606v2 picks the best Irish RWC 22: STARTING BACK 3

First topic message reminder :

First of all wanted to say thanks to everyone who has contributed over the past few days the debates have been pretty good for the most part. We have had nearly 1000 votes and nearly 600 comments and a lot of people have contributed to what has been a really good couple of days debating. It's been great to hear so many opinions (even ones I have disagreed with) and to get a feel for what everyone thinks of certain players. There were a number of very tight calls between Hayes and Buckley, O'Leary and Murray and McFadden and Fitzgerald so it's been interesting to see people's opinions being tested against those of others.

In this series gets the same great reaction and that we hear some more great debates that were started or were not touched on in the previous series. Calls like; should Jennings be on the bench, the backrow selections, the fullback selection, should Stringer be selected on the bench are all going to be very interesting and am looking forward to hearing everyones opinions.


The idea of this series is to establish the first choice front row, second row, backrow, halfbacks, centres, back3, forwards subs and backs subs. These debates I may leave a little longer than the previous series as more can be said about them. The idea is to chose the best 22 that we have be it on form, experience, partnerships, balance, fitness whatever.

Perhaps think of this as the team you want to line out against Australia

IN THE SERIES PLEASE LOOK AT THE PLAYERS WHO HAVE BEEN/YOU THINK WILL BE PICKED LATER IN THE SERIES, AS TO CREATE BALANCE IN THE TEAM
eg: Playing Flannery would mean needing a work horse somewhere else in the pack as Best does a lot of the donkey work.

IF A PLAYER IS IN OUR SQUAD PLEASE TAKE FOR GRANTED THAT THEY CAME THROUGH THE WARM UPS AND THUS HAVE SOME FORM (IF NOT A LOT) AND ARE SOMEWHAT FIT. THIS IS OBVIOUSLY A HYPOTHETICAL SITUATION.

We are going to use the squad that we (the 606v2 community) have chosen.

Healy, Ross, Buckley, Court
Best, Cronin, Flannery
O'Connell, O'Callaghan, Cullen, Ryan
Ferris, O'Brien, Wallace, Jennings, Heaslip
Reddan, Stringer, O'Leary*
Sexton, O'Gara
O'Driscoll, Darcy, Wallace
Bowe, Earls, Trimble, Kearney, Jones, McFadden

*O'Leary just beat Murray yesterday evening in the poll by one vote.

So far the team is

Healy-Best-Ross
O'Connell-O'Callaghan
Ferris-Heaslip-Wallace
Reddan-Sexton
Darcy-O'Driscoll

This will be a toughie...brace yourselves......

EARLS: One of the quickest members in the squad if not the quickest. Excellent ballance, acceleration and agility, and thus a fantastic broken field runner. Primarily a winger due to his pace and exceptional finishing skills, he has a great strike rate. Good tackler and also a good kicker of the ball. Can play 15 but hasn't really been tested in this position for Ireland under the high ball, can be a worry in this area but hopefully that facet of his game has improved.
BOWE: One of the best finishers in Europe. Deceptively quick and strong can ride a tackle for a few metres or put his foot on the gas. Fairly good defence and also a very good fielder of the ball. runs great lines off the halfbacks in the lineout and off the centres in general play. Is also good at running support lines and is an adept offloader himself. One weakness would be his kicking game is not of a very high standard.
TRIMBLE: The most physical back 3 player we have. Is excellent in contact and can pump the legs well in the tackle area, also has a good fend off. His skills are much improved from passing, to fielding, to kicking although they may not be as good as those of other back3 players, his offloading is the most improved IMO. he runs good lines off his wing and could be a go to man due to his strength and power.
MCFADDEN: Another very quick player who can also play in the centres. has good leg drive in the tackle and breaks more than you would think he should. Good kicker and fielder. Inexperienced and hasn't had that much game time for either Leinster or Ireland. Strong in defence and appears to have big game tempermeant (Clermont game for example) but a lot of question marks about how much of his potential he will live up to.
JONES: Has been a star player this season at Munster and has showed incredible mental strength in overcoming injuries. Fast, reliable, strong in defence, on form, has vision, good skills are all things you would say about him. Seems safe enough (not Kearney) under the high ball but much more elusive going forward with the ball. And has joined the line well over the past number of months showing good hands. Untried at HCup level as well as International level however.
KEARNEY: Has been out for over 9 months and wasn't in great form pre that injury. Is probably the best player under the highball in the world over the last 3 years or so. Is very fast in a straight line and can kick the ball further than any other Irish player (Sexton and ROG possibly excluded). His attacking play however is not great and too often he runs straight into contact from deep, doesn't pass or offload often enough and when joining the line can be selfish. His defence can be questionable at times too.

Enjoy

Remember...

a) think of balance of the whole team
b) assume if they are in the squad they have some form and some fitness (not necessarily full fitness or good form)
c) play nice and no provincial stuff, attack the arguement not the person making it
d) to place your votes
e) back up your points with examples, clips etc if possible

[quote="MBTGOG"]Irish,

Ever think he might be able to come into the line from full back instead where there are more options than from the wing? [/quote]

Yes i do know that But I just think he would be better severed doing this from the wing

MBTGOG wrote:Opinion can't be wrong

My choice for Earls is that I can't see Australia kicking to us too much and I want the best attacking option there then and he is that. I like the balance in the back three with him, Trimble and Bowe and think it will do us best out of the options we have against Australia.

Australia will kick a decent amount of ball but I think earls will deal with it, hes come on a lot since he started. Also in the lions game that people love to bring up, I don't think he knocked on any kicks, he just couldnt catch any passes.

Sin é wrote:

Feckless Rogue wrote:Or maybe they could kick it to him a lot and he won't be able to handle it as well as a player who's first position is fullback, and it will put us under all sorts of pressure. The Aussie's will identify a potential weakness and they'll at least test him at the start to see if they get any change out of it.

Went well for him here - not too sure Australia will be kicking too many balls to him after this: (from about 1.50 min in).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYCk0KrEn6Y&feature=related

I love the way he uses the ref in that clip. Earls looks really unfit in that clip, its a brilliant break but he looks like he is running through treacle. He was very good in that game but I don't think aus will kick that badly against us and not have anyone chase the kick.

Irish Curry wrote:

MBTGOG wrote: Irish,

Ever think he might be able to come into the line from full back instead where there are more options than from the wing?

Yes i do know that But I just think he would be better severed doing this from the wing

He can do it from the wing but he would get his hands on the ball much more from fullback. Seeing earls running full speed at me with the ball in two hands would scare the Poopie out of me. He did it a few times against england and in particular on one occassion he did a loop with bod, if we saw that against aus with bowe or a backrower running off him, we could do some serious damage.

[quote="valjester"][quote="Irish Curry"][quote="MBTGOG"] Irish,

Ever think he might be able to come into the line from full back instead where there are more options than from the wing? [/quote]

Yes i do know that But I just think he would be better severed doing this from the wing[/quote]

He can do it from the wing but he would get his hands on the ball much more from fullback. Seeing earls running full speed at me with the ball in two hands would scare the Poopie out of me. He did it a few times against england and in particular on one occassion he did a loop with bod, if we saw that against aus with bowe or a backrower running off him, we could do some serious damage.[/quote]

He can and will do that on the wing he is our best winger IMO and although is a good fullback I'd like to see him on the wing

Irish Curry wrote:

valjester wrote:

Irish Curry wrote:

MBTGOG wrote: Irish,

Ever think he might be able to come into the line from full back instead where there are more options than from the wing?

Yes i do know that But I just think he would be better severed doing this from the wing

He can do it from the wing but he would get his hands on the ball much more from fullback. Seeing earls running full speed at me with the ball in two hands would scare the Poopie out of me. He did it a few times against england and in particular on one occassion he did a loop with bod, if we saw that against aus with bowe or a backrower running off him, we could do some serious damage.

He can and will do that on the wing he is our best winger IMO and although is a good fullback I'd like to see himon the wing

I suppose the whole thing is getting not just getting your best players on the pitch but also your best team. For me that means that trimble has to play, as he brings a physical element as well as being one of our quickest players, but earls and bowe are too good too leave out. Therefore I think playing earls at 15 makes the team stronger even if its not his best position.

valjester wrote:

Irish Curry wrote:

valjester wrote:

Irish Curry wrote:

MBTGOG wrote: Irish,

Ever think he might be able to come into the line from full back instead where there are more options than from the wing?

Yes i do know that But I just think he would be better severed doing this from the wing

He can do it from the wing but he would get his hands on the ball much more from fullback. Seeing earls running full speed at me with the ball in two hands would scare the Poopie out of me. He did it a few times against england and in particular on one occassion he did a loop with bod, if we saw that against aus with bowe or a backrower running off him, we could do some serious damage.

He can and will do that on the wing he is our best winger IMO and although is a good fullback I'd like to see himon the wing

I suppose the whole thing is getting not just getting your best players on the pitch but also your best team. For me that means that trimble has to play, as he brings a physical element as well as being one of our quickest players, but earls and bowe are too good too leave out. Therefore I think playing earls at 15 makes the team stronger even if its not his best position.

+1

red_stag wrote:Depends on the game Pete. If we play SA and Morne Steyn in the 1/4 final I know who I want to see.

Oh no doubt. You'd be insane not to pick Kearney against the Boks.

Notch wrote:

red_stag wrote:Depends on the game Pete. If we play SA and Morne Steyn in the 1/4 final I know who I want to see.

Oh no doubt. You'd be insane not to pick Kearney against the Boks.

Watching the game today, neither team is kicking very well and I think earls would more than cope. Morne Steyn is kicking really poorly and he doesn't have habana or pietersen chasing to make bad kicks come good.

What about Will Genia? Wow. Special player. As undoubtedly great as Cooper is, next to any other Australian scrumhalf I don't think he'd have half as many opportunities to shine.

I've been hugely impressed with O'Connor's defence on Mvovo too. He's got a pretty good technique and he's very brave as well.

MMC wrote:What about Will Genia? Wow. Special player. As undoubtedly great as Cooper is, next to any other Australian scrumhalf I don't think he'd have half as many opportunities to shine.

I've been hugely impressed with O'Connor's defence on Mvovo too. He's got a pretty good technique and he's very brave as well.

O'Connor is a class act but I'd hope that our wingers are smarter than mvovo and would commit him and then pass, make it harder for him. Joc scores as I type.
Genia is a great player probably thee 2nd best scrumhalf after fourie du preeze but his box kicking isn't the greatest and at times he takes the wrong option. He's so good at everything else though so the bad things are magnified because they are so much worse than everything else he does

Also it must be said that isn't anywhere near south africa's best team so we shouldn't go overboard with australia's performance. But if pdv continues to insist on starting smit, then sa are in trouble. Another try,woodesque from moore.