Glasgow and Edinburgh ongoing banter thread 24 - Covid funtimes

by **RDW** Mon 20 Apr 2020, 12:10 am

First topic message reminder :

Previous gibberish

https://www.606v2.com/t69038p1050-glasgow-and-edinburgh-banter-thread-no-23-new-season-new-thread

Fixtures

Glasgow - none

Edinburgh - none

Scotland - none

Sad

by tigertattie Tue 09 Jun 2020, 10:17 am

Hold on, everyone is blaming the SRU here!

Maybe all these youngsters have turned round and said "Right SRU, this ship is sinking faster than Jimbo's nut sack, get us moved over to the real rugby club of Scotland, you know, the ones who can win the title in the future, not the once any only one time fluked champions, or we're off to earn a crust at another rugby club in England or France"

Or, jsut as possible as RDW said, actually, the new coach at Glasgow has a raft of new signings to come in as he rebuilds Glasgow in his own image.

by Hazel Sapling Tue 09 Jun 2020, 10:25 am

Glasgow locks
Richie Gray - Cummings
McDonald - Harley
Sykes - ???

Edinburgh locks
Toolis - Gilchrist
Carmichael - Davidson
McKenzie - Hunter-Hill
Hodgson - ??

I can't see Edinburgh getting Sykes as well as Davidson. What is the point in giving Edinburgh another young player to be 8th choice? The only way the Davidson deal makes sense in terms keeping both sides well stocked is if Sykes and Nakarawa are kept in Glasgow and Hunter-Hill is confirmed to Sarries.

Will have to wait for the end of recruitment to figure out if there has been some joined up thinking. Edinburgh have far too many back-rowers and Glasgows too little. Fife could be a Lee Jones candidate for Glasgow to pick up.

To be fair to the SRU, it is not like Edinburgh have burst the budget with any of the pick ups. They lost Ceccarelli, Barclay, Hickey and Scott (all probably on decent money) to pick up Jono Lance, a youth South African player, two players from the Championship and Glasgow's sixth choice lock from last year. Nakarawa may have the same salary demands as those five combined.

by **NeilyBroon** Tue 09 Jun 2020, 10:26 am

tigertattie wrote:Hold on, everyone is blaming the SRU here!

Maybe all these youngsters have turned round and said "Right SRU, this ship is sinking faster than Jimbo's nut sack, get us moved over to the real rugby club of Scotland, you know, the ones who can win the title in the future, not the once any only one time fluked champions, or we're off to earn a crust at another rugby club in England or France"

Or, jsut as possible as RDW said, actually, the new coach at Glasgow has a raft of new signings to come in as he rebuilds Glasgow in his own image.

Getting a bit late in the day though no? We're in June already, normally these anouncements are made in spring! (Granted Covid hasn't helped but I expect they would have been planning replacements from before then.)

by **RDW** Tue 09 Jun 2020, 10:29 am

CHH is staying at Sarries I think. He ended up getting quite a lot of gametime there.

by **NeilyBroon** Tue 09 Jun 2020, 10:52 am

RDW wrote:CHH is staying at Sarries I think. He ended up getting quite a lot of gametime there.

Probably a good place to be. He's got a great opportunity in the championship to make an impression then nail a starter when Sarries get promoted for the 21-22 season. With the new salary cap too it could become all the more relevant. Sarries have shaped a few Scotland players and he'll be learning off the likes of Itoje etc.

by **NeilyBroon** Thu 11 Jun 2020, 7:04 pm

https://www.theoffsideline.com/jono-lance-edinburgh-visa/?v=79cba1185463

Looks like we'll be seeing Nathan Chamberlain a lot more than expected next season!

by **BigGee** Thu 11 Jun 2020, 7:20 pm

Both sides looking for a FH then.

Fortunately it is a bit of a buyers market at the moment, someone will be available but if NC gets more gametime than we were expecting, that is no bad thing either

by **NeilyBroon** Thu 11 Jun 2020, 7:55 pm

Do you think they'd reapproach baggot and offer him a one season deal? Probably easiest and cheapest option?

Left field suggestion, maybe Hutchinson seeing as he's been covering there for Scotland?

by **BigGee** Thu 11 Jun 2020, 8:55 pm

Hard to imagine they won't want someone able to play first team rugby, which Baggot in two years at Edinburgh, never convinced Cockers he could.

They will have the money allocated for Lance and he would not have been on peanuts, so that presumably will be diverted towards someone else.

by formerly known as Sam Thu 11 Jun 2020, 10:11 pm

NeilyBroon wrote:
Left field suggestion, maybe Hutchinson seeing as he's been covering there for Scotland?

Can't see Northampton letting Hutchinson go he plays too much in their first team and covers too many positions. They've got a lot of young backs as well so will want to keep him as a bit of a leader.

Cockers might ask for Tigers for a favour if Edinburgh are struggling. He sent Scott down to Leicester when they needed a 12. Tigers have four senior flyhalfs so might be talked into loaning McPhillips up north for game time. Given his name is McPhillips and he born and raised in Newcastle there's a chance he's Scottish qualified as well.

If not pretty much any Championship flyhalf is available currently thanks to the RFU cutting funding.

by bsando Thu 11 Jun 2020, 10:27 pm

Shame for Lance, he seemed pretty keen on his move and he would have been a solid replacement for Hickey.

by **RDW** Thu 11 Jun 2020, 11:04 pm

Ah pish that's pretty disappointing.

As has been said we could do with an experienced head to replace him. No idea who that could be.

by **RDW** Thu 11 Jun 2020, 11:06 pm

https://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/53012922

This is more positive news. I bet several players are dusting off the Watt bikes as we speak!

not sure why they're making Glasgow trek through to Murrayfield to train - surely more travel is not the right approach. Maybe it's the Murrayfield 'bio bubble' they've been talking about.

by Hazel Sapling Fri 12 Jun 2020, 9:22 am

Seems strange for Lance to get refused. Lee Millar played Super Six for Watsonians last season and has been a starter at London Scots so maybe he can be a third/fourth option. The issue will be if VDW is injured for any length of time.

Either way, it sounds like Chamberlain has the chance to establish himself.

by tigertattie Fri 12 Jun 2020, 10:55 am

RDW wrote:https://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/53012922

This is more positive news. I bet several players are dusting off the Watt bikes as we speak!

not sure why they're making Glasgow trek through to Murrayfield to train - surely more travel is not the right approach. Maybe it's the Murrayfield 'bio bubble' they've been talking about.

I beleive the plan is to have all the players under one roof and in essence they become one great big household so they can then get within 2 metres of each other.

Of course it just means they are allowed to get within 2 metres of each other. It doesnt mean that in fact the Glasgow wingers will be able to get within 2 metres of the Edinburgh wings.

by **LondonTiger** Fri 12 Jun 2020, 11:37 am

Hazel Sapling wrote:Seems strange for Lance to get refused. Lee Millar played Super Six for Watsonians last season and has been a starter at London Scots so maybe he can be a third/fourth option. The issue will be if VDW is injured for any length of time.

Either way, it sounds like Chamberlain has the chance to establish himself.

Aye seems odd that his visa request was declined as it seems like he had played enough matches for Worcester over the last two seasons to be able to keep it.

by Hazel Sapling Fri 12 Jun 2020, 12:21 pm

LondonTiger wrote:
Hazel Sapling wrote:Seems strange for Lance to get refused. Lee Millar played Super Six for Watsonians last season and has been a starter at London Scots so maybe he can be a third/fourth option. The issue will be if VDW is injured for any length of time.

Either way, it sounds like Chamberlain has the chance to establish himself.

Aye seems odd that his visa request was declined as it seems like he had played enough matches for Worcester over the last two seasons to be able to keep it.

It may end up being for the best. No Scottish fly half has started their careers and established themselves as a professional in Scotland since Russell (Hastings came with a dozen Bath appearances). It might be that forcing Cockers to play Chamberlain through necessity could be the solution. Ross Thompson could end up in the same boat in Glasgow as third choice without Brandon Thomson and Jackson there.

by funnyExiledScot Sat 13 Jun 2020, 5:05 pm

Shame about Lance. I still wonder why we had to let Hickey go. I rated him. Might have been over wages.

Could be a great opportunity for some young Scots at Edinburgh and Glasgow next season.

by **NeilyBroon** Sat 13 Jun 2020, 9:38 pm

To be fair both Thompson and Chamberlain have shown great capability at U20 level and I reckon they're ready to be drip fed into the pro game. Next season is probably the best time to do it, as will be all over the place with fixtures and international games so I expect the standard club squads will be shaken up a bit more than normal. It's a great chance to mix in some younger blood with older, wiser players.

I'm thinking Ollie smith too at Glasgow, and a few of the back rowers.

by bsando Sun 14 Jun 2020, 11:52 am

Findlay Christie off the bench for Blues today to link up with Beauden Barrett. Made a good try saving tackle on Jamie Booth before Booth eventually scored a few phases later. Seems to have a really good engine from what I saw, a lot of aggression, second efforts and a crisp pass. Definitely a good prospect and younger than George Horne.

by **NeilyBroon** Sun 14 Jun 2020, 4:38 pm

Dobie, Sheil and Chapman all look good. It's a position we already have a good pipeline in so I don't know if a Kilted kiwi would really add too much. If there's a winger I'd happily take them however!

by **BigGee** Sun 14 Jun 2020, 4:49 pm

Christie may not be such a bad call, in that a couple of the Edinburgh SHs are HP and Groom are coming to the end of their careers and Price and Horne may well be looking for top dollar on their next contracts, which we may or may not be able to afford.

Christie would be an oven ready replacement, who has been around Super Rugby for three years or so now and is still young enough that he may continue to improve. He probably would not cost a fortune either.

One to be watching out for the 2021/22 season you might think. He was doing some media this week with scrum magazine, so he is definitely keeping his options open about coming over here. He kind of said as much in the interview.

by bsando Sun 14 Jun 2020, 10:24 pm

Yeah I just noticed that SCRUM interview Gee, I agree with your sentiments. More depth and competition is better for Scottish rugby. I totally forgot Carter is at the Blues now too so what an incredible team to be a part of.

I like that Christie is a grounded individual and just wants to improve his game in Super Rugby before jumping on a plane to Scotland. A couple of seasons and hopefully lots of game time at the Blues would be an excellent pathway for a move to the NH, much like Huw Jones did.

by **NeilyBroon** Mon 15 Jun 2020, 8:04 pm

In relation to Glasgow's lack of signings, Dodson has come out saying it's simply due to Danny Wilson not being in situ and wanting to be involved in signings. Surely if he's been working with Dave before he left for the ARU he's had ample time to have input on signings. The announcement he was coaching was made in January. Seems a bit of a weak excuse by Dodson tbh. He also says they're planning on fighting to keep Cockers and re-signing Toonie in 2021.

by demosthenes Tue 16 Jun 2020, 8:17 am

According to The Offside Line, Hamish Bain is coming back from France to join Glasgow.

by **RDW** Tue 16 Jun 2020, 8:20 am

Glasgow are getting all the signings these day - when are Edinburgh going to get theirs... Whistle

by **NeilyBroon** Tue 16 Jun 2020, 9:59 am

demosthenes wrote:According to The Offside Line, Hamish Bain is coming back from France to join Glasgow.

Well that resolves the SR issue, assuming Glasgow's current budget probably doesn't stretch to keeping Nakarawa seeing as there's been radio silence on him renewing (apart from a rumor in May that he may join Tigers).

Still leaves Warriors threadbare at fullback, wing, fly half and back row. Does anyone know how many people are actually left in the squad? I get streamlining but at this rate they'll be drawing from the U18s when internationals are on.

by bsando Tue 16 Jun 2020, 12:21 pm

RDW wrote:Glasgow are getting all the signings these day - when are Edinburgh going to get theirs...

Exactly! Andy Burke was asking on twitter who we'd like to see at fly half as a Lance replacement. I suggested Cockers takes a risk on a young Scottish fly half. What are your thoughts RDW? Perhaps someone like Lang or Chamberlain would be good options to back up VDW, but I'm guessing both are probably committed to their clubs.

by Hazel Sapling Tue 16 Jun 2020, 2:27 pm

bsando wrote:
RDW wrote:Glasgow are getting all the signings these day - when are Edinburgh going to get theirs...
Exactly! Andy Burke was asking on twitter who we'd like to see at fly half as a Lance replacement. I suggested Cockers takes a risk on a young Scottish fly half. What are your thoughts RDW? Perhaps someone like Lang or Chamberlain would be good options to back up VDW, but I'm guessing both are probably committed to their clubs.

I thought Chamberlain was a done deal to Edinburgh?

https://www.bristolbearsrugby.com/news/chamberlain-set-for-edinburgh-switch/#:~:text=Nathan%20Chamberlain%20will%20leave%20the,final%20year%20of%20his%20contract.

by **BigGee** Tue 16 Jun 2020, 6:07 pm

https://www.theoffsideline.com/tim-swinson-comes-out-of-retirement-for-12-month-deal-with-saracens/?v=79cba1185463

Tim Swinson changes mind on retirement and signs on for Sarries for a season in the championship.

He will continue with his legal studies and remain President of the Scottish players Union whilst he does this.

by **NeilyBroon** Tue 16 Jun 2020, 9:08 pm

That'll be a nice fundraiser for his next stage in his career, good for him, I'm sure he'll have a good time at Sarries.

Interestingly, Fraser Strachan has been released from saints. Think there's space for him at Glasgow or Edinburgh?

by **BigGee** Tue 16 Jun 2020, 10:26 pm

NeilyBroon wrote:That'll be a nice fundraiser for his next stage in his career, good for him, I'm sure he'll have a good time at Sarries.

Interestingly, Fraser Strachan has been released from saints. Think there's space for him at Glasgow or Edinburgh?

Strachan is going to Ealing, they are putting together a very decent looking squad for next season, they clearly see a premiership place is there for them in the next couple of years.

Devante Onojafie, who was a decent back row in our U20s, but has never really broken through at Saints and has also been let go, might be a better bet.

by **RDW** Tue 16 Jun 2020, 11:03 pm

More noises coming out about how the Pro 14 will finish, with a domestic double header, semi final then final on the cards. Should mean Edinburgh get in the playoff as they're 10 points ahead of Scarlets, and will easily get 10 points against Glasgow.

Does seem a bit pointless for the clubs who won't make the playoffs though - all that training to come back for 2 games. Given the makeup of the tables just now the games will pretty much just serve as a warm up for the playoff teams.

Maybe the new season will start soon after? Problem with that is European competitions are wanting to finish off in September/October time, then the new international window is meant to be October/November.... steam

by king_carlos Wed 17 Jun 2020, 12:31 am

Northampton have released former Scotland U20 flanker Devante Onojaife. A talented player in my opinion but Saints have back rows coming through the academy and a strong first team squad in those positions.

He might be a cheap pick up for Glasgow or Edinburgh though given that money will be very tight for the SRU at current. Worth a punt as squad depth in my opinion.

by Tramptastic Wed 17 Jun 2020, 10:41 am

RDW wrote:More noises coming out about how the Pro 14 will finish, with a domestic double header, semi final then final on the cards. Should mean Edinburgh get in the playoff as they're 10 points ahead of Scarlets, and will easily get 10 points against Glasgow.

Does seem a bit pointless for the clubs who won't make the playoffs though - all that training to come back for 2 games. Given the makeup of the tables just now the games will pretty much just serve as a warm up for the playoff teams.

Maybe the new season will start soon after? Problem with that is European competitions are wanting to finish off in September/October time, then the new international window is meant to be October/November....

Surely the sensible thing would be to play the remaining league games in AugusT/September, run straight in to euros September/October then Internationals October November, League and Euro finals for November/December Followed by Brand new season format in 2021?

Apparently there's idiocy on both sides of the new season arguments going on - The French league wants business as usual because money, with the head of the LNR pointing out there should be no fixtures in august because thats when French people go on holiday, despite there already being French fixtures during August Shocked

The English league seems to be more in line with the unions on a new calendar which provides the same number of weeks for league/euro fixtures and international windows being in sync.

However it seems the southern hemisphere unions came far less prepared for the discussions as apparently "the southern hemisphere unions only discovered the full extent of the work that has been undertaken by the French Top 14 (LNR), Guinness PRO14 and England’s Premiership (PRL) clubs at Monday’s virtual meeting involving more than 50 people, including England captain Owen Farrell and ex-All Black Conrad Smith representing the international players.", taken from rugbypass. I don't think the SH quite gets the increasing amount of stakeholders in the NH which suggests a bit of naivety on their part.

The stumbling block appears to be the Top 14 has more fixtures to fulfill and potentially want it to run over xmas in to the new proposed season. It's all ludicrous because their players, i.e. the ones that allow them to actually play rugby, will burn out.

It seems like 90% of all parties are on board with the new calendar with the exception being the French. I'd just push it forward and leave them to suffer.

I'd really like my winter grassroots rugby not to be interrupted by the pro game and i'd love to watch the pro game on summer evenings. Everybody wins except for people playing rugby in the borders during the winter. Nobody wins there.

by tigertattie Wed 17 Jun 2020, 12:55 pm

Apparently the SRU asked the Border clubs if they wanted to play "summer rugby"

The Border clubs replied with "What is summer"

by Hazel Sapling Wed 17 Jun 2020, 4:14 pm

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/53082987

Confirming what was considered a done deal.

Sarries are going to have a good Scots contingent next season (Swinson, Hunter Hill, Maitland, Taylor)

by **BigGee** Wed 17 Jun 2020, 8:20 pm

Hazel Sapling wrote:https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/53082987

Confirming what was considered a done deal.

Sarries are going to have a good Scots contingent next season (Swinson, Hunter Hill, Maitland, Taylor)

A three year contract for him as well, that is a sign of confidence and no reason why he should not push on with them now

by **RDW** Wed 17 Jun 2020, 11:26 pm

Great move for CHH and helps broaden Scotland's lock depth.

by bsando Thu 18 Jun 2020, 12:16 pm

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/52979084

by **NeilyBroon** Thu 18 Jun 2020, 12:31 pm

bsando wrote:https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/52979084

Well... as expected I guess.

Bit of a damp squib of a game with Glasgow and Edinburgh but at least gives a chance of a warm-up and pray that the players don't knock ten shades out of each other and we end up with a tonne of preseason injury woes.

Edinburgh have a good chance to win the title as the wind has been taken out of Leinster's sails a wee bit, given the lengthy pause. It now depends on who can get fired up quickly. That being said, this season will likely be written off by many fans of the pro14 as a dud anyway, so even if Edinburgh won the Corona crown the achievement would definitely be dampened somewhat.

by **RDW** Thu 18 Jun 2020, 12:32 pm

Good news for both teams. Edinburgh get a playoff and Champions Cup, Glasgow get Champions Cup.

by **BigGee** Thu 18 Jun 2020, 12:34 pm

So, finally some rugby to look forward to

You would imagine the players will be in and training properly from the begining of July

by bsando Thu 18 Jun 2020, 12:48 pm

Yeah works well for Glasgow and Edinburgh especially. I don’t mind the double header with Glasgow actually, it’ll be a fun watch regardless. Still feels a long way off but I guess from then onwards we’ll get a lot of rugby until the end of the year assuming they finish 6N and get some autumn internationals going and jump into new 20/21 season

by **RDW** Fri 19 Jun 2020, 6:05 am

Would thoroughly recommend the latest Edinburgh rugby podcast with Jim Hamilton. He certainly likes to talk, but there's a lot of good stories in there.

https://www.edinburghrugby.org/the-clubhouse/official-edinburgh-podcast

Really talking up the Scotland player's chances in the Lions - he cites McInally as one of the best hookers available (which I agree with), and if Ritchie and Watson are fit and on form they are shoe ins. I would agree with their quality, but can't imagine both will travel in such a competitive position.

by tigertattie Fri 19 Jun 2020, 11:07 am

Watson and McNally should be going and really should be in the test sqaud.

Hogg will go but is fighting with Liam Williams for FB

Ritchie has time for future tours think. I dont see Gats taking him as there's a richness of talent there so every excuse for him not to take a Scotsman.

by **NeilyBroon** Fri 19 Jun 2020, 12:17 pm

Gatland essentially admitted in a recent interview that Tam was the obligatory second Scot on the last tour because he didnt want to leave Hoggy all alone, then repeated it was because of the England loss he didn't pick Scots. Forget the fact that a lot of Scottish players play in successful clubs as well as Scotland. If you're picking individuals for a team pick individuals. Then we'd see at least 4/5 Scots on tour on merit, that I think would be a much fairer reflection of the quality we have. This lions tour will just be another damp squib for Scotland fans. The whole excitement of it is seeing your exceptional players play with the other home nations exceptional players. I still support the team because we're all part of the same islands but it just doesn't have the intrigue for me.

We'd be lucky to see anyone other than Hogg on tour, unless Darcy gets a run of non-injury form. Watson and Ritchie will be on standby, no doubt behind Welsh players, McInally may have a chance but I expect Gatland will cite Scotland's set piece as a reason not to pick him. The only other bolter might be Fagerson because of the lack of quality tight head props elsewhere but even then it'll probably just be Samson Lee.

by Hazel Sapling Fri 19 Jun 2020, 1:33 pm

I am not so negative NeilyBroon. The back five are the toughest spots. With the decline of Murray, Webb and Sexton the outhalves are more open than last time and the rest of the backs are relatively open to challenge.

Front row is where I reckon we could get some joy. Outside of Jamie George, the hooker spots are up for grabs with an aging Owens (34 at time of tour), some young Irishmen and back-up England players all that stands in the way of McInally and Brown. LH is a mess after M Vunipola and Healy (both have had injury problems). TH is maybe the toughest spot with Furlong, Porter, Sinckler and Francis but Z Fagerson outplayed all of them in the last Six Nations and, if he can back it up in the coming months, has to be a shoe in.

by **NeilyBroon** Fri 19 Jun 2020, 2:44 pm

Oh I agree Fagerson should be, as should Watson, Graham (injury dependent), McInally and at a push, Sutherland (again provided he continues on the same trajectory), Russell (if he shows he can be a big boy and play for country after a bit of handbags with the coach). Doesn't mean it will happen though! Think of all the players (including Watson) we were saying should be a shoe in for a place in 2017.

I just don't believe for a second that Gatland will change his selection policy. He's a successful coach so why should he after all? His mantra is purely results focused so he works with players and systems he knows. He's worked in every system except the Scottish one. Irish coach, 5 years or so at wasps and the English prem, 10 years coaching Wales. Whether it's intentional or not he'll always have more of a bias towards cultures he's familiar with, and probably still sees Scotland as a basket case and therefore if Scotland perform badly that justifies his possible viewpoint that the players aren't so good, wrongly or rightly.

The only other potential avenue is if Toonie takes an assistant role or Cockers or Tandy. Then we should see a better representation of Scotland in the Lions. As I said I'd be happy with 5/6 players representing Scotland, that's still a small proportion of the squad but these are all players who could push for the test squad and is fair based on the number of registered pros in Scotland relative to the others.

We all get excited each time though and each time we either end up with a broken player (Seymour) or a tackle bag holder called away from our summer tour. I just can't see Gatland doing anything different UNLESS he has a strong voice in camp from the Scottish contingent.

by **RDW** Fri 19 Jun 2020, 10:59 pm

Hamilton made the point that we're needing to change our perception as a rugby nation - to the others we're seen as a bit of s charity case just now. He mentioned a press conference a few months ago where Gatland was asked about Scottish lion potential - he couldn't think of any names so just said "Hoggy" and the journos in the room all had a good laugh.

In the last few years we have had more than enough good results and standout performances to genuinely deserve more players represented. However I feel we're going to have to do something extraordinary, particularly away from home, for that to really change.

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