British and Irish Cup Draw

by **Notch** Fri 17 Jun 2011, 2:23 pm

Well, I see this has been missed and I am completely unsurprised. It was very difficult to find any information on it (in fact I was beginning to think it was a secret) but finally I found the draw and schedule on the WRU website. It's the one you've been waiting for... the draw for the British and Irish Cup 2011/2012!

One thing that's misleading is they say Ulster, Munster, Leinster etc. when really it's our A team. Used to give players who are out of the team some gametime and mainly trial prospects in the Academy and sub-Academy.

There's a slightly confusing new format involved;

The third British & Irish Cup will see a change in format, with a cross-Pool fixture list which guarantees two home fixtures for each side and with all English ties played in midweek to ease potential weekend fixture congestion.

Anyway, here are the pools and schedule;

Pool 1: Ayr, Cornish Pirates, Moseley, Neath,

Pool 2: Bristol Rugby, Cross Keys, Plymouth Albion, Munster

Pool 3: Aberavon, Bedford Blues, Leinster, London Scottish

Pool 4: Esher Rugby, Llanelli, London Welsh, Melrose

Pool 5: Currie, Doncaster Knights, Rotherham Titans, Pontypridd

Pool 6: Leeds Carnegie, Nottingham Rugby, Swansea, Ulster,

Round 1 (September 21): Cornish Pirates v Bristol Rugby, Moseley v Plymouth, London Scottish v London Welsh, Bedford Blues v Esher, Nottingham Rugby v Doncaster Knights, Leeds Carnegie v Rotherham Titans. (November 19): Neath v Munster, Ayr v Cross Keys, Aberavon v Llanelli, Leinster v Melrose, Currie v Ulster, Pontypridd v Swansea

Round 2 (October 12): Plymouth v Cornish Pirates, Bristol Rugby v Mosley, Esher v London Scottish, London Welsh v Bedford Blues, Doncaster Knights v Leeds Carnegie, Rotherham Titans v Nottingham Rugby. (December 10): Munster vs. Ayr, Llanelli v Leinster, Ulster v Pontypridd, Cross Keys v Neath, Melrose v Aberavon, Swansea v Currie

Round 3 (November 12): Cross Keys v Moseley, Munster v Cornish Pirates, Bristol Rugby v Neath, Plymouth v Ayr, Melrose v Bedford Blues, Llanelli v London Scottish, London Welsh v Aberavon, Esher v Leinster, Swansea v Rotherham Titans, Ulster v Doncaster Knights, Leeds Carnegie v Currie, Nottingham Rugby v Pontypridd

Round 4 (December 17): Mosley v Munster, Cornish Pirates v Cross Keys, Neath v Plymouth, Ayr v Bristol Rugby, Bedford Blues v Llanelli, London Scottish v Melrose, Aberavon v Esher, Leinster v London Welsh, Rotherham Titans v Ulster, Doncaster Knights v Swansea, Currie v Nottingham Rugby, Pontypridd v Leeds Carnegie

Quarter finals: January 21, 2012

Semi finals: April 7

Final: April 28

What does everyone think of this tournament? All joking aside, I like it because it gives Ulster a chance to give talented guys who are playing club rugby in the three big provinces in Ireland the chance to work in a professional environment with the provincial coaches and play a decent standard of opposition. We get something out of it, so do the players; young American lock Scott La Valla played for the Ulster Ravens at number 8 in this competition against Moseley, Aberavon and away against Swansea when he was playing club rugby in Dublin. Adding that to his appearances with the USA Eagles arguably helped him build his profile a little bit. He's now been picked up by Stade Francais.

But do the fans get anything out of it? Are you a fan of a Welsh, English or Scottish club side competing in this tournament? Does it benefit your club? And are you excited about this competition?

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Fri 17 Jun 2011, 2:36 pm

Notch, I like the competition, and think it has an important place in the calendar - it's good to have a competition between clubs of different nations at the level just below pro elite. As a London Scottish season ticket holder, the match I will definitely go and see is the home fixture against Melrose (not so fussed about London Welsh or Esher cos we'll meet them in the league, and a trip to Llanelli won't compete with a Sandy Park home fixture) thumbsup

by **Notch** Fri 17 Jun 2011, 2:44 pm

I like it on the whole as well actually- despite my slightly acerbic opening post. Nasty habit that; I have the cynicism Rolling Eyes

From an Irish perspective, it's better than just playing Munster A and Leinster A, midweek in the afternoon.

Some of the young guys who have gone on to play in the Magners League and Ireland U20s etc. have played in this competition. Some guys who have played for some of the more prominent Welsh clubs have gone on to regional rugby.

I do feel there are mismatches. I remember Ulster Ravens beating Aberavon 68-0 at Ravenhill, and I just felt bad for them y'know- a motivated side of professionals and Academy players was named that night and there was a bit of a gulf. Since then, Ulster have named weaker sides in the competition.

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Fri 17 Jun 2011, 2:49 pm

Notch wrote:I like it on the whole as well actually- despite my slightly acerbic opening post. Nasty habit that; I have the cynicism

From an Irish perspective, it's better than just playing Munster A and Leinster A, midweek in the afternoon.

Some of the young guys who have gone on to play in the Magners League and Ireland U20s etc. have played in this competition. Some guys who have played for some of the more prominent Welsh clubs have gone on to regional rugby.

I do feel there are mismatches. I remember Ulster Ravens beating Aberavon 68-0 at Ravenhill, and I just felt bad for them y'know- a motivated side of professionals and Academy players was named that night and there was a bit of a gulf. Since then, Ulster have named weaker sides in the competition.

And for one so young?!?! censored

by Guest Fri 17 Jun 2011, 4:02 pm

So Llanelli have Aberavon, Leinster A, London Scottish and Bedford Blues.

Quite looking forward to see how what is sometimes considered the Scarlets A side goes against the Leinster one, could be a nice little contest.

I quite like the B&I cup. Never see too much written up about it which is a shame, but it's a good competition I think.

by **Notch** Fri 17 Jun 2011, 4:04 pm

I was hoping we'd get Llanelli dreamer, or Bedford or a team of that calibre.

Our home matches are against Doncaster and Pontypridd. Away match with Nottingham could be good, some Ulster-born players have gone over there to play in the past. And I don't really know Currie, or what to expect.

by Guest Fri 17 Jun 2011, 4:08 pm

Ah Ponty will be a really good match for you Notch, they're a good side and did really well in this comptetition last year. Have a great pack although they're a bit wobbly at 10.

Don't know what to expect from Llanelli in this really, not sure how seriously it is they take it. And not knowing too much about Bedford, I would still hope that we could beat everyone in our group. We're definitely capable of it if we play like we did the in the semi-final and final of the Welsh Premiership this season.

by Shifty Fri 17 Jun 2011, 4:09 pm

I think it's a good competition, why not it's something different and gives players a chance to play a against teams from different countries Smile

.

by **Notch** Fri 17 Jun 2011, 4:21 pm

Bedford Blues are a good side Dreamer. Last season they played in the Championship playoff final against Worcester. They are definitely one of the stronger Championship sides. We played them in the first year of the competition and won well at home; but they chose to rest players. Their first team is strong, but will they pick them? Priorities, priorities...

I hope Ulster take it a little bit more seriously; in the first season we named very strong sides, with first team players, last year we named development sides with loads of very young players and cleared the bench in the second half regardless of the score.

Young guys will find it tough against grizzled packs that compete in the championship.

by red_stag Fri 17 Jun 2011, 4:23 pm

I hope Munster continue to name the academy boys even if our current crop are urine poor. I'd like to see it used as a means of testing up and coming coaches too. Anthony Foley started coaching our kiddies in this. Maybe O'Gara will do same in a year or two.

by Guest Fri 17 Jun 2011, 10:18 pm

I hope Munster A like playing on pitches with dog Poopie on them. If they do, they'll love Pandy Park in Crosskeys Wink

by **Notch** Sat 18 Jun 2011, 3:31 pm

red_stag wrote:I hope Munster continue to name the academy boys even if our current crop are urine poor. I'd like to see it used as a means of testing up and coming coaches too. Anthony Foley started coaching our kiddies in this. Maybe O'Gara will do same in a year or two.

You know Stag, thats worked very well for Munster. But in the first year of the competition we had experienced players alongside very inexperienced players and I think they learnt a lot more from that set-up than a very weakened team that is well-beaten. Even some weeks, players like BJ Botha and Isaac Boss would help them prepare and pass on their experience. At that time almost every game came on a weekend the senior side wasn't playing so the coaches and senior players would be around to help the Ravens prepare. It made the step-up to Magners League level much ore natural and easy.

Now, with the extra games against the Italian sides we have four extra games to contend with in the calendar. The games fall on weekends when we are playing now. So, unfortunately, that coupled with us having a relatively small squad means we can no longer take the approach which has worked best for us. Instead young players have to learn on the fly in the Magners League.

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