My Top 50 boxers of all time list

First topic message reminder :

1. Floyd Mayweather Jr
2. Sugar Ray Robinson
3. Muhammad Ali
4. Harry Greb
5. Henry Armstrong
6. Sugar Ray Leonard
7. Benny Leonard
8. Willie Pep
9. Tommy Hearns
10. Pernell Whitaker
11. Lennox Lewis
12. Joe Louis
13. Sam Langford
14. Gene Tunney
15. Ezzard Charles
16. Eder Jofre
17. Stanley Ketchel
18. Jack Johnson
19. Joe Gans
20. Bob Fitzsimmons
21. Roberto Duran
22. Bernard Hopkins
23. Marvin Hagler
24. Jimmy Wilde
25. Manny Pacquiao
26. Ricardo Lopez
27. Archie Moore
28. Barney Ross
29. Tony Canzoneri
30. Oscar De La Hoya
31. Roy Jones Junior
33. Alexis Arguello
33. Aaron Pryor
34. Mickey Walker
35. Sandy Saddler
36. Jake LaMotta
37. Evander Holyfield
38. Carlos Monzon
39. Larry Holmes
40. George Foreman
41. Julio Cesar Chavez
42. Charley Burley
43. Jack Dempsey
44. Michael Spinks
45. Ted Lewis
46. Joe Frazier
47. Salvador Sanchez
48. Erik Morales
49. Don Curry
50. Juan Manuel Marquez

Feel free to criticise my list. Add who you want on the list and who you dont. If im convinced I might change the list. You can also produce your own top 50 list.

Not like Arguello was established at the time of the Marcel fight was it or that it was for a world title but your right that victory means nothing like Durans over Leonard of Mayweathers over Mosley or De La Hoya.

The genius of PBF wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Other than that win they're fairly equal but that pushes him a notch above the pair

Duran beat Leonard but you seem to be making excuses for that or is it a one way thing where a controversial win can be excused but a close win gets dismissed?

Arguello got knocked out by a bum early in his career that doesn't make the bum higher than Corrales etc now does it, this is what I mean by buttlicking the old timers and past fighters...Leonard had a off night in the 1st fight and the 2nd fight showed the gulf in class.

You could say the same in reverse if you were so inclined. Leonard has admitted that he waited until Duran had got himself out of condition through partying.

The genius of PBF wrote:Duran is one of the most overrated fighters there is...had the worst record out of fab 4, lost to all 3 yet gets rated higher than them!!!

Considering he beat the best of the three, went the distance with a career 160lb guy in Hagler, and was beaten by a guy with a huge height and reach advantage in Hearns...despite Duran's best weight being 135lbs. Yeah, he was so rubbish..(!)

Sure Mayweather hasn't lost (yet), but has he taken on the same kind of challenges? No.

The genius of PBF wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:The modern era has it's greats but Castillo and Coralles aren't even at Marcels level who people forget was a very very good featherweight, retired after comfortably beating the great Alexis Arguello

Can we use stomach cramps as an excuse for Duran losing to Leonard then PBF?

He has one win over Arguello and that makes him better than Castillo and Corrales...It's you who forgets how good Corrales and Castillo was and also it was a young Arguello he beat.

Duran lost, Floyd Mayweather did not and will not get beat...Duran quit as well.

Also why couldn't Duran get it done the 2nd time? Knew he got lucky in the 1st fight.

We COULD argue that Mayweather didn't rematch Oscar because he 'knew use got lucky in the 1st fight'.

Why because you buttlick the old timers all the time and have the mentality that the modern era cant have any greats?
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but you dont 'buttlick' Mayweather? i know you do.

Balti, what do you think is more impressive, wins over de la Hoya, Baldomir, Hatton and a lightweight in Marquez, or Benitez, Duran, Hagler and Hearns? i have absolutely no doubt in my mind Leonard would of beat Mayweather, faster, better boxer, better determination to fight the best, legend. SRR is much, much better as well.

We can argue Duran never called out Hearns again and yet wanted Leonard and Hagler..

Young_Towzer wrote:Why because you buttlick the old timers all the time and have the mentality that the modern era cant have any greats?
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but you dont 'buttlick' Mayweather? i know you do.

Still obsessed as ever with me.

Miguel Cotto will never ever make the top 50 list. 8)

Balti what do you think is more impressive an unbeaten record or....

rolled like a drunk against Hearns
Outboxed by Kirkland Laing/Benitez/Leonard/Sims etc......

Ask him that...

BALTIMORA wrote:

The genius of PBF wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:The modern era has it's greats but Castillo and Coralles aren't even at Marcels level who people forget was a very very good featherweight, retired after comfortably beating the great Alexis Arguello

Can we use stomach cramps as an excuse for Duran losing to Leonard then PBF?

He has one win over Arguello and that makes him better than Castillo and Corrales...It's you who forgets how good Corrales and Castillo was and also it was a young Arguello he beat.

Duran lost, Floyd Mayweather did not and will not get beat...Duran quit as well.

Also why couldn't Duran get it done the 2nd time? Knew he got lucky in the 1st fight.

We COULD argue that Mayweather didn't rematch Oscar because he 'knew use got lucky in the 1st fight'.

Mayweather won 8 or 9 rounds clearly...stupid comparison but coming from you im not suprised.

Still obsessed as ever with me. Very Happy

Miguel Cotto will never ever make the top 50 list.
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your wum tactics wont work with me, so i'd keep saying obsessed, if it makes you feel better say obsessed, or obsessed, or again?

well he won't make your top 50 list, but your bias and have a rage against Miguel, so not to worry, but you have Curry there who Cotto would of eat your a wum, don't fool me, coxy's spot on what he said. Haha

Mayweather beat four current top 10 p4pers at the time...Only Leonard of the modern day fighters can match that.....

Duran won a contentious decision but which other legends did he beat????

Cuevas was finished..Dejesus wasn't top 10 p4p???

Balti what do you think is more impressive an unbeaten record or....

rolled like a drunk against Hearns
Outboxed by Kirkland Laing/Benitez/Leonard/Sims etc......

Ask him that...
.................................
The best lightweight of all time, moved up to be first man to beat the great Sugar man

BALTIMORA wrote:

The genius of PBF wrote:Duran is one of the most overrated fighters there is...had the worst record out of fab 4, lost to all 3 yet gets rated higher than them!!!

Considering he beat the best of the three, went the distance with a career 160lb guy in Hagler, and was beaten by a guy with a huge height and reach advantage in Hearns...despite Duran's best weight being 135lbs. Yeah, he was so rubbish..(!)

Sure Mayweather hasn't lost (yet), but has he taken on the same kind of challenges? No.

Hagler 2-0-1
Leonard 4-1-1
Hearns 1-1-2
Duran 1-3

Wasn't the best lightweight of alltime..

Benny Leonard was.......

Also lost to Leonard by being embarassed and quit like a dog..

Humiliated against Hearns......lost to lot's of others too including dejesus, Benitez, Hagler, Sims etc.....

Now who has Mayweather lost to??

Young_Towzer wrote:
Still obsessed as ever with me. Very Happy

Miguel Cotto will never ever make the top 50 list.
...........................
your wum tactics wont work with me, so i'd keep saying obsessed, if it makes you feel better say obsessed, or obsessed, or again?

well he won't make your top 50 list, but your bias and have a rage against Miguel, so not to worry, but you have Curry there who Cotto would of eat your a wum, don't fool me, coxy's spot on what he said. Haha

Cotto beats Curry???

Your following me about on my articles and im the obsessed one? Ok

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Mayweather beat four current top 10 p4pers at the time...Only Leonard of the modern day fighters can match that.....

Duran won a contentious decision but which other legends did he beat????

Cuevas was finished..Dejesus wasn't top 10 p4p???

Mosley was finished, Hatton was a never was and the less said about Marquez the better, you make out these wins are something extra special when they are not

Palomino, Buchanan, Cuevas and Leonard are all hall of famers while Marcel and Dejesus are normally always in contention for a place, guessing all of them were finished

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Wasn't the best lightweight of alltime..

Benny Leonard was.......

Joe Gans for me.

Also lost to Leonard by being embarassed and quit like a dog..

Humiliated against Hearns......lost to lot's of others too including dejesus, Benitez, Hagler, Sims etc.....

Now who has Mayweather lost to??
...........................
Hasn't fought anyone near the calibre of Leonard, Hagler, Duran, Benitez, did Hagler lose? thought so, did Ottke lose? thought not. So Ottke's better?

I aint deceived by an unbeaten record, has a nack of handpicking absolute bums, i don't get deceived by that. It's not a legit opinion anyway to have him ranked 1 by an obsessed fan and also a wum, didn't Curry also 'quit like a dog'? and get absolutely obliterated by a slugger in Honeyghan, he's ranked 50th, but no Bodysnatcher who sparked him clean out, or as you say 'rolled him like a drunk', but of course Truss in your head he played with Mike didn't he? he must of been too tired to keep playing after being knocked sparko though!

and Leonard brawled with Duran too Ghosty and got a contentious decision...what happened when Leonard boxed?????Duran should've been thrown out against Buchanan and thumbed Moore in the first round...and got a gift against Barkley!!!!

b*****cks you talk some rubbish

Hatton was unbeaten, Oscar was at 154 suiting Oscar!!! Marquez is still winning now.....Mosley was coming off a good performance..

Bull---

did Hagler lose?????? No.

Imperial Ghosty wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Mayweather beat four current top 10 p4pers at the time...Only Leonard of the modern day fighters can match that.....

Duran won a contentious decision but which other legends did he beat????

Cuevas was finished..Dejesus wasn't top 10 p4p???

Mosley was finished, Hatton was a never was and the less said about Marquez the better, you make out these wins are something extra special when they are not

Palomino, Buchanan, Cuevas and Leonard are all hall of famers while Marcel and Dejesus are normally always in contention for a place, guessing all of them were finished

It's just you buttlicking the past fighters again and discrediting a true great. You bring up Marcel when Mosley, Hatton, Marquez. Corrales etc are better.

Fact is Duran lost to Dejesus in his prime...quit against Leonard, humiliated against Hearns and lost to the no-mark Laing....

He fought better opposition for sure and bar leonard controversy!!!

Got slapped...end of..

As for Hagler losing...Mayweather is unbeaten and above Hagler...

Young_Towzer wrote:Also lost to Leonard by being embarassed and quit like a dog..

Humiliated against Hearns......lost to lot's of others too including dejesus, Benitez, Hagler, Sims etc.....

Now who has Mayweather lost to??
...........................
Hasn't fought anyone near the calibre of Leonard, Hagler, Duran, Benitez, did Hagler lose? thought so, did Ottke lose? thought not. So Ottke's better?

I aint deceived by an unbeaten record, has a nack of handpicking absolute bums, i don't get deceived by that. It's not a legit opinion anyway to have him ranked 1 by an obsessed fan and also a wum, didn't Curry also 'quit like a dog'? and get absolutely obliterated by a slugger in Honeyghan, he's ranked 50th, but no Bodysnatcher who sparked him clean out, or as you say 'rolled him like a drunk', but of course Truss in your head he played with Mike didn't he? he must of been too tired to keep playing after being knocked sparko though!

Mr delusional supports the BNP says all you need to know about the guy.

Duran beat Leonard fair and square, the more you protest against that the more bitter you look, you can't handle the fact that a panamanian beat the top man of American boxing

Can always tell when you've been gotten the better of you start to get aggressive

Hatton wasn't all that and never will be, De La Hoya was past his best and whether the weight suited him or not doesn't change that fact. Mosley had scored a good win over Margarito but lets not make out he was anywhere near his best and Marquez will never be more than a lightweight.

Curry had a two inch gash above his eye....and the Doctor stopped the fight...which you'd know if you'd seen it....

Facts right...

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Balti what do you think is more impressive an unbeaten record or....

rolled like a drunk against Hearns
Outboxed by Kirkland Laing/Benitez/Leonard/Sims etc......

Ask him that...

It's not that clear cut though, because Ottke has an unbeaten record too, and we both know he's WAAAAY off any top 50.

I'm not denying Mayweather his dues, but I DO think you're a little hard on Duran, especially on the Hearns issue. It's the 'great big vs great little' argument, and in that context the result is less impressive than if they were of equal size or if Hearns had been the smaller man.

Perhaps if Hagler had moved up through the weights the way Duran did we'd have seen him rolled like a drunk, but he played it safe at middleweight. Not a criticism, just an observation.

The other guys you mention top-these guys are used as a stick to beat Duran with because they're guys a great should be expected to beat, but by that token Leonard should have beaten Duran first time out. Doesn't it massively affect Leonard's standing that he was beaten by a lightweight who was moving up?

I can't and won't make excuses for the other guys you named. Laing was named 'Upset of the Year', and sometimes these things happen-events which are unexpected and which buck the trend. There are a lot of ifs and buts which could be dragged out, but I won't because it does neither of us any credit.

As for that remark by this thread's OP...that's about what I'd expect from a WUM like him...

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Curry had a two inch gash above his eye....and the Doctor stopped the fight...which you'd know if you'd seen it....

Facts right...

You wouldn't see me letting the doc get in the way when I've a gash in my face... Ahem.

I said it was a contentious decision like Mosley-delaHoya...I had Leonard by one round....

It was controversial at the time....a lot of newspapers called it for Leonard..

not arguing with the call but it was contentious...

Won by a point...

F**k off with the gotten the better of....PBF and me have owned your worthless backside.

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Duran beat Leonard fair and square, the more you protest against that the more bitter you look, you can't handle the fact that a panamanian beat the top man of American boxing

Can always tell when you've been gotten the better of you start to get aggressive

Hatton wasn't all that and never will be, De La Hoya was past his best and whether the weight suited him or not doesn't change that fact. Mosley had scored a good win over Margarito but lets not make out he was anywhere near his best and Marquez will never be more than a lightweight.

Hatton was unbeaten and a great at 140, De La Hoya, Mosley and Marquez are greats as well, stop disrespecting the modern era.

The genius of PBF wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Mayweather beat four current top 10 p4pers at the time...Only Leonard of the modern day fighters can match that.....

Duran won a contentious decision but which other legends did he beat????

Cuevas was finished..Dejesus wasn't top 10 p4p???

Mosley was finished, Hatton was a never was and the less said about Marquez the better, you make out these wins are something extra special when they are not

Palomino, Buchanan, Cuevas and Leonard are all hall of famers while Marcel and Dejesus are normally always in contention for a place, guessing all of them were finished

It's just you buttlicking the past fighters again and discrediting a true great. You bring up Marcel when Mosley, Hatton, Marquez. Corrales etc are better.

Will accept that Mosley and Marquez will be placed higher than Marcel but in no shape or form are they better wins, as for Hatton, Corrales etc. (whoever they may be) simply put they weren't good

Discrediting a true great would be what you do against Mayweather or what your doing against Duran right now, placing Mayweather at number 23 is hardly discrediting him

Please answer me this, since when was Duran and old timer?

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:I said it was a contentious decision like Mosley-delaHoya...I had Leonard by one round....

It was controversial at the time....a lot of newspapers called it for Leonard..

not arguing with the call but it was contentious...

Won by a point...

F**k off with the gotten the better of....PBF and me have owned your worthless backside.

Of course you've owned Truss, so much so you've resorted to swearing, has your feeble argument really got that low?

Laing, dejesus, Benitez, Leonard, Sims, hagler vs unbeaten record at the top in 11 years......

game over...

Best wins over Buchanan, Dejesus, Palomino, Cuevas and Leonard up against De La Hoya, Mosley, Corrales, Castillo and Hatton

You sure are right Truss, it's game over and Duran has come out a clear winner

Imperial Ghosty wrote:

The genius of PBF wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Mayweather beat four current top 10 p4pers at the time...Only Leonard of the modern day fighters can match that.....

Duran won a contentious decision but which other legends did he beat????

Cuevas was finished..Dejesus wasn't top 10 p4p???

Mosley was finished, Hatton was a never was and the less said about Marquez the better, you make out these wins are something extra special when they are not

Palomino, Buchanan, Cuevas and Leonard are all hall of famers while Marcel and Dejesus are normally always in contention for a place, guessing all of them were finished

It's just you buttlicking the past fighters again and discrediting a true great. You bring up Marcel when Mosley, Hatton, Marquez. Corrales etc are better.

Will accept that Mosley and Marquez will be placed higher than Marcel but in no shape or form are they better wins, as for Hatton, Corrales etc. (whoever they may be) simply put they weren't good

Discrediting a true great would be what you do against Mayweather or what your doing against Duran right now, placing Mayweather at number 23 is hardly discrediting him

Please answer me this, since when was Duran and old timer?

When did I say Duran was a old timer??? Resorting to making stuff up means you been owned again.

BALTIMORA wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Balti what do you think is more impressive an unbeaten record or....

rolled like a drunk against Hearns
Outboxed by Kirkland Laing/Benitez/Leonard/Sims etc......

Ask him that...

It's not that clear cut though, because Ottke has an unbeaten record too, and we both know he's WAAAAY off any top 50.

I'm not denying Mayweather his dues, but I DO think you're a little hard on Duran, especially on the Hearns issue. It's the 'great big vs great little' argument, and in that context the result is less impressive than if they were of equal size or if Hearns had been the smaller man.

Perhaps if Hagler had moved up through the weights the way Duran did we'd have seen him rolled like a drunk, but he played it safe at middleweight. Not a criticism, just an observation.

The other guys you mention top-these guys are used as a stick to beat Duran with because they're guys a great should be expected to beat, but by that token Leonard should have beaten Duran first time out. Doesn't it massively affect Leonard's standing that he was beaten by a lightweight who was moving up?

I can't and won't make excuses for the other guys you named. Laing was named 'Upset of the Year', and sometimes these things happen-events which are unexpected and which buck the trend. There are a lot of ifs and buts which could be dragged out, but I won't because it does neither of us any credit.

As for that remark by this thread's OP...that's about what I'd expect from a WUM like him...

Making excuses for Durans hammering off Hearns are we? As for your last comment no D4 to stalk these days isit.

Mr delusional supports the BNP says all you need to know about the guy.
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Reported that
But you follow a guy, well your obsessed with a guy who calls Manny vile racist names ? haha, never been racist in me life, i would shake any BNP hand if they opposed the weirdos who burn poppys, etc, don't support them though i wouldn't support any narrow minded idiot who judges someone by what colour they are, not for me that pal. I've boxed with lads of Asian, African origin and been like family to me, nice try however at another WUM comment, i don't care if your yellow, black, purple, orange or gold, all the same to me, like i say though, reported you, you've had more bans than roy keane so should look at it.

Keep the swearing out of it please guys, whether censored or not. Swear filters are there for a purpose, don't try to work ways around it.

Becoming a habit this owning business PBF....

According to ghosty we shouldn't count the fight at 154 with Hearns because he had no business there...but we should count his wins against Barkley at 160, Moore at 154...and his performance v Hagler at 160

I will discuss this another time but you lot are showing yourselves up...Off to the gym play nice now.

Duran isn't good enough to be Floyd Mayweather's sparring partner. Duran a legend but nowhere near Floyd Mayweather's level.

The genius of PBF wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Castillo in many peoples eyes beat Mayweather first time around but didn't come close in the rematch, why not?

Calling Castillo and Coralles future hall of famers is going a bit too far, they were both very good but fell short of the highest level

Buchanan, Cuevas, Palomino and Leonard are already hall of famers and all beaten by Duran

Why because you buttlick the old timers all the time and have the mentality that the modern era cant have any greats?

Torn rotator cuff and didn't quit like a dog like Duran.

Accuse me of buttlicking old timers when i'm debating Duran

Putting two and two together means I get four

The genius of PBF wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Duran beat Leonard fair and square, the more you protest against that the more bitter you look, you can't handle the fact that a panamanian beat the top man of American boxing

Can always tell when you've been gotten the better of you start to get aggressive

Hatton wasn't all that and never will be, De La Hoya was past his best and whether the weight suited him or not doesn't change that fact. Mosley had scored a good win over Margarito but lets not make out he was anywhere near his best and Marquez will never be more than a lightweight.

Hatton was unbeaten and a great at 140, De La Hoya, Mosley and Marquez are greats as well, stop disrespecting the modern era.

Good wins, but not immune to criticism.

Hatton was fighting at a weight not his best-chosen by Mayweather for this very reason.

Oscar, while more suited to the weight, had not been as active and was past his best, having been beaten already four (some may say five) times already.

Mosley was a knackered has-been who'd been made to look somewhat shot against Mayorga before beating Margarito-who in turn could be claimed to have had his mind elsewhere when beaten by SSM.

Marquez-a modern great (Towzer may not agree...), sure, but not at 144, not by a long way.

The fact you brought up some tosh about the BNP shows me how desperate you're getting...

play nice champs, i'm off to the gym myself, it's 4.41 AM in Manilla, getting my training in for JMM, peace out gents

Smokescreening.........avoiding the argument..

Very good...

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Becoming a habit this owning business PBF....

According to ghosty we shouldn't count the fight at 154 with Hearns because he had no business there...but we should count his wins against Barkley at 160, Moore at 154...and his performance v Hagler at 160

Selective reasoning again on your part, at no point have I said we shouldn't count the Hearns fight but taking into account the vast size difference it plays down the significance of the loss, were he knocked out in two rounds at lightweight then you may have a point but he wasn't

The fact you brought up some tosh about the BNP shows me how desperate you're getting...
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how can you take seriously someone so bias as he is towards Mayweather? just saying!

Towzer..with all due respect you just said Curry quit like a dog when the Doctor stopped it..

Get your own house in order...

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Becoming a habit this owning business PBF....

According to ghosty we shouldn't count the fight at 154 with Hearns because he had no business there...but we should count his wins against Barkley at 160, Moore at 154...and his performance v Hagler at 160

Truss I really find it hard to believe you can't see why a win over a bigger guy means more than a loss to one. Just the simple principle of it. I'm not totally dismissing the losses, but the size has to be taken into account.

Dejesus beat him at his natural weight...

Mayweather is unbeaten from 130-154...have it anyway you like.