremendous on the run in but took him 20 games to get fit. He was awesome for gloucester after that 2007 world cup as the cup made him stay fit in the off season. hope the same happens this year.

Watching him pick steffan up 2 or 3 times and drive him back about 20 metres the season before last was one of the greatest things i have seen in a stadium live.

Seen him do it to much better players also.

He is not your scavenging 7 but an open field running big hitting 7. suits gloucesters play when on song to a T

That's the thing right there Mat, he is suited to the way Gloucester play, much in the same way that Steffon was suited to the Irish gameplan.

I am not convinced that he will be a success at Toulon to be honest, simply because he is a player who needs to be playing week in week out in order to perform at his peak, and I can't see him getting that down there. They have such a big squad that they will rotate regularly, and not convinced he will cope well with that.

I hope that I am wrong, as Steff is a genuinely nice fella who deserves a bit of success and I wish him every bit of luck down in the South of France.

for sure matt they wouldnt pay so much money for him to sit on the bench.
they were so impressed with him after we played them in the HC this year they approached him after the game.

How much is he getting paid?? I imagine George Smith would be on more as a legend of the game. i imagine the cleaner at toulon is on a few million a year

Where has Smith gone, Japan?

I dont know how much he is being paid at Toulon, I mean the transfer fee Toulon paid Irish was a lot in rugby terms.

Smith is still at Toulon i think?? Can see Delon Armitage going to france next year. He has been making noises about it in the rugby press

Think Smith has gone to Pays d'Aix, in the 2nd division....

Smith has left to go to Japan hasn't he, think he's still only 30 too. Was pretty good for Toulon last season but was played all over the backrow.

Looking for a hooker, openside flanker, scrum half, inside centre, outside centre and full back. Please let me know if you have anyone available guys.

wouldnt be suprised if he joined steff at toulon matt

Nonu to the Blues....

http://i.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/sport/rugby/5216940/Ma-a-Nonu-signs-with-Blues-for-two-seasons

I wonder how he'll feel covering in defence for Brett who's defence is nearly as bad as Coopers!

Really, really need an inside and outside centre lads, willing to pay cash or do player exchanges.

brett is off to japan pooly

I didn't know that Nick...doubt he'll be missed

I liked Brett

Great with the ball in his hand Steve, but can't kick for love nor money! No defence to speak of either. I'm no fan, glad nobody has bought him on here.

he's average. constantly being dropped by the blues then they realise mcalister is worse at 10 and put brett back in!

whats peoples thoughts on jared payne?
thinking of going for him as a 13 that can be back up at 15 also.

He is okay. Rating will go up when he's at Ulster as he will certainly improve their backline

What do you guys think of Jon Clarke and James Downey?

Will World Cup players be availible for the first week of fixtures as they are a week before the WC begins?

Looking for a hooker, openside flanker, scrum half, loosehead prop and tight head prop.

Arry John Clarke is a very good player - really rate him a lot, is the centre point of the Saints defence and attack. Dont think many feel the same though in this game, seem to question his defence and pace.

Downey is a good player, never going to be spectacular - but combine him with Clarke and not many will get through them in midfield.

Rate both, but in this game I guess you need starting internationals to push you on.

Cheers for the feedback Chris, I expect the pair of them will be my starting centre combination during the WC.

I'm still about for some deals lads

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BoZBKxO4TQ&feature=player_embedded

for anyone doubting my hooker/flanker/full backs abilities as one of the best hookers in the world

Can't get YouTube....please don't tell me you're saying Brits is one of the best hookers in the world!

I am. Got everything in his locker. Throwing is now top notch after some work and the idea that he can't scrummage is a myth

Is that right lol. He is amazing in the loose but a hooker shouldn't be stood at FB receiving kicks. He's a long way off a world class hooker in my opinion.

I've read he got dropped from SA because he scrummaging was so poor, his throwing has came on though.

I've never liked him myself as I like a hooker to hit his basics which I've never thought Brits really has. Not sure what others opinions are on him though, I might stand alone.

Why isn't that what a hooker should be doing?? Any team would love to have the option of Brits in there team. He creates tries as well as throwing in straight and winning the ball at scrum time.

you can't ask for much more from your hooker.

No coincidence that Brits was the best player in the team that won the premiership. His influence was phenominal. He also had a massive part in the try of the season as well as setting up another in the AP final

Don't really want to argue about him, I just don't think he's anywhere near world class.

He's a poor scrummager, don't think I've seen him anywhere near a ruck the whole season, he's just not into the dirty work of the front row. He goes missing as soon as the heavy pitches come out. Prefers to think he's a FB. If he was half the player he gets portrayed he is on the rugby club he'd be at least somewhere near the SA squad.

A game breaker in the loose but an average hooker.

Using the SA squad as a measure of someone's ability? This isn't the Pooly I know..

If the SA squad is the measure of a players ability then surely your own Sarel Pretorius isn't much of a player as he's at least 5th choice in PDV's mind?

using PDV's judgeent of player ability isn't the best of ideas

I've never stated Pretorious was world class mate, was the best scrum half in the S15 with Genia, that's all I've said. Don't think a player can be considered world class if he doesn't even get selected for his country.

We'll never agree about Brits, I've always had this stance on him and until I see something to make me think otherwise I'll hold that view.

Good win on the Euro by the way

Brits is mint. Scrummages not very well but with nieto and Stevens no need. Fourie the stormers hooker I have is similar in that he has 1 fault. everything but his throw on certain occasions is tremendous. However 1 out of 7 or 8 he collapses.

Brits is fantastic but his scrummaging is bad. Very few hookers scrum well these days so becoming less important. However bdp, Hartley and Strauss show the value of it.

Hartley and tiny make mujati look much better. Bdp makes his brother look better although he fights a 1 man battle with beast struggling