Ireland vs New Zealand 8th November

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Ireland (15-1):

Hugo Keenan, Mack Hansen, Garry Ringrose, Bundee Aki, James Lowe, Jack Crowley, Jamison Gibson-Park, Caelan Doris (capt), Josh van der Flier, Tadhg Beirne, James Ryan, Joe McCarthy, Finlay Bealham, Ronan Kelleher, Andrew Porter.

Replacements: Rob Herring, Cian Healy, Tom O'Toole, Iain Henderson, Peter O'Mahony, Conor Murray, Ciaran Frawley, Jamie Osborne.

New Zealand (1-15)

1. Tamaiti Williams, 2. Asafo Aumua, 3. Tyrel Lomax, 4. Scott Barrett (Captain), 5. Tupou Vaa’i, 6. Wallace Sititi, 7. Sam Cane, 8. Ardie Savea (Vice-Captain), 9. Cortez Ratima, 10. Damian McKenzie, 11. Caleb Clarke, 12. Jordie Barrett (Vice-Captain), 13. Rieko Ioane, 14. Mark Tele’a, 15. Will Jordan

Replacements: 16. George Bell, 17. Ofa Tu’ungafasi, 18. Pasilio Tosi, 19. Patrick Tuipulotu, 20. Samipeni Finau, 21. Cam Roigard, 22. Anton Lienert-Brown, 23. Stephen Perofeta

Overall a real low quality affair. And I agree the NZ 9 very poor and appeared out of his depth.

I can see it going a wrong in the last 20

Tom O'Toole making a brief appearance before heading off very groggy

Belham comes back on and immediately concedes a pen

15-13 NZ

Ridiculous penalty. The Kiwi clearly stepped out. Bealham low and square.

This is the worst I've seen Ireland play in years. They're still in this though.

Another stupid penalty.
So now we will start to chase the game, try and force more, make more mistakes and gift NZ territory and points

Another silly penalty and another 3 points

18-13 NZ

12 pens to 5. Not seen the Irish discipline be this bad in a while. NZ haven't looked like scoring a try but haven't needed to.

still anyone's game. This second half has been good knuckle dragging fun,

This is more frustrating than last week. Ireland dont need to try and slow NZ ball down as their defence is sound and NZ don't look like scoring from open play.

Great try and probably the game

To easy for NZ

Far far too many mistakes from Ireland. You don't go fresh into a game v New Zealand when they have played the week before. Poor forward planning of the schedule from Ireland.

Has frawley put his boots on his hands?

The new Kiwi hooker is excellent....serious impact V England and very good tonight

Ireland really all over the place, not what we have come to expect

It has not been a great game for them

That was a kick

neilthom7 wrote:Far far too many mistakes from Ireland.  You don't go fresh into a game v New Zealand when they have played the week before.  Poor forward planning of the schedule from Ireland.

What does that say about the planning from England?

doctor_grey wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:Far far too many mistakes from Ireland.  You don't go fresh into a game v New Zealand when they have played the week before.  Poor forward planning of the schedule from Ireland.

What does that say about the planning from England?

To be fair, the England game was already one week outside the international window

They really did not have much scope

doctor_grey wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:Far far too many mistakes from Ireland.  You don't go fresh into a game v New Zealand when they have played the week before.  Poor forward planning of the schedule from Ireland.

What does that say about the planning from England?

England hadn't played either but All Blacks also hadn't played in over a month so not as bad as giving them a nice warm up game then playing them

neilthom7 wrote:

doctor_grey wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:Far far too many mistakes from Ireland.  You don't go fresh into a game v New Zealand when they have played the week before.  Poor forward planning of the schedule from Ireland.

What does that say about the planning from England?

England hadn't played either but All Blacks also hadn't played in over a month so not as bad as giving them a nice warm up game then playing them

Did NZ not have a warm up against Japan?

Christ Frawley is having a terrible game

Frawley's cameo here has not done him any favours in getting that 10 shirt, he has been really sloppy since coming on

Has been dreadful from Ireland, utterly miserable performance. Ball in hand they've made so many basic errors. Struggled to go more than four phases without knocking on. At the ruck they've conceded so many needless penalties, and failed to adapt to Berry's refereeing.

A quite un-New Zealand like win as well. 23 points, 18 off the boot!

Pretty poor from Ireland

Not what we have come to expect unfortunately

BigGee wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:

doctor_grey wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:Far far too many mistakes from Ireland.  You don't go fresh into a game v New Zealand when they have played the week before.  Poor forward planning of the schedule from Ireland.

What does that say about the planning from England?

England hadn't played either but All Blacks also hadn't played in over a month so not as bad as giving them a nice warm up game then playing them

Did NZ not have a warm up against Japan?

Ah they did I forgot about that, although it wasn't the full first NZ team but I take the point.  I'd say bad planning by England but I suppose they couldn't do much since they couldn't have a warm up game the week before.

Well, I think I got my money's worth from that second half. Ireland was amazing defensively in that first half. Second half was big boy Rugby.

It could be that Robertson is finally bringing the All Blacks back? They seemed to have a specific plan and got most of right.

Well done NZ - fully deserving of the win. Controlled the game from minute 1.

As far Ireland....can see them having an uncomfortable training week next week!

Also far play to Scott Robertson. Coming into this tour I thought they were looking very vulnerable, and I've been critical of him setting up the team to play like it's Super Rugby. A win at Twickenham and the Aviva - they're proper Test Match animals now.

Congrats NZ. Been written off for the last two weeks by the "pundits" and have come away with two wins

Wow the Irish looked undercooked. Needed a warm up game or not playing enough in the URC I don't know. They were tactically out thought tonight and lost the breakdown, scrum and lineout.

Well done NZ, looked a lot slicker than Ireland, their subs too made a good difference.

Too many errors from Ireland, subs also poor when they came on Henderson with the penalty, Frawley just generally awful when he came on. O'Toole won't be playing next week I'm guessing after the way he was wobbling around from the head injury.

doctor_grey wrote:Well, I think I got my money's worth from that second half.  Ireland was amazing defensively in that first half.  Second half was big boy Rugby.  

I might ask for a refund

Well played NZ. Did what they had to do to get the win. Ireland far to many stupid penalties and some very inaccurate play.

I said it before the game but we need to have more impact from our forwards on the bench. We needed a Baird or Izzy or both to come on.
And we need to find a couple more props. Exactly where the next international props are coming from I'm not sure. Young Wilson at Ulster looks like he has potential.
Ah well on to next week

Wow the Irish looked undercooked. Needed a warm up game or not playing enough in the URC I don't know. They were tactically out thought tonight and lost the breakdown, scrum and lineout.

Theres a lot of top international teams that are rebuilding or not at their best or consistent.....

Goes to show it's tight up the top 5, with teams very close. Will be interesting to see how France play this autumn.

Not irelands day and a pretty pragmatic grind it out victory from NZ

Not a pretty game at all

The calling of penalties for blocking kick chasers caused chaos. It will be interesting to see how this develops

formerly known as Sam wrote:

Maine man wrote:Ireland scrum is creaking more than my bed on Valentines Day!

The weight of all those empty ice cream tubs and beer bottles causing havoc with the springs?

You're not a million miles away from the truth. As Mrs Maine Man says, birthdays and Christmas if you behave yourself

neilthom7 wrote:

BigGee wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:All Blacks also hadn't played in over a month

Did NZ not have a warm up against Japan?

Ah they did I forgot about that, although it wasn't the full first NZ team but I take the point.

I was at the Japan game. One thing it showcased was DMac's impressive kicking form, as he slotted several conversions from near the touchline. That clutch conversion against England didn't come as a surprise.

Maine man wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:

Maine man wrote:Ireland scrum is creaking more than my bed on Valentines Day!

The weight of all those empty ice cream tubs and beer bottles causing havoc with the springs?

You're not a million miles away from the truth. As Mrs Maine Man says, birthdays and Christmas if you behave yourself

Twice a year you lucky devil you. I'll tell my long suffering other half she's being stingy.

TJ wrote:Not irelands day and a pretty pragmatic grind it out victory from NZ

Not a pretty game at all

The calling of penalties for blocking kick chasers caused chaos.  It will be interesting to see how this develops

Finally the blocking of chasers being stopped creating some good aerial duals. Enjoyed that element of the game.

Re Ireland, are we seeing the loss of Mike Catt as attack coach? They really were lacking a cutting edge and felt like the were going through the motions a touch.

I enjoyed game, pretty error strewn especially  first half but enthralling.
Also think it somewhat puts England into perspective, NZ are on the up again.

Very interesting test.

13 penalties conceded, 30 missed tackles and 21 handling errors - not much more needs to be said. The conditions were greasy and it obviously didn't help but Ireland have been characterised in the past 5 years by their low error count so Farrell will be nonplussed at this. When watching the replay however, they will realise that NZ were tight all over the park and just didn't give them anything.

I would obviously rather my paddy cousins won, but this was a correction which will be good for them. They will sharpen up for the other games in the test but I hope that this delays or diverts the narrative that the Lions just need to send the Irish squad and they'll win. Not so. Wallabies are a very different prospect obviously, but there are skillsets that the other home nations have that will complement this group of players.

NZ fully deserved that.

Ireland really need to become more ruthless with team selections. Having Healy, POM and Henderson coming off the bench is beyond ridiculous.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:NZ fully deserved that.

Ireland really need to become more ruthless with team selections. Having Healy, POM and Henderson coming off the bench is beyond ridiculous.

It's where the game was lost. Those geriatric players just went on to prove they have no place on squad of a serious, top class international test.
Add that to losing O'Toole meaning the knackered Bealham had to effectively play 80 mins.
Then add the fact that Frawley was a one man Poopie show and a there you have it.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

TJ wrote:Not irelands day and a pretty pragmatic grind it out victory from NZ

Not a pretty game at all

The calling of penalties for blocking kick chasers caused chaos.  It will be interesting to see how this develops

Finally the blocking of chasers being stopped creating some good aerial duals. Enjoyed that element of the game.

Re Ireland, are we seeing the loss of Mike Catt as attack coach? They really were lacking a cutting edge and felt like the were going through the motions a touch.

I think Catt is massively underrated as a coach. Would have loved him to stay. He just sees the game in a completely different way to most.

Think this autumn is a massive missed opportunity for Ireland to get some younger players into the environment.
Sheridan, Gavin, McCann, Poselthwait all need to be in the squad

I think the AB game plan was pretty simple, but obviously effective.  They seemed to me to make a lot more of the up the jumper, channel 1 or 2 runs with the pods in the first half.  That was physically demanding stuff and likely took some of the wind out of Ireland's sails.  Match was still knife edge close almost the whole way.

But was still a great game for a neutral to watch.  Good old fashioned grind it out stuff.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:NZ fully deserved that.

Ireland really need to become more ruthless with team selections. Having Healy, POM and Henderson coming off the bench is beyond ridiculous.

I've obviously not been paying attention as I was surprised when I saw POM as I thought he'd retired ...