IRB World Rankings ... Part 1

by Portnoy Mon 08 Aug 2011, 10:42 am

First topic message reminder :

Current World Rankings

IRB
http://www.irb.com/rankings/full.html

4Ns Round 1
http://www.espnscrum.com/scrum/rugby/match/fixtures/international.html

September 2012

Sat 15 Rugby Championship / Freedom Cup
New Zealand v South Africa, Dunedin
19:35 local, 07:35 GMT, 08:35 BST

nzl (on 92.43 points) at home -vs- rsa (on 84.20 points)

If nzl win by 1-15 points 0.000 92.43 84.20 No
If nzl win by more than 15 0.000 92.43 84.20 No
If result is a draw 1.000 91.43 85.20 No
If rsa win by 1-15 points 2.000 90.43 86.20 No
If rsa win by more than 15 3.000 89.43 87.20 No

Sat 15 Rugby Championship
Australia v Argentina, Gold Coast
20:05 local, 10:05 GMT, 11:05 BST

aus (on 86.62 points) at home -vs- arg (on 79.34 points)

If aus win by 1-15 points 0.000 86.62 79.34 No
If aus win by more than 15 0.000 86.62 79.34 No
If result is a draw 1.000 85.62 80.34 No
If arg win by 1-15 points 2.000 84.62 81.34 No
If arg win by more than 15 3.000 83.62 82.34 No

[ed]

Original post:

Pretty much World rankings provide both an 'official' balance sheet and P/L account of international bragging rights.

Sources:
IRB Rankings : http://www.irb.com/rankings/index.html
Rankings explanation : http://www.irb.com/rankings/explain/index.html
Rankings archive : http://www.irb.com/rankings/archive/index.html

Online calculator (Courtesy of Robbo277 (thanks)) : http://www.lassen.co.nz/pagmisc.php#hrh

by Portnoy Thu 07 Jun 2012, 2:36 pm

Missed from the OP:

Sam 20 v Ton 18

Software predicted rankings points:

Sam 76.59
Ton 75.46

estimated Sco Oz rankings points:

Sco 75.8
Aus 85.99

by wales606 Thu 07 Jun 2012, 3:13 pm

If that right then

Aus (on 85.99 points) at home -vs- Wal (on 83.32 points)

If Aus win by 1-15 points.......0.4338......86.42 82.89 No
If Aus win by more than 15.....0.649.......86.64 82.67 No
If result is a draw..................0.567.......85.42 83.89 No
If Wal win by 1-15 points.......1.567........84.42 84.89 Yes
If Wal win by more than 15.....2.351........83.64 85.67 Yes

Which could put Wales in 3rd behind England or SA this weekend if they win.

Potentially could go second.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Thu 07 Jun 2012, 3:29 pm

wales606 wrote:If that right then

Aus (on 85.99 points) at home -vs- Wal (on 83.32 points)

If Aus win by 1-15 points.......0.4338......86.42 82.89 No
If Aus win by more than 15.....0.649.......86.64 82.67 No
If result is a draw..................0.567.......85.42 83.89 No
If Wal win by 1-15 points.......1.567........84.42 84.89 Yes
If Wal win by more than 15.....2.351........83.64 85.67 Yes

Which could put Wales in 3rd behind England or SA this weekend if they win.

Potentially could go second.

And to be fair if england had turned over SA and Aus had lost twice in a row then whos to argue they dont deserve to be there? As much as I enjoy poking the more pompous statements made by some welshists a side that had finished 4th in the world cup, then won a grandslam, then beaten the tri nations chumps in their own back yard is unarguably good.
But this does rely on results this weekend. Both games are close calls, Im going with wales to win england to lose...putting wales up to third.

by wales606 Thu 07 Jun 2012, 3:33 pm

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:
wales606 wrote:If that right then

Aus (on 85.99 points) at home -vs- Wal (on 83.32 points)

If Aus win by 1-15 points.......0.4338......86.42 82.89 No
If Aus win by more than 15.....0.649.......86.64 82.67 No
If result is a draw..................0.567.......85.42 83.89 No
If Wal win by 1-15 points.......1.567........84.42 84.89 Yes
If Wal win by more than 15.....2.351........83.64 85.67 Yes

Which could put Wales in 3rd behind England or SA this weekend if they win.

Potentially could go second.

And to be fair if england had turned over SA and Aus had lost twice in a row then whos to argue they dont deserve to be there? As much as I enjoy poking the more pompous statements made by some welshists a side that had finished 4th in the world cup, then won a grandslam, then beaten the tri nations chumps in their own back yard is unarguably good.
But this does rely on results this weekend. Both games are close calls, Im going with wales to win england to lose...putting wales up to third.

I think if Wales win the series (winning the last game for maximum points) and England lose 2 - 1 then it should be enough for Wales to be second.

If Wales win this weekend they will be 3rd and only slightly behind SA or England no matter which wins.

by anotherworldofpain Sun 10 Jun 2012, 12:18 am

So what will be rankings on Monday? All stay the same? Or Australia get some points back?

by wales606 Sun 10 Jun 2012, 12:47 am

Stays the same.

Wales and England get closer as Aus are 2nd SA 3rd and England are 4th and Wales 5th.

by **Biltong** Sun 10 Jun 2012, 9:49 am

Wales will only be .1 behind england.

by **LondonTiger** Mon 11 Jun 2012, 2:49 pm

Latest official rankings are now up.

http://www.irb.com/rankings/full.html

similar narrow defeats would see Wales go above England.

But I think a big win for Argentina could see them go 4th if England and Wales both lose (or France could if they win).

by wales606 Mon 11 Jun 2012, 3:03 pm

LondonTiger wrote:Latest official rankings are now up.

http://www.irb.com/rankings/full.html

similar narrow defeats would see Wales go above England.

But I think a big win for Argentina could see them go 4th if England and Wales both lose (or France could if they win).

A bit odd considering France and Argentina are playing very second string sides. Still, I hope Argentina win, both because I like them more than France and because they will lose all those lovely ranking points during the 4Ns

by **Biltong** Mon 11 Jun 2012, 3:18 pm

Well, if you ain't number one, does the rest really matter?

Yes, I know about the RWC seedings.

by **LondonTiger** Mon 11 Jun 2012, 3:26 pm

Not sure being number 1 is particularly relevant - except as a "moral victory" if you do not hold the RWC Run

Only relevance these have are for RWC seedings - and who wouldn't want to be seeded so they avoid NZ?.

by Smirnoffpriest Mon 11 Jun 2012, 3:32 pm

Am I right in thinking that Top 4 ranked sides later this year will be put into different groups, but the side ranked 5th will be put into the group of the 4th ranked team (ie as it stands Wales would be put into Englands group) as 2nd seeds?

Or am I wrong?

by wales606 Mon 11 Jun 2012, 3:35 pm

Smirnoffpriest wrote:Am I right in thinking that Top 4 ranked sides later this year will be put into different groups, but the side ranked 5th will be put into the group of the 4th ranked team (ie as it stands Wales would be put into Englands group) as 2nd seeds?

Or am I wrong?

I think/hope so. It means even if Wales finish 5th it won't really matter as they still avoid the big 3.

by Pete C (Kiwireddevil) Mon 11 Jun 2012, 3:36 pm

Smirnoffpriest wrote:Am I right in thinking that Top 4 ranked sides later this year will be put into different groups, but the side ranked 5th will be put into the group of the 4th ranked team (ie as it stands Wales would be put into Englands group) as 2nd seeds?

Or am I wrong?

You're wrong Wink

The top 4 later this year go into the top seeds pot, then the next 4 go into the 2nd seeds pot, then the next 4 qualified teams into 3rd seed, then there are the regional qualifiers' pots, with a random draw to assign 1 from each seed group to a pool.

by Smirnoffpriest Mon 11 Jun 2012, 3:56 pm

Kiwireddevil wrote:
Smirnoffpriest wrote:Am I right in thinking that Top 4 ranked sides later this year will be put into different groups, but the side ranked 5th will be put into the group of the 4th ranked team (ie as it stands Wales would be put into Englands group) as 2nd seeds?

Or am I wrong?

You're wrong

The top 4 later this year go into the top seeds pot, then the next 4 go into the 2nd seeds pot, then the next 4 qualified teams into 3rd seed, then there are the regional qualifiers' pots, with a random draw to assign 1 from each seed group to a pool.

I see, damn I'm getting too use to being wrong!

Such a shame, and a little bit harsh on which ever team misses out on the 4th ranking spot considering how close the points are.

by KickAndChase Mon 11 Jun 2012, 3:57 pm

Being in the second pot is absolutely fine - you have to beat SH opposition to have a shout anyway.

It's being in the third pot that's scary. Scotland got lucky last time to pull England and Argentina, both teams they can and do beat. But this time around it might be awful, such as a pool of New Zealand, Wales/France, Scotland ... all 3 of those teams really have a number on the Scots in general.

And all thanks to AR Wink

by RubyGuby Mon 11 Jun 2012, 4:31 pm

Ive said it a million times, forget the seedings and the pots - The key is to avoid Samoa thumbsup

by **Biltong** Mon 11 Jun 2012, 4:47 pm

Nope, the key is to avoid THE BRUCE! Whistle

by wales606 Mon 11 Jun 2012, 4:47 pm

KickAndChase wrote:Being in the second pot is absolutely fine - you have to beat SH opposition to have a shout anyway.

It's being in the third pot that's scary. Scotland got lucky last time to pull England and Argentina, both teams they can and do beat. But this time around it might be awful, such as a pool of New Zealand, Wales/France, Scotland ... all 3 of those teams really have a number on the Scots in general.

And all thanks to AR

I'd rather face the SH team in the semi-final though.

I really hope Wales can finish 4th - then its likely that 2 wins over NH teams in 2015 will see them in the SF.

It would be horrible to finish 5th and draw NZ, Samoa/Scotland and Italy.

by wales606 Mon 11 Jun 2012, 4:48 pm

biltongbek wrote:Nope, the key is to avoid THE BRUCE!

Australians?

by **Biltong** Mon 11 Jun 2012, 5:41 pm

wales606 wrote:
biltongbek wrote:Nope, the key is to avoid THE BRUCE!

Australians?

Ya mocking me?

IRB World Rankings ... Part 1 - Page 17 Smiley-violent001

by wales606 Mon 11 Jun 2012, 5:57 pm

biltongbek wrote:
wales606 wrote:
biltongbek wrote:Nope, the key is to avoid THE BRUCE!

Australians?

Ya mocking me?

IRB World Rankings ... Part 1 - Page 17 Sadno

IRB World Rankings ... Part 1 - Page 17 Poke

IRB World Rankings ... Part 1 - Page 17 Smiley-taunt014

by **Biltong** Mon 11 Jun 2012, 6:05 pm

wales606 wrote:
biltongbek wrote:
wales606 wrote:
biltongbek wrote:Nope, the key is to avoid THE BRUCE!

Australians?

Ya mocking me?

You poking me with that stick reminds me of this story.

Van der Merwe is caught by cannibals and put in a huge pot to add the meat to a stew they are brewing.

Every now and then they poke him with a fork to see whether he is getting tender, and then he starts laughing.

After a while the interpreter comes over and asks in broken English "why you laugh"

He responds " you

I

IRB World Rankings ... Part 1 - Page 17 Poop13

in your soup"

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Mon 11 Jun 2012, 8:31 pm

wales606 wrote:
LondonTiger wrote:Latest official rankings are now up.

http://www.irb.com/rankings/full.html

similar narrow defeats would see Wales go above England.

But I think a big win for Argentina could see them go 4th if England and Wales both lose (or France could if they win).

A bit odd considering France and Argentina are playing very second string sides. Still, I hope Argentina win, both because I like them more than France and because they will lose all those lovely ranking points during the 4Ns

I dont think Arg can .. because of home weighting they can only get up to 81.64 points by a 15 point + win, if england get pasted they will still be on 82.24 .. and if wales get pasted they will be on 82.37

by wales606 Mon 11 Jun 2012, 8:52 pm

biltongbek wrote:
wales606 wrote:
biltongbek wrote:
wales606 wrote:
biltongbek wrote:Nope, the key is to avoid THE BRUCE!

Australians?

Ya mocking me?

You poking me with that stick reminds me of this story.

Van der Merwe is caught by cannibals and put in a huge pot to add the meat to a stew they are brewing.

Every now and then they poke him with a fork to see whether he is getting tender, and then he starts laughing.

After a while the interpreter comes over and asks in broken English "why you laugh"

He responds " you I in your soup"

IRB World Rankings ... Part 1 - Page 17 Smiley-confused002

by mystiroakey Mon 11 Jun 2012, 10:48 pm

Errr lol. fruit bats haha

by Portnoy Tue 12 Jun 2012, 4:30 pm

Predictions to June 17 updated on OP

by RubyGuby Sun 17 Jun 2012, 10:27 pm

1 - Blacks
2 - Aus
3 - SA
4 - Wales 82.54
5 - England 82.49

We even win when we're losing thumbsup

by wales606 Sun 17 Jun 2012, 10:46 pm

RubyGuby wrote:1 - Blacks
2 - Aus
3 - SA
4 - Wales 82.54
5 - England 82.49

We even win when we're losing

Now we just have to stay there until the end of the summer.

Our last game before the WC draw is against Australia at home - that will be a huge game if England/France/Ireland/Argentina have a successful 6 months.

by Portnoy Mon 18 Jun 2012, 1:18 pm

OP updated.

Wales could go 2nd.

by KickAndChase Mon 18 Jun 2012, 2:21 pm

Most Scotland can do is go 9th

by **Biltong** Mon 18 Jun 2012, 4:19 pm

Don't know why we bother playing tests, we remain at 3, either way. Whistle

by **George Carlin** Mon 18 Jun 2012, 5:28 pm

Biltong, surely you are not complaining about your Awesomeness?

by **Biltong** Mon 18 Jun 2012, 5:51 pm

George Carlin wrote:Biltong, surely you are not complaining about your Awesomeness?

IRB World Rankings ... Part 1 - Page 17 Smiley-scared004

Nope!

IRB World Rankings ... Part 1 - Page 17 Smiley-laughing021

by wales606 Mon 18 Jun 2012, 5:59 pm

biltongbek wrote:
George Carlin wrote:Biltong, surely you are not complaining about your Awesomeness?
Nope!

Just wait for the 4Ns - then you might go down a bit Whistle

by **Biltong** Mon 18 Jun 2012, 6:28 pm

by wales606 Mon 18 Jun 2012, 6:56 pm

Or up a bit

IRB World Rankings ... Part 1 - Page 17 Smiley-happy100

by **Biltong** Mon 18 Jun 2012, 7:18 pm

Well, I don't really care raspberry

by mystiroakey Mon 18 Jun 2012, 7:44 pm

Rankings arnt important anymore(they were last week mind)

by glamorganalun Mon 18 Jun 2012, 10:40 pm

At least the top 6 are finally in the correct order this week.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sat 23 Jun 2012, 10:40 am

Scotland are right on Irelands heels for 8th spot and a pot 2 now...unbelievable from 6 months ago

Saw this from them before a couple of years ago of course when they got as high as 6th in the rankings after the argentina tour only to hit a patch of truely abysmal form.

by KickAndChase Sat 23 Jun 2012, 2:59 pm

When's the draw though? BEFORE the AIs, right? Still pot 3.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sat 23 Jun 2012, 3:00 pm

KickAndChase wrote:When's the draw though? BEFORE the AIs, right? Still pot 3.

After isnt it?

by KickAndChase Sat 23 Jun 2012, 3:19 pm

"As for the 2011 tournament, the 12 automatically qualified teams will be seeded based on the IRB World Rankings on December 3, 2012 and positioned into three bands of four teams."

Crikey , you're right. Cheers PSW " thumbsup

There were scots saying that after our loss to Italy and slip to 12th it was literally impossible to make it back into band 2. Maybe they were assuming losses against Aus.

This means that a victory over SA & Tonga, depending on results elsewhere, would put us into the 2nd band. A loss to NZ wouldn't change our rating but a victory would obviously almost guarantee 2nd band.

Finally...some good news.

by Sin é Sat 23 Jun 2012, 4:35 pm

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Scotland are right on Irelands heels for 8th spot and a pot 2 now...unbelievable from 6 months ago

Saw this from them before a couple of years ago of course when they got as high as 6th in the rankings after the argentina tour only to hit a patch of truely abysmal form.

Yea, no one expected that win against Australia. Looks like Scotland are Australia's boogey team.

by **Pal Joey** Sat 23 Jun 2012, 5:17 pm

Wouldn't go as far to say that, Sin.

Just the last 2 matches we failed. Before that it was 28 years we hadn't lost to Scotland.
I was a young boy back then I'm now a middle aged man! Laugh

by **Pal Joey** Sat 23 Jun 2012, 6:20 pm

1. NZ 91.43
2. Oz 87.05
3. SA 84.87
4. Eng 83.09
5. Wales 82.26
6. Argentina* 81.22
7. France* 81.06
8. Ireland 79.85
9. Scotland 77.97
10. Samoa 76.23
11. Italy* 75.26
12. Tonga 74.79
13. Canada* 71.74
14. Fiji 70.61

* play today

by HammerofThunor Sat 23 Jun 2012, 6:31 pm

So if France win or Argentina win by more than 15, they go 5th. If Italy beat Canada they go 10th. If Canada win Tonga go to 11th

by **Pal Joey** Sat 23 Jun 2012, 6:42 pm

If Argentina win by more than 15 points they will be just below Wales in 6th on 82.25
If Argentina win by 1-15 they will still be below Wales in 6th on 81.90

If France win by more than 15 points they will be above Wales in 5th on 83.03
If France win by 1-15 they will be above Wales in 5th on 82.38

by Portnoy Sat 23 Jun 2012, 7:15 pm

I hope people are not taking conclusions from my own inputs into the calculator.

Beware of GIGO.

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